Which is why I said I think Fire Blast would be the most reliable STAB on him, as You can do more damage with two Fire Blasts then Blast Burn and it's recharge. In my opinion If your gonna use Overheat/Blast Burn on Zard Y I'd go with Overheat as the ability to switch when something comes in makes it slightly better to me, but I'd still say Fire Blast or Flamethrower is the more reliable option. Eh, can we stop discussing Blast Burn of all things, there's a reason it's very rarely used.
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Pokémon Charizard
- Thread starter X5Dragon
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Which is why I said I think Fire Blast would be the most reliable STAB on him, as You can do more damage with two Fire Blasts then Blast Burn and it's recharge. In my opinion If your gonna use Overheat/Blast Burn on Zard Y I'd go with Overheat as the ability to switch when something comes in makes it slightly better to me, but I'd still say Fire Blast or Flamethrower is the more reliable option. Eh, can we stop discussing Blast Burn of all things, there's a reason it's very rarely used.
Agreed, Overheat > Blast Burn. Agreed to drop it, it'll almost never get used anyways.
The more important question is if the 20 BP difference between Fire Blast & Overheat gets you any important damage differences. I haven't done any calcs, but I don't think it does. Also Fire Blast does more damage over two turns anyways IIRC, all without lowering any stats. For a 'nuke', I don't think the power difference is worth the stat debuff at all.
Your set looks like something I'd put on Charizard back in Red and Blue if those moves existed back then.
Not sure if serious. Even in my RBY days I don't think I would have run 3 moves of the same type on a dual type pokemon. I'd at least have had a move for each type and then maybe something ridiculous like explosion or hyper beam. Oh to be a kid again, I miss the 90s.
Have fun killing something, then losing your Charizard the next turn because you thought Blast Burn would be good.
Over the course of two turns:
Fire Blast: 110+110=220
Overheat: 130+65=195
Blast Burn: 150+0=150
I meant in actual battles on actual pokemon, not just BP.
Thats not how you calc that. you need damage on something. like this: (All Timid 252 Under Sun vs Standard Ou Support Bliss)
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Fire Blast vs. 4 HP / 252+ SpD Blissey in sun: 192-226 (29.44 - 34.66%) -- possible 4HKO
so over 2 turns your doing 69.32% Max not including Leftovers. Not Bad. Not Great and you would never stay in unless your packing a physical move but thats not awful for a Special attacker
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Overheat vs. 4 HP / 252+ SpD Blissey in sun: 226-267 (34.66 - 40.95%) -- 64.6% chance to 3HKO
-2 252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Overheat vs. 4 HP / 252+ SpD Blissey in sun: 114-135 (17.48 - 20.7%) -- possible 7HKO
61.75% after 2 Turns with Overheat Max Not including Leftovers
252 SpA Mega Charizard Y Blast Burn vs. 4 HP / 252+ SpD Blissey in sun: 261-307 (40.03 - 47.08%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
so not only is it the Weakest option 47.08%, which will be recovered back after 2 turns of leftovers, more or less, your defenseless. so......Don't use Blast Burn. Ever. (I took power changes into account don't worry.) The only advantage it has is its more likely to get all that damage off cause its more likely to hit but Power > Accuracy.
Overheats use is on X as a wall breaking move. Y should stick with Fire Blast.
To elaborate on why Blast Burn is a ridiculously stupid idea, one of 2 things are guaranteed to happen:
1.) You fail to KO (either from a Focus Sash, Sturdy, Not Very Effective Hit, or you were stupid enough to try it on a Blissey) and your opponent gets a free switch or stays in to status you/set up some Sneaky Pebbles.
2.) You KO, but your opponent sends in a Lucario, Gyarados, Salamence, Garchomp, etc. which HAS A GUARANTEED TURN OF SET UP. You get 5-0'd.
Either way, GG Blast Burn dumbasses.
Like I said on the last page, the only time Blast Burn would *EVER* be "useful" is when you KNOW without any doubt whatsoever that it's your last turn, and you want to dish out as much damage as possible on that turn... So basically Explosion/Self Destruct. Even then nobody with half a brain is going to dedicate a move slot to something like that. So basically yes, it's a dumbass move.
Anyways yeah, we can not talk about Derp Burn anymore. Just wanted to clarify, wasn't sure if I was being included in the "dumbass" group.
I wouldn't recommend Blast Burn or Overheat for ZardY in singles ever. It has better options than losing 2 stages of its special attack or giving the opponent a free turn.
However in doubles (VGC anyway) I'm planning on using Overheat. Overheat, then use Malamars topsy turvy to get +2 special attack and then start obliterating things with Heat Wave.
However in doubles (VGC anyway) I'm planning on using Overheat. Overheat, then use Malamars topsy turvy to get +2 special attack and then start obliterating things with Heat Wave.
I kind of want to point out that it isn't like Explosion/Self-Destruct at all because Explosion and Self-Destruct do not allow the opponent a free turn to set up. Blast burn doesn't kill you and allow you to bring in another Pokemon, it leaves you there unable to do a thing for the next turn while the opponent can do whatever they like. Them killing you immediately is only the BEST case scenario and only then is it equivalent to Explosion/Self-Destruct.
The thing is, your calculations don't say anything more than his calcs, you just took much longer to get to your point, and it's needlessly complicated. Oh, and your calcs are subject to rounding, while BP isn't, so your calcs are slightly more inaccurate.
If your targets are arbitrary, like in the case of just comparing moves, there is no reason not to just look at the BP. You only need direct calculations for specific pokemon, or if you want to see a one vs all. The reason is that damage calculation works as follows:
dmg = BP * f with f being a function of defense, attack etc.
so, dmg1/dmg2 = (BP1 * f)/(BP2 * f) = BP1/BP2
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If I use Blast Burn to kill a last Pokemon in 3v3 I don't have to recharge. If I run into some psycho shit like Groudon or maybe even Arceus I'm willing to sacrifice my Charizard and make it a 2 on 2 match since maybe I just created an opening with a top 5 strongest attack in the game.
I barely use the move but I'm being serious. Pass a Tail Glow or a Nasty Plot and I OHKO everything with Heat Wave anyways. Flare Blitz is an insanely powerful move and I've come to realize it's necessary to kill stuff like Sylveon and Xerneas who special defence boost.
I realize it looks like an old RBY set... I probably would have called it shit and tossed Fly on there if I were still nine.
Regarding damage calcs: Blissey switches into Focus Blast or Heat Wave. You both do the fandango until she didn't recover or has 47.45456 percent and then BAM, nuked her with Blast Burn. Your calcs don't actually take into consideration how to play a match. Shit maybe I even taunted Blissey ahead of time with my Zoroark and she can't recover.
Blast Burn is good in 3v3 guys. Don't like the move don't use it. Otherwise please don't circle jerk over Fire Blast/Solar Beam/Dragon Pulse/Roost like there's anything to discuss we don't already know.
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Okay next topic anyone have any success using Protect on Charizard Y? I used it in a match where I Protected vs. Blastoise first turn and proceeded to sweep because of Sun. Charizard with Protect overrides Tyranitar/Politoad/Kyogre/etc/etc. Probably a necessary move if you have a sun team since you don't get whether until you Mega evolve.
I barely use the move but I'm being serious. Pass a Tail Glow or a Nasty Plot and I OHKO everything with Heat Wave anyways. Flare Blitz is an insanely powerful move and I've come to realize it's necessary to kill stuff like Sylveon and Xerneas who special defence boost.
I realize it looks like an old RBY set... I probably would have called it shit and tossed Fly on there if I were still nine.
Regarding damage calcs: Blissey switches into Focus Blast or Heat Wave. You both do the fandango until she didn't recover or has 47.45456 percent and then BAM, nuked her with Blast Burn. Your calcs don't actually take into consideration how to play a match. Shit maybe I even taunted Blissey ahead of time with my Zoroark and she can't recover.
Blast Burn is good in 3v3 guys. Don't like the move don't use it. Otherwise please don't circle jerk over Fire Blast/Solar Beam/Dragon Pulse/Roost like there's anything to discuss we don't already know.
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Okay next topic anyone have any success using Protect on Charizard Y? I used it in a match where I Protected vs. Blastoise first turn and proceeded to sweep because of Sun. Charizard with Protect overrides Tyranitar/Politoad/Kyogre/etc/etc. Probably a necessary move if you have a sun team since you don't get whether until you Mega evolve.
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Its not a Charizard thread without a discussion about Blast Burn.
TLDR; Use Blast Burn, get the user killed or set up on, then killed. More importantly, ANYTHING can switch in on the free turn, even the fastest and frailest of sweepers, which can set up however they like. The actual utility of Blast Burn doesn't warrant a moveslot, you have more useful options.
TLDR; Use Blast Burn, get the user killed or set up on, then killed. More importantly, ANYTHING can switch in on the free turn, even the fastest and frailest of sweepers, which can set up however they like. The actual utility of Blast Burn doesn't warrant a moveslot, you have more useful options.
For a dual-weather team I was thinking Tyranitar, ChainChomp, LO Keldeo, SD RS Excadrill, ZardY, and Ferrothorn or Forry
Get a Pokemon from the Axew line to pass it down Outrage, also as the Axew line also learns Dragon Dance alongside Outrage, you can pass down Both of those moves if you so desire.
What's the best alternative to outrage? I'm running dragon claw cuz the only reason I'd choose MegaZardX over another dragon is fairy/steel coverage.
How does a dragon move get you coverage on fairy when they are immune?
Dragon Claw overall is the best alternative overall, *I think* Dragon Rush is also an egg move (don't quote me on it) with a bit more power, but it's accuracy is shaky. I'm assuming this is for X, but Dragon Pulse is worth mentioning. Though the damage will be less due to tough claws and/or hindering nature.
No idea, but give him the benefit of a doubt that Zard X is neutral to Fairy's.
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Hey guys, im not sure if this is the right thread for it so i apologize in advance if im doing smth wrong.
Im trying to build a team around Charizard X. This is what i have in mind so far :
- Charizard X
- Azumarill
- Ferrothorn
- Gengar
- Galvantula
- Hawlucha
What do u think? Any advice/corrections?
Im trying to build a team around Charizard X. This is what i have in mind so far :
- Charizard X
- Azumarill
- Ferrothorn
- Gengar
- Galvantula
- Hawlucha
What do u think? Any advice/corrections?
Dragon claw's just the stab move for targets that resist flare blitz. Fire/Dragon is a great coverage set and I want to make the most of it (that means no getting locked into outrage)
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