Metagame NP ZU Stage 7: Como La Flor - Heat Rock and Venomoth banned, Vulpix free #19

[Tuthur]

With 38 drops, the ZU council unanimously agreed to free ZUBL. Tagging Marty and dhelmise. Thank you.

Drops

Appletun moved from PU to ZU
Articuno moved from PU to ZU
Avalugg-Hisui moved from PU to ZU
Basculin moved from PU to ZU
Bellossom moved from PU to ZU
Crabominable moved from PU to ZU
Cryogonal moved from PU to ZU
Dewgong moved from PU to ZU
Eelektross moved from PU to ZU
Exeggutor moved from PU to ZU
Glaceon moved from PU to ZU
Granbull moved from PU to ZU
Gurdurr moved from PU to ZU
Komala moved from PU to ZU
Lilligant moved from PU to ZU
Lurantis moved from PU to ZU
Magneton moved from PU to ZU
Medicham moved from PU to ZU
Meowstic moved from PU to ZU
Minun moved from PU to ZU
Oricorio-Pa'u moved from PU to ZU
Orthworm moved from PU to ZU
Persian-Alola moved from PU to ZU
Piloswine moved from PU to ZU
Plusle moved from PU to ZU
Probopass moved from PU to ZU
Pyroar moved from PU to ZU
Raichu-Alola moved from PU to ZU
Regice moved from PU to ZU
Samurott moved from PU to ZU
Shaymin moved from PU to ZU
Shiftry moved from PU to ZU
Spiritomb moved from PU to ZU
Swanna moved from PU to ZU
Toucannon moved from PU to ZU
Veluza moved from PU to ZU
Vivillon moved from PU to ZU
Zebstrika moved from PU to ZU

 

[Welcome to mars]

this might be the biggest shift gen 9 zu has seen so far

shaymin and the comically overpowed medicham have already caused massive power creep amongst the tier, every mid tier pokemon except ampharos is struggling to keep up in this entirely different metagame, and some may fall out entirely

and i doubt glaceon will even be half of the powerful wallbreaker it once was, its slow and weak to alot meaning anything with an ice resist or a strong pokemon speed stat above 65 speed will threaten overwhelm its prized specs set, i personally
think it will be entirely unviable next month
a pokemon i want to bring up for being an amazing glue mon that isn’t articuno is magneton who has returned to zu after a gen 8 ban and rise to pu

its pretty bulky with eviolite and hp investment and has one of the highest special attack stats along with the flawed but very useful volt switch, it puts alot of work every game and hits hard
if it had an actually good movepool we wouldn’t even be dreaming of magneton in ZU because of its typing, solid bulk and sheer power

Magneton @ Eviolite
Ability: Analytic
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 SpA / 4 SpD
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Flash Cannon
- Thunderbolt
- Volt Switch
- Magnet Rise
a bulky steel type with amazing breaking power and direct pivoting, we may never have it this good again

 

[wooper]

the freeing of zubl sees the following pokemon back in the zu tier:


i'd love to know folks' initial thoughts on any and all of the newly available 53 mons, as well as mons that were previously available! are any zu veterans like sneasel, combusken, whiscash, and tinkatuff still good, or was the powercreep too much for them? i personally think sun might be too cracked, with the addition of shiftry, exeggutor, and pyroar, with the re-addition of vulpix, and the recently-freed heat rock

 

[Monai]

Since one liners are not allowed because tuthur is LAME, I will elaborate on why I think Shaymin is broken. Shaymin in theory is countered by generally bulky Pokemon like av eel, faster attackers like Tauros, pyroar, and scarfers like pauros, and is checked by walls like Spdef orthoworm. While all these Pokemon are excellent, Shaymin's ability to raw dog its checks with seed flares (no drops either) is quite extreme, and the movepool gives it enough tools to crack games open. I've been partial to sub leech, hwish, and 3 attacks as options, and they drastically change counterplay to HEDGEhog. I think checking shaymin more than like once is too difficult, and until we get more drops I'll be pro ban for now.

 

[plznostep]

February Tier Shifts
Hello ZU. These Tier Shifts are quite big and I can't really be bothered to speak about them all, so I'll talk about the ones I have used and enjoyed thus far.
As usual, thanks to the PMD Sprite Repository for the cute sprites

Articuno

Set

Articuno @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Steel / Dragon
EVs: 252 HP / 204 SpD / 52 Spe
Calm Nature
- Freeze-Dry
- U-turn
- Roost
- Haze

A really important Pokemon who dropped. Answers some new scary Pokemon like Shaymin, Bellossom, and Oricorio-Pa'u quite well as blanket checks a majority of other special attackers as well. Haze is crucial to stopping Quiver Dancers like the aforementioned Oricorio-Pa'u from sweeping you and its longevity when combined with Roost allows it to check them long term. U-turn is another tool that allows you to get frail wallbreakers like Medicham in.

Eelektross

Set

Eelektross @ Assault Vest
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Steel / Dragon
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Sassy Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Discharge
- Giga Drain
- Knock Off
- U-turn

Eelektross @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Steel / Dragon
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Drain Punch
- Knock Off
- Thunder Punch / Substitute
- Coil

Eelektross stands out as a bulky check to just about everything in the tier thanks to having no weaknesses due to Levitate and a great movepool as well. AV synergizes well with Levitate giving Eelektross an immunity to Spikes and patching up its relatively okay bulk to a super good level. Eelektross also has access to Coil which is also a very scary set considering you have to rely on pure firepower to break Eeletkross. Overall another top tier, keep an eye out for it.

Shaymin

Set

Shaymin @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Natural Cure
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Seed Flare
- Earth Power
- Air Slash / Dazzling Gleam
- Healing Wish

Shaymin @ Life Orb
Ability: Natural Cure
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Seed Flare
- Earth Power
- Air Slash / Dazzling Gleam
- Synthesis

Shaymin cements itself as a tier staple due to an amazing STAB move in Seed Flare and great stats all round. It's utility is also amazing with access to moves like Healing Wish that can support teammates such as Oricorio-Pa'u for instance once Shaymin is low. Shaymin has great set diversity with Life Orb and Scarf sets standing out to me at first glance. Overall just really good in general, I don't think its too broken considering Articuno is a very tough matchup for it but we'll have to see.

Medicham

Set

Medicham @ Choice Scarf / Choice Band
Ability: Pure Power
Tera Type: Fairy / Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Zen Headbutt
- Tera Blast / Ice Punch
- Trick

Medicham thus far seems like its very good, but not broken at first impressions thanks to the additions of Spiritomb and Oricorio-Pa'u who are two very common Pokemon at the moment. It is of course super powerful however and is probably one of the best Choice users available to use with either Choice Scarf or Band depending on if you want it to clean or break. It's quite hard to get on the field too since its bulk is not very good whatsoever, so it requires a pivot to make use of it.

Spiritomb

Set

Spiritomb @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Fairy / Poison
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Foul Play
- Night Shade
- Will-O-Wisp / Toxic
- Pain Split

Spiritomb @ Leftovers
Ability: Pressure
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Dark Pulse
- Psyshock / Pain Split / Shadow Ball
- Nasty Plot
- Trick Room

Now this is a really good Pokemon. Defensively is one of the best Pokemon to use with recovery in Pain Split and access to status with Will O Wisp and Toxic. It also has access to consistent damage in Night Shade and Foul Play to punish physical attackers boosting in front of it. What makes Spiritomb even better is its set diversity. Offensive Trick Room Spiritomb completely flips Spiritombs awful speed into an asset making it outspeed basically everything in the tier and boost up using Nasty Plot. This makes Spiritomb a great asset for Hyper Offense and Balance teams alike.

Orthworm

Set

Orthworm @ Leftovers
Ability: Earth Eater
Tera Type: Ghost / Electric
EVs: 252 HP / 40 Def / 216 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Tail
- Body Press / Rock Slide / Tera Blast
- Coil
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Substitute
(speed is for Modest Magneton)

Another impactful addition, Orthworm is a great defensive addition to any team with is Steel-typing while giving you a setup sweeper in Coil and hazard support at the same time. It can find setup opportunities on Articuno and start using Coil, which has the benefit of increasing Iron Tails accuracy meaning Orthworm has a high power Steel-type move with an additional secondary effect of lowering defense which comes up quite often.

Oricorio-Pa'u

Set

Oricorio-Pa'u @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Dancer
Tera Type: Fairy / Ground / Fighting
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
IVs: 0 Atk
- Revelation Dance / Air Slash
- Air Slash / Hurricane / Taunt
- Roost
- Quiver Dance

Oricorio-Pa'u stands out as a Quiver Dance user who also does well into our other Quiver Dancers like Lilligant and Bellossom thanks to its ability in Dancer. Additionally, Relevation Dance + Terastallization gives it some nasty Tera potential giving it the ability to change its offensive and defensive profile at the same time. When combined with access to reliable recovery, a great defensive typing for switching into threats like Medicham, and a versatile moveset including Taunt for Pokemon like Articuno, you have yourself a very scary setup sweeper. Thankfully, it seems it can be put at bay due to the existance of Eelektross who beats all sets and Articuno, who beats all but Taunt.

Avalugg-Hisui

Set

Avalugg-Hisui @ Custap Berry
Ability: Sturdy
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Mountain Gale
- Body Press
- Rapid Spin
- Stealth Rock

Avalugg-Hisui @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Sturdy
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Impish Nature
- Mountain Gale
- Body Press
- Recover
- Rapid Spin

Avalugg-Hisui doesn't really look to notable until you realise it has Sturdy, Stealth Rocks, and Rapid Spin. This combines to make it the best Custap Berry lead the tier has the offer, especially since Avalugg-Hisui is quite threatening offensively boasting an amazing attack stat and good coverage. Additionally, Avalugg-Hisui can assume a defensive role and when combined with Tera, it walls a majority of the physical attackers in the tier making it a worthy consideration for that role as well.

Pyroar

Set

Pyroar @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Unnerve
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Fire Blast
- Tera Blast
- Will-O-Wisp
- Taunt

Pyroar is the best Fire-type in the tier, no competition. It hit's very hard and can utilize Terastallization quite well with Tera Blast to hit Fire resistant Pokemon like Whiscash. It's fast speed and Will O Wisp can also be quite annoying for some physical attackers like Samurott to switch into as well and walls do not appreciate taking the residual burn damage as well. Taunt can also see use to prevent healing from Pokemon like Appletun and Tera Dragon Articuno. And finally, Pyroar's speed tier is absolutely amazing. Out of the relevant Pokemon left, it is only outsped by Pokemon like Raichu-Alola, Persian-Alola, Electrode, Sneasel, Dugtrio-Alola, Tauros and Zebstrika. Everything else is outsped by Pyroar and is liable to be hit by it's strong Fire STAB if not running scarf.​

 

[Dorsia]

These new drops are huge, I guess I have to start a team from zero. Meanwhile the meta stabilises a bit, let me share you my Trick Room team:

https://pokepast.es/461bf78ee448e29b



The Trick Room setters

is probably the best lead you can have; Mental Herb combined with Sturdy always guarantee you to set up TR. Mental Herb also prevents Encore (which would result in cancelling TR). Body Press does decent damage while Misty Explosion allows you to bring your wallbreaker once the job is done. Its main problem is actually Iron Head + flinch.

is marvelous as it brings so many utility with TR, Magic Bounce and Healing Wish. Future Sight does decent damage and Mystical Fire chip Steel types while the SpA drop may be useful to bring another mon.

it's decently bulky enough and Revival Blessing is precious, plus it's pairing perfectly with Hattrem's Healing Wish.

The cleaners

this thing is so good and I'm glad it lands here. did a solid job back then but Spiritomb honestly saved me so many games in PU. It's bulky and strong, even Dark types can't switch in safely after +2.

this slot used to be but I think Lurantis will do a better job thanks to its better bulk and its snowball capability.

I feel like Punching Gloves is ok but HDB could be better overall. It's just strong and has the coverage it needs.

 

[LettuceLeaf07]

I have been looking for a reason to get into ZU ever since PUWC, and now that my favorite mons to use around that time are ZU legal, I thought I'd give it a shot.

Especially with this post I made for PU, there was no way I could avoid trying trick room in this meta. The only relevant mon from that post that isn't in ZU is Clawitzer, and after getting swept by a Veluza I figured out that Exeggutor is a good replacement.

Here's the team for ZU: | (high enough ladder replay)

I know this team looks exactly like the one Dorsia just posted, only with Exeggutor > Rabsca and Eel > Hattrem. I think that Tomb + Crab is the best way to run full trick room, and Lurantis and Carbink offer utility in defog and hazards that fits perfectly onto tr. I think that Eel is a little questionable but I like the water coverage and setup opportunity it presents, and Lunge helps it hit grass types.

In addition to Trick Room, Rain is another playstyle that I like. I am overjoyed that Golduck is 'High' on the viability list since I rarely see anything that lives a +2 rain-boosted mystic water surf. Here's a replay and a team. If I didn't feel like I needed to stop procrastinating I'd tell you what beartic is doing there. Have fun!

 

[Tuthur]

ZU got some new toys

Braviary moved from PU to ZU
Dipplin moved from PU to ZU
Dodrio moved from PU to ZU
Farigiraf moved from PU to ZU
Magmortar moved from PU to ZU
Meganium moved from PU to ZU
Muk moved from PU to ZU
Oricorio moved from PU to ZU
Primeape moved from PU to ZU
Regigigas moved from PU to ZU
Sneasel-Hisui moved from PU to ZU
Venomoth moved from PU to ZU

 

[Melons-N-Soda]

First impressions:

have the potential to be really stupid set-up mons. Latter two benefit from the fact our Steels are either uber passive or have bad SpD. Primeape looks to be the most manageable of these, and IMO if it does stay I imagine it'll be a key part of the meta with Scarf and even Stealth Rock sets, in addition to of course Bulk Up Rage Fist.

is an Appletun that trades Apple Acid and more practical ability for far greater bulk.

I'm super hyped for, as Flying + Fighting coverage with Knock nukes a lot of the tier, though its really fragile.

is a bulkier Dodrio but I feel it has quite a bit of potential, Bulk Up sets for one. Its also a Defogger so take that for what it's worth.

fuck off. (this one I put in a different section from Moth and Giraf because there's 0 way an Oricorio with an actually usable defensive typing is okay here)

sadly doesn't have much of a niche over the other Grass-types beyond Knock, so you can kinda pretend to be SS Tangela but not really.

gimmick mon that's only marginally helped by Tera.

however is looking to be a staple, handling most of our Special Attackers sans Indeedee really well. It gaining Knock and T-Spikes this gen is quite huge for it. You could also try stuff like CroMuk or even AV/Band, but those sets I'm unsure of the exact viability. Either way, rip Swalot.

Either really broken or just really solid. Hard to say, but it having relatively poor coverage (plus the fact that regular Sneasel is a top 5 mon I feel like still) is a knock against it.

really good breaker held back by unfortunate Speed tier. Choiced sets look to be better served by Pyroar though.

 

[Tuthur]

My first impression is that once again killed defensive playstyles. Dipplin and Muk offer two great defensive options but we got so many new threats and Defog got so much worse with two new Defiant users and some other mon taking advantage of Gurdurr and Lurantis.

Putting these two together as the obvious broken to me. We lack consistent Flying resists able to switch-into their Fighting-coverage. Braviary can run a ton of sets from various bulk up variants to sheer force sky attack nuke, with an insane stats all around the board for ZU. On the other hand, Dodrio is a better Tauros, same speed tier, worse bulk, and forced to run Heavy-Duty Boots, however Brave Bird is such an upgrade from Sheer Force Body Slam, given the recoil isn't that bad and we don't have good Flying-resists willing to come onto Knock Off and Low Kick. It got SD to break through walls and even Quick Attack to threaten faster attackers like Sneasel and Choice Scarf users.

That mon is really good, but it has obvious answers like Sableye, Spiritomb, Muk, and physically defensive Whiscash. Anything with a tera Poison / Ghost should be able to handle it, though I'm not really happy with its ability to use tera to find better setup opportunities (its Eviolite boosted bulk is more than what you'd expect from a Sneasel) and let it beat Ghost-types with Tera-Dark / Ghost, and Ground types / Scarfer with Tera-Grass Trailblaze. I think it is fine to keep around at the moment, but it should probably be banned in the future.

Curiously enough, it hasn't felt broken to me atm. The metagame might be too offensive at the moment, but oricorio usually either lacked power or bulk in the games I play. Given the counterplay to it is worse than when it got banned from SV NU earlier this gen, I don't think we will keep it for long, but it is fine to stay for the time being.

I don't have much to say on these three. Some people thought they'd be broken, but they happened to be quite manageable in practice. Without Sleep Powder, Venomoth quite struggles to get multiple Quiver Dance in. It has two main sets in Quiver Dance + 3 Atk (STABs + Psychic / Psychic Noise) and SubDisableQD mono attacker, and both seemed to have sufficient counterplay, while also being unable to break through oricorio outside well timed Sludge Bomb poisons. Farigiraf has a sort of 4mss, were it wants NP, a speed control move (TR / Agility), both STABs, and Dazzling Gleam to hit Sableye / Spiritomb, so it felt kinda manageable, especially since it needs so many turns. Primeape is quite overrated as setup users. Offensive SR and Choice Sets seemed far better, or maybe even an offensive Bulk Up user, but bulky sets are just terrible. Rage Fist is an amazing move, but without STAB and with Drain Punch as only recovery, Primeape doesn't make for an amazing user. Obvious do not ban on all of them, even if Venomoth might become a problem if we ever have to lose Oricorio.

Not a setup user, but an insane wallbreaker. Whiscash and Appletun can handle it, and Oricorio and Muk can kinda too, even if they all really dislike Knock Off. I don't think this Pokemon will stay in the tier in the long run, given how powerful it is, but in this HO meta, it is too slow to be considered banworthy. It is the Pokemon I'm voting Do not ban on, im the most convinced will become broken behind Sneasel.

tldr: ban braviary, dodrio ; might ban oricorio, sneasel, and magmortar later ; no reason to ban the rest

 

[sinnabyss]

Thoughts on the new mons after some laddering

Very powerful mon, a bit held back by mediocre speed but it hits hard in return. Servicable bulk, defiant is nice in some scenarios. Bulk up or defog is probably what itll be running. Not really broken imo.

Bulky af, but gets worn down by hazards and doesnt really do anything. Dragon tail is really all the utility it has. Appletun was fine, so ig dipp will be fine aswell.

Super fast and hits hard since we have like no flying resists. Low kick and knock off is all it needs, and swords dance makes it even scarier. Might be broken.

Havent really seen enough of it to decide, but the potential is definitely there. OTR and double dance are both super threatening, Not exactly a tera hog but can struggle without it. Needs a lot of turns to set up, which holds it back a bit.

Despite seeming like worse pyroar at first, mortar hits much harder and has knock, as well as actual coverage. Flame body can be nice for clutch scenarios. Low speed really hurts it, as well as being forced into boots. Cool mon, not at all problematic, but if the meta shifts to be more defensive then it may cause problems.

Legends AZ will perhaps grant my sweet baby dino the love it deserves.

The fall of swalot has arrived, Super good glue mon with knock, toxic, haze etc and can eat special hits for days. Is really only held back by lack of recovery. Very solid.

Honestly, this mon isnt as i thought it would be. Not a ton of setup opportunity, and is pretty reliant on tera to get any. If it does get to QD then it can get scary, especially if it gets off more than one. Fine for the time being, but keep an eye on it.

:primape: The only thing really giving primape a niche over pauros is dp and rage fist. Bulk up sets are great into certain teams but feels like a matchup fish honestly. Will be interesting to see good use of it, but for now is managable.

Yeah remember when jsneas was problematic? Now, give it stab cc, no rocks weakness, and surprisingly decent bulk with eviolite and weird typing. The only mons that can outspeed it besides gimmick mons are scarfers, and if you get off a trailblaze than those arent answers anymore. Very limited counterplay, feels super straining in and out of battle. Ban pls.

OU has gutted it of any real viability. Without sleep powder to create setup and mindgames, moth is far too fragile to really get setup opportuniy. Sub disable is really the only way for it to get any chance to dance. Curse you darkrai / ival.

No mind to think. No will to break, No voice to cry suffering, as the cruel gods toy and mock the tormented souls. They scream and cry out for anything, but no mercy is shown. Even the sweet release of nonexistence seems like heaven to those condemmed by the heartless deity known as gamefreak.

 

[Tuthur]

The SV ZU council voted on some of the new drops, and here are the results!

	Outcome	Corthius	Danny	Drud	fish anemometer	LustfulLice	Monai	OranBerryBlissey10	Tuthur
Braviary	Ban	Ban	Ban	DNB	ban	Ban	Ban	Do not ban	Ban
Dodrio	Ban	Ban	Ban	Ban	ban	Ban	Ban	Do not ban	Ban
Farigiraf	Do not ban	Do not ban	DNB	DNB	dnb	Do not ban	DNB	Do not ban	Do not ban
Magmortar	Do not ban	Do not ban	Dnb	DNB	ban	Do not ban	DNB	Do not ban	Do not ban
Oricorio	Do not ban	Ban	Dnb	Ban	dnb	Ban	Ban	Ban	Do not ban
Primeape	Do not ban	Do not ban	Dnb	DNB	dnb	Do not ban	Ban	Do not ban	Do not ban
Sneasel-Hisui	Do not ban	Do not ban	Dnb	Ban	ban	Do not ban	DNB	Do not ban	Do not ban
Venomoth	Do not ban	Do not ban	Dnb	DNB	dnb	Do not ban	DNB	Do not ban	Do not ban

As a reminder, the banthreshold for quickbans is 2/3, which means Oricorio is not banned, despite having a majority of ban votes. Nonetheless, as a result of this vote, Braviary and Dodrio are banned from SV ZU! Tagging Marty and dhelmise to implement the ban on PS. Thank you.
The council will keep an eye on the other threats, especialy Oricorio and Sneasel-Hisui which received multiple ban votes. Stay tuned.

 

[Tuthur]

It's been almost two weeks since Braviary's and Dodrio's ban, allowing for more diversity in the teambuilder. However, four Pokemon stand out as potential problematic elements in the metagame; and the SV ZU council decided to hold a quickban slate on them. Here are the results.

	Outcome	Corthius	Danny	Drud	fish anemometer	LustfulLice	Monai	OranBerryBlissey10	Tuthur
Farigiraf	Ban	ban	Ban	Ban	ban	ban	BAN	Ban	Ban
Magmortar	DNB	dnb	Dnb	DNB	dnb	DNB	DNB	dnb	DNB
Oricorio	Ban	ban	Ban	Ban	ban	Ban	BAN	Ban	Ban
Sneasel-Hisui	DNB	dnb	Dnb	Ban	dnb	DNB	BAN	dnb	DNB

Oricorio had barely missed the 6/8 ban threshold last slate, and eventually proved to be too much with its Quiver Dance sets. With Quiver Dance, Oricorio can easily overpower and outspeed most teams. Unlike its Pa'u counterpart, it can make better use of Revelation Dance, as it gets a much better neutral coverage and the only immunities to it are very niche Pokemon like Dachsbun and Houndoom, meaning it relies less on tera. Fire / Flying is also a much better defensive typing, notably missing out on Ice, Dark, and Ghost weakness that are quite common in the tier. Tera Fairy mono attacker sets could seat on most teams that don't have a Muk, while double attacker had great coverage and could make use of Tera Ground or Grass to hit certain threats like Naclstack, Muk, and Whiscash. Overall, Oricorio's lack of counterplay, and ability to pick its checks and counters with no drawback due to the tera interaction with Revelation Dance made it quite often unmanageable in game, hence broken.

While Farigiraf was initially deemed to be one of the least problematic drops, as shown by its 0 ban votes last slate, due to it struggling to pick moveslots that hit the whole tier, further metagame developpment proved this idea was flawed. Spiritomb and Sableye might be immune to Farigiraf's STAB moves, but they get blown away if Farigiraf uses tera. Much like Oricorio's Revelation Dance, Farigiraf's Terablast is a terrifying STAB move that comes with 0 opportunity cost and allows Farigiraf to nuke its checks. With outstanding bulk, Farigiraf can easily run double dance sets, using Nasty Plot + Trick Room or Agility and then demolish everything with the combination of Psyshock and Terablast, letting it fire off Nasty Plot boosted STAB attacks both on the special and physical side. Farigiraf is also immune to priorities, making it very hard to revenge kill, even if you managed to get two hits on it while it setup, and the uncertainty on what coverage Farigiraf has, until it commits tera, mean the counterplay to Farigiraf was deemed unsufficient.

Sneasel-Hisui avoided the ban. Despite its great offensive profile paired with a solid Eviolited boosted bulk, Toxic Spikes immunity, and Stealth Rock resistance, Sneasel-Hisui STAB combination leaves it unprepared for Ghost- and Poison-types. While Tera-Dark and -Ghost powers up its coverage for Ghost-types, the base power of Throat Chop and Shadow Claw is quite underwhelming and can't make up for the ease to revenge kill with Choice Scarf users and opposing Sneasel-Hisui. Likewise, Trailblaze lets it outspeed Choice Scarf users but gives Sneasel-Hisui no tool to break past Ghost- and Poison-types. The council is still discussing what will come next with this Pokemon, so don't be surprise if further actions are taken on it.

​

Tagging dhelmise and Marty to implement Oricorio-Baile and Farigiraf ban from SV ZU. Thank you.

 

[Dorsia]

moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU
moved from PU to ZU

Thoughts on these?


Malamar @ Leftovers
Ability: Contrary
Tera Type: Poison / Steel / Fighting
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Atk / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Superpower
- Knock Off
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

This set is quite old but should still be fine. Thanks to its good typing, Malamar has a few weakness (Bug/Fairy) which are easily covered thanks to Tera Poison/Steel. Fighting gives STAB on Superpower and resist to Bug types but you still lose to Fairy.


Magmortar (M) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Flame Body
Tera Type: Grass / Fighting
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Flamethrower / Fire Blast
- Thunderbolt
- Tera Blast / Focus Blast
- Acid Spray / WoW

Acid Spray can punish a switch-in and Tera Blast Grass gives you more coverage to hit things like Rhydon.


Rotom @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch
- Thunderbolt
- Shadow Ball
- Trick

Classic set with a very nice speed tier.

 

[Melons-N-Soda]

So yeah drops.

Part of me wants to be good or at least niche in the same way Crabominable is though the unfortunate manner is that for the most part Lycanroc-Midnight outclasses it. That being said that power is still undeniable and maybe some TR build might make use of it.

is cope for people who want a Steel with not crap SpD. Tera does help it as does things like Body Press or Foul Play but its still mostly a passive blob that lets too much in for free.

enables Snow which has a few abusers (Frosmoth and Beartic being the most notable funny enough). As a mon by itself I'm not 100% sure of its value but it does get unique coverage compared to its competition like Shaymin.

could maybe do stuff in Snow but its too weak and too slow for physical sets and special sets have competition with a lot of other Ice-types.

is another Snow abuser. Unlike Lapras though I see this being pretty good in general cause Ice Scales comboes really well with Tera and Quiver Dance is a good move. Not sure what Tera it'd use but there's a couple I can think of.

has stronger physical Electric STAB (albeit you're cockblocked by Electric immunes of which we have plenty), and now has access to Trailblaze, Bulk Up, and Knock Off. That being said I'm not sure it's worth using your Electric slot on this in general given the general utility of Rotom or Eel, or Morpeko having actually reliable physical Electric STAB.

good spinner and solid breaker in general. Tera comboes well with Aura Wheel. Not much more to say.

either this ends up top 3 mon or just busted. Either way expect to see this on a good chunk of teams alongside Rotom.

cockblocks Basculin almost entirely especially with Tera Dark, and in general is good as a bulky Water which we don't have much of ATM.

does SS ZU Rhydon things but now it can have an actual ability thanks to Tera. Good mon, probably the best bulky Ground for sure.

same mon as last gen but with Tera. Annoying but not really broken.

the main reasons you use this over other Grass-types is SPEEN, Knock Off, and Spikes. Yes even with a god-awful ability Spikes are quite helpful. I did meme an AoA set in RU a long time ago though I'm not sure of the value of an offensive Toedscruel. If this thing got Earthquake I'd consider it a lot more but it strangely doesn't?

a million sets and unlike Hisuian Sneasel has good coverage for Ghost-types. If anything has a chance of being dumb its this IMO.

fairly straight forward mon. I feel like the meta is offensive enough to where this will be more manageable than last time but whose to say.

I'm not 100% sure what this does but with that stat spread and neat movepool options surely it can't be bad, right?

 

[Lauhdcris]

Just going to slap this here:

Poliwrath @ Assault Vest
Ability: Water Absorb
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 248 HP / 188 Atk / 72 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Circle Throw
- Liquidation
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch


Takes hits surprisingly well, while also dealing serviceable damage. Is great at stopping setup threats such as Bulk up Paldean tauros, Sammurott, and venomoth. Works well with other walls like dipplin.

 

[plznostep]

April Shifts

First Impressions on the ZU Meta

Banworthy Pokemon

Malamar

Set

Malamar @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Contrary
Tera Type: Poison / Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Superpower
- Knock Off / Psycho Cut / Tera Blast
- Sleep Talk
- Rest

Malamar has stood out to me as a unhealthy presence in the tier. The one Pokemon that has been able to consistently stand up to Malamar so far has been Spiritomb, but Malamar can run options such as Tera Blast Fairy to potentially get around this. Outside of that, Malamar is very difficult to answer with great bulk and Terastallization allowing it to shed its awful typing and Superpower to boost with Contrary. Knock Off in its arsenal additionally makes it able to cripple its answers on the switch, making it more difficult to answer.

Frosmoth

Set

Frosmoth @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Ice Scales
Tera Type: Fighting / Ground / Fire
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Ice Beam
- Tera Blast
- Bug Buzz
- Quiver Dance

Frosmoth is a really dangerous Pokemon in the metagame. Quiver Dance makes it a threatening setup sweeper in a tier where Ice-resistances are limited to Steel-types like Orthworm, a Pokemon with horrible Special Defense and one Frosmoth is able to hit via Terastallization along with Fire-types that Frosmoth can also deal with similarly. So far, checks have included Muk and Passimian, the best being Muk being able to beat it 1v1 while Passimian can only switch in if its at full health. These answers still aren't fool proof either however, as Frosmoth has Tera Ground additionally to beat Muk and Passimian is not a long term solution, only being able to either switch in once or revenge kill with Scarf when Frosmoth is at +1.

Vulpix

Set

Vulpix @ Heat Rock
Ability: Drought
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Weather Ball
- Energy Ball
- Healing Wish
- Encore
(Vulpix isn't broken, it's ability is though)

Vulpix has Drought which enables Pokemon such as Scovillain, Victreebel, Shiftry and even more to break open the tiers defensive walls. Fire-types are relatively difficult to answer in general within the tier due to a lack of bulky Water- and Dragon-types available, meaning steamrolling teams can be fairly easy to do once weather has been setup. It is just really difficult to deal with in general and overwhelms defensive answers quite quickly.

Metagame Staples

Passimian

Set

Passimian @ Choice Scarf / Choice Band
Ability: Defiant
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Knock Off
- U-turn
- Earthquake / Gunk Shot

Passimian stands out as one of the best Pokemon in the tier thanks to its amazing movepool with options such as Knock Off for crippling its answers and U-turn to pivot out of it's poor matchups. Additionally, it has amazing stats, with particularly great physical bulk and attack allowing it to take hits and fire off strong attacks at the same time. Overall, a very splashable and great Pokemon in the tier to use.

Rotom

Set

Rotom @ Choice Scarf / Choice Specs
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Volt Switch
- Shadow Ball
- Will-O-Wisp / Nasty Plot
- Trick

Rotom @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Thunderbolt
- Hex / Shadow Ball
- Will-O-Wisp / Nasty Plot
- Substitute

Rotom boasts a great defensive profile with it's Ghost-typing allowing it to check Fighting-types like Passimian while also being potent offensively with a great STAB combination of Electric/Ghost and a movepool which gives it a way of spreading status in Will-O-Wisp for Pokemon like Rhydon and Muk, boost its offensive stats with Nasty Plot, or Trick a Choice Item onto a Pokemon it is walled by, such as Arboliva. It makes for a great VoltTurn pair with Passimian as well, with Passimian additionally being able to threaten our resident Ground-types in Rhydon and Toedscruel.

Muk

Set

Muk @ Leftovers
Ability: Sticky Hold / Poison Touch
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Poison Jab
- Knock Off
- Haze / Drain Punch / Shadow Sneak
- Protect

Muk @ Leftovers
Ability: Sticky Hold
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Poison Jab
- Knock Off
- Drain Punch
- Curse

Muk functions very well as a blanket special wall in the tier being able to take on Pokemon like Pyroar, Rotom, Arboliva, and many more. It's movepool is also excellent with tools such as Knock Off to punish Pokemon like Orthworm or Rhydon for switching into it. It also has boosting options such as Curse meaning it can work as a wincon lategame as well. Definitely a contender for best Pokemon in the tier with how splashable it is and how much it offers in one slot.

Orthworm

Set

Orthworm @ Leftovers
Ability: Earth Eater
Tera Type: Ghost / Electric
EVs: 252 HP / 40 Def / 216 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Tail
- Body Press / Rock Slide / Tera Blast
- Coil
- Stealth Rock / Spikes / Substitute

Orthworm has an amazing typing and ability allowing it answer Ground-types like Rhydon and Piloswine and other Pokemon such as Sneasel and Morpeko. Orthworm can be quite threatening itself if it gets opportunities to setup with Coil and leveraging its good bulk and Substitute to take advantage of Pokemon such as Muk and Dipplin. It's access to hazards such as Stealth Rock and Spikes is also great, as hazards are quite powerful in this metagame.

Toedscruel

Set

Toedscruel @ Leftovers
Ability: Mycelium Might
Tera Type: Steel / Water
EVs: 252 HP / 240 SpD / 16 Spe
Calm Nature
- Earth Power
- Knock Off
- Toxic
- Rapid Spin

Toedscruel @ Assault Vest
Ability: Mycelium Might
Tera Type: Steel
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Leaf Storm
- Earth Power
- Knock Off
- Rapid Spin

Toedscruel has an incredibly vast movepool with options such as Knock Off, Toxic, Rapid Spin, and Spikes which it can offer to your team along with amazing special defenses and a decent typing allowing it to take on Electric-types like Rotom. The hazard removal it offers to teams is crucial for many balance teams and unlike spinners such as Quaxwell, Toedscruel has ways to pressure Ghost-types through Toxic and Knock Off on defensive sets or going Offensive with its decent offenses. Overall, very good.

Rhydon

Set

Rhydon @ Eviolite
Ability: Rock Head
Tera Type: Dragon
EVs: 248 HP / 176 SpD / 84 Spe
Calm Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Heat Crash / Swords Dance
- Stealth Rock

Rhydon has excellent stats alongside Eviolite making incredibly bulky while also hitting quite hard, making it function quite nicely as an offensive tank in the tier, answering Pokemon like Muk and Rotom. Additionally, it has some great coverage to hit Grass-types like Toedscruel in Heat Crash which can also chip down Orthworm for a bit of damage, but unfortunately not too much due to Orthworm weighing quite a lot in comparison to Orthworm.


Toxicroak

Toxicroak

Toxicroak @ Leftovers / Life Orb
Ability: Dry Skin
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Close Combat
- Gunk Shot
- Knock Off / Sucker Punch
- Swords Dance

Toxicroak @ Leftovers / Life Orb
Ability: Dry Skin
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Focus Blast
- Sludge Wave
- Dark Pulse / Vaccum Wave
- Nasty Plot

Toxicroak @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Dry Skin
Tera Type: Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Gunk Shot
- Close Combat
- Knock Off
- Ice Punch

Toxicroak has a lot of set diversity which makes it quite difficult to answer, making it potentially banworthy but I thought I would exclude it for now because there are at least Pokemon like Spiritomb and Poison-types like Muk can give somewhat give it trouble. However, it is still probably the best breaker in the tier just thanks to how you are not sure of what set it is before it reveals itself and both are equally quite strong. It's no slouch defensively as well, checking Passimian, Poliwrath, and Basculin quite well additionally.

That will be it for now from me. Are there any Pokemon that you think I missed out?
Make a post, I would love to hear your thoughts on the metagame!​

 

[Tuthur]

The ZU council voted on some of the new Pokemon that have been made available on Monday.

	Outcome	Corthius	Danny	Drud	fish anemometer	LustfulLice	Monai	OranBerryBlissey10	Tuthur
Frosmoth	Ban	ban	Ban	ban	ban	ban	ban	Ban	Ban
Malamar	Ban	ban	Ban	ban	ban	ban	ban	Ban	Ban
Poliwrath	DNB	dnb	Dnb	ban	ban	dnb	dnb	DNB	DNB
Vulpix	Ban	ban	Dnb	ban	BAN	ban	ban	DNB	Ban

This should be a surprise for no one to see Frosmoth get unanimous ban support. The counterplay to this Pokemon has been very lacking, the combination of Quiver Dance and Ice Scales lets Frosmoth easily find setup opportunities on most special attackers, and even on some physical attackers if it gets Snow + Aurora Veil support from Abomasnow. All three of Tera Ground, Fire, and Fighting gives it access to a different kind of coverage letting it nail would be checks like Steel-types, Fire-types, Ice-types, and Muk. While physical Choice Scarf users like Passimian and Basculin outspeed Frosmoth they take massive damage from unboosted STAB moves (252 SpA Frosmoth Bug Buzz vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Basculin: 229-271 (81.4 - 96.4%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock, 252 SpA Frosmoth Ice Beam vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Passimian: 216-255 (63.3 - 74.7%) -- guaranteed 2HKO after Stealth Rock), making it very risky to directly switch Choice Scarf users into Frosmoth. Overall, Frosmoth is broken.

The counterplay to Malamar, while more reliable than to Frosmoth, has still felt underwhelming. It is almost impossible to prevent Malamar from getting Superpower boosts as Knock Off can OHKO most Ghost-types, while Sableye can get overwhelmed by RestTalk variants due to its inability to use status moves on Malamar and Recover only having 8 PP. With Tera Fairy, Malamar loses its overwhelming Bug (i.e. U-turn) weakness and can take advantage of the lack of powerful Poison attacks, while threatening out Steel-types with Superpower. Tera Fairy also has the added benefit of blowing away would be checks like Dipplin and defensive Spiritomb if Malamar opts to run Tera Blast. Between its incredible sweep potential with Contrary Superpower, huge progress making with Knock Off, and ability to beat its few counters with Tera Blast Fairy, Malamar has been deemed too much for the tier.

While Vulpix has been in the tier for a while, Drought only became legal this week with PU freeing it. While one of the main sun abuser was Frosmoth, giving it access to Fire-coverage through Weather Ball without needing to commit Tera, there are still plenty of other abusers. SV ZU has a huge amount of extremely threatening Chlorophyll users, starting with Scovillain that abuses the lack of Dragon-types and bulky Fire-types in the tier, being able to brute force everything not named Appletun or Tera-Dragon Muk with Tera-Fire Growth Sun boosted Flamethrower, while outspeeding the totatily of the tier. Shiftry is immune to Prankster and can punch extremely powerful Knock Off, Solar Beam, Sucker Punch, and Heat Wave boosted by Growth or Swords Dance. Exeggutor has access to the combination of Growth and Stored Power, while retaining a good enough Speed tier to outspeed Choice Scarf Passimian and access to Ancient Power to nail Articuno. Leafeon has excellent stats, letting it easily setup and punch holes with Adamant Swords Dance boosted Solar Blade and Tera Dark Knock Off. Victreebel gets a huge amount of options, being able to run physical, special, and mixed sets a like thanks to Growth and good coverage options. There is no clear abuser that stands out in this list, while Vulpix stands out as a setter due to its ability to freely reset sun with no counterplay from the opponent; it can be sacked on a turn, or even sacrifice itself through Healing Wish or even sometimes generate switch-in opportunities with Encore, Will-O-Wisp, or Memento.

Poliwrath can seem like an odd choice to feature on this quickban slate, given how little discussion and complains it generated compared to the other three, but discussions rose in the council chat about the efficiency of Bulk Up sets. Tera-Steel making its Substitute unable to be broken by common (p)hazers like Dipplin, Articuno, and Muk, while STAB Drain Punch keeps it alive and Knock Off makes progress on everything. Poliwrath also has access to a terrifying Belly Drum set under Rain. Most council members didn't encounter much difficulties playing around Poliwrath during their playtest as Pokemon like Abomasnow, Lurantis, Toedscruel, and Sableye prove to be quite annoying for it; while Tera Steel Poliwrath can be taken advantage of by the multiple Fighting-types, especially other Poliwrath and Toxicroak, but also other Tera users like Rhydon.

Frosmoth, Malamar, and Vulpix have been quickbanned from SV ZU. Tagging Marty and dhelmise to implement the bans on PS! please.

 

[Tuthur]

Following the first round of ZUWC, the council thought it was necessary to take action on some elements they deemed as potentially unhealthy.

	Outcome	Corthius	Danny	Drud	fish anemometer	LustfulLice	Monai	OranBerryBlissey10	Tuthur
Heat Rock (+free Vulpix)	Ban	ban	Ban	ban	ban	ban	ban	Ban	Ban
Veluza	Do not ban	dnb	Dnb	ban	ban	ban	Ban	DO NOT BAN	Ban
Venomoth	Ban	ban	Ban	ban	ban	ban	Ban	Ban	Ban

Despite Vulpix's ban, Sun has stayed a problematic playstyle. Even when using sturdy Fire-resists like Tera Dragon Muk and Articuno, teams struggle to fight sun back, unless they use oddly specific counterplay such as Dachsbun or Golduck. The playstyle has just felt overwhelming during the duration of the tournament, and with still a lack of sturdy answers to strong Grass- and Fire-moves, the council has decided to adjust the banlist to banning Heat Rock, while freeing Vulpix.

Venomoth already felt strong earlier, but with Oricorio losing in popularity and players figuring out more optimal sets using Psychic Noise and Morning Sun to overwhelm its counters in the long run, it just feels insanely broken. Tera is no help against Tinted Lens, while Tera and Quiver Dance boosted Bug Buzz gives a huge firepower to Venomoth. Venomoth is also very flexible with sets like Substitute + Disable, Bold Venomoth, or Choice Specs, needing to approached differently than the most standard set. Overall, Venomoth feels out of place in the tier and is just extremely broken.

While less prominent than the other two, some council members raised issues with how easily it seemed for Veluza to create huge holes in opposing teams. Compared to when it first dropped, Dark-types like Alolan Persian and Cacturne have felt out of favor due to the rise of Fighting-types, while Thwackey rose to PU. Moreover, the use of Terablast Fairy has let Veluza beat common Water immunity that could run Tera Dark to combat Veluza. That said, while a majority of the council finds Veluza overwhelming, it felt right under the 66% threashold, and will remain legal in the tier. Veluza is definitely on a lower level than the other two bans, struggling to setup due to needing to sacrifice half of its health, having a lot of common weaknesses, and a subpar Speed tier pre Fillet Away.

As a result, Heat Rock and Venomoth have been banned from SV ZU, while Vulpix has been freed! Tagging dhelmise and Marty to please implement it on PS.

 

[wooper]

As a result, Heat Rock and Venomoth have been banned from SV ZU, while Vulpix has been freed! Tagging dhelmise and Marty to please implement it on PS.

tagging dhelmise and Marty again to implement please!