Under clauses it says Terastal clause
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Metagame Nature Swap
- Thread starter BandedBodyPress
- Start date
You’re looking at the watchlist. That means we’re considering implementing it. Our clauses are under rules, and not watchlist.
I quite like Tera in this honestly.
It's definitely incredibly strong here, but I quite like the opportunity that this OM grants to use Tera Types I would otherwise seldom use on certain Pokemon. Tera Fighting Modest Scyther is one of my favorites right now, honestly (Although I might be the only one willing to run it, especially with Eviolite over Boots). Struggle Bug, Air Cutter, Vacuum Wave, Move of Choice is REALLY fun.
I'm also quite liking Jolly Exeggutor-Alola with a Harvest set. Being able to run a Harvest Substitute Set at 383 Speed is comical, and I'm REALLY appreciating Tera on it as well. Only problem is slot distribution, since I find it really appreciates Leech Seed, and have been finding solid success with Breaking Swipe, on top of Substitute, leaving it only really with one spare slot, which I'm really not sure what would be its best slot.
I'm also kinda liking Impish Slowking, but feel like I need a bit more time with it to know if I'm really sure about it.
It's definitely incredibly strong here, but I quite like the opportunity that this OM grants to use Tera Types I would otherwise seldom use on certain Pokemon. Tera Fighting Modest Scyther is one of my favorites right now, honestly (Although I might be the only one willing to run it, especially with Eviolite over Boots). Struggle Bug, Air Cutter, Vacuum Wave, Move of Choice is REALLY fun.
I'm also quite liking Jolly Exeggutor-Alola with a Harvest set. Being able to run a Harvest Substitute Set at 383 Speed is comical, and I'm REALLY appreciating Tera on it as well. Only problem is slot distribution, since I find it really appreciates Leech Seed, and have been finding solid success with Breaking Swipe, on top of Substitute, leaving it only really with one spare slot, which I'm really not sure what would be its best slot.
I'm also kinda liking Impish Slowking, but feel like I need a bit more time with it to know if I'm really sure about it.
Hey all. As the first player to reach both 1400 elo (#1 on the ladder) and 80.0% GXE, I'd like to share a team that aims to exploit the very essence of Nature Swap. Be warned, however, that many of the Pokemon featured are extremely overpowered; thus, they are highly susceptible to the ban hammer. Without further ado, here is the team, and the description of each member:
70/70/140/85/85/20
Torkoal (F) @ Heat Rock
Ability: Drought
Tera Type: Flying
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpD / 8 Spe
Calm Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Lava Plume
- Earth Power
- Rapid Spin
Honestly, the standard physically defensive Torkoal set commonly used in OU is the best. However, due to the nature of this metagame, we are forced to use specially defensive Torkoal. Earth Power is chosen over Body Press because our defense stat isn't high enough; it is also chosen over Wisp because Lava Plume has a fair chance to burn. The ground coverage helps to inflict damage to opposing Fire types, namely Torkoal and Gouging Fire, in Sun vs. Sun matchups.
105/115/91/65/93/121
Gouging Fire @ Choice Band
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Raging Fury/Flare Blitz
- Heat Crash
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake
Before Gouging Fire was banned in OU, this exact set only used 176 Attack EVs to get the Speed boost under Sun. In Nature Swap, however, we can fully invest into attack without worry. Having a base speed of 121 outside of Sun is also critical to creep major threats like Kingambit that are base 120 speed or lower. Tera Fire allows you to 1HKO Offensive Water Pokemon like Crawdaunt and Primarina, as well as 2HKO various resists.
Please note that once you click Raging Fury, you can't Terastallize. Using Flare Blitz as an alternative eliminates this uncertainty at the cost of taking major recoil damage.
55/55/55/135/135/135
Flutter Mane @ Choice Specs
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Shadow Ball
- Mystical Fire
- Draining Kiss/Psyshock/Power Gem
I struggle to understand what state of mind the council was in to not only consider unbanning Flutter Mane, but also to actually follow through and set the monster free. This thing is extremely broken. It cleaves through offensive teams as if they were A5 Wagyu. Tera Fairy powers up Moonblast to unimaginable levels, landing 1HKOs on Offensive Kingambit and Primarina while most importantly granting a resist to Sucker Punch. Draining Kiss is chosen in the fourth slot to get out of Sucker ranges, but Flutter Mane is clicking Moonblast 95% of the time.
125/73/91/13775/89
Raging Bolt @ Air Balloon
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Naive Nature/Hasty Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Thunderbolt/Weather Ball
- Dragon Pulse/Draco Meteor
- Thunderclap
Raging Bolt is a must have on Sun teams; forgoing the Pokemon means forgoing an easy match-up into Rain teams. Air Balloon is necessary due to the abundance of Great Tusk, as well as to get around this team's non-existent Ground switch-ins.
115/131/87/53/53/131
Great Tusk @ Focus Sash
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Bulk Up
- Headlong Rush
- Ice Spinner
- Rapid Spin
On Hyper Offensive teams, I usually opt for Iron Treads because it can eliminate itself with Steel Beam and is better in dealing with Raging Bolt. However, Great Tusk's newfound 131 Speed in this metagame means that there is absolutely no competition to an offensive Ground spinner. A Focus Sash is used to spin away hazards in a pinch, as well as surviving various special attacks like Raging Bolt's Draco Meteor.
100/135/50/60/85/120
Kingambit (F) @ Black Glasses/Life Orb
Ability: Supreme Overlord
Tera Type: Dark/Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Swords Dance
- Iron Head/Low Kick
- Kowtow Cleave
- Sucker Punch
What happens when we take OU's #1 Pokemon and elevate it to a new level? We get Urshifu-Dark on crack. Using Tera Fighting with Low Kick and Life Orb will truly turn Kingambit into Urshifu-Dark and dismantle opposing Kingambits and Dondozo, but the usual Tera Dark + Black Glasses is more than enough to overwhelm any team in the late game.
Overall, the team excels against virtually every single type of team, but may struggle against bulkier teams. Speficially, stall teams with a physically defensive Moltres and a specially defensive wall that can both deal with Flutter Mane and Raging Bolt are tough to break through due to the lack of Knock Off on the team - you'll have to tread carefully towards the end game and use Tera Dark Kimgambit with Supreme Overlord boosts to break through, just like in a normal Gen 9 OU game. To turn this match-up 100% in your favor, Ogerpon-Hearthflame can be used in place of Kingambit, with a Timid Nature and a moveset of SD/Ivy/Horn Leech/Knock. This monster can easily overwhelm any stall team with utter ease thanks to Mold Breaker; against other teams, a +1 Tera Fire Ivy Cudgel in the Sun is sure to 1HKO even resists. However, speed is king in this metagame, and exchanging Sucker Punch for that power to guarantee a win against stall teams means that there is less room for error against other types of teams.
Additionally, I'd like touch on the balance of the metagame. I'll start by calling the council out on banning Araquanid, Azumarill, and the two Deoxys forms. For the two Water types, their damage isn't even overwhelming, and their speed is complete utter garbage. Frankly speaking, if there was ever a "Viability Rankings," I'd put those Pokemon in the B- to B tier due to how much they suck in comparison to Ogerpon-Wellspring, who can deal just as much damage and is way more dangerous in practice because of a respectable 120 Speed (with Timid). To ban these two Pokemon while keeping powerhouses that hit much harder and are much faster, such as Ogerpon-Hearthflame, Flutter Mane, Gouging Fire, Archaludon, and Kingambit, is a complete utter joke. And as for the two Deoxys forms... what do they even do? Even before they should be considered to be banned, they should first be considered to be a worthy member on a team slot - and though Deoxys-S could prove itself to be a poor man's Tapu Lele with Knock Off to some, there's nothing that Deoxys-D could actually do.
Oh, and good job on booting Blissey, Chansey, and Kyurem. They were clearly not balanced.
Torkoal (F) @ Heat Rock
Ability: Drought
Tera Type: Flying
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpD / 8 Spe
Calm Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Lava Plume
- Earth Power
- Rapid Spin
Gouging Fire @ Choice Band
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Raging Fury
- Heat Crash
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake
Flutter Mane @ Choice Specs
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Shadow Ball
- Mystical Fire
- Draining Kiss
Raging Bolt @ Air Balloon
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Thunderbolt
- Dragon Pulse
- Thunderclap
Great Tusk @ Focus Sash
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Bulk Up
- Headlong Rush
- Ice Spinner
- Rapid Spin
Kingambit (F) @ Black Glasses
Ability: Supreme Overlord
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Swords Dance
- Iron Head
- Kowtow Cleave
- Sucker Punch
Ability: Drought
Tera Type: Flying
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpD / 8 Spe
Calm Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Lava Plume
- Earth Power
- Rapid Spin
Gouging Fire @ Choice Band
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Raging Fury
- Heat Crash
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake
Flutter Mane @ Choice Specs
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Shadow Ball
- Mystical Fire
- Draining Kiss
Raging Bolt @ Air Balloon
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Thunderbolt
- Dragon Pulse
- Thunderclap
Great Tusk @ Focus Sash
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Bulk Up
- Headlong Rush
- Ice Spinner
- Rapid Spin
Kingambit (F) @ Black Glasses
Ability: Supreme Overlord
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Swords Dance
- Iron Head
- Kowtow Cleave
- Sucker Punch
70/70/140/85/85/20
Torkoal (F) @ Heat Rock
Ability: Drought
Tera Type: Flying
EVs: 248 HP / 252 SpD / 8 Spe
Calm Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Lava Plume
- Earth Power
- Rapid Spin
Honestly, the standard physically defensive Torkoal set commonly used in OU is the best. However, due to the nature of this metagame, we are forced to use specially defensive Torkoal. Earth Power is chosen over Body Press because our defense stat isn't high enough; it is also chosen over Wisp because Lava Plume has a fair chance to burn. The ground coverage helps to inflict damage to opposing Fire types, namely Torkoal and Gouging Fire, in Sun vs. Sun matchups.
105/115/91/65/93/121
Gouging Fire @ Choice Band
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fire
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Raging Fury/Flare Blitz
- Heat Crash
- Dragon Claw
- Earthquake
Before Gouging Fire was banned in OU, this exact set only used 176 Attack EVs to get the Speed boost under Sun. In Nature Swap, however, we can fully invest into attack without worry. Having a base speed of 121 outside of Sun is also critical to creep major threats like Kingambit that are base 120 speed or lower. Tera Fire allows you to 1HKO Offensive Water Pokemon like Crawdaunt and Primarina, as well as 2HKO various resists.
Please note that once you click Raging Fury, you can't Terastallize. Using Flare Blitz as an alternative eliminates this uncertainty at the cost of taking major recoil damage.
55/55/55/135/135/135
Flutter Mane @ Choice Specs
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Moonblast
- Shadow Ball
- Mystical Fire
- Draining Kiss/Psyshock/Power Gem
I struggle to understand what state of mind the council was in to not only consider unbanning Flutter Mane, but also to actually follow through and set the monster free. This thing is extremely broken. It cleaves through offensive teams as if they were A5 Wagyu. Tera Fairy powers up Moonblast to unimaginable levels, landing 1HKOs on Offensive Kingambit and Primarina while most importantly granting a resist to Sucker Punch. Draining Kiss is chosen in the fourth slot to get out of Sucker ranges, but Flutter Mane is clicking Moonblast 95% of the time.
125/73/91/13775/89
Raging Bolt @ Air Balloon
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Naive Nature/Hasty Nature
IVs: 20 Atk
- Calm Mind
- Thunderbolt/Weather Ball
- Dragon Pulse/Draco Meteor
- Thunderclap
Raging Bolt is a must have on Sun teams; forgoing the Pokemon means forgoing an easy match-up into Rain teams. Air Balloon is necessary due to the abundance of Great Tusk, as well as to get around this team's non-existent Ground switch-ins.
115/131/87/53/53/131
Great Tusk @ Focus Sash
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Bulk Up
- Headlong Rush
- Ice Spinner
- Rapid Spin
On Hyper Offensive teams, I usually opt for Iron Treads because it can eliminate itself with Steel Beam and is better in dealing with Raging Bolt. However, Great Tusk's newfound 131 Speed in this metagame means that there is absolutely no competition to an offensive Ground spinner. A Focus Sash is used to spin away hazards in a pinch, as well as surviving various special attacks like Raging Bolt's Draco Meteor.
100/135/50/60/85/120
Kingambit (F) @ Black Glasses/Life Orb
Ability: Supreme Overlord
Tera Type: Dark/Fighting
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Hasty Nature
- Swords Dance
- Iron Head/Low Kick
- Kowtow Cleave
- Sucker Punch
What happens when we take OU's #1 Pokemon and elevate it to a new level? We get Urshifu-Dark on crack. Using Tera Fighting with Low Kick and Life Orb will truly turn Kingambit into Urshifu-Dark and dismantle opposing Kingambits and Dondozo, but the usual Tera Dark + Black Glasses is more than enough to overwhelm any team in the late game.
Overall, the team excels against virtually every single type of team, but may struggle against bulkier teams. Speficially, stall teams with a physically defensive Moltres and a specially defensive wall that can both deal with Flutter Mane and Raging Bolt are tough to break through due to the lack of Knock Off on the team - you'll have to tread carefully towards the end game and use Tera Dark Kimgambit with Supreme Overlord boosts to break through, just like in a normal Gen 9 OU game. To turn this match-up 100% in your favor, Ogerpon-Hearthflame can be used in place of Kingambit, with a Timid Nature and a moveset of SD/Ivy/Horn Leech/Knock. This monster can easily overwhelm any stall team with utter ease thanks to Mold Breaker; against other teams, a +1 Tera Fire Ivy Cudgel in the Sun is sure to 1HKO even resists. However, speed is king in this metagame, and exchanging Sucker Punch for that power to guarantee a win against stall teams means that there is less room for error against other types of teams.
Additionally, I'd like touch on the balance of the metagame. I'll start by calling the council out on banning Araquanid, Azumarill, and the two Deoxys forms. For the two Water types, their damage isn't even overwhelming, and their speed is complete utter garbage. Frankly speaking, if there was ever a "Viability Rankings," I'd put those Pokemon in the B- to B tier due to how much they suck in comparison to Ogerpon-Wellspring, who can deal just as much damage and is way more dangerous in practice because of a respectable 120 Speed (with Timid). To ban these two Pokemon while keeping powerhouses that hit much harder and are much faster, such as Ogerpon-Hearthflame, Flutter Mane, Gouging Fire, Archaludon, and Kingambit, is a complete utter joke. And as for the two Deoxys forms... what do they even do? Even before they should be considered to be banned, they should first be considered to be a worthy member on a team slot - and though Deoxys-S could prove itself to be a poor man's Tapu Lele with Knock Off to some, there's nothing that Deoxys-D could actually do.
Oh, and good job on booting Blissey, Chansey, and Kyurem. They were clearly not balanced.
Thank you for the clarification
Congrats on making it to #1, and I’d like to answer your question. Deoxys speed and defense have incredible power with band, and even without it scarf and other sets still have power on the special side. Deoxys Defense was better in the council’s opinion for having much more bulk on one side in exchange for a neglible amount fewer damage. These sets often held a fighting type move to deal with Kingambit, which was the only thing that could consistently deal with them. And I’m not sure I need to explain why the powerful water types tend to struggle against a sun team with Raging Bolt.
Also Araquanid is completely utterly not banned.
Even tho I voted Abstain on Araq/Azu because I wanted to play against them more, I do now think they're both top threats. The more HO and/or Sun-based your squad gets the easier they are to deal with, but vs a big portion of the tier they are great breakers that get pushed over the top with tera and also have multiple annoying sets- both can clean up a team since Naive Araq is faster and way harder hitting than Ogerpon-W, and Azu can belly drum and sweep at +6 while also making you guess whether its dropping Def or Spdef. Its really uncomfortable to try and scout for what set either of these mons is running and especially Araquanid feels really awful to switch around between its physical slow, special slow, fast physical and webs options- I think this is the worst part of Araquanid and if you know its nature or assume it to be slow you're going to probably have a much better time, but if you feel like you have to respect a potential fast set its a nightmare mon. You dont really need to respect it with Sun because fast Araq doesn't collect ohkos under Sun, and with a team of only offensive mons you can happily ohko it at any point when it shows up. Both can also get boosted by Rain, which takes them to beyond nuclear levels. As for saying that stuff like Arch and Kingambit hit much harder is just incorrect and shown with calcs
I did vote ban on both Deoxys for their set diversity and unpredictability. 180/160 Atk Espeed, 180/160 SpA Psycho Boost, Iron Def + CM + Stored Power or just regular CM + Psychic Noise, could be LO, mixed, or Band, plus Tera making things more awkward, all the while not knowing which defense stat is 160 feels too much. I think Flutter Mane and Gambit offer some counterplay and you just so happen to have both, which is helpful.. but tbh I'm kinda surprised that you think Deo-S is mid and dont even think Deo-D can do anything at all.
And for the record, I agree with you that Flutter Mane and Gouging Fire are pretty broken and shouldnt really be in the tier, but I didnt want to hold off from getting Deoxys out just because something like Gouging Fire is imo more broken when both are broken and Deoxys is on a slate for removal
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Why is Magearna included in the banlist if it isn't actually banned?
Why do all OMs have to ban tera? Could we at least try to justify it a bit?
What makes Gen 9 unique is tera, we'll be able to have endless Nature Swap in Gens 10+ without tera, I think it's great to be able to explore what could be done with tera + being able to swap a stat
^ Absolutely agree with this- banning the generational gimmick across the board is crazy (disregarding dynamax cause that was awful).Jiro7 said:
^ Imho tera is not remotely broken in Nature Swap. The very nature of the OM means that most mons are unpredictable and variable (is that tusk a glass cannon or a bulky wall? Physical or special araquanid*?) and the usual chaos tera provides pales in comparison to this mayhem. Keep tera, it’s funJiro7 said:
the reason why is pretty much because tera was never designed for 6v6 singles, let alone OMs. while i can understand wanting to experiment, the variance it brings is almost always too much. if you want to read up on peoples thought on tera, theres been many a tera suspect in many tiers, reading through the discussion on them should help inform why its banned in tiers. i will admit, ive yet to play nature swap, but i cant imagine such a unstable variable improving it, when the concept already has a lot of variety. variety/interesting != healthy
Good news everyone the bans confirmed earlier have been implemented:
bring back chansey it deserves to tank a gigaton hammer fr
BAN SLATE
Alright, Nature Swap council held a vote on pretty much all the Pokemon we consider to be problematic as of right now . The voting items were:
Araquanid
Azumarill
Blissey
Chansey
Deoxys-Defense
Deoxys-Speed
Kyurem
and Magearna.
Each of these Pokemon had a noticeable problem to anyone playing the tier yesterday. NS council votes are hidden below
xxx Banded Body Press Prunyy Pipotchi Clas Result Araquanid BAN DO NOT BAN ABSTAIN DO NOT BAN DO NOT BAN Azumarill BAN BAN ABSTAIN BAN BAN Blissey BAN BAN BAN BAN BAN Chansey ABSTAIN BAN BAN BAN BAN Deoxys-Defense DO NOT BAN BAN BAN ABSTAIN BAN Deoxys-Speed ABSTAIN BAN BAN ABSTAIN BAN Kyurem BAN BAN BAN BAN BAN Magearna DO NOT BAN BAN BAN ABSTAIN BAN
Each of these Pokemon are banned an will no longer be playable in Nature Swap, except our designated survivor Araquanid. The argument for Araquanid is that it might just be terastallization that breaks it, and we're still going to have that up for future banning consideration. Another thing is that Araquanid isn't broken all by itself. The Naive set is the most self-sufficient, setting up webs fast and still firing off powerful Surfs or Liquidations. The Naughty and Rash sets have the most damage output, and are often a predict-the-set-or-you-die scenario, but webs matter much less here because bulkier teams usually have have tools to deal with Araquanid. However, a lot of these bulkier teams are only able to know which set Araquanid is once they make a prediction, which is often a sack. With removing a lot of the top offensive threats, hopefully more teams can be built around not dying to a 454 BST bug, instead of a 660 BST dragon or 600 BST alien.
I'd like to thank everyone who's been playing Nature Swap. This is my favorite OM and I'd love for it to remain popular.
Tagging dhelmise to implement, thank you.
Is Araquanid supposed to be banned? Unless I missed something, of course, but I can't bring it on the Ladder anymore.
It’s not. I take responsibility for this, the ban slate post wasn’t clearly apparent which pokemon were banned, so Araqua is banned until it’s undone. Zamazenta was also banned in a mistake, so they will be let back in the tier together.
I sure do love a guessing game that will potentially 6-0 my team. I would personally prefer if araquanid stayed banned but I understand that mistakes do happen sometimes even if a banned araquanid is one of the oddest mistakes of all time.
Well I guess this is a good time to talk about something we’ve been talking about implementing: Nature Reveal Clause. This would display your nature upon switching in, similar to the way donors are displayed in the Inheritance OM. If I may speak personally, I don’t like the guessing game as of the moment, and I believe this would have no downsides on the tier.
I wholeheartedly agree with this. No more guessing if something is aggressive or passive, physical or special, physdef or spdef. I think that this would be very positive for the health of the tier. AND it would make tera feel even more balanced imo :)
Thank Pipotchi, all his idea
Shoutout to Pipotchi you are a real one
ALSO shoutout to the one singular person on ladder (other than me) running moltres-g. Idk if their set was as gimmicky as mine cause I ohko'd it with a crit ice spinner from tusk (and I sadly don't remember their name) but you are also a real one. If for whatever reason you want to use goltres here's my set:
90/85/90/125/100/90
night witch (Moltres-Galar) @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Berserk
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Rash Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hurricane/Air Slash
- Fiery Wrath
- Shadow Ball
- Agility
Usually bulky enough to live even a SE hit while using agility to boost speed to 558 (crucially outspeeding the monster that is avalugg-h) and then getting +3 spatk from weakness policy & berserk. At this point if they don't have priority or a special wall they die. In the latter case, confusions from hurricane or flinches from air slash or fiery wrath can greatly help too. Tera ghost to play around espeed and power up shadow ball. This set often does not work but when it does it REALLY does :3
ALSO shoutout to the one singular person on ladder (other than me) running moltres-g. Idk if their set was as gimmicky as mine cause I ohko'd it with a crit ice spinner from tusk (and I sadly don't remember their name) but you are also a real one. If for whatever reason you want to use goltres here's my set:
90/85/90/125/100/90
night witch (Moltres-Galar) @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Berserk
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Rash Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hurricane/Air Slash
- Fiery Wrath
- Shadow Ball
- Agility
Usually bulky enough to live even a SE hit while using agility to boost speed to 558 (crucially outspeeding the monster that is avalugg-h) and then getting +3 spatk from weakness policy & berserk. At this point if they don't have priority or a special wall they die. In the latter case, confusions from hurricane or flinches from air slash or fiery wrath can greatly help too. Tera ghost to play around espeed and power up shadow ball. This set often does not work but when it does it REALLY does :3
What does naughty do
This core is just... Horrible to face. sorry for making everyone aware of its presence. Even without spore, it persists. Use only if you dont like other people and are a bad person yourself.
@ Toxic Orb
Ability: Poison Heal
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Leech Seed
- Protect
- Mud-Slap
@ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Static
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 240 HP / 252 Def / 16 Spe
Impish Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Roost
- Volt Switch
- Drill Peck
@ Toxic Orb Ability: Poison Heal
Tera Type: Grass
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Substitute
- Leech Seed
- Protect
- Mud-Slap
@ Heavy-Duty Boots Ability: Static
Tera Type: Electric
EVs: 240 HP / 252 Def / 16 Spe
Impish Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Roost
- Volt Switch
- Drill Peck
I came to this tread to suggest exactly this, happy to see others are thinking about it already as well! Here's an example to further illustrate why i think this would make the tier much better:
Say you're facing a Toxapex. Not a great mon in this tier, but if you guess it's nature wrong you can easily lose two Pokémon when you shouldn't have lost any. You switch in your special wall because most of them are special attackers, but you get hit with a 150 base attack gunk shot. Bye bye special wall, now you have to guess if it's defense or spdef were sacrificed for its attack stat. If you guess wrong again you probably won't be able to KO it and lose another mon. There is very little skill involved in these guessing games.
You probably could, but increasing the now 68 atk seems a bit useless compared to the heightened spD. Maybe if you want to use it as an extremely bulky setup sweeper, but other than that I think calm is better.
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Well as someone who hasn't even made a full team yet I would like some ideas I had for my boi dragonite.
Dragonite @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Extreme Speed
- Earthquake
- Ice Spinner
This set might seem fairly boring at first (and it kind of is) but the idea is to give dragonite salamence's speed which combined with multiscale makes it an even better dragon dancer. The reason why the moveset is the same as dragonite in ou is because I couldn't think of a better one but maybe those with better imagination can think of something.
Dragonite @ Life Orb/Heavy-Duty Boots/Weakness Policy
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor/Dragon Pulse
- Hurricane
- Thunder
- Agility/Weather Ball
Now this is a far more creative set on my part. The idea is obviously what if you switched around dragonite's physical and special attack and then slapped it on rain? While there are other pokemon that are probably way stronger than dragonite it still has multiscale which could give it an edge. I had a couple ideas including all out attacking with draco meteor thunder hurricane and weather ball (or agility if you really want speed) with life orb or heavy duty boots as the item. However another slightly more evil idea I had was dragon pulse hurricane thunder agility with weakness policy as the item as with multiscale dragonite can take a super effective hit and get a boost in its special attack.
I am not sure how good either of these sets are as I have not tried them yet but I hope you all try them yourselves because I believe dragonite has serious potential.
Dragonite @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Extreme Speed
- Earthquake
- Ice Spinner
This set might seem fairly boring at first (and it kind of is) but the idea is to give dragonite salamence's speed which combined with multiscale makes it an even better dragon dancer. The reason why the moveset is the same as dragonite in ou is because I couldn't think of a better one but maybe those with better imagination can think of something.
Dragonite @ Life Orb/Heavy-Duty Boots/Weakness Policy
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Draco Meteor/Dragon Pulse
- Hurricane
- Thunder
- Agility/Weather Ball
Now this is a far more creative set on my part. The idea is obviously what if you switched around dragonite's physical and special attack and then slapped it on rain? While there are other pokemon that are probably way stronger than dragonite it still has multiscale which could give it an edge. I had a couple ideas including all out attacking with draco meteor thunder hurricane and weather ball (or agility if you really want speed) with life orb or heavy duty boots as the item. However another slightly more evil idea I had was dragon pulse hurricane thunder agility with weakness policy as the item as with multiscale dragonite can take a super effective hit and get a boost in its special attack.
I am not sure how good either of these sets are as I have not tried them yet but I hope you all try them yourselves because I believe dragonite has serious potential.