ORAS OU Have I cracked it? The ultimate HO team?

Introduction:
Good Day Smogon community! I'm back again with another variant of a HO team! Still built around Mega-Charizard-X but with the benefit of about a months worth of playing experience with him as my premier sweeper. So without further ado, here it is, the culmination of all my work with the big black dragon, my beat HO team yet!

Teambuilding Process:
So I am of the belief that a HO team is, unlike almost any other playstyle, quite formulaic. There are 6 specific roles that must be addressed when designing any HO team (imho). They are: Lead, Walbreaker 1, Wallbreaker 2, Utility, Revenge Killer and Sweeper.

I began the design of this team with Mega-Charizard-X as my sweeper. After a Dragon Dance he is one of the most potentially lethal pokemon in the current OU metagame (and he looks badass too!) However, he is in possession of some very key weaknesses! Fairies, Bulky Ground Types, Other faster Dragons (Namely Lati@s), Talonflame using priority moves, Bulky Water types, Ice, Stealth rocks and Status. So I set about designing the rest of the team to counter these weaknesses.

A Lead pokemon on a HO team has only one job. Get rocks up. Period. Nobody does this better than Azelf in my opinion. So Azelf will be my lead with a lovely explosive surprise for the unwary!

Next I considered my utility pokemon. Of all the rapid spinners in the game only one of them can deal with Status too. It also nicely deals with my bulky water problem! Enter Starmie!

Next comes wallbreaker 1. I knew I had to have a strong answer to Fairies which meant a Steel type and the first Pokemon that came to mind was Bisharp. Additional Dark typing means we have a secondary check to the Slowbros and Starmies of the world and a way of Knocking off Chanseys

Wallbreaker 2 needed to answer my ground type weaknesses very strongly and there are scant few who can do that effectively. Landorus-T does it beautifully while being a potent threat of its own.

This leaves only my revenge killer, which looking at the lack of ice coverage can only be Weavile, one of the meanest revengers in the game!

The Team:
Charizard-Mega-X @ Charizardite X
Ability: Tough Claws
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Dragon Claw
- Dragon Dance
- Roost
My sweeper. A fairly standard set, nothing unorthodox here. I have chosen a Jolly nature over Adamant mostly for my own psychological wellbeing that he is as fast as he can be. After a Dragon Dance there are very few things faster, all of which are specifically countered below. The slight HP investment is for worst case scenario entrys into Stealth Rocks to ensure 51% HP. Other than that its about hitting as fast and hard as possible

Azelf @ Focus Sash
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Taunt
- Explosion
- Flamethrower
The only purpose of this guy is to be tricky and get rocks up. EV investment is designed to make Explosion hit as hard as possible, with a little investment to SpA to make flamethrower worthwhile. The Focus Sash prevents OHKOs which are common for this frail pokemon. Taunt is for the Stealth Rock mindgames at the start of a battle and Flamethrower is a contingency damaging move for the likes of Ferrothorn.

Landorus-Therian @ Life Orb
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- U-turn
- Swords Dance
A fairly standard offensive Landorus set. Again, its about hitting as hard and fast as possible in regard to nature and IVs. I've included U Turn on this set to allow him to pivot out without losing momentum offensively.

Weavile @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Ice Shard
- Icicle Crash
- Low Kick
Its very much the same philosophy here too, hitting as hard and fast as I can. Ice Shard is a priority move to ensure Weaviles an effective revenger, the rest of the set are strong STAB moves with Low Kick included to dissuade opposing Weavile

Bisharp @ Life Orb
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Iron Head
- Sucker Punch
- Swords Dance
Guess what! We've got max speed and offensive investment here too... surprise surprise. I've added Sucker Punch because this move alone has ripped through entire teams when opponents were particularly dim witted. Other than that its very straightforward.

Starmie @ Life Orb
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hydro Pump
- Thunderbolt
- Rapid Spin
- Psyshock
And last, but by no means least, my Utility. Again, its all about being as fast and powerful as possible. With this in mind, I've never understood why people run the ability that give Starmie more power if it goes second.... it almost never goes second. I favour Natural Cure and use Starmie to absorb status where I can. As Starmie is a special attacker I've dropped the Atk IVs to 0 to mitigate confusion and foul play damage. The sets fairly standard except that one of either Thunderbolt or Psyshock is used, but I've added both for a little bit of psychic coverage which has occasionally come in handy as an additional check to fighting types which can do some serious damage to 3/6 of my pokemon.

Conclusion:
So thats the team! Please feel free to comment, critique, copy, use, playtest and review. All constructive comments and suggestions are welcome. I would say that I very much want to keep the team HO, so if you could keep your suggestions in that vein I would greatly appreciate it.

Importable:
Charizard-Mega-X @ Charizardite X
Ability: Tough Claws
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Dragon Claw
- Dragon Dance
- Roost

Azelf @ Focus Sash
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpA / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Taunt
- Explosion
- Flamethrower

Landorus-Therian @ Life Orb
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- U-turn
- Swords Dance

Weavile @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Ice Shard
- Icicle Crash
- Low Kick

Bisharp @ Life Orb
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Iron Head
- Sucker Punch
- Swords Dance

Starmie @ Life Orb
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hydro Pump
- Thunderbolt
- Rapid Spin
- Psyshock
 
1)
Azelf - skillswap>flamethrower
This beats mega sab lead

2- natural cure is for fat starmie. Analytics is for HO starmie, why would you not want to hit switch ins harder, starmie can hit anything that wants to switch in hard bar ferrothorn. Use fat natural cure or offensive analytics. Don't try to mix em.IMO

3- nitpick, why do you say "added sucker punch" as if you're doing something ground breaking. Typing and sucker punch is the only reason sharp is ou

4-that lando set looks bad IMO, run earth plate/lefties if you're determined to run the sword dance set.

5-poison jab>ice shard is something I've found works really well with all the clefables thinking they can switch in and force weavile out

Edit

6-get rid of that HP ev on zard. Odd HP's are always better unless you have magic guard
 
✧✧✧Hi, Anime_Fan here✧✧✧

Arutha19 great job on creating the team! I can tell you've really put in a lot of work into making this team. From what I can see, it's offensive pressure can easily overwhelm teams, which is ideal on HO. You understand the play-style of HO, so congrats on that. I've done some research into the Pokemon you're using, so I'll try to offer some advice (as best I can). I'll also try to avoid making too many radical changes to your team.

Btw, since Azelf is equipped with a Focus Sash (due to its frailness), couldn't it be better to run a Naive or Hasty nature? I mean, by using a Jolly nature; you're reducing Azelf's Sp.Atk stat (weaker Flamethrower). Anyways, without any further ado, let's begin!^^

Here are some cons to the team:

  • As it is, the team may have difficulty facing stall.
  • The team can be worn down by opposing offensive pressure e.g from Mega Diancie, CB Azumarill, Volcanion, and Keldeo.
  • Powerful fighting types with Ice or Dark coverage threaten this team.
Here are some ideas you might like:

charizard-mega-x.png
[Small recommendation to Move-set]

Charizard @ Charizardite X
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 104 HP / 220 Atk / 184 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Flare Blitz
- Dragon Claw
- Roost

This recommendation isn't too important, however the EV changes above provide M-Charizard X with more bulk. With these changes, it can set up on Rotom-W as it spams Hydo Pump. Another benefit to increasing Zard-X's bulk, is that it will be able to set up Dragon Dance even easier. The drop in speed isn't too bad, because at +1 Zard-X can still out speed a Choice Scarf Landorus-T (even with a Jolly nature). The additional bulk can come in handy for surviving some priority attacks.

Hint/Tip: Mega Charizard-X works best as a late game sweeper. This is performed best when all its checks and counters are either KO'd, or weakened by the rest of the team.

starmie.gif
[Small recommendation to Move-set]

Starmie @ Life Orb
Ability: Analytic
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Rapid Spin
- Hydro Pump
- Thunderbolt
- Ice Beam

Here, I agree with Jordansucksatpkmn's suggestion. Analytic is the superior ability, and can I'll explain why. Analytic boosts the power of moves if the user goes last. If your opponent switches out, you've technically just gone last. Switching out a Pokemon has the highest priority in the game. What this means is that with the ability Analytic; you'll be be dealing 30%+ damage to every Pokemon that switches into Starmie. I recommend replacing Psyshock with Ice Beam. The reason for this is that Ice Beam compliments your water and electric-type attacks. Ice Beam allows Starmie to KO powerful grass and dragon-type Pokemon, like Serperior, and the Lati-Twins.

Hint/Tip: Starmie has the power to KO every single hazard remover in the game! Most Hazard removers are weak to the either water, ice or electric. So when they swap places and switch into battle, they risk getting KO'd by a super charged Hydro Pump (143 BP), Thunderbolt (117 BP) or Ice Beam (117 BP).

landorus-therian.png
[Small recommendation to Move-set]

Landorus-Therian @ Earth Plate
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Swords Dance
- Rock Polish

This set makes an excellent substitute as it can potentially sweep unprepared teams with ease. An Earth Plate is used to give Landorus-Therian's Earthquake a devastating boost in power (120 BP). An Adamant nature maximises Landorus-T's attack, pair this up with Swords Dance and you have a terrifying wall breaker. Next, Rock Polish gives Landorus-T a huge boost in speed! This will allow it to out speed every faster Pokemon in the game, and potentially sweep through teams. The Earth Plate can be replace with a Lum Berry, or a Yache Berry.

Hint/Tip: Here's a great way to use this set; when facing a defensive team, immediately use Swords Dance. When facing offensive teams, immediately use Rock Polish. This will give you the advantage against such teams. If you see an opening, don't be afraid to go for another boost (as this might allow you to sweep).

azelf.gif
[Small recommendation to Move-set]

Azelf @ Focus Sash
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 28 Atk / 228 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Explosion
- Skill Swap
- Taunt

This is a similar set to the one you have above. The EV's slightly increase Azelf's defence, the reason for this is preventing [the ever-so-popular] Mega Lopunny from stopping you from setting up Stealth Rock (Fake Out+Return). Skill Swap, is very important. It allows Azelf to do all sorts of crazy things e.g. you can steal Magic Bounce from Mega Sableye and Mega Diancie. This will allow you to set up Stealth Rocks. You can also steal the Water Absorb ability from Volcanion, or Regenerator from Slowbro. That possibilities are endless :)

Hint/Tip: Even with Ev investments in Atk, Explosion can still do a lot of damage. The main role for Explosion, is to have Azelf sit at "time-out" for the rest of the match (poor Azelf).

jirachi.png
[Main recommendation: Replace Bisharp]

Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- U-turn
- Heart Stamp / Fire Punch
- Healing Wish

This is the main change I recommend. A Choice Scarf Jirachi makes an excellent win-con for the team. Due to it's ability to cause multiple flinches, Jirachi can turn a bad situation around (if you're lucky). Jirachi's access to Healing Wish is a god-send to Mega Charizard-X, as it will often find itself worn out in battle (because of recoil from Flare Blitz). I recommend Heart Stamp over Fire Punch. This will allow Jirachi to continue to flinch Mega Charizard-Y, Mega Manetric, and Mega Lopunny etc (whilst hitting harder than Iron Head).

With these changes in mind, I hope they improve your team's performance in battle. Best of luck! :3

P.S: Weavile was an excellent choice to add to the team. Its dark-typing and access to Low Kick, makes it a great counter to most dark-types. Bisharp was also a great choice, however Jirachi's ability to cause flinches and pass Healing Wish was more helpful to the team (especially for Mega Charizard-X). Jiachi also makes an excellent check to most fairy, and grass-type Pokemon.
 
Last edited:
A suggestion You might want to consider is Thunder Punch over Roost On Zard too hit Manaphy. Tbolt From starmie is the only thing on your team that is reliable against it.
Also I would Agree with Anime_Fan about the Jirachi replacing Bisharp. Jirachi also makes it so that you dont get swept by Draco+FocusMiss Dragalge or BraveBird+CloseCombat Staraptor.
 
Hello everyone and thank you all for you contributions and for clarifying a few things!

I'm playtesting the proposed changes as we speak and I have a few questions:

What would make you use Blaze over Tough Claws on Charizard?

I still think the team has a slight weakness to fighting types given that the only psychic move on the team is on Jirachi... Is this purely in my head or should I look at addressing it? Perhaps by running a Defog Lati@s in place of Starmie?

Thank you all again, and I'll post a revision of the team soon after all the proposed changes have been tested!
 
you shoud not have a problem with fighting types, since you dont necesarilly have to suicide lead with azelf. and lando-t can take physical hits decently well. gonna test this team on mid ladder and tell you any other flaws i see.

Edit: Walled By WashingMachine
 
Last edited:
A suggestion You might want to consider is Thunder Punch over Roost On Zard too hit Manaphy. Tbolt From starmie is the only thing on your team that is reliable against it.
Also I would Agree with Anime_Fan about the Jirachi replacing Bisharp. Jirachi also makes it so that you dont get swept by Draco+FocusMiss Dragalge or BraveBird+CloseCombat Staraptor.
Thunder Punch on MZard x is useless imho, manaphy still dies from +1 dclaw. Dragalge and Staraptor are not the reason for changing bisharp to jirachi since theh're NEVER or better rarely used in OU.
 
Is it worth considering something like Iron Tail or should I just stick to roost?
Iron Tail is useless as well because +1 Flare Blitz kills everything. If you really want to run a 3rd move the best choice is earthquake to hit Heatran wich is a counter to the set with only double stabs.
 
Heres the current version of the team:

Charizard-Mega-X (M) @ Charizardite X
Ability: Tough Claws
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Claw
- Flare Blitz
- Dragon Dance
- Roost

Landorus-Therian @ Earth Plate
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Swords Dance
- Rock Polish

Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- Heart Stamp
- U-turn
- Healing Wish

Starmie @ Life Orb
Ability: Analytic
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Rapid Spin

Weavile @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Poison Jab
- Low Kick
- Ice Shard

Azelf @ Focus Sash
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Taunt
- Skill Swap
- Explosion

So, I stayed with my Charizard set, because the bulky version just wasnt hiting hard enough. Jirachi is in there now and poison jab has been adeed to weavile. All fabulous suggestions!

What do we think of the squad now?
 
Heres the current version of the team:

Charizard-Mega-X (M) @ Charizardite X
Ability: Tough Claws
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Claw
- Flare Blitz
- Dragon Dance
- Roost

Landorus-Therian @ Earth Plate
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- Swords Dance
- Rock Polish

Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Iron Head
- Heart Stamp
- U-turn
- Healing Wish

Starmie @ Life Orb
Ability: Analytic
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hydro Pump
- Ice Beam
- Thunderbolt
- Rapid Spin

Weavile @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Poison Jab
- Low Kick
- Ice Shard

Azelf @ Focus Sash
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Taunt
- Skill Swap
- Explosion

So, I stayed with my Charizard set, because the bulky version just wasnt hiting hard enough. Jirachi is in there now and poison jab has been adeed to weavile. All fabulous suggestions!

What do we think of the squad now?

Your team looks to be in decent shape, although there are a few things I would change, nothing too big, but changes that will help your team in the long run.

Charizard-X looks perfect to me, I really like the set, so nothing to change there.

As for Landorus, I like the idea of SwordPolish (is that a thing or no?) Landorus-T, but the reality is, Landorus will almost never have the opportunity to set up both a Swords Dance or a Rock Polish. Too many teams run counters to Landorus, because it is the most popular Pokemon in the tier, according to data statistics. Instead, I would prefer that you choose one boosting move, either Swords Dance or Rock Polish, and change the other to U-Turn in order to generate momentum on your team. HO teams usually switch around a lot, and trying to set up with Landorus will kill your momentum.

Jirachi looks great to me, no changes there.

For Starmie, I would run Natural Cure instead of Analytic. With Natural Cure, Starmie can be a status absorber for the team, taking Thunder Waves and Toxics, status that would otherwise be detrimental to your team.

As for Weavile, Poison Jab? No, I mean, why? If a Fairy type comes out, Weavile is most definitely switching out. Poison Jab is cool on paper, but Icicle Crash comes in handy more often, especially with the large change to flinch. Poison Jab doesn't OHKO Clefable or Gardevoir, so there is no point in running it. Icicle Crash is better.
 
Thank you for your input. I had noticed that Ice shard just doesnt hit hard enough so I've re-added Icicle Crash.

I have been toying with a slightly bulkier set for lando and using him as my rocker swapping Azelf for something like Serperior. What do we think?

Anyway, as for SwordPolish Lando, I use Rock Polish more often because of the Adamant Nature, and Earthquake hits like a Truck anyway
 
Thank you for your input. I had noticed that Ice shard just doesnt hit hard enough so I've re-added Icicle Crash.

I have been toying with a slightly bulkier set for lando and using him as my rocker swapping Azelf for something like Serperior. What do we think?

Anyway, as for SwordPolish Lando, I use Rock Polish more often because of the Adamant Nature, and Earthquake hits like a Truck anyway

For an HO team, the goal is too hit hard and get out fast. Without U-Turn, Landorus can struggle a bit to keep up and generate momentum. You don't have to run a bulkier set to run Stealth Rocks on Landorus.

Serperior has great synergy with all of your team, especially Charizard, wearing down Pokemon like Azumarill and Slowbro. I would definitely suggest you fit Serperior onto your team. If you are going to replace Azelf however, definitely put SR on Landorus, as hazards are too good to pass up on an HO team.

latest

Serperior @ Leftovers
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Leaf Storm
- Dragon Pulse
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Glare

cute-tiny-sun-animation-3.gif
 
Last edited:
I've noticed your team is quite weak to bisharp a possible solution to this could be Tank chomp over Axelf although I have not looked into this much so my change may just cause more problems its just food for thought.
 
I'm finding Lopunny + Magnezone is hard to deal with. Rotom-W is also hard to play around. A Grass like SR Celebi could go > Azelf.

Testing this right now:

Celebi @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 148 Def / 108 Spe
Impish Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Thunder Wave / Recover
- Giga Drain
- U-turn

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-417235443
Why did you opt for an Impish nature? U-turn is just for momentum but it's more important get damage from Giga Drain that's the only stab. I suggest a bold nature and Recover > Thunder Wave. :)
Being this an HO he could try even a Baton pass set (lacking SR):

Celebi @ Leftovers
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 252 HP / 148 Def / 108 Spd
Impish Nature
- Swords Dance
- Baton Pass
- Seed Bomb
- Recover
 
Last edited:
Thats an unusual idea! Please let me know how SR celebi goes!

it occurs to me if I were going to run Celebi it would have to be the rovks varient, becasue if I were going to run a Grass type without rocks Serperior is a much better fit

So I could keep my Offensive Lando set, but maybe drop Rock polish for Stealth Rocks? I was under the impression I'd have to opt for a bulkier set to carry it off
 
Hey. This team looks really good. Two pokemon that are weak to fighting isnt really good for the team so i would say take out bisharp for Talonflame. A Talonflame with Choice Band Set makes huge dents in everything. If you dont like the lock in effect i suggest using sharp beak instead. Also adamant nature is good for the CB set. Hope this helps!
 
Thank you all again for your input

If I swap bisharp for Talonflame then I have nothing to deter the ubiquitous Fairy Types that do serious damage to my main sweeper. I think I'm definately going to swap Bisharp for Jirachi.

Heres the version of the team I'm testing now, with a bulkier Rocks varient of Lando and Serperior in there too. Now Serp is in there I I have opted to run psyshock on Starmie for a little extra coverage thus freeing a moveslot for Jirachi to have Trick to dissuade opposing setup sweepers. In this varient Jirachi and Lando act as pivots for the team!:

Charizard-Mega-X @ Charizardite X
Ability: Tough Claws
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Dragon Claw
- Flare Blitz
- Dragon Dance
- Roost

Weavile @ Life Orb
Ability: Pressure
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Knock Off
- Low Kick
- Ice Shard
- Icicle Crash

Serperior @ Life Orb
Ability: Contrary
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 SpA / 30 Spe
- Leaf Storm
- Hidden Power [Fire]
- Dragon Pulse
- Glare

Starmie @ Life Orb
Ability: Natural Cure
EVs: 4 HP / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Hydro Pump
- Psyshock
- Ice Beam
- Rapid Spin

Jirachi @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Healing Wish
- U-turn
- Iron Head
- Trick

Landorus-Therian @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Impish Nature
IVs: 29 Spe
- Earthquake
- Stone Edge
- U-turn
- Stealth Rock
 
Back
Top