(Little) Things that annoy you in Pokémon

[Pikachu315111]

I mean in that case it would be Ursaluna, not Kleavor.

I mean for a Bug Signature Pokemon. Right now her options are Lokix, Spidops, and Rabsca. Spidops just isn't good, Rabsca is not a Pokemon you want in a kitchen (or at least its prevo), which just leaves Lokix which is alright though compared to other Pokemon is lacking. So my joke was her trying to get the Kleavor categorized as a Gen 9 mon so she could use that instead, no Terastallizing required (and Kleavor would be useful in a kitchen, maybe not so much in a bakery but still gotta cut up dough and other ingrediants).

Also his catchphrase is "Vaulting Veluza!"

That's an English translation thing. In the Japanese version, well, Bulbapedia explains it better:

In the Japanese version of Pokémon Scarlet and Violet, Kofu says 「ウオーッ！」 whenever he is surprised. While this interjection can be transliterated directly as "Woah!", it also contains a pun on 魚 uo (fish).

 

[CPU]

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New research tasks with the Home update definitely implies the Paldean Gym Leaders have Paldean Pokemon as their signature, which makes their use of an older Pokemon that has to terastalize in order to fit into their team more jarring. I get the devs have to showcase the newest gimmick and show tricks you can use to change up older Pokemon, but it feels only the 1st 3 gyms do anything worthwhile with this. Like, yeah Electric Levitate Mismagius is cool, but is it worth it to sideline Bellibolt, the brand new Pokemon that was most likely designed with being Iono's signature in mind, as a regular team member?

I don't use Home, but I checked Serebii for the research tasks (since I hadn't heard of them before) and I don't think everything listed there is necessarily correct. The Gym Leaders' Pokémon seem mostly correct, with the exception for Farigiraf for Tulip (which Pikachu315111 pointed out should probably be Espathra). However, it also has Annihilape as one of the Titan Pokémon (the paradox Donphan forms have their own entry), and under "Treasured Partners," which seems designed for the fully-evolved starters, the listed Pokémon are Meowscarada, Skeledirge, and... Lechonk.

I'm guessing these are just errors on Serebii's part (the Annihilape in the Titan section is directly under the Annihilape properly placed in Team Star's section, and I wouldn't be surprised if he just used Lechonk as a placeholder), but it could be funny if it was a mistake from Home itself. If it _was_ a data entry error, part of me wonders if he just put Farigiraf for Tulip's ace from memory. I associate Farigiraf more with Jacq than Tulip.

 

[Coronis]

I mean for a Bug Signature Pokemon. Right now her options are Lokix, Spidops, and Rabsca. Spidops just isn't good, Rabsca is not a Pokemon you want in a kitchen (or at least its prevo), which just leaves Lokix which is alright though compared to other Pokemon is lacking. So my joke was her trying to get the Kleavor categorized as a Gen 9 mon so she could use that instead, no Terastallizing required (and Kleavor would be useful in a kitchen, maybe not so much in a bakery but still gotta cut up dough and other ingrediants).



That's an English translation thing. In the Japanese version, well, Bulbapedia explains it better:

You shut your mouth and you shut it now. Lokix is awesome.

 

[DrumstickGaming]

One thing about the recent games that really bugs me is the inexplicable fact that you can lose certain battles yet still progress with the story. Yes, this has been a thing since RBY with the first rival battle (same with subsequent games) but that's perfectly fine because it's not really a test of skill with a Tackle fest that they can crit; not so much when you lose to Hau or even Lusamine 1 in SM and the game goes "here's your participation award, you can continue." And this is still happening in SV: I've seen one Nemona battle you can lose in a video.

May I ask: Why?

Look, the simplification for newer players has been happening as far back as Black and White, with the scaled-back team rosters that game had. But I think going so far to let you lose yet continue is actually condescending to children. What's the point of trying if the game will give me the victory sometimes anyway? It devalues victory and makes it less fulfilling. I hate to bring up the "back in my day, it was way harder" angle because it's so overdone and I honestly don't mind how the games have become more accessible to a degree (RPGs are a pretty complicated genre after all), but when handholding is this extreme, it decreases my immersion and desire to make smart plays.

With the rival battles especially, doesn't that kinda derail the concept if you can lose and still continue? A lot of the recent ones since SM even heal you up beforehand, because we can never catch the player off guard ever. In 2067 I wouldn't be surprised if we got a Pokemon game that just beats itself.

Now surely there could never be a way around this, having just a story experience mode with higher challenge for veteran players...

OH WAIT...

it's right there guys

In all seriousness, I enjoy the newer games like SM/USUM / SV, so I hate to rag on them. But this participation award mentality really just needs to go away soon. Kids are smarter than this.

 

[Worldie]

Kids are smarter than this.

If you've played any online raid in SV or SwSh, or honestly read any of the experiences from the raid threads, you will reconsider this statement.

While I will agree that "kids are smarter than this", you grossly overestimate the amount of effort and knowledge your average Pokemon player has.

 

[DrumstickGaming]

If you've played any online raid in SV or SwSh, or honestly read any of the experiences from the raid threads, you will reconsider this statement.

While I will agree that "kids are smarter than this", you grossly overestimate the amount of effort and knowledge your average Pokemon player has.

Thing is though: the raids are optional. Experiencing story mode to beat the game isn't (unless people just don't enjoy getting their money's worth, insert tired comment about SV being buggy here).

 

[R_N]

Thing is though: the raids are optional. Experiencing story mode to beat the game isn't (unless people just don't enjoy getting their money's worth, insert tired comment about SV being buggy here).

I once saw children unable to collect a single star in Galaxy 2 and I've seen grown men fully unable to understand concepts the game just explained to them

Most people are just not good at, or otherwise do not care, about games. Like they could have had Nemona be an actual gate, whatever, but the conceit of "kids are smarter than this" is thwarted by "most people are kinda dumb" + "most people don't play a lot of the games they buy"

 

[DrumstickGaming]

if only people were smarter

 

[Worldie]

Thing is though: the raids are optional. Experiencing story mode to beat the game isn't (unless people just don't enjoy getting their money's worth, insert tired comment about SV being buggy here).

I once saw children unable to collect a single star in Galaxy 2 and I've seen grown men fully unable to understand concepts the game just explained to them

Most people are just not good at, or otherwise do not care, about games. Like they could have had Nemona be an actual gate, whatever, but the conceit of "kids are smarter than this" is thwarted by "most people are kinda dumb" + "most people don't play a lot of the games they buy"

Normally, the way you address multiple playerbases are difficulty options.

In practicality, considering GameFreaks is *still* struggling to put toghether AAA games that are functional enough in time for deadlines, I think the last thing we need is them having to also figure out difficulty options.

Hopefully there'll be a time when Pokemon games come out properly and at the level you'd expect from 60€ titles and we can actually complain about the lack of difficulty variance, but for now, I'm afraid this cannot really be a priority.

(Besides, at least to some degree, you can "make your own challenge" to make them harder)

 

[pika pal]

The design ethos for Shroomish was a play on the "keep unevolved to learn different moves before evolving", probably since there's such a big design difference between the pair. Since Shroomish is more "mushroom" than weird kangaroo, it gets Spore as the grand prize for doing this.

Which is stupid, of course, because Shroomish only had 4 moves over Breloom (Poison Powder, Growth, Giga Drain, Spore) and of those only Spore actually mattered.
And for some reason they just continued being married to this concept, even adding a few extra moves for Shroomish, despite Spore continuing to be the only thing that really mattered

And now, man I dunno, I guess they think its Shroomish's thing and integral to its identity even though Gen 9 Breloom can still move relearner Poison Powder, Toxic & Growth (& get Giga Drain through TM) so now its literally the only reason to keep Shroomish as a Shroomish. Dumb!

What bothers me about this is that they were clearly aware of this in Gen 8 since Breloom had Spore added to its relearn-set in BDSP (the only game I know of where a Breloom can go from no Spore to Spore), then taken away again in SV. Yet despite THAT, they gave the wild Tera Breloom Spore as a "special" move (i.e. not part of its learnable set), so they obviously know what people want to use on it. Why not just put it in the movepool at that point instead of making 17 Lefts, a 180, and face-faulting to go Right?

I've seen grown men fully unable to understand concepts the game just explained to them

Next time on Game Grumps!

 

[QuentinQuonce]

"So yeah, due to space limitations we can't include all the Pokemon in our new game"

"Anyway here's Alcremie, it has approximately 7000 different forms, isn't that neat"

 

[R_N]

"So yeah, due to space limitations we can't include all the Pokemon in our new game"

"Anyway here's Alcremie, it has approximately 7000 different forms, isn't that neat"

I don't think space limitations were a concern at all, certainly not in the modern era. It was definitely more of a time (& tools) concern, if anything.
Which blah blah blah debatable what the actual reason is blah blah blah incompetence blah blah blah i dont care.

Regardless in that regard Alcremie is 7 different texture swaps and a bunch of swappable very low poly decorations. So not really....as much a time concern (most of which is probably taken care of as a matter of designing the Pokemon anyway) or as much a space concern I imagine.

 

[CPU]

What bothers me about this is that they were clearly aware of this in Gen 8 since Breloom had Spore added to its relearn-set in BDSP (the only game I know of where a Breloom can go from no Spore to Spore), then taken away again in SV. Yet despite THAT, they gave the wild Tera Breloom Spore as a "special" move (i.e. not part of its learnable set), so they obviously know what people want to use on it. Why not just put it in the movepool at that point instead of making 17 Lefts, a 180, and face-faulting to go Right?

Prevos learning valuable moves that their evolutions can't has been in the series since Gen 1 (with the exception of Gen 8, but I personally disagree with the choice they made to bloat learnsets with the moves of pre-evolved forms). Breloom losing Spore when transferred is unfortunate, but it not having Spore in its level-up movepool, even as a relearn-only move, is a fine decision on its own.

I've personally wanted Magikarp, and not Gyarados, to learn Bounce at level 40 or something for a few gens now. It would give Gyarados access to physical Flying STAB without the need for a TM/Tutor, but it also makes flavor sense for Magikarp to be the one to learn it and not Gyarados. Plus, it would be funny to need to keep a Magikarp until level 40 to get it.

 

[Worldie]

Prevos learning valuable moves that their evolutions can't has been in the series since Gen 1 (with the exception of Gen 8, but I personally disagree with the choice they made to bloat learnsets with the moves of pre-evolved forms). Breloom losing Spore when transferred is unfortunate, but it not having Spore in its level-up movepool, even as a relearn-only move, is a fine decision on its own.

I've personally wanted Magikarp, and not Gyarados, to learn Bounce at level 40 or something for a few gens now. It would give Gyarados access to physical Flying STAB without the need for a TM/Tutor, but it also makes flavor sense for Magikarp to be the one to learn it and not Gyarados. Plus, it would be funny to need to keep a Magikarp until level 40 to get it.

I think the problem with "preevo only moves" is that it's just another relic of when the games were old and people actually bought guides to figure out weird quirks like high level movesets or egg moves.

Nowadays, when you're trying to push the game into accessibility and ease-of-competitive-preparation, things like that have to go.

They don't make the game (or the preparation) harder nor more interesting, expecially as nowadays when you need a PvP mon all you're doing is whispering one of the many genning bots clicking 30 XL candies and then throwing some bottle caps and TMs at it.

 

[Coronis]

"So yeah, due to space limitations we can't include all the Pokemon in our new game"

"Anyway here's Alcremie, it has approximately 7000 different forms, isn't that neat"

Alcremie as a mon is just horribly frustrating. Like Spinda had all these patterns but hey it was just a random little thing, not registered in the Dex. But now Alcremie has these all registered as individual forms with specific fruits and ridiculously annoying spinning evolving method (the stupidest evo method ever - it’d be fine if it was just “spin for this one evo” but using it for Alcremie and all its forms and making each one specific is so fucking stupid ARGH). I get the whole ooh cake/cream can be different colours and decorated differently and even the evo method (spinning around = mixing stuff together in a bowl) but they literally implemented it in the most annoying way possible. Hell I find Alcremies forms more annoying than all other forms that annoy me put together - mainly the ones that don’t actually make any sense and the anime pandering ones.

 

[Karxrida]

Next time on Game Grumps!

Listen, Arin might be a moron but he actually got through FireRed competently. Outside of forgetting that Psychic is weak to Bug. Plus that entire playthrough is classic.

 

[R_N]

I thought the spinning was pretty cute for Alcremie, honestly. It was a little annoying having to count out seconds but the actual process was fine and fairly painless; it took more effort to get the 9 Milcery.

Glad Home just goes "bro here's all the accessories dont even worry", though. I wasn't ever going to aim for all 63 (I really cannot care about the individual Pokedexes to that granular a level) so I just focused on getting the accessories I thought matched them which was the actual intent and not wanting people to spend the better part of their lives getting over 2 boxes of Alcremie and hunting down the rare accessories.

 

[Coronis]

I thought the spinning was pretty cute for Alcremie, honestly. It was a little annoying having to count out seconds but the actual process was fine and fairly painless; it took more effort to get the 9 Milcery.

Glad Home just goes "bro here's all the accessories dont even worry", though. I wasn't ever going to aim for all 63 (I really cannot care about the individual Pokedexes to that granular a level) so I just focused on getting the accessories I thought matched them which was the actual intent and not wanting people to spend the better part of their lives getting over 2 boxes of Alcremie and hunting down the rare accessories.

Like I said the spinning thing itself was fine and made sense but having to do it over and over and in different patterns was overdone. Its like if we had 10 Pokemon evolving like Pawmot rather than 2.

 

[QuentinQuonce]

I don't think space limitations were a concern at all, certainly not in the modern era. It was definitely more of a time (& tools) concern, if anything.
Which blah blah blah debatable what the actual reason is blah blah blah incompetence blah blah blah i dont care.

Regardless in that regard Alcremie is 7 different texture swaps and a bunch of swappable very low poly decorations. So not really....as much a time concern (most of which is probably taken care of as a matter of designing the Pokemon anyway) or as much a space concern I imagine.

No I know this, it just bugs me that this was the excuse they used. And regardless of how much time Alcremie took to create all those forms still take up a slot in the game's memory.

 

[R_N]

No I know this, it just bugs me that this was the excuse they used. And regardless of how much time Alcremie took to create all those forms still take up a slot in the game's memory.

Was this the excuse they used, though? I suppose I could believe it, they definitely say some "bro just tell the truth or pick a better lie" type things during that era (stil rotating the Exp Share comments in my brain to this day), but I really don't recall them ever saying that specifically

Also a "slot" in the game's memory is kind of...fluid. Different things take different amounts of space and such. Though again not like it really matters for the Pokemon switch games, which are surprisingly optimized considering everything. *glances at bdsp* Well, Gamefreak's games anyway.

 

[RocketSurgery]

The decision to not give Legend mons evolution data in SV was already pretty annoying, but I forgot how much of a chore it is to evolve most of these mons in PLA.

Want to evolve this shiny qwilfish? Better start KOing random things with barb barrage, a move that only has 15 pp but you have to do it 20 times. Uh oh, your level 76 qwilfish just got one-shot by a level 27 shellos that survived a hit, because that's how level scaling works in this game. What's that, you used it 20 times and can't evolve? Silly you, you should have double-checked Serebii, you have to use strong style barb barrage 20 times! (Which uses double the pp)

Need a peat block to evolve an Ursaring? Can't buy it, better start digging. Want to give up and evolve one in GO instead? Whoops you didn't evolve any extras on community day, now you have to wait for the next real life full moon to evolve one.

 

[R_N]

The decision to not give Legend mons evolution data in SV was already pretty annoying, but I forgot how much of a chore it is to evolve most of these mons in PLA.

Want to evolve this shiny qwilfish? Better start KOing random things with barb barrage, a move that only has 15 pp but you have to do it 20 times. Uh oh, your level 76 qwilfish just got one-shot by a level 27 shellos that survived a hit, because that's how level scaling works in this game. What's that, you used it 20 times and can't evolve? Silly you, you should have double-checked Serebii, you have to use strong style barb barrage 20 times! (Which uses double the pp)

Need a peat block to evolve an Ursaring? Can't buy it, better start digging. Want to give up and evolve one in GO instead? Whoops you didn't evolve any extras on community day, now you have to wait for the next real life full moon to evolve one.

me spending the better part of 30 minutes running around the area to evolve my shiny stantler
this was after using candies to get it to learn the move
then having to level it up more so it could master the move

also Psyshield Bash only has 10 PP...

I think these "use 20 times" methods aren't bad in terms of "using the pokemon normally", since those are criteria you'll just get over the course of a playthrough if you want to use them. But oh my god it is the pits if all you want is the Pokemon (god help you if you want MULTIPLE of those Pokemon).

 

[QuentinQuonce]

Was this the excuse they used, though? I suppose I could believe it, they definitely say some "bro just tell the truth or pick a better lie" type things during that era (stil rotating the Exp Share comments in my brain to this day), but I really don't recall them ever saying that specifically

Also a "slot" in the game's memory is kind of...fluid. Different things take different amounts of space and such. Though again not like it really matters for the Pokemon switch games, which are surprisingly optimized considering everything. *glances at bdsp* Well, Gamefreak's games anyway.

Having just read the justification, they start off by blaming "the sheer number" of Pokemon but then pivot to talking about game balance since too many species means hard to balance the battle system. So... sort of but not really.

My post was obviously kind of flippant but equally I feel like when you're saying "oh there's just too many Pokemon in this series" giving one species a bunch of nearly identical cosmetic forms sort of goes against that. Quality over quantity, and all that.

Anyway.

 

[R_N]

Having just read the justification, they start off by blaming "the sheer number" of Pokemon but then pivot to talking about game balance since too many species means hard to balance the battle system. So... sort of but not really.

My post was obviously kind of flippant but equally I feel like when you're saying "oh there's just too many Pokemon in this series" giving one species a bunch of nearly identical cosmetic forms sort of goes against that. Quality over quantity, and all that.

Anyway.

Well I am nothing if not someone who gets caught on small details, so... "there's so many Pokemon" affects a lot of things like where you put them, balancing, blah blah blah

and again we can all roll our eyes at how that's panned out or how they handle (or didn't handle) balance* in general or whatever. Just look at any topic for more than 5 minutes, we've all picked stuff like this apart. We didn't get to 500+ pages of annoyances alone on the back of consistent, understandable good decision making.

but it is categorically different from 1 pokemon getting a bunch of visual differences for forms. All the Alcremies share the same moves, stats, location (or...lackthere of, I suppose), etc. And as a new Pokemon it probably gets preferential treatment anyway.
Implementing all the Alolan Forms was probably more intensive compared to all the alcremie colors.

Like I'm sure if we keep this back & forth going you can dig in and find more reasons to why you find it stupid or hypocritical or skewed priorities or whatever but man i dunno i just think gamefreak says & does enough dumb bullshit* we don't have to basically misconstrue stuff like this



*for example, Series D suddenly introducing the influx of import Legendary Pokemon for what will likely be the Worlds list in a few months. Doesn't seem like many people are thrilled about that happening for several reasons!

 

[Worldie]

*for example, Series D suddenly introducing the influx of import Legendary Pokemon for what will likely be the Worlds list in a few months. Doesn't seem like many people are thrilled about that happening for several reasons!

Fwiw, people aren't annoyed by the introduction of the new pokemon / legendaries per se.

It's the fact that the regulation starts on 1st of July, and the last official tournament before world starts on June 30th, meaning it'll be on regulation C, so they'll be going to Worlds in a format noone has played a real VGC match on.

If anything people are excited about the new funny tools coming up (except Regieleki, to use Wolfey's words, Regieleki's existance in VGC doubles invalidates so many pokemon it aint even funny), just the main issue is the timing.

Everyone expected Worlds to be played on Regulation C. If worlds are played on regulation D, it'll be a massive shitshow.