Lower Tiers DPP UU Viability Ranking

[Cheryl.]

Time to nominate some stuff:

Absol for A Low
Absol is good, like REALLY good. I've been spamming this thing on almost all my teams and it always pulls it weight. It's sets range from the Swords Dance set, the Choice Scarf set, Choice Band, and even a lead set. Swords Dance is my favorite as it's a really good sweeper or wallbreaker and if used right, can guarantee at least 1 kill per match. Choice Scarf is a really nice revenge killer or Pursuit trapper that helps Absol out with it's speed. Choice Band is an awesome wallbreaker and Pursuit trapper, and lead has advantages over Psychic type leads. Absol has so much power that it can literally 2HKO or OHKO frail resists, like Houndoom, with CB or after a SD boost. There's also not many answers to Absol, as nobody really prepares for it i my experience. The best ones are probably stuff like Registeel and Rhyperior, but both can get worn down to the point where Superpower kills or Absol can sacrifice itself if it's Swords Dance and use +2 Superpower on them, killing them after residual damage or if they're healthy, doing 90-95% to them. (If it's Life Orb SD, my personal preference over Lum) Absol still has some flaws that can make it not as useful or consistent as you want it to be, like it's 75 speed and frailness. But Absol has access to priority in STAB Sucker Punch, a viable Choice Scarf set, and while the frailness is still a problem, it's not as hard to set up with Absol as you may think, you can switch into a predicted Psychic attack, or try to come in on a weak bulky mon like Milotic with no SpA investment after a teammate is killed and set up. Overall, while Absol still has flaws, it doesn't need as much support as people think it needs, and it's a very poweful attacker or sweeper, and imo deserves a rise to A low.

Azumarill for B Top
I never thought Azumarill was as good as people made it out to be, it may have Huge Power and a neat priority move in Aqua Jet, but it has so many flaws that I never think it's that worth it sometimes. It hits hard, sure, but even then a bulky water like Milotic can switch in on a CB Return if it's physically defensive and Recover the damage and wait for a min roll so it can just Toxic Azumarill and let it be worn down. Azu has priority, sure, but it can still get outsped and revenged by a lot of mons due to it's 50 speed. I do have to say, it's bulk is pretty remarkable, but it's lack of recovery means it can't just take a Dark Pulse or Superpower forever. Azu has a couple other cool sets other than Choice Band, like SubPunch, but each has their own problems. Overall, while Azumarill has some cool advantages, like being extremely strong, it's flaws really hurt it and I think it should drop.

 

[Cheryl.]

I know this is double-posting, but I just wanna keep the thread a bit more active. But, anyways, here's a new nomination:

Magneton for C Top / B Low

Magneton is actually a pretty cool pokemon, and C is really underestimating it's capabilities. It may receive competiton from Dugtrio, who can also trap Steel types and other types, but Magneton's access to Magnet Rise can make it a better Steel remover for some teams. It's typing is also pretty cool, as it helps it wall Normal and Flying types, along with some other types. It's access to Substitute can make it a pretty sturdy mon to take down, with all it's resistances and decent bulk. Magneton also has some other sets it can use, from a more offensive set to Choice Scarf, making it a bit versatile. Magneton still has a lot of problems, including it's numerous weaknesses and mediocre Speed without a Scarf, and competing for a moveslot as a trapper from Dugtrio, but it's unique movepool and resistances make it a more viable choice for teams than the stuff in C, and I think C Top or even B Low is a better place for it.

 

[WillSO]

I think Moltres should stay mid S. LO 3 Attacks as a lead is just so damn effective, Choice Specs is horrendous to switch into, Scarf works, SubRoost is annoying as all hell. Spin support is required, but it's so easy to fit one onto a team via Donphan, Hitmontop or Blastoise. Can use without a spinner if you lead with it to lure Chansey and take advantage with Dugtrio.

Down to mid A. Is it really that much better than Azumarill, or Donphan? Suffers from 4mss too much.

Up to to A+. the huge variety of sets it runs is astonishing, the LO wallbreaker set destroys stall, spdef checks venusaur, can even set stealth rock.

Up to mid A/A+. Scyther's really good, like a physical Moltres but U-turn provides momentum. Only reason it's not higher for me is the presence of Intimidate Arcanine.

Up to low A alongside Tauros and Swellow. Scrappy is great, and Kang provides speed control with Fake Out and Sucker Punch.

With the recent banning of Sand Veil and Snow Cloak, Sand and Hail weather teams just got worse, Sand definitely moreso than Hail. I'd also argue that these weather styles probably don't deserve B+ rank to start. Down to B- or B.



...this would take me a long long time to finish my movements... most of the stuff below A and B doesn't really matter, but I'll throw this last one out:

This thing destroys weather teams, can be an anti-lead, can go mixed with Cross Chop, can boost with Calm Mind, can support with Encore... Hugely underrated, nominating for mid C at least. Honestly though, I think it should be ranked the same as Snover and Hippopotas, because it beats weather just as they provide weather, and it isn't a liability outside of weather matches.

I may come back to this post at a later date.

 

[Oldamar999]

don't want to sound rude. but does anyone think this vr should be redone? it hasn't been updated in 4 years, and i'd assume a lot (or at least some) of things would have changed within that 4 year timespan. could an update be looked at sometime?

 

[Oglemi]

The metagame is played basically once maybe twice a year though; just taking a cursory look I'd say it's still pretty accurate. The only things I'd consider moving are Tangrowth and Magneton up a smidge and MAYBE bumping Kangaskhan into A- honestly.

 

[Oldamar999]

The metagame is played basically once maybe twice a year though; just taking a cursory look I'd say it's still pretty accurate. The only things I'd consider moving are Tangrowth and Magneton up a smidge and MAYBE bumping Kangaskhan into A- honestly.

ok man. thanks
just wanting to know if any of the D ranks are truly viable as well though. why would I use whiscash or articuno?

 

[Oglemi]

Whiscash is just a super subpar DDer but it has a really nice typing, so it will actually find setup opportunities, but with the prevalence of any of the Grass-types, big boss Venu being #1, a full sweep is super unlikely to happen, not to mention the amount of priority and Scarfers in the tier.

Articuno can be a nice SubRooster thank to its insane bulk and ability to beat a lot of the tier one-on-one, especially the cookie cutter cores, it just requires an intense amount of spin support and Duggy support to remove Registeel, which in the end there's just way better options to pair with that level of support, namely Moltres, Scyther, Arcanine, and Houndoom.

 

[Wisteria1010]

Suggestion out of literally nowhere lol: Claydol>B+ and regice at least >B- . Regice can tear through teams with that life orb set and CLAYDOL IS UNDERRATED as always. Invest slightly more into offense and you have a nicely defensively oriented rapid spinner with key ground and electricity immunities with a decent speed tier of 75, which is kinda slept on. Investing into Claydol’s offenses lets it chunk something hard on the physical side with earthquake and on the special side, Claydol has great coverage in earth power, psychic, ice beam, shadow ball, and a hp fire possibly, allowing it to chunk spin blockers such as rotom A and Missy, as well as Venasaur with its stab psychic, and Regiseel with its eq from the physical front or earth power. Claydol’s mediocre offenses is the main gripe, and personally I feel that with full hp investment to back up its poor hp stat and a little bit on the physical or spdef sides with a nice amount of investment in Claydol’s offense, it can fulfill its roll of removing the spikes that it is immune to, and rocks, which it resists. Trick choice scarf Claydol is an amazing set to capitalize on its offense, letting it get off an unexpectedly faster move with a little more punch to it against frail teams, while surviving their hits with its immense base defenses and hp investment. This also allows Claydol to unexpectedly cripple walls that would otherwise wall it such as Milotic. Personally I even have some good success with Claydol in generation 7 overused even.
Additionally, Claydol can always go boom or even run solar beam alongside Venasaur for some spicey shenanigans

 

[Sickist]

Claydol does offer Hazards + Hazard Control in one slot, but I feel it suffers severe 4MSS. I always feel like I want Rocks+Spin obviously, but I also want Beam, Psychic, and Earthpower, but I can only fit 2. Now it does vary from team to team, but the 4MSS doesn't change for the most part. The tier is also super pursuit heavy, which doesn't help it. However, it still does it's job, so keep it where it's at.

Regice is pretty cool, but priority still smacks it everywhere. Keep it where it's at, nothing has changed for it for better or worse.

 

[Wisteria1010]

Claydol does offer Hazards + Hazard Control in one slot, but I feel it suffers severe 4MSS. I always feel like I want Rocks+Spin obviously, but I also want Beam, Psychic, and Earthpower, but I can only fit 2. Now it does vary from team to team, but the 4MSS doesn't change for the most part. The tier is also super pursuit heavy, which doesn't help it. However, it still does it's job, so keep it where it's at.

Regice is pretty cool, but priority still smacks it everywhere. Keep it where it's at, nothing has changed for it for better or worse.

I do agree to an extent with your views on Claydol, however I feel as if it’s being relegated to a specific niche that does leave it susepable to 4mss, people react to Claydol’s lack of reliable recovery, however I feel that they are trying to push it into a role that it doesn’t specifically excel in as well as it can in others imo. Scarf trick dol can smack a drapion that wants to pursuit and given the situation, trick a scarf onto tomb for its team mates to deal with it better, or to let it chunk Spiritomb a bit by not folding to the non switch pursuit, allowing it to get a couple earth powers off. Claydol should be on more hyper offense teams, as it’s solid def and massive spdef and odd resistances lend themselves toward checking and disrupting cores well. A Claydol can come in maybe only once or twice during a game to get its rapid spin off/ chunk or cripple pursuit switches/ double, predicting the switch, and can hurt registeel. Drop stealth rocks on Claydol and take more risks with it and there will be more success. Either go rapid spin, shadow ball, earth power, psychic, or rapid spin, earth power, trick, psychic/ explosion. Claydol has no problem switching into sand teams and doesn’t care at all about hazards.

 

[Sickist]

This VR needs a change. Not too many things have changed, but after playing for a couple years and watching DPP UU games from UUPL and even playing some in UUFPL (Discord thing), some of the rankings shown on here are not accurate in my opinion.

• Arcanine: This thing is still okay, but I feel Top of A is more reflective of it's place in current DPP UU then S at all. I don't actually recall seeing this thing at all for the past year and a half. Arcanine has always been super awkward to build with as well, due to it being a shoddy check to the tier's grass types which can punish a switch in for most cases, which those have been on the rise, mainly Torterra. It's not bad by any means, as Intimidate + Morning Sun is pretty good, as well as having Espeed on offensive sets to revenge kill is always appreciated. That's just my thoughts on the matter.
• Regice: This thing should actually be in low B imo, but I'll settle for a rise to the Top of C. After many, many, and I mean MANY games of playing with and against Regice, it's a lot less niche and more actual scary to fight. It's so freakin bulky, and alongside sub, is really difficult to beat at all unless you sit there and C-team it. It also provides good offensive powers with Explosion actually being able to pressure the tier's special walls, and Rock Polish sets being quite effective late game due to Regice's bulk preventing it from being revenged killed as easily.
• Milotic: Another maybe controversial one, but I don't feel like top of S is an accurate way of representing Milotic in the current DPP UU metagame. Again, rise of Grass types that prey on it are increasing, and players are starting to find more Water types that do what Milotic would do in that specific slot better, such as Blastoise. While it's not completely terrible, I don't feel like it should be at the top of S. The bottom of S seems like a way more accurate represenation due to it still being pretty good at what it does, but its just not as good as it used to be.

Sorry to those who think otherwise. Feel free to disagree, but please share your views and evidence to back it up. I'm interested to see what you all think. Good day, all!

 

[Iguana]

Hello!

I've been playing a lot of DPP UU recently (it's one of my favorite tiers), and I've finally found this VR thread after searching for some time. That being said, I wanted to share some thoughts on the current state of the VR and make some nominations. Perhaps this will rejuvenate this thread a bit insodoing! Let's get into it...

I'll try and organize these in order of priority in my opinion (as in, VR changes in my opinion that most need to happen starting first to some that are more subjective towards the end).

Drapion is in significant need of a VR boost. It is arguably the best Venusaur and Mismagius counter in the game, both of which are top tier Pokémon. And it hard walls both. It has a variety of sets to choose from as well, which can consist of more offensive options than the aforementioned SpD-invested one. Toxic Spikes support is also very helpful for bulky, support Pokémon like Milotic or Hitmontop. It is susceptible to Dugtrio, but frankly, what isn't at this point? (And I'll table that topic for a little later in here.) I'm nominating Drapion from B-Low to A-Low. This is a sharp rise in its VR position, I know, but I honestly think it deserves it. Venusaur and Mismagius are everywhere in the current DPP UU metagame.

Claydol is one of the more important VR nominations I'd like to make. I realize that people are a bit divided on the degree of Claydol's viability in DPP UU, but in my opinion, C-High is quite low for it. If for no other reason than look at the VR position of other fantastic Rapid Spinners: Hitmontop is A-High, Donphan is A-Mid, and Blastoise is B-High. This is crazy that Claydol is ranked so low right now. Claydol's typing and ability combinations also assist its viability a lot. It's a great counter to Rhyperior and Toxicroak, both of which can wreck havoc on teams if they don't run checks. Additionally, there are a few different viable sets to choose from, like a Calm Mind set as well as the typical Rapid Spin, bulky support one. I'm going to nominate Claydol up to B-High for the time being. I'd like to see it become A-Low in the VR, but given some of the concerns about its 4MSS and other issues, I'll nominate to a middle-ground.

Arcanine definitely needs to drop. Being in mid S tier right now is just not reflective of the current DPP UU metagame. It's still decent, but usage is notably minimal nowadays. There's not a lot to say here, but it just doesn't do enough to check really offensive Pokémon, and it can't sustain taking on Toxic by more defensive teams. I think A-Mid is more accurate for it right now.

Miltank I find to be disappointingly low considering its superior defensive utility. It's very speedy for such a bulky Pokémon, and has Stealth Rock, access to Toxic and easy HP recovery with Milk Drink, excellent Heal Bell support, and frankly two great abilities to choose from. Scrappy is helpful for Body Slam to hit neutrally and threaten paralysis against Ghost-types like Spiritomb, Mismagius, Rotom, etc., and Thick Fat doesn't seem to see a lot of usage, but if you're not running a STAB Normal-type attack on Miltank like Body Slam, it is super helpful to contend with powerful attacks from the likes of LO Ludicolo or Moltres. I am nominating it from B-Mid to B-Top or A-Low (leaning towards A-Low considering the success I've had with it recently).

Cradily seems low to me at C-High. I have been using it fairly often recently on the RoA Spotlight ladder, and it is solid. Its defensive stats are strong, and with a Curse set with no means to phaze it out due to its ability, Suction Cups, it can become an offensive weapon if wielded properly. Cradily does have some issues, like the time needed to boost a couple of Curses and how Registeel hard walls it, but I'm going to nominate it up to B-Low.

Medicham is low where it's at in C-High. It is generally outclassed by some other offensive options, and Spiritomb does wall it, but with Pure Power and options to boost its Speed (Choice Scarf set, Sub and Salac Berry, etc.), it can be massively threatening. Also, important to note is that some of the key support Pokémon for Medicham, such as Houndoom and Registeel, are excelling in the metagame currently. I recommend a rise up to B-Low.

Leafeon seems high to me right now. I'm not steadfast in this opinion, but whenever I face it on ladder or in friendlies, it just doesn't have the same punch it once did. Maybe it's a matter of not being utilized effectively; maybe it's just not as good as it used to be in the metagame. Part of it I think can be attributable to Moltres' and Venusaur's high viability at the moment. Regardless, I think a small drop in its VR position is in order, personally. I'm nominating it down to A-Low.

Dugtrio is last up here, and that's for a reason. It seems like there's been a decent amount of conversation--at least in years past--on where Dugtrio should fall in this VR. I'm considering nominating it up to S-Low, but I'd like to hear from some of you who are playing the game in its current metagame state first. The reality is that Dugtrio is devastating in this metagame--some might say borderline unhealthy. It traps a number of checks to other offensive Pokémon, allowing them to sweep or severely damage the opponent's team. Or, it just gets rid of a pesky Pokémon without which the opponent's team's plan falls apart. I haven't seen it utilized quite as often as I thought might be the case nowadays in the metagame, but it's still fearsome and very bothersome. Let me know what you guys think.

That's it for me for now! Hope you guys enjoy reading over my nominations, and I look forward to reading your responses and perhaps some nominations of your own!

 

[Wisteria1010]

Hello!

I've been playing a lot of DPP UU recently (it's one of my favorite tiers), and I've finally found this VR thread after searching for some time. That being said, I wanted to share some thoughts on the current state of the VR and make some nominations. Perhaps this will rejuvenate this thread a bit insodoing! Let's get into it...

I'll try and organize these in order of priority in my opinion (as in, VR changes in my opinion that most need to happen starting first to some that are more subjective towards the end).

View attachment 263379Drapion is in significant need of a VR boost. It is arguably the best Venusaur and Mismagius counter in the game, both of which are top tier Pokémon. And it hard walls both. It has a variety of sets to choose from as well, which can consist of more offensive options than the aforementioned SpD-invested one. Toxic Spikes support is also very helpful for bulky, support Pokémon like Milotic or Hitmontop. It is susceptible to Dugtrio, but frankly, what isn't at this point? (And I'll table that topic for a little later in here.) I'm nominating Drapion from B-Low to A-Low. This is a sharp rise in its VR position, I know, but I honestly think it deserves it. Venusaur and Mismagius are everywhere in the current DPP UU metagame.

View attachment 263378Claydol is one of the more important VR nominations I'd like to make. I realize that people are a bit divided on the degree of Claydol's viability in DPP UU, but in my opinion, C-High is quite low for it. If for no other reason than look at the VR position of other fantastic Rapid Spinners: Hitmontop is A-High, Donphan is A-Mid, and Blastoise is B-High. This is crazy that Claydol is ranked so low right now. Claydol's typing and ability combinations also assist its viability a lot. It's a great counter to Rhyperior and Toxicroak, both of which can wreck havoc on teams if they don't run checks. Additionally, there are a few different viable sets to choose from, like a Calm Mind set as well as the typical Rapid Spin, bulky support one. I'm going to nominate Claydol up to B-High for the time being. I'd like to see it become A-Low in the VR, but given some of the concerns about its 4MSS and other issues, I'll nominate to a middle-ground.

View attachment 263377Arcanine definitely needs to drop. Being in mid S tier right now is just not reflective of the current DPP UU metagame. It's still decent, but usage is notably minimal nowadays. There's not a lot to say here, but it just doesn't do enough to check really offensive Pokémon, and it can't sustain taking on Toxic by more defensive teams. I think A-Mid is more accurate for it right now.

View attachment 263376Miltank I find to be disappointingly low considering its superior defensive utility. It's very speedy for such a bulky Pokémon, and has Stealth Rock, access to Toxic and easy HP recovery with Milk Drink, excellent Heal Bell support, and frankly two great abilities to choose from. Scrappy is helpful for Body Slam to hit neutrally and threaten paralysis against Ghost-types like Spiritomb, Mismagius, Rotom, etc., and Thick Fat doesn't seem to see a lot of usage, but if you're not running a STAB Normal-type attack on Miltank like Body Slam, it is super helpful to contend with powerful attacks from the likes of LO Ludicolo or Moltres. I am nominating it from B-Mid to B-Top or A-Low (leaning towards A-Low considering the success I've had with it recently).

View attachment 263375Cradily seems low to me at C-High. I have been using it fairly often recently on the RoA Spotlight ladder, and it is solid. Its defensive stats are strong, and with a Curse set with no means to phaze it out due to its ability, Suction Cups, it can become an offensive weapon if wielded properly. Cradily does have some issues, like the time needed to boost a couple of Curses and how Registeel hard walls it, but I'm going to nominate it up to B-Low.

View attachment 263374Medicham is low where it's at in C-High. It is generally outclassed by some other offensive options, and Spiritomb does wall it, but with Pure Power and options to boost its Speed (Choice Scarf set, Sub and Salac Berry, etc.), it can be massively threatening. Also, important to note is that some of the key support Pokémon for Medicham, such as Houndoom and Registeel, are excelling in the metagame currently. I recommend a rise up to B-Low.

View attachment 263380Leafeon seems high to me right now. I'm not steadfast in this opinion, but whenever I face it on ladder or in friendlies, it just doesn't have the same punch it once did. Maybe it's a matter of not being utilized effectively; maybe it's just not as good as it used to be in the metagame. Part of it I think can be attributable to Moltres' and Venusaur's high viability at the moment. Regardless, I think a small drop in its VR position is in order, personally. I'm nominating it down to A-Low.

View attachment 263381Dugtrio is last up here, and that's for a reason. It seems like there's been a decent amount of conversation--at least in years past--on where Dugtrio should fall in this VR. I'm considering nominating it up to S-Low, but I'd like to hear from some of you who are playing the game in its current metagame state first. The reality is that Dugtrio is devastating in this metagame--some might say borderline unhealthy. It traps a number of checks to other offensive Pokémon, allowing them to sweep or severely damage the opponent's team. Or, it just gets rid of a pesky Pokémon without which the opponent's team's plan falls apart. I haven't seen it utilized quite as often as I thought might be the case nowadays in the metagame, but it's still fearsome and very bothersome. Let me know what you guys think.

That's it for me for now! Hope you guys enjoy reading over my nominations, and I look forward to reading your responses and perhaps some nominations of your own!

I agree pretty much 100% with everything said here