Metagame Force of the Fallen

[Gimlaf]

I'm just gonna join in on the fun and post the two teams I've made as well:


I was also intrigued by the idea of passing Trick Room around, but I somehow ended up turning it into a team full of special attackers instead of adding Ursaluna and Kingambit. Highlights include Arboliva getting Boomburst and it passing Strength Sap for general longevity, as well as Torkoal passing Clear Smog because I'm forseeing a lot of stat boosting shenanigans in the first several days. Not too sure about the last slot though, I could replace it with Sylveon to get more use of Boomburst.


After realizing that Final Gambit could be passed, I couldn't resist building my own team around that. Spamming Final Gambit for Kingambit to clean up felt like the obvious solution, lol. Meanwhile Urshifu is there to pressure Ghost switchins as all as giving Wicked Blow to Kingambit. That being said, I didn't put too much thought into this. Won't stop me from trying it out, though.

 

[StompyStomps]

A late welcome to the OM group. I hope you are better and more popular than tera donation. Also

I'm just gonna join in on the fun and post the two teams I've made as well:


I was also intrigued by the idea of passing Trick Room around, but I somehow ended up turning it into a team full of special attackers instead of adding Ursaluna and Kingambit. Highlights include Arboliva getting Boomburst and it passing Strength Sap for general longevity, as well as Torkoal passing Clear Smog because I'm forseeing a lot of stat boosting shenanigans in the first several days. Not too sure about the last slot though, I could replace it with Sylveon to get more use of Boomburst.


After realizing that Final Gambit could be passed, I couldn't resist building my own team around that. Spamming Final Gambit for Kingambit to clean up felt like the obvious solution, lol. Meanwhile Urshifu is there to pressure Ghost switchins as all as giving Wicked Blow to Kingambit. That being said, I didn't put too much thought into this. Won't stop me from trying it out, though.

This is stupid

Stpid fun looking!!!!!

swaping Boomburst with roost and clear smog with eruption is better imo

 

[cat]

hello, ive done some playtesting here and there, here to give day one thoughts:

sneasler. sneasler is sneaslering. giving it actual moves is a crime since it can just pull out ice move for lando, edge for flyings like zapdos or smth, and its a flawed mon by itself, tera flying + acro beats tusk, and the nightmare called giving anything dire claw is worrisome.

speaking of giving, im surprised quiver dance, bdrum, etc werent watchlisted / banned before the ladder was out. i havent toyed with them yet but in theory they are looking pretty crazy.

Hazard Stack - DosDogs

why is tinglu spatk and bslam here btw

 

[Billybobman]

Destiny bond seems fun. A team with and some other mon could work. Might have to consider lagging tail to make use of Prankster Dbond better and maybe leppa berry on the slower mons. Assuming that leppa heals the pp.

 

[emillight]

okay so explosion is actually really good but seems to be bugged? explosioning out seems to not pass your moves if you die (and the other mon dies? not sure) and pop bomb is sharpness boosted for god knows why

Pop Bomb Explosion HO


basic premise is to explode out into gallade as fast as possible
arc is really dumb if it gets a vic dance up as well and espeed can do cleanup

hardest mu for this team is donBOZO fat structures but just hope you can explosion it into kill range

EDIT: so it seems explosion (and final gambit) is bugged. if you explosion and the opposing mon doesnt die, you pass your move as usual. however if you explosion and both mons die, the exploding mon does not pass its move (the opposing mon passes normally)

pinging Kris Instruct

 

[Catzzadilla]

Hey, what are your thoughts on unbanning Annihilape and banning Rage Fist for this meta? The reason Annihilape was banned in OU and not Rage Fist was because Rage Fist Primeape was unable to be as broken as Annihilape because it lacked the stats. But now that Rage Fist can be passed on to bulkier, stronger mons, could we ban the move instead so we can use a ghost/fighting mon that isn’t Marshadow?

 

[Iynhe]

I am going to be THAT person and say that Taunt is probably THE fourth move that every team wants.
Also, at least during the first few days, pack a ghost to avoid final gambit spam XD

 

[StompyStomps]

Hey, what are your thoughts on unbanning Annihilape and banning Rage Fist for this meta? The reason Annihilape was banned in OU and not Rage Fist was because Rage Fist Primeape was unable to be as broken as Annihilape because it lacked the stats. But now that Rage Fist can be passed on to bulkier, stronger mons, could we ban the move instead so we can use a ghost/fighting mon that isn’t Marshadow?

marshadow doesnt exist in gen 9, but i agree, rage fist is the toxic element here, and the thought of tera ghost rage fist dondozo terrifies me

I am going to be THAT person and say that Taunt is probably THE fourth move that every team wants.
Also, at least during the first few days, pack a ghost to avoid final gambit spam XD

but funny nuke move :(
on a serious note, i agree, taunt is nescicary

i also belive our lord and savior Clodsire could be very good

okay so explosion is actually really good but seems to be bugged? explosioning out seems to not pass your moves if you die (and the other mon dies? not sure) and pop bomb is sharpness boosted for god knows why

Pop Bomb Explosion HO


basic premise is to explode out into gallade as fast as possible
arc is really dumb if it gets a vic dance up as well and espeed can do cleanup

hardest mu for this team is donBOZO fat structures but just hope you can explosion it into kill range

EDIT: so it seems explosion (and final gambit) is bugged. if you explosion and the opposing mon doesnt die, you pass your move as usual. however if you explosion and both mons die, the exploding mon does not pass its move (the opposing mon passes normally)

pinging Kris Instruct

put loaded dice on gallade, so that pop bomb and icicle spear always hit 20/4-5 times respectively

also, where is the july tier changes post?

 

[emillight]

marshadow doesnt exist in gen 9, but i agree, rage fist is the toxic element here, and the thought of tera ghost rage fist dondozo terrifies me


but funny nuke move :(
on a serious note, i agree, taunt is nescicary

i also belive our lord and savior Clodsire could be very good

put loaded dice on gallade, so that pop bomb and icicle spear always hit 20/4-5 times respectively

loaded dice doesnt work on pop bomb btw; accuracy check, itll always hit 10 times its just that itll stop if one misses

 

[StompyStomps]

loaded dice doesnt work on pop bomb btw; accuracy check, itll always hit 10 times its just that itll stop if one misses

i wasnt aware of this. thanks for the new bit of knowledge

 

[Catzzadilla]

pop bomb is sharpness boosted for god knows why

Population Bomb’s japanese name references something that would be boosted by Sharpness. It didn’t translate into english, but it’s a feature, not a bug.

 

[abemaster5]

Trickroom is very strong here, arguably broken if used right. I got top of the ladder spamming this shit.

https://pokepast.es/9ed1bbb5888094ad
(Belle Starr is me) Taunt is pretty tough agaisnt it however, are you willing to taunt in front of an ursaluna? The 50-50s are stressful.
The team isn't super reliant on it however, each mon can take a hit and trade until its down to kingambit. Who in the end gets access to Slack off/Trick room/Headlong rush/Destiny Bond. Completely self sufficient, Hoopa-U is here to break any physical wall like Tusk or Dozo, not even dark types wanna mess with it unless your name is ting-lu. Skeledirge is a backup plan for any set up sweepers, with curse to make sure it dies the turn after, this team puts in incredible work. Opposing ursaluna is a tough match up, but thats why we have tera, iron hands getting a trickroom after terastall is game ending most of the time. Handle with care though, this team involves allot of mindfuckery.

 

[StompyStomps]

Trickroom is very strong here, arguably broken if used right. I got top of the ladder spamming this shit.

View attachment 530913
https://pokepast.es/9ed1bbb5888094ad
(Belle Starr is me) Taunt is pretty tough agaisnt it however, are you willing to taunt in front of an ursaluna? The 50-50s are stressful.
The team isn't super reliant on it however, each mon can take a hit and trade until its down to kingambit. Who in the end gets access to Slack off/Trick room/Headlong rush/Destiny Bond. Completely self sufficient, Hoopa-U is here to break any physical wall like Tusk or Dozo, not even dark types wanna mess with it unless your name is ting-lu. Skeledirge is a backup plan for any set up sweepers, with curse to make sure it dies the turn after, this team puts in incredible work. Opposing ursaluna is a tough match up, but thats why we have tera, iron hands getting a trickroom after terastall is game ending most of the time. Handle with care though, this team involves allot of mindfuckery.

one phrase

libera me a malo de profundis inferni

 

[April]

In Force of the Fallen, the fourth move slot does NOT pass on to the rest of the team if a Pokemon KOes an opposing pokemon with a self-ko move

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9forceofthefallen-1895962675 self-test replay. Also tested with Dark Koopatrol and came to the same conclusion.

here, squawkabilly should be passing Roost to the rest of the team once it faints.

Squawkabilly uses Final Gambit, KOes the opposing Diglett, and Wooper does not recieve Roost as a move.

Here, Staravia should be passing Agility to the rest of the team once it faints.

Staravia uses Final Gambit, KOing itself, but the opposing Wigglet survives. Because Wigglet survived, Wooper correctly received Agility. The same applies to other self-KO moves such as Explosion. The fourth moveslot is not passed if the opposing pokemon faints due to a Self-KO move used by one of your Pokemon.

If this is an intended mechanic or a glitch, I don't know, but if this is the intended implementation, I think it should be edited into the OP to avoid further confusion

 

[NoobHereWaddup]

not sure if this is intentional, but ditto is unusable. i would assume it isn't because the op suggests you should be able to use a pokemon with imposter (aka ditto), but no matter where you put transform, it ends up saying that transform can't be on the last moveslot

 

[Iynhe]

Probably intentional from the game's perspective too.
Also irrelevant, Transform is restricted.
-----
I guess that ghosts will have to wait for their moment until that coding feature becomes a bug XD or wait forevah, if it will be considered a feature.

 

[KaenSoul]

Hey fellas, just want to comment that the council will be voting on Lilligant-H, Shell Smash, Quiver Dance, Belly Drum, Rage Fist, Population Bomb and Terastal, I'm going to share what I think about them.

I think everyone knows by now how strong the set-up moves are, we wanted to give them a chance as this is the first time the format becomes playable, and they ended as broken as we expected.

Lilligant-H will be voted on instead of Victory Dance because first, is the only user, second, it also becomes a broken sweeper when passed coverage moves and new stabs, specially Flower Trick that is a strong spammable stab that can't miss even with Hustle.

Annihilape is already banned, but Primeape has been good enough to cause trouble, it gains moves to fix its problems like reliable recovery and new ways to boost like Cosmic Power, and there is also the option to just let it die and let stronger mons use the move like Dragapult or Ceruledge.

Population Bomb is a really strong move that now anyone can use, one of the best teams in ladder abuse the move and little would change if we change Maushold to Tandemaus so the move will be voted on instead of the mice.

This is an extremely volatile format and the possibility to get a free set-up turn or gain stab on your new moves just make everything potentially broken.

 

[Catzzadilla]

Hey fellas, just want to comment that the council will be voting on Lilligant-H, Shell Smash, Quiver Dance, Belly Drum, Rage Fist, Population Bomb and Terastal, I'm going to share what I think about them.

I think everyone knows by now how strong the set-up moves are, we wanted to give them a chance as this is the first time the format becomes playable, and they ended as broken as we expected.

Will they be restricted or banned outright?

Annihilape is already banned, but Primeape has been good enough to cause trouble, it gains moves to fix its problems like reliable recovery and new ways to boost like Cosmic Power, and there is also the option to just let it die and let stronger mons use the move like Dragapult or Ceruledge

With Rage Fist and Tera being suspected, does this mean Annihilape could come back if the reasons for his ban are gone from the meta?

 

[StompyStomps]

My FoTF team that speaks for itself
https://pokepast.es/bf97d4b516b53321
if you understand the refrences, respect.
Urshifu Gifts Wicked Blow, Reva Gifts Shift Gear, Gren Water Shuriken, Pelliper Roost, Vivillion Grants Quiver Dance, With Typh-H Giving Infernal Parade

One Punch Bear Shift Gears and Sweeps, Reva Shift Gears And Sweeps, Pelliper is the PHAT burd, and the other 3 quiver dance once or twice and win

this should be a sample team with how easy it is to use

quiver dance battle bond greninja is goated
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9forceofthefallen-1896446943-oto7eq2cw8ruikwug1h23pmlccg0f5fpw

 

[DosDogs]

Will they be restricted or banned outright?



With Rage Fist and Tera being suspected, does this mean Annihilape could come back if the reasons for his ban are gone from the meta?

Mostly restricted outside of Tera and the Mons, moves would be restricted. Annihilape being free is something we are deciding, if rage fist is restricted than Annihilape could be freed, or it could stay banned.

 

[S1nn0hC0nfirm3d]

Mortal Spin Stall:
https://pokepast.es/7d46d5b33fa387cc
#1 ladder, counters Trick Room. Suicide lead your Glimora, then everything loves Mortal Spin.

Population Bomb:
https://pokepast.es/5053640307b33072
Shit just goes hard idk what else to say also very good but its a lot harder into priority spam / TR.

 

[Malareon]

approved by KaenSoul and drampa's grandpa, but technically UT
View attachment 527590
Amazing banner by IMakeNoSense​

A Pokemon fainting is usually an unfavorable event during a battle for the player. This OM attempts to change that. Fainted Pokemon now turn into ghostly spirits that still have a role in the battle now. These spirits accompany the healthy Pokemon and can use one of their moves to help their teammates during battle. They can stack, giving more and more move options for your Pokemon that are alive. If this intrigues you, then consider giving this OM a try!

Premise of the Metagame: When a Pokemon faints, all other Pokemon that are alive gain the fourth move slot of the Pokemon that fainted as an extra move in their moveset.

If your first pokemon faints, the remaining five will have five moves, four of which being their regular moves and the last one being the fourth move of the fainted pokemon. If another pokemon faints, the remaining four pokemon will have six moves, four of which being their regular moves and the last two being the fourth moves of the two fainted pokemon. It goes like this until the final pokemon standing will have nine moves, four of which being their regular moves and the last five being the fourth moves of all the other fainted pokemon.

The PP each Pokemon gets is the PP the fallen Pokemon left and is shared among the rest of the receivers.

Banlist​

Clauses: Sleep Moves Clause, Standard OMs Clause, Min Source Gen=9
Pokemon: Annihilape, Arceus, Calyrex-Ice, Calyrex-Shadow, Chi-Yu, Chien-Pao, Dialga, Dialga-Origin, Enamorus-Base, Espathra, Eternatus, Flutter Mane, Giratina, Giratina-Origin, Groudon, Iron Bundle, Komala, Koraidon, Kyogre, Landorus-Base, Magearna, Mewtwo, Miraidon, Palafin, Palkia, Palkia-Origin, Rayquaza, Regieleki, Spectrier, Zacian, Zacian-Crowned, Zamazenta-Crowned
Abilities: Arena Trap, Moody, Shadow Tag
Moves: Baton Pass, Last Respects, Shed Tail
Restricted Moves (These moves cannot be used in the fourth moveslot): Extreme Speed, Revival Blessing, Transform
Items: Booster Energy, King's Rock

Watchlist

Pokemon: Falinks, Hoopa-Unbound, Lilligant-Hisui, Sneasler, Tinkaton, Ursaluna, Urshifu-Base, Veluza, Zamazenta
Clauses: Tera Clause
Abilities: Stench
Restricted Moves: Belly Drum, Quiver Dance, Rage Fist, Shell Smash, Shift Gear

Strategy​

- Suicide leads have the sole purpose of leading and then fainting. Adding a useful move for the rest of the team is a great way to take advantage of this mechanic without losing too much yourself. There will be an overall buff for these types of pokemon who are running niche fourth slots to fit their team well.

- There are so many recover clones and passing them to other pokemon makes them take forever to break down. With the recovery PP nerf this gen, it is very useful for stall and semi-stall teams. Obviously stall teams don’t want their pokemon dying, but even if they do, the others will be even harder to break.

- You can pass around setup moves around for your entire team. This can overwhelm opponents by constantly setting up one after another, but the opponent can also use these setup turns to their advantage. Your own defensive setup moves can also be passed to try to mitigate the opponent’s setup.

- Endgames are going to be very chaotic. Your teams can and should be able to prepare for anything the opponent might throw during these endgames. With a plethora of moves, you can turn the tables in an unfavorable matchup.

FAQ​

Q: How much PP would the shared move have?
A: The PP of the shared move would be equal to the PP of that move when the donor fainted. The shared move's PP is also distributed among the rest of the receivers that have the move.

Q: How does Ditto work with Imposter?
A: Ditto cannot be used since it has to have Transform, which is restricted.

Q: How do duplicate moves work?
A: You get a clone of the move.

Q: Why didn’t my move get donated? [BUG]
A: Self-KO moves currently do not work properly. They are won’t pass the move if the Pokemon KO’d itself.

Council​

prunyy
DosDogs
Dark Koopatrol
KaenSoul
100th post wooo!

Some sort of rage fist stall team seams really good, the idea being that once primeape goes down and gives all 5 of your other pokemon rage fist, you can build up rage fist by just doing what stall does best and swapping in on crap and tanking attacks, then any one of your pokemon will eventually have a 300 base power move they can spam to finish an opponent off, thinking of it like a win condition for stalling the game out and primeape does have at least a couple of decent tools like stealth rock and taunt but it might not be enough, worth a shot at least.

 

[TheMonkePig]

I would like to offer a counterpoint to banning Quiver/Victory dance, Shell Smash, etc. I realize that in some circumstances these are broken moves, however, there are ways around it, and you can't just spam the moves and win the game. We have some really solid Unaware Pokemon, and access to Haze. I run Unaware Mons anyway, I don't know why it is a problem to add one. Furthermore, Haze is an objectively good move. Putting Haze on a Bulky Mon is not that hard. Case and point Clodsire. Set-up moves don't win you a game. Yeah, putting Shell Smash on a Great Tusk sounds broken on paper, but in practice, it has the normal set-up move limitations. You can also run the same thing if you are worried about it being too powerful, then your opponent has to worry about the same thing. If you compare it to other moves that got banned it doesn't come close. Baton Pass was banned because it straight-up passed on stat changes. Shed Tail Got banned because it swapped you into expendable HP and a free set-up move (in most cases). That is why I don't think that set-up moves should be banned at all.

 

[KaenSoul]

I would like to offer a counterpoint to banning Quiver/Victory dance, Shell Smash, etc. I realize that in some circumstances these are broken moves, however, there are ways around it, and you can't just spam the moves and win the game. We have some really solid Unaware Pokemon, and access to Haze. I run Unaware Mons anyway, I don't know why it is a problem to add one. Furthermore, Haze is an objectively good move. Putting Haze on a Bulky Mon is not that hard. Case and point Clodsire. Set-up moves don't win you a game. Yeah, putting Shell Smash on a Great Tusk sounds broken on paper, but in practice, it has the normal set-up move limitations. You can also run the same thing if you are worried about it being too powerful, then your opponent has to worry about the same thing. If you compare it to other moves that got banned it doesn't come close. Baton Pass was banned because it straight-up passed on stat changes. Shed Tail Got banned because it swapped you into expendable HP and a free set-up move (in most cases). That is why I don't think that set-up moves should be banned at all.

The problem with that kind of counterplay, beyond being kinda centralizing, is that it is quite easy to have counterplay to the counterplay in this format, boosting moves and coverage aren't the only thing you can pass around, any good HO should be able to fit Taunt or Encore somewhere to easily beat walls, HO leads like Grimmsnarl already have Taunt on their regular sets anyway.

 

[xqgwpafz]

Just reporting a little bug:

https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9forceofthefallen-1896415799

In this game, my landorus-therian with Swords Dance in its fourth moveslot uses trick room from Hatterene on turn 2 followed by its own EQ on turn 3, then dies to scizor's bullet punch on turn 4. The rest of my team does not have Swords Dance after lando dies. Maybe this bug is caused by a pokemon using an inherited move as its first move out?