• Snag some vintage SPL team logo merch over at our Teespring store before January 12th!

The Dragons be leaving (OU RMT)

Wilechase

So recently I heard about salamence possibly hitting the uber tier, and I wanted to make something that could possibly work in the new metagame. I also had a couple pokes I wanted to try out, and this became the result. Been testing it out, seems pretty nice, but opinions always help. So anyways, here it is:





149.png

Dragonite (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Inner Focus
EVs: 248 Atk/8 Spd/252 SAtk
Quiet nature (+SAtk, -Spd)
- Earthquake
- Extremespeed
- Fire Blast
- Draco Meteor
So I started out with a swampert lead, but that wasn't working out that greatly. I originally had a heatran, but it wasn't working well. So I replaced it with a dragonite because it provided better synergy. Then I decided to move this to the lead because of swampert not doing great, and some leads causing problems. So EQ hits steels and rocks, E-Speed for weak leads that I can 2HKO, Fire Blast for other steels and grasses, Draco Meteor for STAB.



385.png

Jirachi @ Leftovers
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 164 HP/168 Atk/176 Spd
Jolly nature (+Spd, -SAtk)
- Thunder Wave
- Iron Head
- Fire Punch
- Substitute
This is the center of this team, sub-twave jirachi. I saw this set, and I really wanted to use it, so yea. So T-Wave paralyzes stuff, Iron Head works for paraflinch, plus provides STAB, Fire Punch Hits most steels that block Iron Head, and subsitute allows me to keep jirachi safe and scout a bit, plus provide for free paraflinching.



121.png

Starmie @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 4 HP/252 Spd/252 SAtk
Timid nature (+Spd, -Atk)
- Hydro Pump
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Beam
- Trick
So some of the things that I figured out that would pose a problem for jirachi would be fire types, flygon, and other various ground types. I also needed some form of revenge killer. Starmie could take care of the things mentioned pretty well, and has had some recent freedom from less ttar to revenge kill decently. So Hydro Pump for STAB and make up for some power by not using specs or LO, T-Bolt helps deal with gyarados trying to set-up, and also deal with opposing waters. Ice Beam helps with dragons such as flygon, and the still present mence, and also deals with grass types. Trick helps a bit with stall, crippling some stallers.



497.png

Shaymin @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP/216 Def/40 Spd
Bold nature (+Def, -Atk)
- Seed Flare
- Rest
- Leech Seed
- Hidden Power [Fire]
I knew starmie would have a bit of a hard time staying alive long enough to deal with the threats, plus I lacked a solid ground resist. I knew that celebi might have been a good option, but it doesnt pair as well with starmie, and I didn't exactly need more twaving with my jirachi running around, so I opted for a shaymin. Seed Flare hits for a powerful STAB and deals with waters, grounds, and rocks. Rest heals up, and with natural cure, can get rid of it pretty quick, Leech Seed to steal some health, and HP Fire to hit scizor. Considering putting EP to hit fires like tran and ape since scizor usage is going down, but dunno.



260.png

Swampert (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Torrent
EVs: 252 HP/4 Atk/252 Def
Relaxed nature (+Def, -Spd)
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Ice Beam
- Roar
This was originally my lead. I needed something that can usually get rocks up, and maybe provide additional support to my team if it got out alive from the opponents lead. I opted for swampert, as it complimented shaymin, and also stopped agiligross which could be a pain. I decided it was a lackluster lead, and switched its spot with dragonite, and can set up rocks later just fine. So SR because its very needed in todays metagame, EQ for STAB, Ice Beam to provide very good coverage with EQ, and roar allows me to scout my opponents team.



68.png

Machamp (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: No Guard
EVs: 252 HP/152 Atk/8 Spd/96 SDef
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Dynamicpunch
- Payback
- Rest
- Sleep Talk
So now I needed some physical attacker. I also needed something that could take a couple hits fairly decently, mainly on the special side. I remembered this one machamp spread I got from a friend that worked pretty well. With its spread, I can take special hits a bit better, mainly from infernape, heatran, and rotom, and then have the strength to take them out. So Dynamicpunch for strong STAB and confusion, payback for ghosts, rest for healing, sleep talk to hit while asleep.





So theres the team, thanks for reading, and hopefully you can help make some changes for the better!!!
 
On Dnite use Superpower over Earthquake, Fire Blast hits Metagross harder and Superpower hits through Heatran's Shuca, as well as murdering Blissey and Snorlax. Also Heatran with HP Grass with some smart predicting can wear down Starmie without Recover, especially since you are vulnerable to SR/Spikes. Then it can proceed to run over the rest of your team fairly easily, maybe only Machamp giving it problems (and Heatran is not staying in on Machamp). So maybe Earth Power on Shaymin for a surprise KO would be wise since you already have surprise Fire Punch on Jirachi.
 
I would go with sleep talk over leech seed. I know the extra health drain and gain is helpfull, but firing off free seed flares (I think) is worth the gamble. Btw, love your battle vids. Keep it up.
 
Superpower>EQ as somebody already stated. This also lets you beat Tyranitar leads easier. Anyway, very good team, just I have a nitpick for your Jirachi's Ev's. I really don't think you need the speed that your Jirachi has. A set of 252Hp/220Atk/36Spe and an Adamant nature allow you to finish off your paralyzed opponents a lot easier. 101 HP substitutes are also nice, in case Blissey breaks through Paralysis and Flinches and breaks your sub. This is totally situational, though. Once again, great team.
 
Anyway, on Machamp, you may want to consider using the "Substitute + 3 attacks" set, but keep the EV spread. Unless you find yourself using Rest a lot, Stone Edge is very useful to hit a Gyara switch-in or DNite, two pokemon I find switch in to my Machamp often.
 
@cosmic Changing my machamp to a more offensive oriented one ruins its bulk, therefore not being able to do its job.

But if I get rid of machamp, I become walled by special walls, and have more tyranitar problems if swampert goes away. I also lose a check to infernape that I really need, and heatran to an extent. My machamp is a reliable ghost check, unlike heatran who cannot take on gengars or offensive rotoms as well. I originally had a heatran in this team, and it wasn't doing as much as you think it would do. Scizor can be problematic, but with jirachi and shaymin, its not too huge of a concern.

Timid outspeeds gengar, which would otherwise destroy starmie, while I at least get some heavy damage on him. It also allows me to tie with other timid starmies, so I have a better chance against them. Plus, once I trick, I would be put at a disadvantage speed wise.

By switching the set around, you are completely changing what its role is, how does it provide the same role? I then lose a way to take some hits. It also makes gyarados a bit more problematic since I cant take those boosted stone edges anymore (example).

Thats just what I think, not trying to knock it much, but thats just how I see it. Thanks for the rate though.

Also, I got suggestions to change starmie to an LO sweeper once mence goes uber, and then MAYBE change shaymin to a celebi, thoughts on that?
 
Theres honestly not that great of a reason to not run quiet. It doesnt need the speed since extreme speed, plus most leads I wouldn't e-speed are slower than quiet dnite. I dont really outspeed anything important otherwise, and lowering my defenses could hinder me.
 
what the hell, my team is Froslass, Infernape, Scarf Starmie, Machamp, Shaymin, and Sub Twave Jirachi. HAHA well, now that I said that I have to give you help. I am not so sure Dragonite is the best choice for a team such as this. I think you're going to want (and I'm speaking from experience) some spikes. As our teams are nigh on identical, I know spikes works well. With your shaymin causing crazy switches with leech seed and seed flare and swampy roaring I think You could use as many entry hazards as possible. Now I really hate to recommend froslass, but well, I'm going to have to recommend froslass. Just use the strategy dex lead set.
 
What situational purposes, getting swept? Honestly, machamp is an important part of my team, and I would need really good reasoning to change it.
 
Oh my god I am so sorry I didn't really read your description for the Machamp; Resttalk works great for what you have in mind. Sorry again. But I do want to say that in your Shaymin analysis, you say that you don't need more TWave. Well, as most of your team is base 100 speed and below, you may find that TWave really helps on more than one pokemon. In fact, I think there's an RMT in the archive that has 3 pokemon with TWave. And while your team has more speed than that one (Starmie, Jirachi), I think that with Swampert, Machamp, and to an extent Dragonite having lower speeds (although DNite does make up for it with ExtremeSpeed), TWave could really help them to do more damage. Now if your team works differently than that, like if you find you just use Machamp and Swampert to take damage and you use Starmie and Jirachi to sweep, then use Shaymin. But you may find that the extra TWave helps. Also, besides Seed Flare, does Shaymin do anything much different than Celebi would with a seeding set? You mentioned that Celebi doesn't pair well with Starmie. Besides the obvious Dark/Ghost weakness, could you explain that?
 
Well, thats really the main reason they dont pair well. I'd rather not have the extra worry attached to it, even though I am slightly safe with machamp. But its just one big lure that I could sometimes not afford to send out. It is something worth consideration, but dunno.
 
i'd say have heatran because jirachi and celebi are mad weak to fire moves so have a heatran. also scizor is mad good even though its not the original 151 that's okay so yeah replace jirachi with scizor and dragonite with heatran.
 
I don't know what's happening to me; I don't know why I forgot Pursuit. You are completely right, just having that weakness is a deal-breaker. Next time I post I'll try to look over what I'm saying before I click submit. Sorry again.
 
First off, Mence really isn't going anywhere. We all want it too, but it isn't his SR weakness and being revenge killed by Starmie, a common poke, and finished by Scizor with SR SS and LO BP scores a free kill. (no SS with CB)

Shaymin only shines in Suspect, where Mence is gone. Rest? no Sleep Talk? those 2 turns are going to be a bitch to you if Shaymin is so frail. Sure you'll have leech seed, hopefully, but if you only survive 1 turn and then need to rest, you're toast.

for overall strategy, make sure Swampy has SR out before you switch in Shaymin, else you'll lose to common switch-ins unless you score a crit hit. SR hits shaymins counters hard, fires, flyers... you know.

Proposing you drop trick on Starmie since Blissey is checked my Machamp, sides, blissey doesn't like a -2 SpD drop either from Shaymin.

Too lazy to think of anything else. Good luck with the team.
 
Hiya Wile!

Right off the bat, I can see that your team doesn't like variants of Jolteon much, especially LO variants. You have Swampert, but Shadow Ball will really hurt your team. On top of that, Lucario might pose a problem should it find ample opportunity to set up on Starmie stuck on Ice Beam. Have you tried Gliscor > Swampert, yet? Gliscor practically does everything that you want Swampert to do and more. Gliscor sets up SR, and checks Lucario and Agiligross; as a plus, he gives you assurance against variants of Jolteon, CM Rachi, and Ape, gives you another nice Ground resist, and stops stall from setting up. What more could you ask for? I don't really see what you would lose from swapping out Swampert, so it's a change I would highly suggest.

The suggested spread is as follows:

Gliscor @ Leftovers
206 HP | 216 Spe | 88 Atk; Jolly
Stealth Rock | Earthquake | Roost | Taunt or U-Turn

I know the EV's look weird, but hear me out. I first put 216 in Spe to outrun Adamant Lucario. Then I shoved 88 in Atk to 2hko Metagross. Then I shoved the rest into HP. I know 206 HP doesn't reach an OLRP number, but it's better than nothing. You can alwasy do the standard 252 HP | 216 Spe | 40 Atk spread, but you lose out on the 2hko on Gross. I just made that weird spread based upon Swampert's original role. It's your pick.

BTW, been a huge fan of your work. It's what made me decide to join Wifi competitive battling scene long ago. Although I'm kinda retired until the JPN BW rom is leaked, it's always nice to watch you battle (although your videos are a bit monotonous at times). Glad to see even the mighty comes to ask for helps sometimes. I hope I helped, and I expect to see Gliscor in your next vid. Aha!
 
Cowboy how would this help me, considering I already have two fire resists, and one guy that can check fire types decently. I don't see heatran doing much, considering I originally ran a heatran over dragonite and pert was leading. Also, what merit would there be replacing the core of my team (jirachi).

I understand cosmic, its ok. It helps me think with different mindsets working around.

Lucien, are you serious, of course mence is leaving. Nothing can switch in free on mence, because especially with latias gone, DD mence is more popular, especially bulky variants. SR wont keep mence around in OU. Rest is the most reliable recovery shaymin has considering with ttar running around, synthesis sucks. Sleep talk would just take away from leech seed. Shaymin still works just fine with mence around, and would probably hurt a bit less than having celebi in there.

Enygma, jolteon can't do too much. Most are switch-ins to starmie expecting like a tbolt, then 2HKO'd by hydro pump if I am predicting (thats actually most situations I get in with jolteon). Plus jolteon can't take down shaymin really, or machamp as much either. Plus most jolts carry HP grass for pert, so worrying about the shadow ball is just like yea. Lucario isn't too much of a problem if jirachi is still around, since most of the time it will net a kill first, then fire punch kill. Honestly, luke hasnt been a huge problem. Gliscor I could see working though. Only thing I am thinking though is that I lose out against the dragons that are gonna go up (dragonite and flygon), and also I would lose my roar shuffling, both of which I rely on from pert. Pert checks CM rachi, and if ape is full mixape, gliscor losses anyways. The ground resist could help too. I think I will test it once mence is gone maybe, dunno. And thanks, nice to meet a good fan of my stuff. I am not that mighty, I just entertain well. For a wifi'er I am good, for overall, I am above average at the least tbh.
 
This is an excellent team, I just have one suggestion: as someone already said, Spikes would really help, with the switches Shaymin forces and Pert's Roaring. I'd change the Starmie into the TrickScarf lead set, as this helps you retain your revenging capabilities if you want to keep the Scarf, and if not, you can cripple a lead like Swampert, spin their stuff away, and be in good shape to kill things off later.

Then, replace Starmie's current slot with a specially defensive Skarmory.
It comes in and sets up easily on things like Vaporeon that come in and wall Jirachi, try to Toxic Swampert, etc.

Otherwise, solid team.
 
Wile, a lot of people have the same thought as me. Sides, Donphan 2HKOs Mence with Ice Shard while takes 70%, sure, but it's a reliable check to mence. Starmie is an easy revenge kill. Heatran OHKOs with HP Ice. HAHA! Shuckle can switch into ANY attack and take like 15%. I've used Mence a lot, it's not as hyped as it is. It only sweeps UNPREPARED teams. I can easily get a 6-0 sweep with a Zapdos while, on a good game for me, I'll just go 6-4 with Mence, assuming I switch to Mence right off the bat. There are soo many easy counters to Mence, most are on a lot of teams.
 
Lucien Lachance said:
Wile, a lot of people have the same thought as me. Sides, Donphan 2HKOs Mence with Ice Shard while takes 70%, sure, but it's a reliable check to mence. Starmie is an easy revenge kill. Heatran OHKOs with HP Ice. HAHA! Shuckle can switch into ANY attack and take like 15%. I've used Mence a lot, it's not as hyped as it is. It only sweeps UNPREPARED teams. I can easily get a 6-0 sweep with a Zapdos while, on a good game for me, I'll just go 6-4 with Mence, assuming I switch to Mence right off the bat. There are soo many easy counters to Mence, most are on a lot of teams.
Click to expand...

Cool story bro.
 
Lucien Lachance said:
HAHA! Shuckle can switch into ANY attack and take like 15%..
Click to expand...

Are you on crack?

240 Naive Life Orb Salamence(New MixMence) Draco Meteor
vs. 248/8 Impish Leftovers Shuckle : 51% - 60.5%

16 Naive Life Orb Salamence(New MixMence) Outrage
vs. 248/252 Impish Leftovers Shuckle : 34.6% - 41.2%

That's a 2HKO every time (Shuckle is SR weak)

232 Naive Life Orb Salamence +1 Outrage
vs. 248/252 Impish Leftovers Shuckle : 61.7% - 72.8%

Not to mention Shuckle can't really do anything to Mence anyways...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top