Game Freak hit with another hack, info leaking

[Mad Ram]

-While we are talking about mythology, I don't get why people are taking the creation chart/cycles with the pseudos as canon (actually I do know, it's Centro as always spreading misinformation but you get the point). If it wasn't in the games proper is probably because it was discarded. It isn't any different to the mentioned stories of humans breeding with Pokemon, in fact, it has less of a reason to not be in-game. Do you really want me to believe nowadays than Xerneas/Yveltal have no place in the creation process but Gyarados does? It was obviously written just for gen 4, and discared for whatever reason.

There is a reason that is being taken as somewhat canon, and that's because we have seen it before.

Spoiler

While slightly modified, it is clearly derived from those same circles. Plus it's not as if old lore hasn't been kept just to be used years later showing it's still canon. For example, in the first Pokémon Red and Green guidebook it mentioned that all Pokémon have the ability to shrink in size and Pokéballs take advantage of this to catch Pokémon. For over 20 years that was the only source of that info. Then, in 2022 that lore was used once again for Legends Arceus. Just from that, we can tell that lore even if introduced early on or not mentioned in games can still be canon. The fact that this glyph has been used in HGSS and Legends Arceus shows there is still something to it even if the exact meanings aren't the same. Is it exactly canon? Probably not. The names for five of the Pokémon are for ones that don't exist, and they added a circle in the middle clearly for Giratina. However, the fact it still exists and was modified in such a way argues for some form of canonicity to it.

 

[spectrum-5]

seriously whose idea was it to break the rules by posting leaks on this site

 

[R_N]

Probably more accurate to say that the original, exact meaning of the diagram has changed, even if the general intent of the diagram (a representation of the world's driving forces) is probably still the same.

 

[spectrum-5]

i expect this thread to be deleted soon.

 

[Mad Ram]

i expect this thread to be deleted soon.

Post in thread 'Game Freak hit with another hack, info leaking'

Oct 13, 2024

After discussions with some other staff members, we have decided to allow discussion of certain aspects of this leak.

This will be: Anything that is from previous generations - this includes the concept artwork and sprites which have been released.

Please do not post about future games which may have been involved in the leak. Please also do not directly link to any accessible materials of this leak.

• DHR-107

• 
• 

The mods themselves said it was ok as long as we don't directly link the leaked material or talk about upcoming games with leaked info.

 

[R_N]

Post in thread 'Game Freak hit with another hack, info leaking'

Oct 13, 2024

After discussions with some other staff members, we have decided to allow discussion of certain aspects of this leak.

This will be: Anything that is from previous generations - this includes the concept artwork and sprites which have been released.

Please do not post about future games which may have been involved in the leak. Please also do not directly link to any accessible materials of this leak.

• DHR-107

• 
• 

The mods themselves said it was ok as long as we don't directly link the leaked material or talk about upcoming games with leaked info.

Which also has precedence since there was no qualms about discussing the other leaked stuff for the other gens over the years

 

[AmbientDinosaur]

I figure if that was the intent (& not just "we'll figure out its evolutions later) they probably scrapped it because it would be weird for this one random thing to evolve into any other Pokemon in the game. Feels like a concept that would be more at home in Gen 1 when things were still loose with ideas, rather than gen 3.

I still can imagine it might've used the personality value to determine things and that was repurpused as wurmple's branching evolution, though.

Might be the case. There was a point when both Evolotto and the Wurmple line was planned. Wurmple still had no evolution conditions by July 11, '02 and by that point Evolotto had gotten axed. So if they didn't have anything else in mind for Wurmple's evolution, they may have decided repurpose the random evolution concept after that.

 

[spectrum-5]

Post in thread 'Game Freak hit with another hack, info leaking'

Oct 13, 2024

After discussions with some other staff members, we have decided to allow discussion of certain aspects of this leak.

This will be: Anything that is from previous generations - this includes the concept artwork and sprites which have been released.

Please do not post about future games which may have been involved in the leak. Please also do not directly link to any accessible materials of this leak.

• DHR-107

• 
• 

The mods themselves said it was ok as long as we don't directly link the leaked material or talk about upcoming games with leaked info.

I thought posting leaks was banned on this site. Why did the mods even approve of this thread? They should have deleted it.

 

[doipy hooves]

I thought posting leaks was banned on this site. Why did the mods even approve of this thread? They should have deleted it.

The official pokemon.com forums (infamous for their moderation practices) have also had a leak thread up for over a year so I think that ship has already sailed.
https://community.pokemon.com/en-us/discussion/5917/about-the-prototypes-of-the-pokemon-games

There's another recent one here that you might empathize with better if you just want to talk about how immoral leaks are.
https://community.pokemon.com/en-us...ks-delays-and-consequences-for-leakers#latest

 

[AmbientDinosaur]

Of course this had to happen during my break from the Internet. I had lots of thougths, but I have edited some out regarding future games and the anime if it isn't allowed. When I say "people" I obviously don't mean users on here (I think? I need to catch up on a lot, I plan on keep the discussions I started before leaving) just what I have seen today on the fandom. Admitedly, as much as I love to know about beta stuff, it coming from an attack that has also unnecesary leaked employees' personal info is pretty uncomfortable. I know we would have never gotten them otherwise but still, why get them involved? And as much as I love Gen 3, I would be much more interested in more recent stuff that actually has a chance of being revisited. Anyways:

-Fans: come up with elaborare theories about the origin of Pokemon relating them to humans or the real world, arguing it's too dark for GF because it would make uncomfortable that humans give orders to creatures too similar to them
GF mythology: "so this guy had sex with an Octillery like twice and got it pregnant, the offspring went around mutilating Ursarings with a sword"

I know it's not literal, just a realistic gen 4-style myth to represent humans are close to Pokemon and all, but it's funny. I also somehow recall already seeing it somewhere? Just like Grovyle being a repurpoused fossil, unless that was some kind of extremely on point speculation.

-While we are talking about mythology, I don't get why people are taking the creation chart/cycles with the pseudos as canon (actually I do know, it's Centro as always spreading misinformation but you get the point). If it wasn't in the games proper is probably because it was discarded. It isn't any different to the mentioned stories of humans breeding with Pokemon, in fact, it has less of a reason to not be in-game. Do you really want me to believe nowadays than Xerneas/Yveltal have no place in the creation process but Gyarados does? It was obviously written just for gen 4, and discared for whatever reason.

-Mega Jynx was already known, nothing new there. Still glad it didn't happen as it deserves an actual evolution. This means we could know something about scrapped regional forms however? That would be a lot more fascinating to me. Apparently Mewtwo also had another form in Gen 5? Probably Mega Mewtwo Y if I had to guess. The movie always felt like it just treated it like any new form change.

I have not seen the beta designs in depth, but then again I wasn't even planning on seeing the leaks, but it's impossible with all the reaction and memes these myths have created.

Grovyle being a repurposed fossil comes from the 2020 gigaleak, with this pokédex quote:

The scales on its arms have come to resemble wings.
It jumps like a glider.
A living fossil from the dinosaur age.

 

[AztecCroc]

Grovyle being a repurposed fossil comes from the 2020 gigaleak, with this pokédex quote:

It also evolves from what is basically blue Rock Scraggy. So Grovyle was seemingly the base for both Archeops and Scrafty.

 

[AmbientDinosaur]

Does this imply Mawile was a two-stager? That makes sense to me ngl

View attachment 678570

what did the low HP music do to you to warrant this visceral reaction of yours

anyways seeing a mawile two-stager in development seems super interesting, did sableye ever get this same treatment or was it just relegated to a one-stager from the start

It does indeed seem like Mawile was a 2 stage line, if quite briefly. I guess the idea was scrapped when they decided on making Mawile the version counterpart to Sableye. I have not seen any indication of Sableye being part of an evolution line in development so far.

I do really wonder though if Mawile was supposed to be the Stage 1 or Stage 2 of the line.

 

[Yung Dramps]

XY leaks are either gonna be a complete nothingburger (relatively speaking) or some of the most outrageous, god-smacking and iconic cut content since the GS gigaleak

Realistic guess is we get some cut Mega evidence and a hint as to what was going on in the power plant

Expanding off of this: I'm gonna be kinda relieved if it's just relatively boring prototype stuff like we're seeing now ngl. If something really scandalous exists like proof of the aliens leak or in-depth XZYZ concepts and design notes, then aside from the general bummer of seeing how much was lost it would also completely mutilate any and all discussion about Legends Z-A. We're gonna have at least 5 years where all analysis of the game will be through the prism of "how thoroughly did it 'atone' for mistakes and missed opportunities made over a decade ago" instead of evaluating it on its own merits and how it expands on the XY we actually got. Devs looking at fan reactions to new mega and Kalosian form reveals only to see a chorus of "WHERE SOUTHERN KALOS I WANNA SEE MEGA GIGALITH AND AYYLMAO LYSANDRE AIIIEEEEEEE"

 

[Ironmage]

actually reading through the scrapped myths, it's really fascinating seeing them try and work out what they wanted to say about the world.

I respect they kept trying to tie in "regular" Pokemon into the creation myths, per the original idea for the diagram, even if it is kind of goofy.

I think it was the right call to pull back on it and keep things more insular to a Sinnoh creation myth (rather than a greater Pokemon-Japan creation myth) with other, more vague myths that are simpler over all. Seems like there was a lot of revisions before getting to that point.

Shame there's probably not similar write ups for Gen 5's abyssal ruins?

That passage feels really weird to me because I think of Gyarados and Tyranitar much more as forces of destruction in-universe rather than maintaining their realms. Dragonite at least has the mystic guardian vibes, though I also think of it's mysticism as more tied to (fresh)water than the sky despite being Flying-type.

 

[Axiemeister]

yeah i am glad they dropped that part of the lore because it's both a) kind of silly, and b) would be really restrictive to future generations. arceus on its own already feels kind of like a shadow over any legendary storyline they created afterwards.

the diagram is very cool though and i am glad it stayed

 

[ant4456]

Expanding off of this: I'm gonna be kinda relieved if it's just relatively boring prototype stuff like we're seeing now ngl. If something really scandalous exists like proof of the aliens leak or in-depth XZYZ concepts and design notes, then aside from the general bummer of seeing how much was lost it would also completely mutilate any and all discussion about Legends Z-A. We're gonna have at least 5 years where all analysis of the game will be through the prism of "how thoroughly did it 'atone' for mistakes and missed opportunities made over a decade ago" instead of evaluating it on its own merits and how it expands on the XY we actually got. Devs looking at fan reactions to new mega and Kalosian form reveals only to see a chorus of "WHERE SOUTHERN KALOS I WANNA SEE MEGA GIGALITH AND AYYLMAO LYSANDRE AIIIEEEEEEE"

the weird thing isnt xy to me, its that no one has even dived into gen 7 even tho builds of that have been up for like 24 hours

like is it just all recent builds? site doesnt specify

 

[Blitz]

Southern Kalos has been found.

I repeat, SOUTHERN KALOS has been found!

 

[AtlasFlame18]

Southern Kalos has been found.

I repeat, SOUTHERN KALOS has been found!

This is not a drill is it?

 

[R_N]

yeah i am glad they dropped that part of the lore because it's both a) kind of silly, and b) would be really restrictive to future generations. arceus on its own already feels kind of like a shadow over any legendary storyline they created afterwards.

the diagram is very cool though and i am glad it stayed

I think the restrictiveness wouldn't be too bad, with knowledge of where the series went.
It's easy to just focus the creation myth as, well, an in-universe myth so it'd be focused on local things but also one pertaining the Poke-Japan mega-country specifically. Obviously you wind up with some silliness regardless (the forces of nature seem to now have ties to the area, not just Pokemon-America, as an example), but on the whole it can fudge its way through if they did decide to commit to it.

Easier that they didn't, of course.

 

[Yung Dramps]

This is not a drill is it?

So far only poryleeks has talked about this so idk. After the Gen 5 meeting fiasco I'm not taking anything for granted

 

[R_N]

I'd be curious to what extent "Southern Kalos" would even exist as from what we have.

 

[Yung Dramps]

Look man Im just hoping I didn't capital j Jynx this shit lmao

 

[doipy hooves]

So far only poryleeks has talked about this so idk. After the Gen 5 meeting fiasco I'm not taking anything for granted

I'd be curious to what extent "Southern Kalos" would even exist as from what we have.

It's just a town map visual in one of the early builds, no descriptions aside from the early towns. I've seen a video and people mention how to reproduce it independently so it seems alright.

 

[ant4456]

I mean it makes sense they planned Southern Kalos at some point, probably with Z/whatever they were gonna do. Esp. since their last set of games had an entire part of the map also be revealed in the same region in its "third versions" equivalent.

 

[R_N]

It's just a town map visual in one of the early builds, no descriptions aside from the early towns. I've seen a video and people mention how to reproduce it independently so it seems alright.
View attachment 678645

comparing with the final map, it looks like Kiloude the dot to the left of the starting town. In the final it was moved to the right
I think people forget its actually in "Southern Kalos"

The other dot, who knows. I see that a few of the minor dots aren't on here so maybe it was one of those - like the Chamber of Emptiness and such.