Pokémon Dracovish

[Robot7620]

is there any benefits in running water absorb vs strong jaw? I guess water absorb can just eat a gmax waterfall from gyarados, but other than that I dont see much use in it

well for more defensive orientated sets yeah
edit: no dracovish has no defensive utility whatsoever outsi

Because not even a full-power Water Spout from a +1 Calm Mind Primal Kyogre stands to its power:

+1 252+ SpA Kyogre-Primal Water Spout (150 BP) vs. 252 HP / 252+ SpD Appletun in Heavy Rain: 160-189 (37.7 - 44.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery (Appletun has symmetrical defense stats)

So yeah, forget about the "double-resists" bit. You have to be immune to the move to be a switch-in.

It does not help that Water/Dragon is a neat defensive typing as it's only weak to Dragon and Fairy... which cannot switch-in in the first place.

first off pogre is in uber and 2nd it's gone
also you're using +1 while fore dracovish we were calculating at original base stats
soo... yeah

 

[Siggu]

is there any benefits in running water absorb vs strong jaw? I guess water absorb can just eat a gmax waterfall from gyarados, but other than that I dont see much use in it

To check other Dracovish given it's unlikely any will run Outrage, as it's otherwise almost completely pointless to have.

But then you cannot use your own nuclear-powered Fishous Rends so...

first off pogre is in uber and 2nd it's gone
also you're using +1 while fore dracovish we were calculating at original base stats
soo... yeah

It was for the sake of a comparison with what was likely the strongest Water-type move that existed beforehand. POgre cannot run Specs so the +1 from a Calm Mind was needed.

 

[Bakugames]

To check other Dracovish given it's unlikely any will run Outrage, as it's otherwise almost completely pointless to have.

But then you cannot use your own nuclear-powered Fishous Rends so...

if it ends up being used a lot, I could see that. Though being 4x resistant to water already seems good enough for me but I haven't done the calcs yet, I should be doing that soon...

well for more defensive orientated sets yeah

what would be a good defensive set for this guy? lack of good recovery would probabily damp things a lot imo

 

[Robot7620]

if it ends up being used a lot, I could see that. Though being 4x resistant to water already seems good enough for me but I haven't done the calcs yet, I should be doing that soon...



what would be a good defensive set for this guy? lack of good recovery would probabily damp things a lot imo

Appletun is hardpressed to stay healthy throughout the match in rain in order to check it effectively.
Dracovish @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 96 Def / 164 Spe
Impish Nature
- Body Slam
- Leech Life
- Super Fang
- Outrage/Fishious Rend
prob run some like this
lack of recovery hits it hard so leech life basically acts to somewhat compensate for that
164 outspeeds arcanine but use fishious rend with that or if using outrage to act as dracovish check i'd run 92 speed to outspeed rotom-w
body slam fishes for paralysis
super fang pressures switch-ins
edit: it could also potentially utilize a resttalk set though lack of 2 available moveslots hampers it a great deal

 

[MrHands]

Yeeeeah unless this thing becomes oppressive enough to the point where you need 2-3 checks for it I don't think anyone should be using water absorb. If you want a water immunity use a different Pokemon. Scald immunity is neat but you're passing up a 50% damage bonus to do so. Burned Strong Jaw has 75% as much power as Water Absorb.

The real question is Band vs Scarf. Band will KO basically everything while Scarf should shred most offensive pokemon. In either case run it with rain and laugh as even 4x resists get wrecked.

Edit: band in rain deals more damage than a STAB Close Combat would to a Tyranitar.

 

[spatula]

I can't tell you how consistent this mon is but holy shit it's one of the most fun ones I've ever used. Fishious Rend is such an absurd move.

 

[Vengeance417]

The amount of damage Fishious Rend does is just as unholy* as its design.

*bro im jk i love this beautiful bastard look how adorable it is

 

[Apollousa]

I used a lot of Dracozolt on the ladder and it worked out pretty well for me. Dracovish doesnt have the disadvantage of missing attacks due to hustle, but other moves beside bite moves dont get a boost. Dracozolt also is the better dynamax abuser, but rain is easier to setup than electric terrain in Gen 8.

So what do you guys think, which of these 2 is more viable in OU?

 

[MrHands]

I used a lot of Dracozolt on the ladder and it worked out pretty well for me. Dracovish doesnt have the disadvantage of missing attacks due to hustle, but other moves beside bite moves dont get a boost. Dracozolt also is the better dynamax abuser, but rain is easier to setup than electric terrain in Gen 8.

So what do you guys think, which of these 2 is more viable in OU?

My guess is the one that can OHKO Ferrothorn with a resisted unboosted move.

 

[tenkai]

I used a lot of Dracozolt on the ladder and it worked out pretty well for me. Dracovish doesnt have the disadvantage of missing attacks due to hustle, but other moves beside bite moves dont get a boost. Dracozolt also is the better dynamax abuser, but rain is easier to setup than electric terrain in Gen 8.

So what do you guys think, which of these 2 is more viable in OU?

both are certainly usable but vish definitely edges it out imo, partially because of the better defensive typing and lack of low accuracy but mostly for how absolutely spammable fishious rend is. having your busted move be water instead of electric is huge in terms of the ease in which you can just click it; vish also gets wonderful coverage in strong jaw crunch for the only common water immunity rn, jellicent (seis is good but mostly with swift swim) and on top of that can receive easy support from rain to break past things that can normally live one rend even more easily

 

[TURBODERP]

both are certainly usable but vish definitely edges it out imo, partially because of the better defensive typing and lack of low accuracy but mostly for how absolutely spammable fishious rend is. having your busted move be water instead of electric is huge in terms of the ease in which you can just click it; vish also gets wonderful coverage in strong jaw crunch for the only common water immunity rn, jellicent (seis is good but mostly with swift swim) and on top of that can receive easy support from rain to break past things that can normally live one rend even more easily

Not saying it's necessarily a good idea, but the two actually have some decent synergy outside of Rain teams. Dracozolt can muscle past Pex, Jellicent, and Ferro (Bolt Beak for the first two and Fire Fang for the latter), while Dracovish eats Ground-types for breakfast.

 

[GJLimeade]

The amount of damage Fishious Rend does is just as unholy* as its design.

View attachment 207900
*bro im jk i love this beautiful bastard look how adorable it is

He may be the ungodly product of reckless scientific necromancy who suffers nearly every second of his cruel existence thanks to his horrifyingly botched anatomy that makes even basic functions of life such as breathing and swallowing absurdly difficult and exhausting, but at least he can 2HKO defensive Ferrothorn with a resisted attack.

 

[zferolie]

Its amazing how this pokemon went from unholy abomination to probably the strongest pokemon in the game. All because strong jaw works on fishish rend. I am honestly tempted to replace my rapidash with this, i just loose a fairy move on my team if i do(and is that a big loss? Does one need fairy coverage if you have other attacks on the team that hit those types?)

I mean we all seem 100% set on 3 of its moves, fishous rend, crunch, and psychic fangs, but what else could be needed? Ice fang is nice but its shown even guys that arw 4x resistant to water still take a good chunk of damage. Earthquake? I think leech life may be good to just get some healing. Sadly that isnt boosted by strong jaw right?

 

[MrHands]

Probably Leech Life. There might be some niche situations where you can get a low hp KO but are forced out after.

I don't think it needs anything else.

 

[Dreadfury]

https://play.pokemonshowdown.com/battle-gen8ou-1015568981

So my opponent ended up running a really slow and fat team that proceeded to get mauled by my Dracovish. What in the actual fuck was he supposed to do against Dracovish?

 

[MrCookiepants]

Kinda funny seeing the bandwagon hype for this when Dracozolt with Hustle hits harder and can use its dual stab.

I know water is more spammable but still.

 

[GaileOxstain]

He may be the ungodly product of reckless scientific necromancy who suffers nearly every second of his cruel existence thanks to his horrifyingly botched anatomy that makes even basic functions of life such as breathing and swallowing absurdly difficult and exhausting, but at least he can 2HKO defensive Ferrothorn with a resisted attack.

I actually thought that Dracozolt, Arctozolt, Dracovish, and Arctovish were based off of paleontology mistakes. There are actually more than a few errors fossil scientists have made including putting the wrong skull on a dinosaur's body (See Brontosaurus), or even mistaking a dinosaur's tail for its neck and placing the skull on that instead (See Elasosaurus). So odds are these Pokemon are not intentional Frankenstein Monsters, but accidental creations because some paleontologist didn't double check their research.
"I just discovered 4 new Pokemon from these damaged fossil remains that I reassembled because I am a GENIUS!" (Restores fossils only to create weird mash-ups) 'Uhhh...THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO BE THAT WAY!"

 

[Dreadfury]

Kinda funny seeing the bandwagon hype for this when Dracozolt with Hustle hits harder and can use its dual stab.

I know water is more spammable but still.

Water being more spammable is incredibly important. The tier is absolutely crawling with Ground types right now but there are very few Water Absorb users. Moreover, Fishious Rend can be boosted by Rain, which isn't hard to set up.

The reason why Dracovish doesn't use its dual-STAB is because it literally doesn't need to use its dual-STAB because Fishious Rend 2HKOs literally everything in the tier.

 

[Vengeance417]

Kinda funny seeing the bandwagon hype for this when Dracozolt with Hustle hits harder and can use its dual stab.

I know water is more spammable but still.

You're also forgetting Hustle's drawback of every move Dracozolt has besides Aerial Ace using Stone Edge's accuracy, making Zolt the less consistent option. Fishious Rend is really all it needs to click especially in Rain, but Psychic Fangs, Ice Fang, and Crunch all get SJ-boosted and provide the coverage Vish needs when necessary, and all with perfect accuracy.

 

[Leica]

Kinda funny seeing the bandwagon hype for this when Dracozolt with Hustle hits harder and can use its dual stab.

I know water is more spammable but still.

Hustle's accuracy drawback comes into play pretty often and can be game losing with how fast this meta is right now (imo at least) and Excadrill is everywhere. Fishious Rend you just click and unless they're running Jellicent or something you're probably killing something.

 

[readytolose]

Plus, Dracozolt actually doesn't hit harder; Strong Jaw offers the same boost (1.5x) to biting moves as Hustle does, and Dracovish only uses biting moves anyway.

I think what they meant by that is simply that Dracozolt hits harder because it has a higher Attack stat.

 

[earl]

You're also forgetting Hustle's drawback of every move Dracozolt has besides Aerial Ace using Stone Edge's accuracy, making Zolt the less consistent option. Plus, Dracozolt actually doesn't hit harder; Strong Jaw offers the same boost (1.5x) to biting moves as Hustle does, and Dracovish only uses biting moves anyway. Fishious Rend is really all it needs to click especially in Rain, but Psychic Fangs, Ice Fang, and Crunch all get SJ-boosted and provide the coverage Vish needs when necessary.

Dracozolt has 100 attack while Vish has 90, so yeah it is stronger- But I agree, Vish is much more consistent and better imo

 

[Vengeance417]

Dracozolt has 100 attack while Vish has 90, so yeah it is stronger- But I agree, Vish is much more consistent and better imo

Yeah, you're right, completely forgot about that but either way, that power difference is negligible at best and the other way around when Rain is up, which is something way easier to set than Electric terrain unless you're running Pincurchin.

 

[Theukon_Dos]

Just out of curioucity, would it be better to run Dracovish with a choice band or choice scarf? Obviously band would do more damage, but, in theory, choice scarf would let it outspeed more often, thus making it's damage more consistant. That being said, I'm not familiar enough with the average speed in the current meta, so I could be wrong.

 

[1234hjkl]

Just out of curioucity, would it be better to run Dracovish with a choice band or choice scarf? Obviously band would do more damage, but, in theory, choice scarf would let it outspeed more often, thus making it's damage more consistant. That being said, I'm not familiar enough with the average speed in the current meta, so I could be wrong.

Band is better if you're running rain as his nuke get turned into a nova, you can use without rain as it still hits pretty hard but it's a bit slow so I suggest you use a scarf on non-rain teams as it will be faster than a lot of stuff while hitting very hard with Fishious Rend.