Fun with Technician

Bourbon

Hey, I've been testing a Hitmontop on Shoddy. I'm running adamant wiht Technician, 252 HP, 252 ATK, 6 def. I have him in BL play, though I ahve has "some" success against OU.

Heres the set I was working with:

Triple Kick (does 135 w/ technician)
Fake Out (does 60 w/ tech)
Mach Punch (does 90 w/ tech)
Rapid Spin

Basically, I switch in on a low health poke, try and Fake Out, if that doesnt kill, I mach punched. Then, I triple kick/mach punch to do damage. Triple kick is there for sub breaking, which I saw a lot of on Shoddy... Problem is, he's completely walled by Ghost. Where can I squeeze in Pursuit? Maybe no fake out...? (pursuit w/ tech does 60)

Now, I know someone will probably say "read the D/P analysis" but they ahd no Technician sets. Thats where I need your help. I need the best Techniacian set possible, and again, the lack of pursuit is a prob.
 
Why Pursuit? Which Ghost in it's right mind would run from Hitmontop?

I'd be more worried about the fliers like Salamence and Gyarados who Intimidate you, then threaten you and your whole squad.

In conclusion Stone Edge>Pursuit. Drop Fake Out.
 
Yup, Fake Out needs to go. At least Ambipom has STAB on it, which is why it can use the move effectively; Hitmontop--not so much.

I'm trying to think if there's a better move in that spot than Stone Edge, but the best I can come up with is Aerial Ace. (Yeah...)

So, I second Lee's suggestion.
 
Fake Out + Mach Punch is fun. Stone Edge is vital for coverage and power issues. The combination has saved me time and time again from full sweeps, its pretty much a staple on my team for stalling, cumulative damage and anti-sweep and Focus Sash scouting.

Its also quite an amusing counter on Ambipom itself scoring a OHKO if it attempts that U-Turn and can be the bane of fully setup PorygonZ's.

Actually I'm reluctant to disclose my full Techtop set and EV's since someone will probably figure it out sooner or later and there goes my personal advantage.
 
With Hitmontop's amazing sp. def, he can take a shadow ball from Genny easily, and then use pursuit. It's basically so that he has a little insurance in case a Ghost shows up. It will likely 2HKO, and gengar can't run or else it most certainly would. Thanks to technician, Pursuit would do 120 to a ghost/psychic. It's more "surprise" factor than anything (and since a lot of people really depend on Gengar, killing it is worth it)

Anyways, right now, I'm leaning towards this:

Pursuit
Stone Edge/Mach Punch
Rapid Spin
Triple Kick

So, yeah, I realize Stone Edge is a good anti flier move, but since I'm trying to take advantage of technician, I want to use moves as close to 60 power as possible, to take max advantage. Also, Stone edge has just 5 PP, and bear in mind that there isnt many fliers that resist fight (save for gliscor and dragons)

I'll try both, and see how it works. Mach punch is great for revenge kills, and does 90, and Stone Edge does 100, which is why I'm not too keen on it. Once again, tech'd pursuit is for catching things that run.
 
Yes, max attack Pursuit would 2HKO Gengar 0/0 Gengar. But so would Stone Edge. So just use that. 8PP aint too bad, as with 50 base HP, Hitmontop aint gonna be around long enough to get off anywhere near that many attacks.

What would run from Hitmontop? Weavile? Tyranitar? Oh great, Pursuit does nothing to them. It's gotta be a 26HKO on Tyranitar. ¬_¬
 
Sadly, no one will ever really "depend" on Gengar. It can't stat up, nor can it wall. It can't beat Blissey one on one.

As much as I like Mach Punch, Stone Edge is needed for coverage purposes.

And most fliers resist fighting...... I think you meant rock there.
 
The only other Technicial physical moves it gets are Aerial Ace, Bullet Punch and Theif, none of which seem that great.

Its pretty tough to pick 4 moves here, and having only Fighting, Normal moves (and EQ) to pick from doesn't help much.

So basically I didn't help at all :S

That said Triple Kick isn't that great, after all Fake Out + Mach Punch or Mach Punch x 2 is better. Hitmontop isn't that fast to using priority moves is probably worth going all the way with.

I'd suggest
Mach Punch
Fake Out
Stone Edge
Rapid Spin

If you want a nice Technician-based spinner, pursuit doesn't work to its strenghts, nothing is going to be running from Hitmontop much except dark types which resist it.
 
With Technician, the running bonus doesn't add up much anyway.

Pursuit is 40 BP, 60 BP with technician. When they run, it is always 80 BP.

Pursuit can be used as a trapping move, indeed, that is what it is used for. If Hitmontop were to be a revenge-killer, Pursuit would work out perfectly especially if the opponent relies on wish passing.

That said, I could see a use of pursuit in the place of Fake-Out. You already have a priority move that is significantly stronger (Mach Punch is 90 BP after stab and technician, while Fake Out is only 60, getting a boost only from technician), and Fighting is a much better attacking type than normal anyway.

Pursuit and Mach Punch gives Hitmontop a pseudo-Dugtrio ability, able to revenge kill those guys who are about ready to die. Granted, Dugtrio has more attack options, but no one is immune to dark and few 4x resist.
 
Wow, you explained my idea better than I did... : O

Thats basically what my plan was, though.

EDIT: found another hitmontop moveset. How's this?

"Hitmontop @ Life Orb
Ability: Technician
EVs: 4 HP/252 Atk/252 Spd
Adamant nature (+Atk, -SAtk)
- Fake Out
- Mach Punch
- Aerial Ace
- Bullet Punch

This. Thing. ****ing. Wins. Technician Fakeout/Machpunch puts a large dent in a lot of things that aren't ghost types. Bullet punch for filler and hitting ghosts w/ priority, Aerial Ace for slow grass and bug types, and non-jolly breloom. All attacks abuse technician."

Should I use a set like this, and use Claydol as my Spinner?
 
That just doesn't carry enough power. Even with Technician, the priority moves only have 60 base power; in effect, you're begging something halfway stable on your knees to set up on you. Add something strong like Close Combat over one of the priority moves.
 
Bullet Punch doesn't do anything for you that Mach Punch can't. You're really going to want Close Combat or something on there over Bullet Punch.
 
Rapid Spinning Hitmontops are better suited with Intimidate. its the trait of choice for a poke that needs to come in and spin frequently throughout the course of one match.
 
gmax said:
Sadly, no one will ever really "depend" on Gengar. It can't stat up, nor can it wall. It can't beat Blissey one on one.
Click to expand...
McGar begs to differ.

Loetke said:
Bullet Punch doesn't do anything for you that Mach Punch can't. You're really going to want Close Combat or something on there over Bullet Punch.
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Actually Bullet Punch does have uses. It finishes off Gengar, I cannot stress how important this is. Gengar is a VERY common switch into Top and is unlikely to ever OHKO it. Bullet Punch can easily leave Hitmontop in a condition to come back in later for some more annoyance.

Bullet Punch + Fake Out is also a instant kill on Alakazam and some fragile psychics, gives it a better priority move for fliers too.

The other popular switch ins are Cress and Dusknoir who Hitmontop can do nothing against really.

Oh yeah and a comment on the item, Life Orb is a really bad choice honestly. Hitmontop has great durability if you EV it into defenses/HP to survive alot of hard hitting moves and last thing you need is sacrificing HP to turn normally 2HKO's into OHKO's.
 
I'm not too keen on Close Combat, personally, lowering Hitmontop's great defense for a little extra damage isnt worth it. How about Hi Jump Kick, or something? If Triple Kick isn't that good (which from my recent shoddy expierience, its great) I would rather go for Hi Jump Kick than Close Combat.


So, right now, I'm thinking:

High Jump Kick/Triple Kick (both have their advantages)
Pursuit/Rapid Spin
Mach Punch
Aerial Ace/EQ/Stone Edge

I can always put Rapid Spin on Claydol
 
skiddle said:
I'm not too keen on Close Combat, personally, lowering Hitmontop's great defense for a little extra damage isnt worth it. How about Hi Jump Kick, or something? If Triple Kick isn't that good (which from my recent shoddy expierience, its great) I would rather go for Hi Jump Kick than Close Combat.
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A little extra damage? It's twice as strong, actually. Hi Jump Kick lacks accuracy, plus there's that little kick back if you do miss. By little I mean at least 1/4 of your HP.
 
As a realife user of a technitop, I must say one of the mainreasons to use it is for the kicks, and machpunches.
stone edge I'd say for over Fake out. also, with hittys low speed I mght want to try a zoom lens, since a critical hit stone edge is just devistateing.
 
Loetke said:
A little extra damage? It's twice as strong, actually. Hi Jump Kick lacks accuracy, plus there's that little kick back if you do miss. By little I mean at least 1/4 of your HP.
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Hi Jump Kick does 100 damage. Thats only a little less. And since hitmontop is kinda slow, lowering his def isnt a god idea at all, as he WILL be taking hits.
 
skiddle said:
Hi Jump Kick does 100 damage. Thats only a little less. And since hitmontop is kinda slow, lowering his def isnt a god idea at all, as he WILL be taking hits.
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Oh the "twice as strong" thing was in response to STAB Technician Mach Punch. Yeah, HJK does have pretty decent damage, but less accuracy, and if you miss with it against a faster sweeper, it's pretty much game over after the recoil. On the other hand, if you hit with it you've still got at least one more turn to take off the rest of their HP, where with the Close Combat Defense reduction, you might not. I can see arguments for both, but I personally wouldn't use HJK.
 
To get mahc punch, do I have to breed with Hitmonchan? How would I do this: breed it with Ditto and get a tyrogue with Mach Punch?
 
Breed a Hitmonchan that know Mach Punch with a Ditto to get a Mach Punch Tyrogue. Evolve said Tyrogue into a Hitmontop. Enjoy.
 
If the first post is correct and Triple Kick has an effective base of 135 why would you ever use Hi Jump Kick, is the extra 15 power really worth a chance or losing a fair portion of your HP?
 
Ah yes, my bad. I misread that.

Triple Kick also has the added bonus of destroying the opponent's Substitute's which goes a long way towards making up for the drop in power. And lets face it...if you didn't care about losing more HP than neccesary, you'd be using Close Combat, yes? Technician Triple Kick > HJK imo.
 
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