I could be wrong but I think that Rotom's spread hits specific benchmarks unlike the Ferro's outside of speed.Absurdly minor thing, but I see you took 8 out of HP on Ferro for a point in Atk and SpD. Perectly reasonable, but why not take 8 out of SpD on Heatom for a point in Def and SpA? Like how do you know when it's worth it to do that?
I could be wrong but I think that Rotom's spread hits specific benchmarks unlike the Ferro's outside of speed.
Its not an analysis so its not the "main" slash, in the sense that you're thinking of.I still don't know why Icy Wind is the main slash on Gengar without us ever nominating / voting on itAzumarill @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 228 HP / 252 Atk / 12 Def / 12 SpD / 4 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Belly Drum
- Play Rough
- Aqua Jet
- Superpower
Rotom-Heat @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 156 HP / 220 SpD / 132 Spe
Calm Nature
- Substitute
- Overheat
- Will-O-Wisp
- Discharge
Ferrothorn @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 244 HP / 4 Atk / 244 Def / 4 SpD / 12 Spe
Impish Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Iron Head
- Leech Seed
- Power Whip
Anything with Sub tends to autowin. Especially if it boosts and carries an attack or two. Thundurus is an issue too for that reason.I'm not really sure how this team is supposed to handle the uncommon Substitute Suicune, except for pray... but I just tried this team again and lost the first match because the Suicune subbed. I don't think that this is a big deal btw. Just something that I noticed...
As it stands, this is the importable of the confirmed sets all together thus far.
Gengar @ Gengarite
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 188 HP / 116 Def / 4 SpA / 4 SpD / 196 Spe
Timid Nature
- Destiny Bond
- Hypnosis
- Hex
- Icy Wind/Focus Blast
Would you believe me if I told you that I considered Mystic Water a couple of days ago & was pleasantly surprised by the power that it brought in relation to Band? :)I've never been a fan of BD Azumarill, it's one of those things that wrecks me every fucking time I see it but is utterly shit when I use it.
Like Chansey.
I like cant say 's proposed sets; bit of a 50/50 on SR or Twave but imo SR is too consistent, yellow magic is far more fun and hellish.
SR doesn't win games that you have no chance at all to win: T-Wave does. And lemme tell ya something I've noticed on a lot of high rated Japanese teams: they all contain 2+ haxxy moves.
Azumarill though, I've always liked my Mystic Water set, it's just a simple variation of the BD set. Using the one cant say posted because 1) lazy and 2) it looks fine:
Azumarill @ Mystic Water
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 228 HP / 252 Atk / 12 Def / 12 SpD / 4 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Knock Off
- Play Rough
- Aqua Jet
- Waterfall
Very friendly with item clause, opens up Sitrus for Ferrothorn / Rotom. The power on Waterfall + Aqua Jet is really nice, and gives you a reliably accurate attack to spam mindlessly, with more power than Play Rough. A lot like Shadow Ball + Shadow Sneak Aegislash, it's good at picking off those annoying bastards left at 15 HP due to a lack of SR damage.
Maintains quite a bit of power, while bluffing CB and not locking us into Aqua Jet against a Dragonite.
Oh and Knock Off, who doesn't like to spam Knock Off.
That sounds like a you problem rather than a BD Azu problem.I've never been a fan of BD Azumarill, it's one of those things that wrecks me every fucking time I see it but is utterly shit when I use it.
That sounds like a you problem rather than a BD Azu problem.
But seriously what significant calcs does mystic water provide over no boosting item?
I like the idea, because i wanted leftovers or sitrus berry for rotom and i like to have leftovers for ferro as well so sitrus berry for rotom but then azu cant run one.It is very much a me problem. Many things can OHKO Azumarill with a crit at 75% HP, which is why I stopped running it.
What significant calcs does Pixie Plate Sylveon provide over no boosting item? Very little; but if you're looking for a damage buff that isn't locked by Specs it's a solid boost to the move you're clicking 99% of the time anyway at literally no detriment. Its more chip damage to switchins, and its less chip damage you need in order to pick off a threat. Having priority means we don't need quite as much damage to get something into AJ range. Couple that with possible SR support from Ferrothorn and we've achieved a passive, subtle, but imo significant bonus range.
tl;dr Beyond (non + Mega) Gengar and a largey useless AJ OHKO on Blaziken, not much. Main point is extra chip damage on Water STABs and freedom to switch moves / opens Sitrus. Not saying its the best set ever; it's not. Just a possibility that has worked rather well for me. No setup, no choice lock. You point, it kills.Gengar for example:
252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Waterfall vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 127-150 (94 - 111.1%) -- 68.8% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Gengar: 64-76 (47.4 - 56.2%) -- 79.7% chance to 2HKO
252 SpA Gengar Sludge Bomb vs. 196 HP / 12 SpD Azumarill: 182-216 (91 - 108%) -- 43.8% chance to OHKO
Azumarill's bulk doesn't have to be... whatever the hell preloaded spread that is, but the point is Azumarill is banking on rolls without SR, which we may not be able to guarentee. If Azumarill is at less than 100% HP, for any multitude of reasons, its probably dead. Yes, you're playing in favorable rolls by comparision, but one should not rely on dice rolls and coin flips to win. It also KOs you if it gets the 30% poison chance.
Mystic Water turns Waterfall into a 100% KO, and AJ into a 100% 2HKO.
Also helps on bulkier, Mega Gengar spreads. Like, say... our own Casino Gengar:
252+ Atk Mystic Water Huge Power Azumarill Waterfall vs. 188 HP / 116 Def Mega Gengar: 106-126 (66.6 - 79.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Mystic Water Huge Power Azumarill Aqua Jet vs. 188 HP / 116 Def Mega Gengar: 54-64 (33.9 - 40.2%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Assuming back-to-back min damage rolls, we get 100.5%.
Even with CB, Aqua Jet fails:
252+ Atk Choice Band Huge Power Azumarill Aqua Jet vs. 188 HP / 116 Def Mega Gengar: 67-79 (42.1 - 49.6%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
And obviously, you don't wanna roll the dice and let it hit you:
4 SpA Mega Gengar Sludge Bomb vs. 196 HP / 12 SpD Azumarill: 192-228 (96 - 114%) -- 75% chance to OHKO
Clefable for example:
252+ Atk Mystic Water Huge Power Azumarill Waterfall vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Clefable: 90-106 (44.5 - 52.4%) -- 20.7% chance to 2HKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Play Rough vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Clefable: 84-99 (41.5 - 49%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Sitrus Waterfall is obviously weaker than Play Rough here so no point calcing.
But the funny thing is, Unaware Clefable takes less than 50% from anything BD Azu throws at it; Mystic Water doesn't have camp out and wait for Clef to be dead or essentially dead to set up and sweep.
Even with SR, Clef can actually live 2 Play Rough if both hit. No hope, whatsoever, with Mystic Water.
252+ Atk Mystic Water Huge Power Azumarill Waterfall vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Gardevoir: 144-169 (100 - 117.3%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252+ Atk Huge Power Azumarill Play Rough vs. 4 HP / 0 Def Mega Gardevoir: 135-159 (93.7 - 110.4%) -- 62.5% chance to OHKO
idk about you, but I never did like to bank on a 62% (at best) roll coupled with 90 Acc. 100% chance with 100 Acc, yeah I'd bank on that.
Sitrus/AV Waterfall won't KO ever.
It's also one of the weirdest Mega Swampert checks you'll get:
252+ Atk Mystic Water Huge Power Azumarill Waterfall vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Mega Swampert in Rain: 141-166 (68.1 - 80.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252+ Atk Mystic Water Huge Power Azumarill Aqua Jet vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Mega Swampert in Rain: 72-85 (34.7 - 41%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
102% assuming back-to-back min damage rolls. Mega Swampy doesn't exist outside rain so I think its a fair calc.
CB gets a mere potshot:
252+ Atk Choice Band Huge Power Azumarill Waterfall vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Mega Swampert in Rain: 175-207 (84.5 - 100%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
And then gets outsped and 2HKO'd with EQ, while Mystic Water hits Waterfall + AJ to deal higher damage and live.
How many pokemon does ferrothorn outspeed when that pokemon is paralysed?I still don't know why Icy Wind is the main slash on Gengar without us ever nominating / voting on itAzumarill @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 228 HP / 252 Atk / 12 Def / 12 SpD / 4 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Belly Drum
- Play Rough
- Aqua Jet
- Superpower
Rotom-Heat @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 156 HP / 220 SpD / 132 Spe
Calm Nature
- Substitute
- Overheat
- Will-O-Wisp
- Discharge
Ferrothorn @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 244 HP / 4 Atk / 244 Def / 4 SpD / 12 Spe
Impish Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Iron Head
- Leech Seed
- Power Whip
Hahah we should name our team something like STATUS TERROR then haha. Are there more moves like hex that abuse status? Facade of course but that works the other way around.Azu I still like Sitrus BD. This makes support more important, so T-Wave on Ferro is good. Leech Seed is a must basically, and it should have Iron Head. That leaves one slot, either Stealth Rock or Power Whip. Not really sure which is better.
Azumarill @ Sitrus Berry
Ability: Huge Power
EVs: 228 HP/ 252 Atk/ 12 Def/ 12 SpD/ 4 Spe
Adamant Nature
-Play Rough
-Aqua Jet
-Belly Drum
-Superpower/ Knock Off
Ferrotthorn @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Iron Barbs
EVs: 252 HP/ 244 Def/ 12 Spe
Impish Nature
-Leech Seed
-Thunder Wave
-Power Whip/ Stealth Rock
-Iron Head
Rotom-h @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 HP/ 252 SpD/ 4 Spe
Calm Nature
-Overheat
-Substitute
-Discharge
-WoW/Toxic
What I'd want for Rotom-h. EVs are flexible, that's just the set in the strat dex. First three moves are pretty fixed for this set, but the status can be either I think. We don't seem very bothered by Cresselia or P2, so that's a point in favor of WoW. I suppose Confuse Ray could be run as the status as well.
Also if we have T-Wave on Ferro, Dicharge on Rotom-W, and Hypnosis on Gengar, I think Discharge is better for P2. Lots of status already, so I think a chance instead of a guaranteed para is better. Also a decently strong attack and not stopped by Taunt.[/Hide]
If a better matchup vs Gengar is what you're trying to get at then wouldnt AV just make more sense so you actually can live a sludge bomb and still 2hko with waterfall+aj?
On a related note, I've got everything but Rotom H ready to go - the Rotom is bred. I took the team for a spin online and had a blast with it. Did I hear that the season is due to end soon? If it is then I would like to have this team sorted and possibly distributed early into the new season.
I really can't wait to see some competent battlers use it online.
Mememe! It seems like there is a new season after all since my rating is set back against to 1500 and it said the usual 'regulations are updated' but i am still rated and going up again. (However i was almost above 1800;( needed just one more evening).
OK that's scary. I was going to message you about it tonight. I'll get hold of the person who cloned it and sort out a version for you ASAP.Mememe! It seems like there is a new season after all since my rating is set back against to 1500 and it said the usual 'regulations are updated' but i am still rated and going up again. (However i was almost above 1800;( needed just one more evening).
I'll get a cloned version of it ready for it.I finally have some time to devote to on-cart play starting next week, so I'm really glad the rating reset and I can ladder seriously on cart after I didn't start seriously in 16 and missed out on 17 completely. I definitely plan on taking this team to cart and try it once I am able to again.
This didn't cross my mind. And the only HP ice Rotom I have is non redis and trained for something else. I could breed you one if you want. I can sort a Ferro for you. Just let me know.If someone can pass me the Rotom and Ferrothorn I can start testing on cart. I've been using this a fair bit on PS but I keep losing to the shitty PS gimmicks that you never see on cart, so I'm interested to see how it fairs against real stuff. One thing I noticed is I default to using Gengar a lot, which is a little disappointing as its meant to be a Salamence team, but I keep running into stuff like Thundurus + Suicune or HP Ice Blaziken + Zapdos + Ferro, or Rock Tomb + [Ice move] Mega Kang so I bench Mence too often for my liking. It also doesn't help Mence's case that we have three status inducers so cleaning up with Hex is so easy.
If anyone's breeding stuff, the Rotom should have HP Ice IVs as it doesn't affect the EV spread and just gives an extra option incase we need it. I plan to do shiny versions but I've got a few projects lined up for others to do first...
edit: oh yeah and I've been testing Focus Blast over Destiny Bond on Gengar which is cool. Whichever you choose though, you'll be missing the other :(