Espeon Discussion

pkmn Trainer Zach

Espeon

Espeon, my absolute favorite Pokémon, has generally been known for its "EspyJump" set, which takes advantage of its somewhat defensive abilities to use Baton Pass to pass on Calm Minds and Substitutes. It is arguably the best Pokémon at doing this, but can it be useful for anything else?

Notable Physical Movepool (STAB in bold)
Covet

60 base Attack compared to its 130 Special Attack? I'll take the latter.

Notable Special Movepool (STAB in bold)
Grass Knot
Hidden Power
Hyper Beam (a real stretch)
Psychic
Shadow Ball

As you can see, poor Espeon is very limited as to what it can attack with. Such an awesome Special Attack and only a few good moves to compliment it. Pitiful.

Notable Suport Movepool
Baton Pass
Calm Mind
Charm
Curse
Fake Tears
Helping Hand (in Double Battles)
Light Screen
Morning Sun
Psych Up
Protect
Reflect
Rest
Substitute
Sunny Day
Tickle
Trick Room
Wish
Yawn

I think this about covers it. Espeon has a very nice support movepool, and its purposes in battle are typically centered around it. With that, let's get to the movesets.

Espeon @ Leftovers
~Baton Pass
~Calm Mind
~Psychic
~Substitute/Hidden Power/Shadow Ball/Grass Knot

Standard "EspyJump" set. I'm not too sure if Espeon will be able to pull it off in this generation as well as it did in the last, with this super-offensive metagame we are apparently going to have.

Espeon @ Choice Specs
~Grass Knot
~Hidden Power
~Psychic
~Shadow Ball

Espeon definately has the Speed and Attack to pull this off. Maybe not the moves, so much, but its stats are in the right place. Alakazam does this much better, but I'm giving Espeon's superior defenses a chance here.

Espeon @ Lum Berry
~Fake Tears/Calm Mind
~Hidden Power
~Psychic
~Shadow Ball

Fake Tears might force a switch...

Espeon @ Leftovers
~Hidden Power
~Shadow Ball/Reflect/Light Screen
~Psychic
~Reflect/Light Screen

Pesudo-passing Espeon. This might could work.

Espeon @ Leftovers
~Calm Mind/Substitute
~Charm/Substitute
~Psychic
~Wish

A Wish "passing" set. Espeon might be able to pull this off, as its stats are not that bad defensively. Vaporeon probobly does this much better...

EDIT:
Espeon @ Leftovers/Hot Rock
~Hidden Power [Fire]
~Morning Sun
~Psychic
~Sunny Day

Sunny Day boosts Hidden Power [Fire] as well as Morning Sun. Could go very nicely on a Sunny Day team, especially if you have other Pokémon that can use Sunny Day in combo with Hot Rock.

Well, discuss and figure out where the best place for and what Espeon should be doing on your team (maybe)!
 
Your psuedo-pass set seems like an attempt at creating Espyblock.
Espyblock is:
Espeon @ Leftovers
EVs: 220 SAtk/220 Spd/70 Def
Nature: Timid (Spd+/Atk-)
- Psychic
- Hidden Power [Fighting]
- Reflect
- Morning Sun

Mine is more of a predictionist's set because it predicts incoming physical attackers (Steelix/Tyranitar/Weavile) and Reflects on the switch to set up its 2HKO on them and not die in one hit. Also beats Pursuit Houndoom because it can outspeed and kill with HP Fighting.

Also you win for liking Espeon.
 
I've never heard of Espyblock before. I assume its a set that's always been out there that I missed...

I'm gonna do my best to give this thing a slot on my competitive team in D/P.
 
pkmn Trainer Zach said:
I've never heard of Espyblock before. I assume its a set that's always been out there that I missed...
Click to expand...

I wouldn't be too sure about that since I am willing to bet 99.9% of everyone hasn't heard of it since it, you know, isn't a standard set or well known.

Why do people insist on trying to give movesets horrible names? Honestly...




Anyway as far as Espeon goes I'm really not so sure about it this gen! It is worse off than it was before, like all Psychics, thanks to Pursuit being as ridiculous as it is, and that alone makes it extremely dangerous to use Choice Specs(although frankly if any pursuer comes in on you you're pretty much dead anyway). I think the only one I would even try using is(argh) EspyJump, and even that I expect will be a little suspect... I just don't see much light for Espeon this generation.

I suppose if nothing else the overwhelming amount of Pursuit could knock its usage down to UU where it would be able to wreck up the place quite splendidly.
 
Shadow Ball, Grass Knot and Hidden Power (especially fighting!) was a pretty nice improvement IMO. HP fighting gets rid of TTar that can screw Espy up bad. So can Grass Knot too. Wow, i like Espy a lot more now.
 
The addition of HP fighting being special this gen is helping a lot of pokes. Alakazam and a few others will benefit from it as well. Espeon still should CM/sub passs (espy jump) since it really doesn't have the defenses to do what some of you want it to do. I suppose HP fighting could be used over psychic or along with it.
 
also what about
Espeon (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Synchronize
EVs: 60 HP / 196 Spd / 252 SAtk
Modest/Timid Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Morning Sun
- Calm Mind
- Psychic
- Hidden Power [Fighting]
 
pkmn Trainer Zach said:
I've never heard of Espyblock before. I assume its a set that's always been out there that I missed...

I'm gonna do my best to give this thing a slot on my competitive team in D/P.
Click to expand...

Espyblock has been around since GSC...
Actually if I remember correctly it was a standard in GSC...

Anyway, Eevee evos definitely need the male + female having the same move trick working.
Espeon's biggest weakness is its poor movepool.
 
e4protector said:
Espyblock has been around since GSC...
Actually if I remember correctly it was a standard in GSC...
Click to expand...
Yes, I'm sure this "Espyblock" was a GSC standard, where HP Fighting was physical, among other things.

Stop posting sets, giving them names, and then claiming they are standard are even good.
 
Yawn/Substitute/Baton Pass/Psychic might be workable. Yawn on the ever predictable Tyranitar/Blissey switch, then Substitute. If they switch out, pass a Substitute to a counter. If they stay in and attack you, their biggest Espeon counter just fell asleep and you get to Substitute again and Baton Pass that out.
 
Espyblock in GSC/ADV had HP Fire.

Anyway @Zach Sandstorm in D/P gives a x1.5 multiplier to the SDef of any Rock type. It does not do that for Grounds/Steels/Sand Veil Pokes.
 
maniaclyrasist said:
also what about
Espeon (M) @ Leftovers
Trait: Synchronize
EVs: 60 HP / 196 Spd / 252 SAtk
Modest/Timid Nature (+SAtk, -Atk)
- Morning Sun
- Calm Mind
- Psychic
- Hidden Power [Fighting]
Click to expand...


Well, I only just got D/P, so I don't have any battle experience in it, but that set's a lot like the one I used on Advance, with HP Fire instead of Fighting, though Fighting is clearly superior here. I would go for Timid over Modest and stick more EVs in his defensive stats, something like 200 HP/72 SPD/236 SP DEF. Those EVs are definitely outdated, but the point is that I think that this set should be taking advantage of his defensive capabilities, especially late-game, when he can just CM without a problem, usually. Also, it just seems to me that it makes more sense to have your SP.ATK and SP.DEF stats close together if you're going to CM. Anyway, I don't really know how viable any of this is, so does anyone else have something to say about it? Espeon's one of my favorite pokemon, and I don't want to just use him to pass.
 
This is my custom Espeon for D/P;

Espeon @ Choice Scarf
Modest; 252 Special Attack, 60 Speed, 180 Special Defense, 12 Defense.

-Grass Knot
-Psychic
-Shadow Ball
-HP Fight

The Spread gives 406 in Speed, 394 Special Attack, 271 HP/Special Defense, so It can switch in on some Special move that It resists. Shadow Ball + HP Fight isn't resisted by anything. Psychic is for STAB and Grass Knot deals with Waters. For It's own Tier, I think it works.
 
The only set I'd even consider using on Espeon now is EspyJump, because otherwise it's completely outclassed by Alakazam.
 
e4protector said:
Your psuedo-pass set seems like an attempt at creating Espyblock.
Espyblock is:
Espeon @ Leftovers
EVs: 220 SAtk/220 Spd/70 Def
Nature: Timid (Spd+/Atk-)
- Psychic
- Hidden Power [Fighting]
- Reflect
- Morning Sun

Mine is more of a predictionist's set because it predicts incoming physical attackers (Steelix/Tyranitar/Weavile) and Reflects on the switch to set up its 2HKO on them and not die in one hit. Also beats Pursuit Houndoom because it can outspeed and kill with HP Fighting.

Also you win for liking Espeon.
Click to expand...
HP Fighting doesn't OHKO Houndoom, so that fails actually. Don't forget that its Special Defense is much better than its Physical Defense, and it could very well be Choice Scarfed too.
 
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