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Smogon University PO Statistics — December 2011

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LucaroarkZ said:
This. Just, this.

Either way, it's still completely disgusting that people can just slap together a team of Tyranitar + Scizor + Rotom-W + Landorus + Terrakion + Dragonite and win games with ease. BW OU is more ass than GSC right now.

Anyway, I believe the only reason Scizor usage is ridiculously high is thanks to the omnipresence of Terrakion in the metagame, since Scizor is the only Pokemon that can check Terrakion with ease and Terrakion has no true counters.
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I hate to admit it, but I have used almost exclusively Sand offense and the Volt-Turn just cause it works so well. I use Scizor to check Terrakion cause it is a huge threat that cannot be left unchecked.

And I kinda disagree with Terrakion having no true counters. Regenerator Slowbro counters it pretty well and isn't so niche that its useless against other things.

Maybe this will sound crazy, but i think we may have been better off with the BW OU metagame if we had allowed Excadrill and Deoxys-S. Maybe if it gets too bad, could there be a possibility of doing like a trial with them allowed to see if it provides a more favorable metagame?
 
Mexifry said:
I hate to admit it, but I have used almost exclusively Sand offense and the Volt-Turn just cause it works so well. I use Scizor to check Terrakion cause it is a huge threat that cannot be left unchecked.

And I kinda disagree with Terrakion having no true counters. Regenerator Slowbro counters it pretty well and isn't so niche that its useless against other things.

Maybe this will sound crazy, but i think we may have been better off with the BW OU metagame if we had allowed Excadrill and Deoxys-S. Maybe if it gets too bad, could there be a possibility of doing like a trial with them allowed to see if it provides a more favorable metagame?
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Actually Regenerator Slowbro takes over 50% from a +2 Stone Edge from double dancer, so.... Not the best counter.

I agree with the possibility of re-testing Excadrill, but I'm doubtful about re-testing Deoxys-S.
 
VolTurning is really common now.
I suppose the banning of a couple fearsome offensive grounds had something to do with that.
If any of those got a free turn from switching into a choiced Volt Switch it could very well be GG.
So their presence probably made players a lot more wary of spamming Volt Switch.
Anyway, I'm sure a majority feels that VolTurning is more manageable than Chomp and Exca were.
 
deluge said:
VolTurning is really common now.
I suppose the banning of a couple fearsome offensive grounds had something to do with that.
If any of those got a free turn from switching into a choiced Volt Switch it could very well be GG.
So their presence probably made players a lot more wary of spamming Volt Switch.
Anyway, I'm sure a majority feels that VolTurning is more manageable than Chomp and Exca were.
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Well if you had a well built team, Excadrill and Garchomp were not going to be a problem. With Voltturn though, anybody can add an extra Pokemon to there team to cover all the threats that Voltturn doesn't beat. Although you could add a Pokemon to beat all of Excadrill's/Garchomp's checks and counters, a well built team would have those Pokemon covered as well. Although Voltturn is very hard to stop once it has a Voltturn chain running just U-Turning/Volt Switching out of all of those Pokemon's counters leaving the opponent at a disadvantage as they could never get there check/counter to a particular Pokemon in as they would be Volt Switching/U-Turning out. Ok, Scizor / Rotom-W / Landorus. Bulk Up Breloom can tear through that core. Add a Celebi. Scizor / Rotom-W. Celebi, Roserade, and Breloom are common Pokemon who beat this core. Add an offensive Heatran.

Just because the core itself is beaten, does not mean the rest of the team is. Voltturn with the right support is pretty difficult to take on and is very centralizing.
 
deluge said:
VolTurning is really common now.
I suppose the banning of a couple fearsome offensive grounds had something to do with that.
If any of those got a free turn from switching into a choiced Volt Switch it could very well be GG.
So their presence probably made players a lot more wary of spamming Volt Switch.
Anyway, I'm sure a majority feels that VolTurning is more manageable than Chomp and Exca were.
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Landorus = Excadrill Mk. 2. It's as huge a threat in a sandstorm as Excadrill ever was.

Terrakion is demolishing stuff as well as Chomp used to as well, especially in a sandstorm where it becomes remarkably bulky even without investment.
 
Sabinfrost said:
Landorus = Excadrill Mk. 2. It's as huge a threat in a sandstorm as Excadrill ever was.

Terrakion is demolishing stuff as well as Chomp used to as well, especially in a sandstorm where it becomes remarkably bulky even without investment.
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I was talking about Volt Switch-immune offensive Pokemon so Terakion would be excepted.
Anyway, your comment about Landorus segues into this point: I don't think the banned grounds were completely overpowering in their own right.
I think part of the pressure players felt was due to the fact that those two and Landy share similar checks.
In fact, a Landy set with Smack Down and HP Ice was designed to lure and ruin Skarm/Glis so Exca could sweep.
 
Aww, Bronzong is gone. Really loved that guy.

Anyways, nice to see Pert gone, I mean, he was only good as a Bulky CBer.

Welcome Zam though!
 
steviestar said:
That's true about Forry not surviving most fire hits anyway, and he does have sturdy so the boost in fire attacks doesn't matter that much. Still, Forry isn't always ideal, as he's a pretty poor stop to Terrakion (HUGE threat to sun teams) and his complete lack of offensive presence prevents him from always rapid spinning reliably. A big point in Donphan's favor is that he scares most Tyranitar away while Forry just eats a fire blast and dies.
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Forretress isn't THAT much of a slouch. With a bit of investment, Forry has more than enough attack to maim unsuspecting Terrakion with Earthquake, especially if he catches it on the switch (if one of the hits is after a CC defense drop, it's an easy 2HKO). If anything, Forry has an easier time Spinning than Donphan does because he actually can hit SpinBlockers for Super-Effective damage with Payback and laughs at Jellicent, who can beat Donphan even in the sun.

I'm certainly not denying the benefits Donphan has over Forry (the ability to beat T-Tar is huge in today's meta, for instance), but I still don't think he's a significant improvement over Sun's other options. I'll need to test him out for myself, I suppose.
 
IMO Dugtrio is a better way of stopping T-tar, as it can use a full-powered Reversal against it after 4 subs or activating Focus Sash and even outspeeds ScarfTar and +1 DDTar. IMO Donphan's only really useful as a physical tank that can set up SR and spin and also not 4x weak to Fire / trapped by Magnezone.
 
LucaroarkZ said:
IMO Dugtrio is a better way of stopping T-tar, as it can use a full-powered Reversal against it after 4 subs or activating Focus Sash and even outspeeds ScarfTar and +1 DDTar. IMO Donphan's only really useful as a physical tank that can set up SR and spin and also not 4x weak to Fire / trapped by Magnezone.
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That seems like a role Donphan could have filled from a lower tier, he doesn't feel deserving of a place in OU, while he was quite popular he was also far from broken in UU.
 
LucaroarkZ said:
Anyway, I believe the only reason Scizor usage is ridiculously high is thanks to the omnipresence of Terrakion in the metagame, since Scizor is the only Pokemon that can check Terrakion with ease and Terrakion has no true counters.
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hmmm..dunno but my milotic is dealing terrakion with ease esp. when marvel scale is up. phaze+scald kills terrak.

btw, since donphan is now noticed, i expect rise in his usage. he's too underrated right now. also for zam but i guess he needs screens support to sweep in ou.

chansey is meh, her eviolite will be a liability for a team when rotom-w is around.

swampert and bronzong in uu means more stalling in uu which means more boring uu lol (i remembered how my uu team stalled an uber team to death)
 
I can't say anything about certain Pokemon's removal from lower tiers, but as a status symbol, it's great to see Alakazam, Jolteon, and Dugtrio up in OU! Let's bring it!
 
NixHex said:
I can't say anything about certain Pokemon's removal from lower tiers, but as a status symbol, it's great to see Alakazam, Jolteon, and Dugtrio up in OU! Let's bring it!
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FUN FACT: before these changes, Starmie is the fastest poke in OU when Deoxys-Speed was ubered. With these guys you just mentioned, they just added faster pokes to probably wake up the speedy meta..

HOORAY for faster OU metagame!
 
Kick Metagross down to UU already. So far he doesn't work well in OU as good as it used to and plus, the usage has dropped pretty dramatically compared to it's other fellow Pseudo-Legendary brothers. Metagross will at least do well in UU.
 
I've been rather optimistic about testing Deoxys-D now that its speed counterpart has been banished to ubers and it is no surprise to see it running around.

Personally I am testing Trick with Taunt, Stealth Rock and Spikes as an effective "crippler" and "deck stacker" so to speak. Common switches in to Deo-D are not as threatening when they're locked in to just one attacking move; proceed to stack up hazards until you die. I went with 252 HP /252 Spd / 6 Def, with a Timid nature.

I find it more appealing than Azelf because it has access to Spikes and has the defense to withstand Dragon-type attacks and manage to set some layers of Spikes up. Despite Azelf's speed its own Taunt isn't getting past Prankster users, and a select few other Pokemon.
 
I've been testing Deo-D on my test alt for a while now and it has worked pretty well.Unlike Taylor,I used it as a defense against OU's strongest fighting types and it's very good at it too.Not to mention unlike most fighting type counters it's quite bulky on both defensive sides even with no investment in one.I've been running a set of taunt,toxic,seismic toss and recover so far and it counters fighting types well(Conkeldurr is kind of a problem with my set but that can be remedied by running psychic i guess i just don't run it coz my team counters Conkel well),is a good counter to stall and is good at outstalling in general.the only problem i've faced so far is how Deo can't do anything to Scizor apart from Seismic toss'ing it before it U-turn's/SD's since it doesn't get WoW like Mew.
 
OU- Getting better from it's former state. I also agree I would enjoy scrafty/metagross in uu. But i cant see donphan doing well, and jolteon may end up as a mini-rotom of sorts, but not as good.

UU- Im gonna miss Zam and donphan, but outside of that it seems like it will definately be fun. Exit chansey, enter swampert/hitmontop/sawsbuck combo.

RU- 1 word, YES! Im gonna love ru this time around. the only downside is cres, but i can deal with that blamish with drapion or spiritomb. Sigilyph is one of my fav pokes to use, especially with a LO 4 attack set, it WRECKS in ou, let alone uu and likely ru. Im gonna abuse whimsicott too, but not as much.

NU- Dx. There goes my former fav tier. what am i going to do without my specs klingklang? Glad to see swellow rise to the powerhouse of the tier, but it will require some major shifts to stop. I guess i could start using bulky regirock. I wonder how walrein would fare in nu now with rhydon, klingklang and stuff out, but should be wary of newly aquired victreebel.
 
OU - I am acutally suprised by Dugtrio's and Alakazam's jump. Alakazam especially because we know that Reuninclus is so much better. Chansey and Mamoswine I was already especting since Chansey is much better than Blissey now with eviolite and Mamoswine got a boost over the past couple of weeks.

UU - Bye Donphan (though with Deoxys-S ban that was expected). I am actually shocked that Swampert droped from OU. Wonder who is repleacing Chansey here.

RU - Wow Aerodactyl keeps falling how the mighty has fallen. Same for Cresselia.
 
Alakazam especially because we know that Reuninclus is so much better.
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Not necessarily. While Reuniclus is a much better Calm Mind user than Alakazam, Alakazam pulls off a better Substitute + 3 attacks set, which Reuniclus can't really pull off since it's so slow.

Sir said:
lol scafty is still ou
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This. Is getting STAB on both Dark and Fighting really that big? Having to either use Drain Punch (weak) or Hi Jump Kick (reckless) is still not that appealing IMO.

Also, just pointing this out, you spelled it wrong. It's Scrafty.
 
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