Gen 6 The XY Ubers Viability Ranking Thread [Read Post #1000]

[skies]

I nominate Lanturn for D-Tier, it is ok, it does nice against Kyogre:
252 SpA Choice Specs Kyogre Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Lanturn in Rain: 382-450 (84.1 - 99.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
and Blaziken:
252+ Atk Mega Blaziken High Jump Kick vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Lanturn: 271-321 (59.6 - 70.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
and MegaKhan / MegaGar:
252+ Atk Parental Bond Mega Kangaskhan Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Lanturn: 351-414 (77.3 - 91.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Gengar Sludge Bomb vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Lanturn: 225-265 (49.5 - 58.3%) -- 64.8% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
amongst other things depending on the set:
+2 252 SpA Fairy Aura Xerneas Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Lanturn: 357-421 (78.6 - 92.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
4 Atk Life Orb Dark Aura Yveltal Sucker Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Lanturn: 188-224 (41.4 - 49.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Life Orb Dark Aura Yveltal Dark Pulse vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Lanturn: 286-339 (62.9 - 74.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+2 252+ Atk Arceus Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Lanturn: 452-532 (99.5 - 117.1%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Silk Scarf Arceus Extreme Speed vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Lanturn: 325-384 (71.5 - 84.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Ho-Oh Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Lanturn: 240-284 (52.8 - 62.5%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
4 Atk Ho-Oh Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Lanturn: 180-214 (39.6 - 47.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Yeah, it isn't that great, but has its niched with Scald, momentum, and Heal Bell.

 

[Magcargo]

I nominate Lanturn for D-Tier, it is ok, it does nice against Kyogre:
252 SpA Choice Specs Kyogre Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Lanturn in Rain: 382-450 (84.1 - 99.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
and Blaziken:
252+ Atk Mega Blaziken High Jump Kick vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Lanturn: 271-321 (59.6 - 70.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
and MegaKhan / MegaGar:
252+ Atk Parental Bond Mega Kangaskhan Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Lanturn: 351-414 (77.3 - 91.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Mega Gengar Sludge Bomb vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Lanturn: 225-265 (49.5 - 58.3%) -- 64.8% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
amongst other things depending on the set:
+2 252 SpA Fairy Aura Xerneas Moonblast vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Lanturn: 357-421 (78.6 - 92.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
4 Atk Life Orb Dark Aura Yveltal Sucker Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Lanturn: 188-224 (41.4 - 49.3%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery
252 SpA Life Orb Dark Aura Yveltal Dark Pulse vs. 252 HP / 0 SpD Lanturn: 286-339 (62.9 - 74.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
+2 252+ Atk Arceus Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Lanturn: 452-532 (99.5 - 117.1%) -- 93.8% chance to OHKO
+2 252+ Atk Silk Scarf Arceus Extreme Speed vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Lanturn: 325-384 (71.5 - 84.5%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
252+ Atk Ho-Oh Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Lanturn: 240-284 (52.8 - 62.5%) -- 99.6% chance to 2HKO after Leftovers recovery
4 Atk Ho-Oh Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Lanturn: 180-214 (39.6 - 47.1%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Leftovers recovery

Yeah, it isn't that great, but has its niched with Scald, momentum, and Heal Bell.

Getting OHKOed / 2HKOed by a large majority of the metagame after SR and doing jackshit in return is hardly what I would call D-Rank. The Pokemon in D-Rank at least need to be at least somewhat salvageable and not completely useless 99% of the time.

 

[skies]

Getting OHKOed / 2HKOed by a large majority of the metagame after SR and doing jackshit in return is hardly what I would call D-Rank. The Pokemon in D-Rank at least need to be at least somewhat salvageable and not completely useless 99% of the time.

That wasn't the point bro, it's niche is being able to absorb a hit, Heal Bell or switch, or even just Scald, or maybe cripple with Thunder Wave.

 

[Magcargo]

That wasn't the point bro, it's niche is being able to absorb a hit, Heal Bell or switch, or even just Scald, or maybe cripple with Thunder Wave.

Except in 90% of the common scenarios, Lanturn is getting KOed before it has a chance to do anything due to its horrendous bulk. Heal Bell, Thunder Wave, and Scald are cool, but what use are they when Lanturn is getting OHKOed by some of the biggest threats in Ubers after Stealth Rock? D-Rank is reserved for either Pokemon who are outclassed, but still very decent, or Pokemon that have a very noteworthy niche, but have several flaws holding them back from accomplishing anything major. Lanturn is neither of these, being able to do nothing noteworthy that other Pokemon cannot accomplish. Besides that, Lanturn is also completely outclassed by Physically Defensive Kyogre and even Gastrodon if you want a water-type wall.

 

[Kebabe]

Lanturns niche is as a specially defensive pivot that can come in on most special attackers and most notably wall Kyogre. What makes it viable is its access to a slow volt-switch so you can force out the threat with a faster but more frail pokemon that couldn't switch right in. It also got a lot of status speeding attacking moves it can use despite carrying the obligatory assault vest. in short it is its good typing, good hp stat and moves like scald, thunder, icy wind and volt-switch that makes it viable.

 

[MMII]

Okay, the QC team has finally come up with an initial list. Keep in mind this list may change at any time so feel free to discuss the positions.

 

[Manaphy]

Very good list for the most part. Some small things I may disagree with:
Klefki in High B. What the fuck?
Arceus-Fairy in low A, while Grassy is in High B. They require the exact same support for Mega Gengar
Genesect in low A. Is it really that good in this meta? I haven't seen it at all.

 

[Jimmyftw]

Took a quick look at the rankings.
>Skarmory and Smeargle are ranked higher than Lugia?!?
>Lugia and Mega-Khan are in same rank as Arceus Dark/Poison and Whimsicott?!?
>Why is Deoxy A/S mid A rank?

 

[realiti]

Yeah Kanga should be higher than Whimsicott. Deo A is good where it is but Deo S imo should be around B+.

 

[orch]

Seconding Manaphy
Genesect belongs in C/D. It's just terrible in this meta. The omnipresence of Ho-Oh just really hurts Genesect. The spikes and toxic spikes that existed in BW2 to chip damage opponent is pretty much nonexistent and easily defogged/rapid spinned. Not to mention, Genesect's favorite target- lati@s is not present at all. The only real target for gensect is mewtwo/mmy and there's shitload of other scarfers that perform better and checks them anyways. Genesect also, suffers massively from the inability to switch in, due to WoW flying everywhere and loss of dark resistance. The role of being a revenge killer is better serviced by Kyogre, Zekrom, Gengar, and Xerneas.

I'll explain why Fireceus deserves to be at least C+ or even B, and Poisonceus should goes down to D.

 

[blitzlefan]

I'm curious about some of the current ratings, especially in the B and C ranks. I'm not looking to spark an argument, but it'd be helpful if somebody could explain to me why Smeargle, Whimsicott, Klefki, and Skarmory are so high, and I guess why Kangaskhan and Chansey seem so low. I'd also argue that the Giratina forms should be knocked to B or even B-, seeing as they have a ton of weaknesses and no longer really hold the niche of keeping hazards on the field.

 

[Fireburn]

Okay I'm going to respond to some initial comments:

Smeargle - Sticky Web Offense is really annoying and its not easy to Defog against well-built versions of these teams.

Chansey - Mega Gengar takes a giant dump on it, Knock Off is annoying, can't really beat most of the top sweepers/wall-breakers, offensive capability is poor and typing is meh. Blissey is better because it can take anti Gengar measures (Shed Shell or Shadow Ball).

Kangaskhan - B was kind of a compromise I guess since some people love it (me), others think it sucks (Dice/Donkey), and most of QC was in-between. I also think it should be higher but I already posted about that and more opinions are needed.

Klefki - Good typing, decent utility with Spikes and TWave, checks Xerneas pretty well, I think B+ is a bit high but it actually soft-checks a lot of things with its typing and TWave.

Whimiscott - Never used this mon, ask Sweep and Melee Mewtwo they like it. Fairy typing is a cool buff but idk much else.

Genesect - Still a decent Scarfer and maintains momentum pretty well but probably not A rank when looking at it again. It's damage output is poor compared to other scarfers, it lacks bulk, and losing 2 resistances sucks balls.

Arceus-Poison - Good Fairy (Xerneas) and Fighting check, Mega Gengar has to use DBond to take it down, can't be Poisoned which makes it useful against defensive teams. It might be a bit high but it has its uses and it is definitely better than D rank lol.

IDK if Fire Arceus deserves B but you're welcome to make a case for it.

 

[ChaosNemesis]

S Rank

• 
  (Kyogre) => agree

A Rank
High

• 
  (Arceus-Normal) => agree
• 
  (Gengar )=> agree
  
• 
  (Ho-Oh) => agree
• 
  (Palkia) => agree
  
• 
  (Xerneas) => agree
  
• 
  (Yveltal) => agree

Mid

• 
  (Arceus-Ghost) => no, there is better arc-forms in this meta, I think it's at maximum A-
• 
  (Blaziken) => can see why, still I don't think it worth mid A
• 
  (Darkrai) => agree
  
• 
  (Deoxys-A) => agree
• 
  (Deoxys-S) => no, suicide lead with so many defogger around (especially defensive arc-forms) are not effectives and other set it can perform are sub optimal in uber. I think B+ at best
• 
  (Dialga) => agree
• 
  (Groudon) => agree
• 
  (Landorus-T) => agree
  
• 
  (Mewtwo) => agree
• 
  (Scizor) => agree
  
• 
  (Zekrom) => agree

Low

• 
  (Aegislash) => agree
• 
  (Arceus-Electric) => agree
• 
  (Arceus-Fairy) => agree
  
• 
  (Arceus-Water) => agree
  
• 
  (Genesect) => no, not in this meta, mid B is where it belongs

B Rank
High

• 
  (Arceus-Grass) => same level as water, so A-
• 
  (Arceus-Ground) => agree
• 
  (Arceus-Rock) => best support-ceus form right now, it really worth mid A
  
• 
  (Ferrothorn) => agree
  
• 
  (Giratina) => agree
• 
  (Giratina-O) => agree
• 
  (Gliscor) => seriously? it's good mon but nothing more than B-
• 
  (Klefki) => annoying but nothing more, B-
  
• 
  (Skarmory) => maybe more B-
• 
  (Smeargle) => mid B at best
• 
  (Thundurus) => agree

Mid

• 
  (Arceus-Dark) => agree
• 
  (Arceus-Poison) => agree
  
• 
  (Bronzong) => I don't know, does it really worth mid B?
• 
  (Deoxys-D) => agree
• 
  (Excadrill) => agree
• 
  (Forretress) => other than spin and maybe some (t) spike it can't do sh1t. C
• 
  (Heatran) => agree
• 
  (Kangaskhan) => this thing is beast. A- at least
  
• 
  (Kyurem-W) => agree
• 
  (Lugia) => agree
  
• 
  (Rayquaza) => agree
• 
  (Shaymin-S) => agree
• 
  (Tyranitar) => agree
• 
  (Whimsicott) => I don't know, does it really worth mid B?

Low

• 
  (Aggron) => agree
• 
  (Arceus-Steel) => agree
  
• 
  (Blissey) => maybe something more, like B+
• 
  (Charizard) => C at best
• 
  (Cloyster) => I don't know
  
• 
  (Hippowdon) => agree
• 
  (Lucario) => agree
• 
  (Scolipede) => agree
  
• 
  (Sylveon) => agree

C Rank
High

• 
  (Absol) => agree
• 
  (Arceus-Fighting) => agree
• 
  (Arceus-Psychic) => agree
  
• 
  (Chansey) => agree
• 
  (Clefable) => agree
• 
  (Gyarados) => agree
  
• 
  (Jirachi) => agree
  
• 
  (Quagsire) => agree
• 
  (Sableye) => agree
  
• 
  (Shuckle) => agree
• 
  (Slowking) => ? never seen in uber
  
• 
  (Snorlax) => ? never seen in uber
• 
  (Terrakion) => agree
• 
  (Wobbuffet) => agree

Mid

• 
  (Amoongus) => agree
• 
  (Arceus-Dragon) => agree
• 
  (Arceus-Fire) => maybe something more
  
• 
  (Arceus-Flying) => agree
  
• 
  (Cresselia) => agree
  
• 
  (Mamoswine) => ? never seen in uber
  
• 
  (Reshiram) => agree

Low

• 
  (Abomasnow) => agree
• 
  (Arceus-Ice) => agree
  
• 
  (Gastrodon) => agree

 

[Haruno]

Arceus-Poison - Good Fairy (Xerneas) and Fighting check, Mega Gengar has to use DBond to take it down, can't be Poisoned which makes it useful against defensive teams. It might be a bit high but it has its uses and it is definitely better than D rank lol.

It isn't a good check to xerneas at all since it gets 2hko'd by w/e 110bp neutral coverage move it has after a geomancy boost, or outright ohko'd if it has psyshock. Fighting types are incredibly rare being limited to mmx and err.......... mmx so that's a pretty moot point since mmx also has a psychic stab which hits it for enormous damage. It doesn''t do so well against blaziken either since the best poisonceus is phaze or hit it with a neutral judgment while being hit insanely hard by a +2 flare blitz. Not to mention poison itself is a shitty offensive and a defensive typing. Overall I can't see it being higher than C rank since the opportunity cost of using it is far too high while you get next to nothing in return if you do use it since it sucks balls against most teams where a diff arceus form can do better. D rank doesn't sound so bad thanks to it being so thoroughly useless, it's akin to using deo-n when deo-a exists.

I disagree with a good amount of the rest of your post but I'm too lazy/cbf to rant right now :(

 

[Hack]

I don't wanna be minimodding and shit but I am the first to notice this- post fucking reasons for why you think the mons don't belong in a certain rank. I don't wanna read through a gigantic post with a bunch of superfluous bs just to see some opinions backed by absolutely nothing at all.

Some people like Manaphy, Orch, Fireburn, Haruno bring up valid discussion points by not having to write a tl;dr post while others do the exact opposite(Chaos Nemesis).

 

[MMII]

If you want to argue for Mega Kanga it's best you address the points already raised against it here:

Mega Kanga - 4mss. Sucker/PuP/Return/EQ loses to offense since non-stab sucker is simply not enough damage to bring down pokemon that aren't Mewtwo and everything else is faster than you. Sucker/Fake Out/Return/EQ is good vs offense, but it will be literally useless vs bulky teams. Have fun against Willowisp Arceuses and Giratinas! Additionally, if you aren't running Crunch, then you're gonna get fucking boned by Mega Gengar since it can just never Mega evolve and switch rather freely, especially with defog.

Kangaskhan sucks. Against HO teams with Mega Gengar it's a 1v1 at best assuming that Gengar doesn't trap / damage any other Pokemon beforehand, and vs any Balanced / Stall team you're doing literally nothing. They switch in a Lugia, Giratina, Skarmory, Scizor, whatever and you're done. Earthquake is the most common on Kanga, so Bronzong is practically a free switch-in too. Kangaskhan is often used as a team's Deo-S / Deo-A / Smeargle, etc. answer, but in reality you're more obligated to lead Kangaskhan than they are to lead Deo-S. If you don't lead Kangaskhan predicting a different lead while they do lead Deo-S, they're getting SR + Spikes set up. If they lead another Pokemon predicting vs Kangaskhan, they can double into Deo-S later in the game and get SR + Spikes. If the Deo-S vs Kanga matchup does occur, they still have SR which gives them momentum. Power Up Punch is terrible; Fake Out is a necessity and PuP as your only coverage move is, quite frankly, retarded. It's not strong enough and the boost is meaningless when you're still cockblocked by steels and ghosts. Kanga's best matchup is against offensive teams, but even then they have several checks. Standard offensive sun has a couple of Groudon / Scizor / Zekrom / Ho-oh at minimum which check Kanga well. The 40% to Groudon may seem awesome, but that's only a 3HKO which gives time to SR and status, phaze, or switch to neuter Kanga and/or give hazards. Wisp Arceus is a great check to Kanga and I believe Fireburn underestimates its longetivity. Who's not to say that Arceus can run PhysDef investment too? At best Kangaskhan should be B-, but I'd stick with Donkey and say C+.

Genesect - It's still quite good, especially now that people know how to set and keep up SR in this metagame. It can't force switches as easily as it used to anymore but it still can do it quite well with the wide coverage and Download boosts. Not quite sure how damage output is an issue when it has Download and U-Turn to punish switches. Special sect is probably the better variant this gen, because +1 Bug Buzz is easy to get and not many teams run Ghost-Arceus anymore which makes them have to predict more. Blaziken and Gengar are probably the biggest downsides to it, I could drop it down to B+ because those are fairly important. (at least the latter because you'll likely not have anything else that outspeeds meaning Dbond fun times) C/D is hyperbolic as fuck, lol.

Grassy is below Fairy because, on top of Mega Gengar, it has a number of important metagame threats that trouble it whereas Fairy Arceus only really has Mega Gengar as a critical flaw.

Kelfki - It's a good Spikes setter cause Prankster and it's typing resists a large amount of the common Defog Arceus formes. (Grassy, Fairy, Rock, etc.) Also can troll in other ways with it's ability.

Poison Arceus / Dark Arceus are effective against more defensive teams because they can absorb status and then proceed to be a pain with CM. (Poison Arceus can Defog but meh) I can drop them down to B-, though, as the opportunity cost bites and stuff.

Skarmory is still a good Spikes setter, not as good as it used to be but still good.

Whimsicott's new typing is a god send as it can find free turns much easier now and proceed to pester teams with Encore and SubSeed strats. Also has Taunt and status so can do quite a few things.

Smeargle is high because Sticky Webs is a very strong team archetype. Only downside to his viability is that those team types are tight on builds but otherwise are amazing. (unless you play a thundurs-I :( )

Giratinas can both drop a rank, I agree they seem out of place now.

 

[sammao]

The following monsters can be put in D almost immediately without much discussion

Arceus-Bug- see Sweep Analysis, Bug Stab sucks, SR weak, Ho-oh weak, resisted by a bunch of other type, etc.

Arceus-Flying- Better than Arceus-Bug, it is not THAT terrible itself, but between Ho-oh, Yveltal, and even Shaymin-S, this thing has massive opportunity cost.

Arceus-Psychic-Use Mewtwo, period. On a serious note, fighting resist job can be filled by fairy, and Mewtwo check is better done by Arceus-Dark. Also it is a Mega-Gengar bait.

Deoxys-N-lol

Xatu-With Defog around, hazard control becomes much easier, making it losing its major niche. Its stat is just plain terrible by Uber standard. Typing is very average at best. And while its movepool is decent with stuff like Roost, Screen, and U-turn, it is far from enough to salvage its other bad quality.

Espeon-See above, except I am not sure is this thing even relevant in Uber now as I never see one.

Metagross-I have still seen this around, Assault Vest is cool and all, but really, use Jirachi/Bronzong as your Xerneas check and Dragon sponge instead


Also, can someone pls explain to me what Clefable has over Sylveon?

 

[Blue Jay]

Lugia was debated a fair amount, but really it has a lot of problems. The walling potential is immense. However, it needs significant Defog support to be truly effective as a wall, all status hampers it significantly, Taunt messes with it a lot, and it has 4MSS. It can't do much beyond walling, because the Defog support it needs removes hazards that it could phaze an opponent through. Another problem is that it doesn't excel at checking much. Whereas a lot of walls are very well-equipped to check certain threats with their typing (eg Xerneas for Dragon- and Dark-types, Yveltal for Normal- and Ground-types), Lugia is either a virtually unbreakable wall with Multiscale, or a mediocre one without it.

As Dice and Donkey pointed out, Mega-Kangaskhan has very severe 4MSS. It has the potential to be quite devastating (A- or so), but whatever moveset it picks has a bad match up against some playstyle. Fake Out + Sucker Punch is great against offense, but is highly likely to be walled by something on balance or stall. Running less priority for coverage like Crunch leaves it very vulnerable to anything fast and strong on offense. Power Up Punch is very hard to fit and still sucks against certain threats. Essentially it can accomplish a lot or very little depending on the match up, so B is a compromise.

Arceus-Poison may be a little high, but to correct Haruno 252 HP is not OHKOed by +2 Psyshock, even after SR. Beyond that it's useful for the reason Melee Mewtwo pointed out, namely being really hard for defensive teams to break since they usually rely on Toxic to handle CM Arceus formes.

I do agree that Genesect, Deoxys-S and perhaps Klefki are placed a little high. Chansey could maybe deserve a little bump. Also, having not used and barely faced Whimsicott, I trust Melee Mewtwo's and Sweep's judgment of it.

As for D rank, there's really no rush to place anything there, since it's more or less a "Do not use" list. However, I will say that Xatu probably deserves a little better. Not only is Defog glorified a little as hazard removal (it is certainly not easy to Defog against some playstyles), but Xatu does more than that, and its other capability is far more prominent now than in the previous generation (where entry hazards were far more prominent, offensive playstyles were preferred and status was less widespread). It essentially hard counters a lot of defensive/support Pokemon, as they cannot status it, set up hazards on it, KO it or otherwise accomplish anything against it, while it can Toxic them and stall them out. In addition, it gets dual screens, and with U-turn, it can seriously hamper Deoxys-S/-A and Sticky Webs offense. Of course, it will accomplish little against a lot of match ups, but it's not quite useless.

Arceus-Psychic also isn't quite so bad as to be D rank. Yes, Arceus-Fairy is generally a better Fighting resist and Arceus-Dark is a better Mewtwo/Mega Mewtwo Y check (good luck with Mega Mewtwo X). But what if a team needs both in one Pokemon? It is a small niche, surely enough, but a niche nonetheless.

Clefable has Unaware, meaning it can beat some set up sweepers that Sylveon cannot. Other than that, it is certainly outclassed.

 

[Rotosect]

B-rank is way too low for Kyurem-W.
I mean Zekrom and Landorus-T are A but Kyu-W B? That's just crazy.
Is it because of the SR weakness? Reliable Defog support is disgustingly easy to get in ubers, otherwise we wouldn't have Ho-oh in A+ (and it was considered for S before if I'm not mistaken).
Xerneas? Takes massive damage from Ice Beam and even if it does switch into Draco Meteor then it becomes Ho-oh/Aegislash bait, who should always be paired with Kyurem-W since they have amazing synergy together. Being paired with one or two of the best pokemon in the tier certainly doesn't count as a flaw.
95 base speed is just good enough to outpace the oh-so-common base 90's (let's be honest, every uber team is going to carry at the very least one of those) and it can be either a powerful wallbreaker with Specs or a solid revenge killer/lategame cleaner with Scarf. If you think it's one set and it ends up being the other you're in serious trouble.

Actually, lots of stuff from B-rank needs to be moved up. It's absurd that things like Kyurem-W, Rayquaza, Heatran and Lugia are in the same rank as Whimsicott of all things.
Anyway I strongly believe Kyurem-W should be moved up to A-rank.

About the Arceus formes, I can say for a matter of fact that Arceus-Ice is more viable than Psychic since it's really not outclassed by anything else unlike it (Kyurem-W is a hit-and-runner, Arceus-Ice is a CM sweeper). For example why on earth would I run Arceus-Psychic over CM Mewtwo? What else does Arceus-Psychic do that another Psychic type doesn't do better? That alone means Psychic should be ranked below Ice.
Either way I think it's a bit too early to rank the more obscure Arceus formes since they may or may not have a niche that makes them worth using over the standard ones like Normal and Ghost.

 

[mertyville]

Wow, M-Aggron is B-Rank? In a tier were almost anything 2 shots it? That thing is barely even usable.

 

[Manaphy]

Grassy is below Fairy because, on top of Mega Gengar, it has a number of important metagame threats that trouble it whereas Fairy Arceus only really has Mega Gengar as a critical flaw.

I know I'm known for being a big Grassy fan but that still seems kinda minimal- most switch-ins absolutely detest Thunder Wave, such as Blaziken, and then there are lure moves you can use such as Stone Edge and EQ. I could also make an argument that Grassy's role is arguably on the level of Fairy Arceus' and maybe more important, being the best Kyogre counter in the tier, while still taking in other mons quite well like Zekrom, Palkia, and Groudon.

Kelfki - It's a good Spikes setter cause Prankster and it's typing resists a large amount of the common Defog Arceus formes. (Grassy, Fairy, Rock, etc.) Also can troll in other ways with it's ability

Genesect - It's still quite good, especially now that people know how to set and keep up SR in this metagame. It can't force switches as easily as it used to anymore but it still can do it quite well with the wide coverage and Download boosts. Not quite sure how damage output is an issue when it has Download and U-Turn to punish switches. Special sect is probably the better variant this gen, because +1 Bug Buzz is easy to get and not many teams run Ghost-Arceus anymore which makes them have to predict more. Blaziken and Gengar are probably the biggest downsides to it, I could drop it down to B+ because those are fairly important. (at least the latter because you'll likely not have anything else that outspeeds meaning Dbond fun times) C/D is hyperbolic as fuck, lol.

I understand your reasoning but I'm agreeing with others that these two seem a little too high ranked for the current meta. If I made the list they'd be a rank down.

 

[Fireburn]

+1 Bug Buzz is easy to get and not many teams run Ghost-Arceus anymore which makes them have to predict more.

Mega Gengar, Blaziken, Aegislash (completely walls any not Fire attack), and Mega Scizor (same) say hi. I agree its not bad but as a revenge killer it can't solidly check that many things and if anything it fares worse vs some of them (Mewtwo can be X, Darkrai hits neutrally with Dark Pulse, gl switching into Kyurem-W, Skymin is rare now, Latis are nonexistent). The fact it can't check Xerneas well at all is also a big minus over other Steels you can run too. B+ fits better imo since it still has good offensive and momentum preserving ability, but it requires much more support then it did and it doesn't function well as a pure revenge killer anymore.

 

[MMII]

Mega Gengar, Blaziken, Aegislash (completely walls any not Fire attack), and Mega Scizor (same) say hi. I agree its not bad but as a revenge killer it can't solidly check that many things and if anything it fares worse vs some of them (Mewtwo can be X, Darkrai hits neutrally with Dark Pulse, gl switching into Kyurem-W, Skymin is rare now, Latis are nonexistent). The fact it can't check Xerneas well at all is also a big minus over other Steels you can run too. B+ fits better imo since it still has good offensive and momentum preserving ability, but it requires much more support then it did and it doesn't function well as a pure revenge killer anymore.

Sorry, the "predict more" bit was supposed to imply Flamethrower vs Bug Buzz calls. Mega Gar and Blaze are the real drawbacks to Genesect which could warrant a drop, yeah.

 

[Haruno]

Poison Arceus / Dark Arceus are effective against more defensive teams because they can absorb status and then proceed to be a pain with CM. (Poison Arceus can Defog but meh) I can drop them down to B-, though, as the opportunity cost bites and stuff.

And at the same time poisonceus sucks vs offense or bulky offense which is the most dominant playstyle by far. I don't see how that's effective and any mono attacking arceus can absorb status while not being restricted to poisonceus alone. It just sucks against far too many things and checks far too little for it to even be considered as a B rank mon. Absorbing toxic spikes is cool........ until you realize it only has one user in scolipede which is questionable in itself so that niche is really small and better fulfilled by something like tenta or whatnot since tenta can remove hazards reliably in spin. Not to mention poison is one total shit defensive/offensive typing. The opportunity cost is far too high for using it while the returns simply aren't high enough. I still maintain that using poisonceus is akin to using deo-n. Easy D rank.

Arceus-Poison may be a little high, but to correct Haruno 252 HP is not OHKOed by +2 Psyshock, even after SR. Beyond that it's useful for the reason Melee Mewtwo pointed out, namely being really hard for defensive teams to break since they usually rely on Toxic to handle CM Arceus formes.

Eh, unaware that it could take a +2 psyshock (albeit not well since it needs at least 80% hp to avoid the ohko) Defensive teams are still nowhere near as common as offensive teams so faring well against a less common playstyle isn't worthy of B rank imo. Defensive teams also rely on psong which removes most setup sweepers which poisonceus isn't an exception to. Overall I see no notable niche that poisonceus can fulfill that isn't better fulfilled by another type.


I'll bash the kanga rating later since dice's post made no sense at all but eh. Essay time first .-.
Just out of curiosity. Why is landog mid A rank?

 

[lordkira]

What is the general consensus on Garchomp on the list?