SV OU PEAKED #2 (2107 ELO) – Regen Stall

SupaGmoney · Jun 10, 2023

Triple Regenerator Stall

:sv/Slowking:

https://pokepast.es/1d35f9d5f5a16c9f

Table of Contents:

Introduction
Proof of Peak
Team Members
How to Use This Team
Threats
Replays
Acknowledgments

Introduction:

With the addition of a plethora of offensive threats to Gen 9 OU via the Pokémon HOME update, all old Gen 9 OU stall teams were rendered obsolete, including my own Hazard Stack Stall (https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/peaked-1-2101-elo-–-hazard-stack-stall.3719401/). A huge problem with the HOME update was that while the meta gained many new offensive options, the new defensive countermeasures were rather lackluster. This imbalance was so great that many people believed that this update would render stall unviable.

Therefore, it is with great pleasure that I present to you my second RMT for Gen 9 OU showcasing the first high ladder Gen 9 OU post-HOME stall team.

I decided to stick to the basics and create a team that could counter every single meta threat.

With the update came a number of new challenging Pokémon and mechanics to deal with.

Firstly, hazard removal did not improve while the number of hazard setters increased. The most notable was :Samurott-Hisui:

with its signature move Ceaseless Edge.

As a result, I knew that 6x boots + Tera Flying :Alomomola:

would remain a necessity. However, I also quickly learned from testing that conserving Tera for the new and powerful threats like :Ursaluna:

and

was critical to success. As a result, stall can no longer rely solely on :Alomomola:

to ease hazard pressure. Therefore, including the only reliable hazard remover :Great Tusk:

was essential.

Finally, as I mentioned earlier, while the offensive options are plentiful, the defensive teambuilder remains extremely constrained, skewing the balance of the meta to predominantly hyper offense. The recovery PP nerf also continues to hamper defensive playstyles. As a result, I knew I needed Pokémon that could counter a wide array of offensive threats and stay healthy while keeping up with fast paced teams. Therefore, I sought to include as many Regenerator Pokémon as I possibly could on this team.

I threw this team together a few days after the HOME update and tested it on a few alts. My expectations were low especially after hearing the struggles that other stall players were going through when laddering. To my surprise, it fared extremely well, and after a few changes I was able to win consistently and achieve the peak shown below.

Ironically, the best Gen 9 OU post-HOME stall team to date consists entirely of pre-HOME Pokémon.

Proof of Peak

With this team, I was able to reach a personal best ELO of 2107 on the Gen 9 OU Ladder.

This team also raised my GXE from around 83% to 86%. If I had to guess, I would say I had an 87-89% GXE while using this team.

I cannot find the peak game replay so I’ve included the game where I reached 2102 ELO instead: https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ou-1879651987-ni23812042q3a5v9leuimbg8ut31aucpw

Team Members

I have been a strong advocate for :Slowking:

’s potential on stall even pre-HOME. Despite the popularity of :Slowking-Galar:

in this meta, :Slowking:

is better on stall in my opinion. Both have different pros and cons, but :Slowking:

in particular offers a few unique counterplay options that nothing else can.

:Slowking:

’s job is to act as a sponge for special hits. Thanks to Regenerator, :Slowking:

can scout attacks from Choice Specs Pokémon like :Dragapult:

and mixed attackers like :Enamorus:

.

also absorbs uninvested pivot attacks like Volt Switch from :Zapdos:

and

throughout the game to prevent the team’s primary special wall :Blissey:

from being worn down.

Although unorthodox, this set provides critical counterplay against common offensive cores such as :Slowking-Galar:

+

which I will elaborate upon later in the RMT. Even though dual screens are primarily a tool for hyper offense, it turns out that they are also extremely effective for stall. Unlike :Slowking-Galar:

,

has access to both Light Screen and Reflect. Finally, STAB Surf provides great neutral coverage into much of the tier, and hits annoying Pokémon like :Heatran:

especially hard.

:Slowking:

was also chosen over :Slowking-Galar:

because of how well it matches up with weather. :Slowking:

walls both pre-HOME weather abusers like :Walking Wake:

and post-HOME weather abusers like Choice Specs :Basculegion:

and

with ease. This in turn enables :Blissey:

to run a Tera type other than Tera Water.

Tera Steel is used to provide immunity to poison as well as let :Slowking:

wall mixed :Dragapult:

when used in tandem with :Toxapex:

.

1 Speed IV is used instead of 0 to allow :Slowking:

to move before opposing Chilly Reception :Slowking-Galar:

to set up screens while still being slow enough to set up screens first in the Trick Room matchup.

needs no introduction. It continues to be one of the best stall Pokémon in Gen 9 OU post-HOME. It eats a hit from almost every single meat threat and denies setup attempts with Haze while spreading status. Most notably, :Toxapex:

stonewalls top meta threats like :Urshifu:

and

. Sludge Bomb is run over something like Infestation to let :Toxapex:

inflict status on Pokémon that try to use Taunt.

When used with the other members of the triple Regenerator core, U-Turn and Volt Switch cores become trivial to deal with. Opposing Pokémon like :Garganacl:

also cannot make any progress even if one of the Regenerators has lost its boots. Maximum physical bulk lets :Toxapex:

survive pretty much any hit and Tera Fairy is used to beat Banded :Baxcalibur:

and Banded :Dragonite:

if necessary.

If it ain’t broke, don’t fix it. Once again, :Alomomola:

returns as the Knock Off absorber and Wish passer for the team. Tera Flying is still used to beat :Gholdengo:

Hazard Stack and strong Grass types like :Meowscarada:

and

.

also functions as a standalone physical wall thanks to Chilling Water. For more details, see section 4 of this RMT and the Ultimate Stall RMT.

is probably my favorite Pokémon introduced in Gen 9. With some of the best physical bulk in the tier and an extremely useful ability with Unaware, :Dondozo:

walls almost every single physical setup attacker in the meta.

In contrast to pre-HOME sets, :Dondozo:

now runs Earthquake to provide better coverage against Pokémon like :Heatran:

while still being able to hit Pokémon like :Kingambit:

hard. Avalanche is still used for beating Tera Flying :Roaring Moon:

,

, Tera Flying :Kingambit:

, and non-choice band :Baxcalibur:

.

Tera Ghost is now run to help improve the :Ursaluna:

matchup as this team's :Great Tusk:

beats Tera Dark :Kingambit:

.

Due to the faster paced nature of the post-HOME meta, it can be difficult to fit in Pokémon like :Clodsire:

on stall. Therefore, :Blissey:

needs to act as a wall against both Choice Specs Pokémon and special setup sweepers. With Calm Mind + Seismic Toss, :Blissey:

is able to easily KO or stall out Pokémon like :Volcarona:

and

.

Despite :Blissey:

gaining access to Heal Bell post-HOME, there simply is not enough room for :Blissey:

to run it. Stealth Rocks is preferred for making progress and this team has many ways of minimizing status conditions as it is.

Additionally, :Blissey:

now runs maximum physical defense EVs and special defense EVs, allowing :Blissey:

to take less damage from U-Turn from Pokémon like :Dragapult:

and

. It can also help vs mixed :Dragapult:

in a pinch. Tera Dark is used to wall mixed :Hoopa-Unbound:

and Stored Power abusers if necessary.

Even though :Great Tusk:

is the most widely used Pokémon in Gen 9 OU, it was largely absent from pre-HOME stall teams. However, that has changed post-HOME. In fact, :Great Tusk:

is extremely good on stall post-HOME.

:Great Tusk:

serves as a bulky utility Pokémon for stall and also acts as a secondary physical wall, checking Pokémon like Choice Band :Arcanine-Hisui:

and Choice Band :Hoopa Unbound:

which are difficult for stall to deal with otherwise.

Knock Off is used to remove items like Rocky Helmet and Leftovers from opposing Pokémon which makes it easier for the rest of the team to make progress. Rapid Spin is also used in emergencies to remove Hazards when other members of the team have had their Boots knocked off. Finally, Body Press hits many frail offensive Pokémon for significant damage while Rest gives :Great Tusk:

the option to heal on passive Pokémon. Notably, :Great Tusk:

with Rest walls Block :Garganacl:

more effectively than :Ting-Lu:

did. Tera Ghost lets :Great Tusk:

act as another emergency counter to :Ursaluna:

.

Enough speed EVs are included to always outspeed :Kingambit:

and

.

How to Use This Team

As I explained earlier, some of the sets on this team are unorthodox and not intuitive to use. I also think that navigating stall in the post-HOME meta is much more challenging than pre-HOME. Therefore I wanted to give a brief guide on how to pilot stall in general, as well as explain some of the more intricate counterplay options that this team has.

Hazards, Knock Off, and Trick

In general, you do not need to worry too much about Hazards due to every member of the team carrying boots. When you see Pokémon that commonly run Knock Off, like opposing :Great Tusk:

and

, you should always swap in :Alomomola:

to absorb them. If your opponent is using :Gholdengo:

as well as a team that can stack both Spikes and Stealth Rock and has a Knock Off user like :Great Tusk:

, only then should you use Tera Flying on :Alomomola:

. Even then, you can often get away without needing to use Tera thanks to Rapid Spin on our own :Great Tusk:

, as I demonstrate in the replays. Get in :Great Tusk:

as often as possible and mix up Knock Off and Rapid Spin use to try and catch :Gholdengo:

when it switches or successfully remove hazards when the opponent doesn’t switch. The key when facing opposing :Gholdengo:

is to be patient. :Alomomola:

can switch in on Stealth Rock + 3 Spikes and recover with Wish many times before it starts to become an issue.

As for Trick, you should be able to identify common Trick users such as :Rotom-Wash:

,

, and

. For example, if :Iron Valiant:

switches in and you don’t see a Booster Energy activate, you should immediately be wary of Trick. Depending on the matchup, you should determine which of your own Pokémon is least useful and try to bait Trick into them if possible. The only Pokémon I would recommend that you never let get Tricked is :Blissey:

.

Damage Mitigation and Recovery PP Management

When using stall in general, you should avoid switching in Pokémon like :Dondozo:

and

directly into attacks if you can avoid it. For example, if your opponent brings out :Baxcalibur:

or

, rather than switching immediately to :Dondozo:

, switch to :Toxapex:

to get a Toxic off first or switch into :Alomomola:

and Wish pass into :Dondozo:

.

and

will be able to regenerate their HP later and the damage to :Dondozo:

is minimized.

Similarly, you can reduce damage to :Blissey:

and save Soft-Boiled PP by using :Slowking:

to scout special attacks and absorb special pivot moves.

As an addition to the above, you should use as little recovery PP as possible, especially in longer matchups. Try and have your Regenerator Pokémon absorb as much damage as possible and switch them around as often as possible to recover HP rather than always using Recover, Wish, and Rest. For example, if your opponent brings out passive Pokémon like :Corviknight:

, use that opportunity to swap around. You can also use safe double switches to recover HP. For example, say that an opponent always switches X in when you have Y out. The next time Y is out on the field, try and mix in some double switches to another Pokémon to regenerate them if it's safe to do so.

Tera Use

Tera is one of the most valuable resources to stall, especially when it is not possible to counter all possible Pokémon and team compositions without it. Therefore you need to be judicious with which Pokémon you Tera. A general rule of thumb is that you want to be the last person to use your Tera unless there is an obvious threat like :Breloom:

that requires Tera immediately.

Dual Screens Counterplay Options

I’m now circling back to the explanation of choosing :Slowking:

over

for dual screens support.

Vs. +

Turn 1: Opponent brings in :Slowking-Galar:

Turn 2: You swap in :Slowking:

. Opponent clicks Future Sight.

Turn 3: You always click Light Screen on the turn after they click Future Sight. If they use Sludge Bomb instead of Future Sight, click Reflect. If they used Future Sight on the previous turn, they will use Chilly Reception this turn.

Turn 4: If they bring in :Urshifu:

or another physical attacker, swap in :Alomomola:

or

. They have enough bulk to eat the hit from the physical attacker while Light Screen halves the damage they take from Future Sight. In an emergency, :Toxapex:

can also eat a hit since it will take roughly 45% from Future Sight behind screens. Also, another reason why :Slowking:

was chosen on this team over :Slowking-Galar:

is that it resists both of :Urshifu:

’s STABs, and therefore it can also stay in on a :Slowking-Galar:

+

combo, especially if Reflect is up.

If they bring in a special attacker like :Dragapult:

, you can simply stay in with :Slowking:

and Slack Off next turn or swap to :Blissey:

.

Finally, the opposing :Slowking-Galar:

will usually try to poison :Slowking:

. In the event that Tera is not needed for anything else, use Tera Steel on :Slowking:

. With that being said, in this matchup, this is usually :Slowking:

’s only job, and so managing :Slowking:

’s HP with dual screens, Regenerator, and Slack Off is not too difficult even with poison damage.

Vs. + and + etc.

Turn 1: :Walking Wake:

or

switches in.

Turn 2: Switch in :Slowking:

. Opponent clicks Water STAB.

Turn 3: Click Light Screen regardless of what opponent does.

Turn 4: Switch to :Toxapex:

to regenerate. If they do not switch out, switch back to :Slowking:

to regenerate. Continue this cycle.

Alternatively:

Turn 2: Switch in :Slowking:

. Opponent clicks Draco Meteor or Shadow Ball.

Turn 3: Immediately switch out into :Toxapex:

or

.

Turn 4: If they do not switch out, switch back to :Slowking:

to regenerate. Continue this cycle.

If they do switch out, bring back :Slowking:

on the turn that they bring in the weather setter ( :Torkoal:

or

) and regenerate and/or Slack Off.

It can also help to Knock Off :Torkoal:

or

with

to minimize the number of turns that the weather is up before they have to switch back in, therefore maximizing the number of turns that :Slowking:

can switch back in to Regenerate HP.

General Usage:

Light Screen and Reflect can also be used outside of the Future Sight and Weather matchups. For example, if :Slowking:

switches into a favorable matchup and gets a turn to move, you can click Reflect if you expect your opponent to switch out into a physical attacker.

:Slowking:

can also sit behind its own screens and chip away at special attackers like :Iron Valiant:

and

with ease. :Slowking:

can also swap into a Pokémon like :Volcarona:

, set up Light Screen, and then swap out into :Toxapex:

who can Toxic it and use Haze or :Blissey:

which is borderline immune to any special attack when it's behind Light Screen.

Threats

With how new the meta is, it is simply not possible to adequately prepare for every single possible threat. That being said, the tera types and move sets on this team are relatively flexible and can be adapted as the meta progresses. However as it stands, here are some of the most prominent threats:

:Ursaluna:

Frankly, this Pokémon is just broken and completely invalidates defensive playstyles. The common argument for why it’s not broken is that it’s slow and can be revenge killed easily. The problem is that defensive teams can’t do that. At least :Annihilape:

could be burned with Flame Body whereas :Ursaluna:

gets boosted by status.

The only reliable defensive counterplay against :Ursaluna:

is

, a NU Pokémon at best. This situation is very reminiscent of the :Dracovish:

and

debacle, and ultimately everyone agreed that :Dracovish:

was just broken.

:Ursaluna:

has already been banned in National Dex where there exists even more defensive counterplay than in Gen 9 OU. Surely this should be a clear indication that :Ursaluna:

needs to be banned from Gen 9 OU. https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/ursaluna-is-now-banned-from-national-dex.3722464/.

Many people have complained that this meta is too centralized around hyper offense and I promise you that :Ursaluna:

is one of the big reasons why. Why would anyone run defensive or balanced playstyles when :Ursaluna:

can come in for free on something like :Toxapex:

and KO half your team easily?

With that being said, as long as :Ursaluna:

remains in the tier, defensive teams must either run double Tera Ghost on the two physically bulkiest Pokémon in the tier as this team does, :Corviknight:

who gets 2HKOd anyways, or :Drifblim:

to even stand a remote chance. :Ursaluna:

is extremely centralizing for defensive playstyles and it’s never a favorable matchup no matter how much you prepare. Even :Chien-Pao:

was easier for stall to deal with than :Ursaluna:

, and that’s saying something.

:Iron Leaves:

While

is less of an issue due to the addition of :Great Tusk:

,

is still very threatening. Use Tera Fairy :Toxapex:

to status it and then try to stall it out as best as you can with Recover, Regenerator, Protect, and :Dondozo:

.

The only Pokémon that can outright break through :Dondozo:

,

presents an unfavorable matchup for any stall team. Switch aggressively to :Dondozo:

if you predict :Haxorus:

will come in to maximize damage on it before it boosts. Tera Fairy :Toxapex:

can also attempt to status it.

Replays

Note that I laddered with this team before and after the bans of :Regieleki:

,

,

, and

zReptar · Jun 10, 2023

GOAT (all that needs to be said)

Highv0ltag3 · Jun 10, 2023

Good job on adapting to a very rough meta for stall, something I couldnt do myself well.

I found the slowking techs very interesting as they open up many possibilities for dealing with future sight.
Just one question, what does the team do against stored power hatterene since it no longer has tera clodsire as an option?

Poke nerd · Jun 10, 2023

~~Haha! Stall is dead! Surely stall can't keep up with ho-~~

Never mind SupaGmoney made another awesome stall.

All joking aside great team- did not expect stall to be alive- but you proved us all wrong.

More on what Highv0ltag3 said, how do you deal with stored power hatt? It definitely seems to give you some trouble, and so will np :Gholdengo:

VannAccessible · Jun 10, 2023

I friggin hate hate HATE Hamurrot, so the old version of this HDB spam team occurred to me as doing well in this hazard stacking HO meta. I’m thrilled to see it updated. :)

I’m going to disagree Ursaluna deserves a ban though. The reason it got banned in NatDex is because Pursuit exits there to remove ghost types, which can wall Ursa, so I wouldn’t call it an analogous situation.

Guts and Mold Breaker are the only tools left to break stall, and it’s not like stall can’t beat them out with smart building and play like you’ve done here. Tera Ghost, Double Screens on Slowking for the TR mu, and Great Tusk, I’d say those are all decent enough counter measures for it.

Mimikyu Stardust · Jun 11, 2023

this is a really cool team but man i really can't ignore the absolute weakness to very common threats like Ursaluna, Hoopa-U, Iron Valiant and even some uncommon ones like Breloom. This just seems very passive and will do worse than the old standard stalls of ou ladder (https://pokepast.es/08e51af0cc840de7 your old stall, Highv0ltag3 's old stall https://pokepast.es/ea33af38b36982c1, and that one stall with Galarian slowking/alo/zama that i dont have the paste for) with some updated tera types.

Im not a stall builder myself but i do know basis of team building and what good stalls look like

Let's ignore ursaluna at the moment as you said that its just broken and you really can't counter it, apart from using pokemon like :houndstone:

Houndstone which, gonna be honest is pretty good and you might be able to slot it in here somehow with tera flying, but ghost dozo does beat it much better. :zamazenta:

Zamazenta is another mon u might need to consider, rest zama does beat luna quite well with tera.

Now i think this team also suffers from some very common threats, just take a :samurott-hisui:

Hisuian Samurott with Edge and Knock off, or just any simple knock off + ghost team that has any hazard, it would be VERY easy for any decent player to outplay this team. Without defog, spikes/tspikes and relying on great tusk to spin it is very exploitable by the most common style of team.

Not only that, a lot of teams usually have a dedicated stall breaker, Mixed Iron Valiant, Block Garganacl, Polteageist, Electric Terrain, Some Tera Poison sweeper and just by looking at this team and playing it a bunch on ladder, this team really cannot handle them and relies on pex WAY more than some other stalls.

here is an example of a replay i saved vs your team with Rain Overqwil, an alright set up sweeper https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ou-1882312692-8pd0eerlnmklyfc1frfodc9dfbyyad5pw

Yes i will admit he did choke by not clicking rest with dondozo on my Qwil's tera dark but apart from that, after i set up rocks and knocked the alomomola, i can freely click dark type move all i want, and dark type is notorious for being this generations best typing.

As an offense player and notorious stall hater (i have 2 RMTs in SS OU dedicated to destroying the best stalls at the time lol) i think what this team needs is.

- A way to punish switching more and give less free turns. with only toxic on toxapex, only hazard removal being tusk, no hazards of your own besides rocks you really cant punish wallbreakers with this team. Dedicated wallbreakers like Banded shifu, Magnezone, Mixed Hoopa-U just rolls and tears this team apart. Maybe adding clodsire or zamazenta might help?

- Making this team less passive. This team has no damage output, no burns from wisp, salt cure, glowking, ting lu earthquake, volcarona flamethrower. youre not really gonna do much damage with this team at all. Adding an offensive mon + corviknight might be the move aswell. Ursaluna is really only broken vs stall, a very all or nothing playstyle like HO so i really doubt it will get the boot, so you really just need to chin up and find something good againts it.

- No more boots, better defoggers and even magic bounce. I have seen a lot of successful stall without mono boots, in ladder and replays of SPL, with stuff like hatterene, leftovers dozo, helmet pex, boots iron moth, cloak dengo, trick glowking, garg and what not. I feel like those type of stall that doesnt rely on boots and no hazard to be good will do much better in this meta that has A LOT of threats, be more proactive. its like last gen with life orb clefable and offensive torn-t on stall to help with stuff like kartana.

So i would suggest try and give this team more status, hazards, or something that can deal damage cause rn its way too passive and can be run over way too easily with any decent breaker by any decent player. Of course this team might just be tailor made just for you and you know your ins and outs with it and do much better with it than your other teams, but i would really like you to go indepth even more and answer some of my questions.

My suggestion is adding clodsire over something as it has toxic and hazards which would DEFINETLY help this teams passiveness.

Sorry if this comes off as rude or very harsh but i just wanted to give my criticism on this team, as much as i hate stall i do really like seeing people experiment with it, creating new sets to counter one niche breaker from ru and what not. but i do feel as someone who faces stall everyday, this one i do feel is very flawed and can be much better.

SupaGmoney · Jun 12, 2023

Highv0ltag3 said:
Good job on adapting to a very rough meta for stall, something I couldnt do myself well.

I found the slowking techs very interesting as they open up many possibilities for dealing with future sight.
Just one question, what does the team do against stored power hatterene since it no longer has tera clodsire as an option?

Poke nerd

I appreciate the compliments. This team has 3 counterplay methods versus :Hatterene:

, 2 of which apply to other Stored Power abusers in general.

The most obvious is Tera Dark :Blissey:

which is immune to Psychic-type attacks that :Hatterene:

commonly runs, including Psyshock and Stored Power. :Blissey:

can match

’s boosts with Calm Mind of its own and wear it down with Seismic Toss. This strategy is also applicable to other Pokémon which rely on Stored Power, including :Articuno-Galar:

.

The second counterplay option utilizes Tera Fairy :Toxapex:

.

can 1v1

with Haze and Sludge Bomb. Haze prevents :Hatterene:

from boosting while Sludge Bomb does roughly 26% to :Hatterene:

and can poison it through Magic Bounce to wear it down even faster. Additionally, you can swap to :Slowking:

to Regenerate :Toxapex:

and set up Light Screen before switching back to :Toxapex:

to continue Hazing and using Sludge Bomb. Finally, once :Hatterene:

is poisoned, :Blissey:

can also easily 1v1 :Hatterene:

without Tera by using Seismic Toss. It can also be helpful to Knock Off :Hatterene:

's Leftovers with :Great Tusk:

if possible.

This method of counterplay is also applicable to other Stored Power abusers, especially those that are prone to Toxic.

You will also notice in some of the replays I used Tera Steel :Toxapex:

to execute this strategy against the infamous Stored Power :Magearna:

set, since Steel resists both Stored Power and Draining Kiss. :Magearna:

has since been banned, and :Hatterene:

is not as common any more on the ladder due to :Samurott-Hisui:

being able to set up Spikes through Magic Bounce with Ceaseless Edge. However, should Stored Power abusers become more common, Tera Steel is a viable Tera Type for :Toxapex:

in this meta.

The third lesser known counterplay option is :Dondozo:

. However, this is only applicable against :Hatterene:

that run Psyshock as their Psychic-type coverage. :Dondozo:

ignores

's boosts with Unaware, and Psyshock hits :Dondozo:

on the physical side where it is extremely bulky. Draining Kiss is a relatively weak move and does little damage to :Dondozo:

.

also resists moves like Mystical Fire and takes negligible damage from Nuzzle. Against this :Hatterene:

set,

can PP stall :Hatterene:

with Rest alone. To make PP stalling easier, when :Dondozo:

is asleep, do not use Sleep Talk. Instead, let :Dondozo:

take the full sleep turn to waste :Hatterene:

’s moves and use Sleep Talk only when :Dondozo:

is awake to burn even more turns.

Finally, :Blissey:

walls Nasty Plot :Gholdengo:

.

can only hit :Blissey:

with Make it Rain, which has 8 PP. Whenever :Gholdengo:

switches in, :Blissey:

switches in on the next turn and begins spamming Calm Mind until :Gholdengo:

uses Make it Rain. Since Soft-Boiled also has 8 PP, :Blissey:

can simply Recover after every hit, and due to :Blissey:

's unmatched special bulk, it can take +2 hits with ease before boosting.

SupaGmoney · Jun 12, 2023

VannAccessible said:
I friggin hate hate HATE Hamurrot, so the old version of this HDB spam team occurred to me as doing well in this hazard stacking HO meta. I’m thrilled to see it updated. :)

I’m going to disagree Ursaluna deserves a ban though. The reason it got banned in NatDex is because Pursuit exits there to remove ghost types, which can wall Ursa, so I wouldn’t call it an analogous situation.

Guts and Mold Breaker are the only tools left to break stall, and it’s not like stall can’t beat them out with smart building and play like you’ve done here. Tera Ghost, Double Screens on Slowking for the TR mu, and Great Tusk, I’d say those are all decent enough counter measures for it.

Thanks for the comment. As you noted, due to :Gholdengo:

, hazard stacking is very common in this meta. Stall requires :Hatterene:

+

at a minimum to be able to not run 6x boots. The issue is that even this setup is not enough to guarantee no hazards due to :Samurott-Hisui:

. As a result, stall teams with no boots require significant investment in the form of 2 Pokémon that may or may not succeed in fulfilling their role in the first place. When you factor in the already constrained builder for stall and the increasing number of difficult offensive threats that need to be dealt with outside of hazard stacking, it is simply not worth the opportunity cost of running no boots on stall at this point in time.

Finally, I agree that :Ursaluna:

is not unbeatable with stall. I wouldn't have managed to ladder with this team as high as I did otherwise, and I have posted a few replays of this team beating :Ursaluna:

. With that being said, my argument was more focused on the fact that the restriction in the builder imposed by :Ursaluna:

on defensive teams is overbearing and centralizing. Stall can either run a niche but otherwise subpar Pokémon like :Drifblim:

which is not very good in a majority of matchups, or it can overly focus resources on not losing to :Ursaluna:

at the cost of being worse against all other playstyles and matchups. In Gen 9 OU, the effect that :Ursaluna:

has on defensive teams is similar to the effect that :Magearna:

or

had on offensive teams. It's not unbeatable, but it requires a disproportionate amount of resources to beat and imposes a massive strain on Pokémon selection in the team builder.

SupaGmoney · Jun 12, 2023

Mimikyu Stardust said:
this is a really cool team but man i really can't ignore the absolute weakness to very common threats like Ursaluna, Hoopa-U, Iron Valiant and even some uncommon ones like Breloom. This just seems very passive and will do worse than the old standard stalls of ou ladder (https://pokepast.es/08e51af0cc840de7 your old stall, Highv0ltag3 's old stall https://pokepast.es/ea33af38b36982c1, and that one stall with Galarian slowking/alo/zama that i dont have the paste for) with some updated tera types.

Im not a stall builder myself but i do know basis of team building and what good stalls look like

Let's ignore ursaluna at the moment as you said that its just broken and you really can't counter it, apart from using pokemon like Houndstone which, gonna be honest is pretty good and you might be able to slot it in here somehow with tera flying, but ghost dozo does beat it much better. Zamazenta is another mon u might need to consider, rest zama does beat luna quite well with tera.

Now i think this team also suffers from some very common threats, just take a Hisuian Samurott with Edge and Knock off, or just any simple knock off + ghost team that has any hazard, it would be VERY easy for any decent player to outplay this team. Without defog, spikes/tspikes and relying on great tusk to spin it is very exploitable by the most common style of team.

Not only that, a lot of teams usually have a dedicated stall breaker, Mixed Iron Valiant, Block Garganacl, Polteageist, Electric Terrain, Some Tera Poison sweeper and just by looking at this team and playing it a bunch on ladder, this team really cannot handle them and relies on pex WAY more than some other stalls.

here is an example of a replay i saved vs your team with Rain Overqwil, an alright set up sweeper https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ou-1882312692-8pd0eerlnmklyfc1frfodc9dfbyyad5pw

Yes i will admit he did choke by not clicking rest with dondozo on my Qwil's tera dark but apart from that, after i set up rocks and knocked the alomomola, i can freely click dark type move all i want, and dark type is notorious for being this generations best typing.

As an offense player and notorious stall hater (i have 2 RMTs in SS OU dedicated to destroying the best stalls at the time lol) i think what this team needs is.

- A way to punish switching more and give less free turns. with only toxic on toxapex, only hazard removal being tusk, no hazards of your own besides rocks you really cant punish wallbreakers with this team. Dedicated wallbreakers like Banded shifu, Magnezone, Mixed Hoopa-U just rolls and tears this team apart. Maybe adding clodsire or zamazenta might help?

- Making this team less passive. This team has no damage output, no burns from wisp, salt cure, glowking, ting lu earthquake, volcarona flamethrower. youre not really gonna do much damage with this team at all. Adding an offensive mon + corviknight might be the move aswell. Ursaluna is really only broken vs stall, a very all or nothing playstyle like HO so i really doubt it will get the boot, so you really just need to chin up and find something good againts it.

- No more boots, better defoggers and even magic bounce. I have seen a lot of successful stall without mono boots, in ladder and replays of SPL, with stuff like hatterene, leftovers dozo, helmet pex, boots iron moth, cloak dengo, trick glowking, garg and what not. I feel like those type of stall that doesnt rely on boots and no hazard to be good will do much better in this meta that has A LOT of threats, be more proactive. its like last gen with life orb clefable and offensive torn-t on stall to help with stuff like kartana.

So i would suggest try and give this team more status, hazards, or something that can deal damage cause rn its way too passive and can be run over way too easily with any decent breaker by any decent player. Of course this team might just be tailor made just for you and you know your ins and outs with it and do much better with it than your other teams, but i would really like you to go indepth even more and answer some of my questions.

My suggestion is adding clodsire over something as it has toxic and hazards which would DEFINETLY help this teams passiveness.

Sorry if this comes off as rude or very harsh but i just wanted to give my criticism on this team, as much as i hate stall i do really like seeing people experiment with it, creating new sets to counter one niche breaker from ru and what not. but i do feel as someone who faces stall everyday, this one i do feel is very flawed and can be much better.

I appreciate the comment and I wanted to address your points.

Firstly, this team does have counterplay against almost every single threat in the meta. In an effort to keep this initial response concise, I’ll leave it at that. However, if you or anyone else would like to ask about specific matchups and their respective counterplay, I would be happy to elaborate further.

As for your second point, Pokémon like :Houndstone:

and

struggle on stall because of their overdependence on Rest. :Ting Lu:

and

are exceptions because they fill utility roles and are never meant to be primary walls. :Dondozo:

is also an exception because of Unaware. However, primary walls which rely on Rest are easily exploited by hit-and-run attacks, which a good opponent will always use.

Additionally, there are a massive number of threats that stall needs to be able to cover with only 6 Pokémon of their own. As a result, stall simply cannot afford to run Pokémon like :Houndstone:

and

which are good in some matchups but do very little in other matchups or Pokémon like :Garganacl:

which are very Tera reliant. I can elaborate more on this if you would like to discuss it further.

In theory, many of the suggestions that you provided make a lot of sense and are things that players like Highv0ltag3 and myself have discussed extensively. However, the discussion usually circles back to the point that I made when responding to an earlier comment. In the end, you can only pick 6 Pokémon to wall all of OU. Therefore, you need to maximize the team's defensive potential and minimize opportunity costs. Thus, in practice, it is extremely difficult to deviate from a handful of defensive Pokémon, especially post-HOME.

That’s not to say that as the meta develops, more diverse counterplay won’t evolve. However, at this point in time, this team is the most successful attempt by any player at running stall in Gen 9 OU post-HOME.

For your next point, this team actually has more hazard control than previous stall teams. Most notably, my :Ting Lu:

stall team had no hazard control at all and was very successful despite this. Hazard Stack + :Gholdengo:

is good against all playstyles, not just stall, simply because :Great Tusk:

is the only viable hazard control in this meta. Also, as I mentioned in the RMT, hazard removal is not a necessity for this team, it is just another option that it has. :Alomomola:

usually does a good job at handling hazards as I demonstrate in the replays. Rapid Spin is only necessary in dire situations.

You also bring up the point that some stall teams in tournaments and SPL have succeeded in running no boots. However, there is a fundamental difference between tournament teams and ladder teams. Tournament teams usually only operate in a sample size of 1 or 2 games. Players can also scout their opponents and tailor strategies to beat those opponents. In contrast, ladder teams must be able to win games against any and every type of playstyle imaginable over much larger sample sizes. Therefore, while it can be a source of inspiration, I personally don’t think the two settings can be compared on an apples to apples basis.

I agree with your point that this team is passive. However, that is by design. As you start adding more offensive options, it becomes less of a stall team and more of a bulky offense or balance team. Frankly, I have no interest in running anything other than hard stall because that’s the playstyle I enjoy. If that means the team is more challenging to build and harder to ladder with, so be it.

Finally, you mention that you do not really play stall yourself. However, I would encourage you to attempt to build your own stall team and try it out on the ladder. This is probably the best way to understand the points I’ve mentioned above. Also, learning how to play stall will give you more insights on how to beat stall with your offensive teams.

I also agree that this team has weaknesses and is not unbeatable. However, that is true for all teams. Additionally, as Highv0ltag3 mentioned, this has been an extremely challenging meta for stall. I’m sure that new teams and innovations will develop eventually. After all, we have only been in the post-HOME meta for less than 2 weeks.

Once again, I appreciate your comment and the criticisms you articulated. I personally did not take offense to your reply as you made it clear that your criticism pertained to the team only. Comments like these really help me think more about what I can do to make better teams in the future, and that’s what matters. After all, we’re here to have fun and help each other get better at the game.

If you or anyone else want to discuss certain matchups in depth or propose new theories/possible innovations for stall, I’d be happy to discuss them in the comments. I am also happy to answer any other questions about the team in general.

Lobby Eeveee · Jun 12, 2023

Without Tera fairy on :blissey:

, how am I supposed to beat Sub Dragon Darts Wisp Hex :dragapult:

?

SupaGmoney · Jun 17, 2023

Bonus Drifblim Stall Team + Zamazenta Suspect Test Requirements

Bonus Stall Team

Due to popular demand from members of the Stall Discord, I've decided to share a bonus :Drifblim:

stall team with everyone. This team is very similar to the original RMT team, and I actually considered including it the original RMT but left it out for various reasons. With that being said, here's the team:

:Alomomola:

https://pokepast.es/22be84f33167b901

This team is largely the same as the original RMT team, however it features :Drifblim:

instead of :Great Tusk:

to improve the :Ursaluna:

matchup.

I was able to reach an ELO of ~2050 with this team on a separate account and probably could have gotten higher but stopped laddering due to time constraints. I don't have a replay of the peak game but I have some replays of 2000+ ELO games with :Drifblim:

that I can share if necessary.

As I said in the original RMT, :Drifblim:

is the only true defensive counter to :Ursaluna:

in all of Gen 9 OU. With its unique Ghost + Flying typing, :Drifblim:

is the only Pokémon in Gen 9 OU that is immune to both of :Ursaluna:

's STABs without requiring Tera. With 92 speed EVs, it always outspeeds :Ursaluna:

. Therefore, the counterplay looks something like this:

Turn 1: :Ursaluna:

switches in.

Turn 2: Switch in :Drifblim:

.

From there, two things can happen:

Turn 2: :Ursaluna:

clicks Crunch.

Turn 3: Click Strength Sap. Repeat this cycle.

Alternatively,

Turn 2: :Ursaluna:

clicks Swords Dance.

Turn 3: Click Haze. :Ursaluna:

clicks Crunch.

Turn 4: Click Strength Sap. Repeat this cycle.

Maximum defense EVs ensure that :Drifblim:

will live any unboosted non-critical hit from :Ursaluna:

, therefore allowing :Drifblim:

to always be able to switch in on :Ursaluna:

and counter it using the method above. This :Drifblim:

set is designed to stall out as many turns as possible against :Ursaluna:

, slowly chipping it via burn damage and/or forcing it out. Additionally, :Drifblim:

can use Air Slash to further chip :Ursaluna:

and potentially flinch it to gain additional turns.

Finally, in the event that :Ursaluna:

lands a critical hit on :Drifblim:

or KOs it for any reason, :Drifblim:

's ability Aftermath will activate and deal an additional 25% to :Ursaluna:

, allowing another member of the team like :Alomomola:

or

to finish

off.

In matchups where the opponent does not have :Ursaluna:

,

is also not a complete do-nothing Pokémon. :Drifblim:

can run up to two additional utility moves if you opt to not include Air Slash, most likely Will-O-Wisp and/or Defog.

This :Drifblim:

set also has the additional advantage of completely walling most setup variants of :Dragonite:

. It can also be used as a counter to most variants of :Great Tusk:

or to harass passive Pokémon like :Clodsire:

and

in some matchups. It also beats Block :Garganacl:

since

can switch out at any time to reset Salt Cure thanks to its Ghost Typing.

A great use of :Drifblim:

would be saving it for late game so that after something like :Kingambit:

KOs a teammate, :Drifblim:

can switch in on the following turn to burn it so that :Dondozo:

can handle it with ease.

Additionally, due to its Ghost typing, reasonable bulk, and access to Strength Sap, :Drifblim:

can act as a Rapid Spin blocker if necessary. It also provides a valuable Ground immunity with its Flying type.

While the Tera type on this :Drifblim:

set is Fairy, it can be changed for almost anything else. I also have never used Tera on :Drifblim:

since the majority of its value comes from its unique dual typing.

Finally, Aftermath ensures that :Drifblim:

always provides value even if all it does is become a sacrifice against a contact physical attacker, such as Choice Band :Baxcalibur:

or

.

The other notable change on this team is the change of :Dondozo:

's Tera type from Ghost to Fighting since :Drifblim:

is now the team's primary :Ursaluna:

answer. For more information on Tera Fighting :Dondozo:

, see my older RMT (https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/peaked-1-2101-elo-–-hazard-stack-stall.3719401/). Additionally, since :Drifblim:

can counter setup :Dragonite:

,

is free to run Waterfall over Avalanche, although Avalanche is still a fine choice.

I initially theorized this :Drifblim:

set in the Stall Discord and was surprised to see how well it worked after putting it into practice. I still think that the original RMT team with :Great Tusk:

is a better team, however this bonus team is solid overall and will perform well on the ladder.

Suspect Test Requirements

Using the original RMT team for every single game (https://pokepast.es/1d35f9d5f5a16c9f), I was able to fulfill the requirements for the :Zamazenta:

suspect test, proving that this team will perform well on any tier of the ladder. If you are having trouble getting requirements, I strongly recommend trying out this team.

https://www.smogon.com/forums/threa...er-identification-thread.3722905/post-9663467

Thank you again. I appreciate all the support on the original RMT. I'm still more than happy to answer any questions regarding the original :Great Tusk:

team or the :Drifblim:

bonus team. Additionally, if you would like to learn more about specific matchups and their respective counterplay, get tips on how to pilot these teams, and/or build/play stall in general, feel free to comment below.

quacc · Jun 17, 2023

This stall team is quite good, but there is a question that annoys me. Against Hoopa-Unbound, if you don't know the set, what is a safe middle ground in order to not get blown away by a choiced set? For example, if Hoopa-Unbound comes in, you don't know if it is physical or special. If you go to a special wall, you seemingly get one shot by physical sets, and if you go for a physical wall, you might get blown away by a special attack. Is this something that you have to predict or is there a safer way to work around Hoopa-Unbound?

Initiatedog · Jun 18, 2023

These teams reignite my passion for playing stall, great team!

Whaloob · Jun 20, 2023

Very nice team(s) (Drifblim was a mon I put a lot of failed effort into making work in Gen 4 OU because of Unburden and I’m happy to see it receive some attention recently even if it’s at the behest of an absolutely broken mon).

How do you feel about Scream Tail on stall teams? I’ve had excellent success with wish/screens/encore in UU and pre-HOME OU, and while I think the power level of post-HOME OU is a bit too high to run wish without protect on a regenless mon at this point (even with screens), I don’t think anyone would deny the mon’s support potential overall. Have you had any success with it in your testing?

SupaGmoney · Jun 20, 2023

quacc said:
This stall team is quite good, but there is a question that annoys me. Against Hoopa-Unbound, if you don't know the set, what is a safe middle ground in order to not get blown away by a choiced set? For example, if Hoopa-Unbound comes in, you don't know if it is physical or special. If you go to a special wall, you seemingly get one shot by physical sets, and if you go for a physical wall, you might get blown away by a special attack. Is this something that you have to predict or is there a safer way to work around Hoopa-Unbound?

Thanks for asking. The hardest part about the :Hoopa-Unbound:

matchup is guessing what set it is running the first time it switches in. Once you can effectively determine the set, :Hoopa-Unbound:

can be managed by this team.

Therefore, as you identified, the most important step when facing :Hoopa-Unbound:

is to be able to scout out its set without suffering a casualty that would prevent you from winning the game. For example, if :Toxapex:

is important to the matchup, you don't want to switch it into :Hoopa-Unbound:

only to get KOd by a Choice Specs Psychic and put yourself at a massive disadvantage for the rest of the game.

The first thing I do is try and guess what set :Hoopa-Unbound:

is based solely off team preview. For example, if I see that the opponent has multiple special attackers such as :Gholdengo:

,

, and

, I would guess that their :Hoopa-Unbound:

will be a physical attacker. From there, I will swap Pokémon like :Alomomola:

and

in to scout. The same logic applies if you see a majority of physical attackers on the opponent's team.

However, this method is not guaranteed. :Hoopa-Unbound:

has extremely high attack stats in both categories and can sometimes run mixed attacking sets. Other times, you simply don't have enough information to deduce the set. Therefore, in these cases, it can be helpful to identify which Pokémon are not as essential to the matchup and can be used to scout since the team will not be completely crippled if :Hoopa-Unbound:

KOs them. To illustrate this point, here's a replay of me facing a team where I was unsure of which set :Hoopa-Unbound:

was running. Even after I was able to discover that it was a special attacking set, I still had difficulty switching in my counter, Tera Dark :Blissey:

safely. As a result, I ended up sacrificing :Toxapex:

so that I could safely swap in :Blissey:

and Tera. However, since I had determined that :Toxapex:

would not be crucial to my success in that matchup, I was able to win the game easily despite the early KO.

Replay vs
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen9ou-1879691805-fvwa62zxo4x1k12rwnolal93ohw89nvpw

As for playing against :Hoopa-Unbound:

, here is a list of the primary counterplay options this team has:

Vs. Choice Specs
Tera Dark :Blissey:

Tera Steel :Slowking:

Vs. Choice Scarf or Mixed
If specially biased:

Tera Dark :Blissey:

Tera Steel :Slowking:

If physically biased:

Tera Fairy :Toxapex:

Vs. Choice Band
:Great Tusk:

Tera Fairy :Toxapex:

As always, be mindful of HP on your chosen counter to :Hoopa-Unbound:

especially if you need it to check other Pokémon in that matchup as well. You may also have to position yourself aggressively to prevent :Hoopa-Unbound:

from getting free switch-ins. Feel free to refer back to my guide in the original RMT on how to use this team for more information. I am also happy to elaborate further on how to approach this matchup or any other matchup with this team.

SupaGmoney · Jun 20, 2023

Whaloob said:
Very nice team(s) (Drifblim was a mon I put a lot of failed effort into making work in Gen 4 OU because of Unburden and I’m happy to see it receive some attention recently even if it’s at the behest of an absolutely broken mon).

How do you feel about Scream Tail on stall teams? I’ve had excellent success with wish/screens/encore in UU and pre-HOME OU, and while I think the power level of post-HOME OU is a bit too high to run wish without protect on a regenless mon at this point (even with screens), I don’t think anyone would deny the mon’s support potential overall. Have you had any success with it in your testing?

Thank you for commenting. :Drifblim:

has been surprisingly good in this meta. I've been experimenting with it and I can say that there is definitely more potential to be unlocked. Unfortunately, :Ursaluna:

is still extremely broken against defensive and balanced teams. This means :Drifblim:

is the best we can do at the moment.

I agree with your assessment of :Scream Tail:

's viability on stall. The reason :Alomomola:

has become so crucial to stall's success this generation is because it does not require its own Wishes to heal itself. :Alomomola:

also has the largest Wish in Gen 9 OU.

On the other hand, :Scream Tail:

requires around half of its Wishes just to sustain itself, diminishing its ability to act as Wish support for the team. As you noted, :Scream Tail:

is also forced to run Protect and usually needs one attacking move, limiting its defensive capabilities overall.

However, :Scream Tail:

definitely has a niche on stall, as it is one of the only Pokémon that can set up Stealth Rock and Wish pass. It's also an excellent counter to :Iron Valiant:

and provides a much needed Fairy typing for a team without requiring Tera.

In fact, a member of the stall Discord was actually able to peak the Gen 9 OU ladder with a :Alomomola:

+

double Wish stall pre-HOME. However, I honestly don't know if this kind of team would be good or not in the post-HOME meta.

In conclusion, I think it's certainly possible that :Scream Tail:

could be used on stall post-HOME. It has good bulk, defensive typing, support options, and a sizeable Wish. The challenging question is if it's worth the opportunity cost of giving up something like :Slowking:

or

to run

. I haven't tested anything with :Scream Tail:

post-HOME yet, but if you manage to discover something or come up with a cool team, please let me know!

As always, please let me know if you have any follow up questions or if anyone else has questions regarding this team and/or anything related to Gen 9 OU post-HOME stall.

Whaloob · Jun 21, 2023

SupaGmoney said:
Thank you for commenting. has been surprisingly good in this meta. I've been experimenting with it and I can say that there is definitely more potential to be unlocked. Unfortunately, is still extremely broken against defensive and balanced teams. This means is the best we can do at the moment.

I agree with your assessment of 's viability on stall. The reason has become so crucial to stall's success this generation is because it does not require its own Wishes to heal itself. also has the largest Wish in Gen 9 OU.

On the other hand, requires around half of its Wishes just to sustain itself, diminishing its ability to act as Wish support for the team. As you noted, is also forced to run Protect and usually needs one attacking move, limiting its defensive capabilities overall.

However, definitely has a niche on stall, as it is one of the only Pokémon that can set up Stealth Rock and Wish pass. It's also an excellent counter to and provides a much needed Fairy typing for a team without requiring Tera.

In fact, a member of the stall Discord was actually able to peak the Gen 9 OU ladder with a + double Wish stall pre-HOME. However, I honestly don't know if this kind of team would be good or not in the post-HOME meta.

In conclusion, I think it's certainly possible that could be used on stall post-HOME. It has good bulk, defensive typing, support options, and a sizeable Wish. The challenging question is if it's worth the opportunity cost of giving up something like or to run . I haven't tested anything with post-HOME yet, but if you manage to discover something or come up with a cool team, please let me know!

As always, please let me know if you have any follow up questions or if anyone else has questions regarding this team and/or anything related to Gen 9 OU post-HOME stall.

Appreciate your assessment. Sometimes it can be a little hard to tell what’s actually good and what’s working at the section of ladder I’m against—depending on how I’m playing and how polished the team I’m using is at the time, that can easily range from 1300-1650 or so, and frankly that lower end doesn’t tell me much.

I’ve experimented a bit with Brambleghast a bit as well on semi-stall and stall builds—I wish it had better overall bulk but its role compression is certainly impressive, being able to act as a solid physical check, spinner, spinblocker, spiker, and rain check thanks to water and electric resistances + immunity to hurricane (as well as heat wave and whirlwind, notably, although in rain those are unimportant). It also can put ursaluna in an awkward spot, being immune to facade and resistant to eq thus forcing out its coverage moves while strength sapping it, but with SD you can’t really hold it down unfortunately, and I don’t think it can quite earn a spot as a luna counter if it can’t consistently counter luna, nor can it quite earn a spot on its other solid qualities. Still, I’d love to hear your experience with it.

Anyway, keep up the good work!

Edit: almost forgot, do you happen to have the pokepaste for the mola/tail stall team you mentioned? I’d happily try my hand at reworking it for post-home.

SupaGmoney · Jun 22, 2023

Whaloob said:
Appreciate your assessment. Sometimes it can be a little hard to tell what’s actually good and what’s working at the section of ladder I’m against—depending on how I’m playing and how polished the team I’m using is at the time, that can easily range from 1300-1650 or so, and frankly that lower end doesn’t tell me much.

I’ve experimented a bit with Brambleghast a bit as well on semi-stall and stall builds—I wish it had better overall bulk but its role compression is certainly impressive, being able to act as a solid physical check, spinner, spinblocker, spiker, and rain check thanks to water and electric resistances + immunity to hurricane (as well as heat wave and whirlwind, notably, although in rain those are unimportant). It also can put ursaluna in an awkward spot, being immune to facade and resistant to eq thus forcing out its coverage moves while strength sapping it, but with SD you can’t really hold it down unfortunately, and I don’t think it can quite earn a spot as a luna counter if it can’t consistently counter luna, nor can it quite earn a spot on its other solid qualities. Still, I’d love to hear your experience with it.

Anyway, keep up the good work!

Edit: almost forgot, do you happen to have the pokepaste for the mola/tail stall team you mentioned? I’d happily try my hand at reworking it for post-home.

I appreciate your follow-up. :Brambleghast:

is another interesting Pokémon. I did consider it during my initial search for :Ursaluna:

counters for the reasons you mentioned. However, it simply doesn't have the bulk to fulfill that role.

252+ Atk Guts :Ursaluna:

Fire Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def :Brambleghast:

258-304 (82.1 - 96.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Crunch does even more damage than that and threatens an OHKO. As a result, :Brambleghast:

is unlikely to be able to make multiple switch-ins against :Ursaluna:

and does not have the "insurance policy" of Aftermath that :Drifblim:

does.

is also done for if :Ursaluna:

uses Swords Dance as :Brambleghast:

does not have access to Haze or a similar move. Finally, outside of the :Ursaluna:

matchup, there is very little that :Brambleghast:

can check defensively due to its relatively poor overall bulk. I think it also faces some stiff competition from :Great Tusk:

as the utility Pokémon on stall as :Great Tusk:

has Knock Off and the bulk necessary to check a number of Pokémon in the tier.

However, as you mentioned, the one potential niche that :Brambleghast:

can provide which nothing else can is Spikes + Utility. Right now, :Clodsire:

and

are the two main stall Pokémon capable of learning Spikes. However, :Ting Lu:

has struggled to find a place on Gen 9 OU stall teams post-HOME for various reasons that I can elaborate upon further. As a result, there could be potential for :Brambleghast:

to fit on a hazard stack stall team as a utility Pokemon that can set and remove hazards as well as prevent opposing hazard removal.

A set like this might work, although a finalized set might have some further optimization:

:Brambleghast:

@ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Wind Rider
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Spikes
- Rapid Spin
- Strength Sap
- Shadow Ball

In conclusion, I think that while :Brambleghast:

would not fit on a stall team like the one in this RMT, it may have a role on a stall team focused on hazard stack like the team in my previous RMT (https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/peaked-1-2101-elo-–-hazard-stack-stall.3719401/). I'd love to hear what you discover in your testing! After reading your ideas, I definitely have to test a :Brambleghast:

stall team now!

As for the :Alomomola:

+

team, while I don't know all the details of the original team, the version below is almost identical to the original and should give you a good idea of what the team looked like. Feel free to edit the team as you see fit. For example, you could run Heal Bell over Stealth Rock on :Blissey:

or Encore over Stealth Rock on :Scream Tail:

etc. Let me know what you find in your testing!

Double Wish Stall

:Clodsire:

https://pokepast.es/ae9f9c9772c5c607

As always, happy to answer any questions regarding this team or Gen 9 OU Stall.

Whaloob · Jun 22, 2023

SupaGmoney said:
I appreciate your follow-up. is another interesting Pokémon. I did consider it during my initial search for counters for the reasons you mentioned. However, it simply doesn't have the bulk to fulfill that role.

252+ Atk Guts Fire Punch vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def 258-304 (82.1 - 96.8%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

Crunch does even more damage than that and threatens an OHKO. As a result, is unlikely to be able to make multiple switch-ins against and does not have the "insurance policy" of Aftermath that does. is also done for if uses Swords Dance as does not have access to Haze or a similar move. Finally, outside of the matchup, there is very little that can check defensively due to its relatively poor overall bulk. I think it also faces some stiff competition from as the utility Pokémon on stall as has Knock Off and the bulk necessary to check a number of Pokémon in the tier.

However, as you mentioned, the one potential niche that can provide which nothing else can is Spikes + Utility. Right now, and are the two main stall Pokémon capable of learning Spikes. However, has struggled to find a place on Gen 9 OU stall teams post-HOME for various reasons that I can elaborate upon further. As a result, there could be potential for to fit on a hazard stack stall team as a utility Pokemon that can set and remove hazards as well as prevent opposing hazard removal.

A set like this might work, although a finalized set might have some further optimization:

@ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Wind Rider
Tera Type: Fairy
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
- Spikes
- Rapid Spin
- Strength Sap
- Shadow Ball

In conclusion, I think that while would not fit on a stall team like the one in this RMT, it may have a role on a stall team focused on hazard stack like the team in my previous RMT (https://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/peaked-1-2101-elo-–-hazard-stack-stall.3719401/). I'd love to hear what you discover in your testing! After reading your ideas, I definitely have to test a stall team now!

As for the + team, while I don't know all the details of the original team, the version below is almost identical to the original and should give you a good idea of what the team looked like. Feel free to edit the team as you see fit. For example, you could run Heal Bell over Stealth Rock on or Encore over Stealth Rock on etc. Let me know what you find in your testing!

Double Wish Stall

https://pokepast.es/ae9f9c9772c5c607

As always, happy to answer any questions regarding this team or Gen 9 OU Stall.

You might be the number one resource for gen 9 stall right now. Gonna have to try that team out.

Re: :brambleghast:

, I admit I haven’t gotten it to do much on true stall teams, but I do think it’s one of the most underrated utility mons for hazard stacking balance and bulky offense teams, and worth considering as a spinner either in place of :great tusk:

, in order to allow :great tusk:

to run ice spinner/body press, or to give your team 2 spinners in case your build is quite weak to hazards. Of course, stall is your business, and I think the only kind of stall team I can imagine it on is some form of :alomomola:

+

toxic spike build where :brambleghast:

runs phantom force over shadow ball, :alomomola:

acts as a dedicated knock off absorber and secondary physical wall much as it does in your builds (also being able to take on and often either force out or kill a number of the mons :brambleghast:

can’t handle without tera such as :cinderace:

,

,

,

, and

), and

works to deny setup and spread tspikes and possibly toxic directly, depending on how willing you are to be completely attackless. An alternative is to run :dondozo:

over

and put tspikes on :slowking-galar:

, which has the benefit of giving an amazing physical unaware wall as well as tspikes on something that has stab psychic coverage to dissuade tspike absorption outside of :muk-alola:

and

, but then you’re dropping :toxapex:

on stall which is hard to swallow. My initial thought is that you would finish the :brambleghast:

,

version of the team out with :blissey:

and then look to use your last slot to patch your weakness to sun or to defog, which leads me to any of spdef :dragonite:

(roost, encore, dragon tail, and iron head with tera steel or poison, where your tera is of course not useful against sun but allow you to take on :enamorus:

and

much more easily in conjunction with encore), tera water or water absorb :clodsire:

(able to help spread toxic, deal with setup with unaware, haze, or both, and set rocks allowing :blissey:

to run either heal bell or shadow ball, while also being able to block volt switch, something you otherwise only punish via hazards), or lefties spdef tera fairy :goodra-hisui:

with curse, rest, dragon tail, iron head (this set is a beast, being able to take advantage of its insane special bulk to run away with games while being difficult to setup on thanks to dragon tail, requiring fairy typing, tera fairy, or the forcing of rest, where the former 2 can be handled with stab curse boosted iron head—tera fairy skeledirge kinda needs to be handled first as iron head barely misses the 2hko mark), or spdef :cyclizar:

(much needed knock off user along with giving you the magical 3 regen users, which I don’t need to explain to you—it also doesn’t necessarily need spin allowing it to run some form of extra offensive pressure, such as tbolt, overheat, or iron head, if desired).

With all that said, I have an initial paste (https://pokepast.es/d3537f3161349f50) in case you want to do any testing yourself with this starting point. Bear in mind this is a rough draft, I’ll be trying out a few variants and seeing what I come up with myself; I’ll edit to include the revised paste if I make changes.

Whaloob · Jun 27, 2023

Apologies for spamming this thread with so many questions, but I’m not sure how this stall team (and, in fairness, virtually any stall team) can ever deal with block + tera ghost curse garg? If it blocks anything lacking a pivot move that it can set up normal curse on (which is clodsire, skeledirge, dondozo although it’ll eat a lot of recovers, alomomola, blissey, defensive tusk, any ting lu set lacking whirlwind—which granted isn’t common—pex, the slowking on this team, and more), it’ll boost away on you, and importantly, tera ghost allows it to passively 3hko anyone with ghost curse + salt cure, which just meets the threshold to outdamage rest recovery unless covert cloak is involved—lefties won’t even save you as you’ll only get 2 turns of lefties. For this particular team, I can see that tera ghost would allow dondozo or tusk to swap out of it, but then what? You’d have to swap right back in or else something else gets blocked and killed, and neither has regenerator. If your opponent catches on—and they will catch on eventually—they’ll spam block to try to catch the switch, and at worst they’ll have to use 3 block PP to do so. Covert cloak only blocks the salt cure damage as well, but running covert cloak rest on dondozo is legitimately the only thing I see that beats it, and with all the hazards flying around I’m not convinced covert dozo is an option.

What say you?

SupaGmoney · Jul 1, 2023

Whaloob said:
Apologies for spamming this thread with so many questions, but I’m not sure how this stall team (and, in fairness, virtually any stall team) can ever deal with block + tera ghost curse garg? If it blocks anything lacking a pivot move that it can set up normal curse on (which is clodsire, skeledirge, dondozo although it’ll eat a lot of recovers, alomomola, blissey, defensive tusk, any ting lu set lacking whirlwind—which granted isn’t common—pex, the slowking on this team, and more), it’ll boost away on you, and importantly, tera ghost allows it to passively 3hko anyone with ghost curse + salt cure, which just meets the threshold to outdamage rest recovery unless covert cloak is involved—lefties won’t even save you as you’ll only get 2 turns of lefties. For this particular team, I can see that tera ghost would allow dondozo or tusk to swap out of it, but then what? You’d have to swap right back in or else something else gets blocked and killed, and neither has regenerator. If your opponent catches on—and they will catch on eventually—they’ll spam block to try to catch the switch, and at worst they’ll have to use 3 block PP to do so. Covert cloak only blocks the salt cure damage as well, but running covert cloak rest on dondozo is legitimately the only thing I see that beats it, and with all the hazards flying around I’m not convinced covert dozo is an option.

What say you?

Thanks for commenting again. I’m always happy to help.

This team beats most sets of Block :Garganacl:

by simply leaving :Great Tusk:

in against it. Even if :Garganacl:

is at +6 Attack, :Great Tusk:

takes little damage from Salt Cure since it 4x resists the move. Block :Garganacl:

also usually runs Salt Cure as its only attacking move, so Great Tusk is easily able to stall out all of :Garganacl:

’s moves while healing the residual Salt Cure damage with Rest. I have a replay of :Ting-Lu:

doing this in my old RMT, and :Great Tusk:

has an even better matchup vs. :Garganacl:

than

.

However, you are correct that Tera Ghost + Block :Garganacl:

cannot be beaten the same way, since Curse from Tera Ghost :Garganacl:

deals an additional 25% damage per turn, meaning neither :Great Tusk:

nor

can reasonably beat it even if they use Tera Ghost themselves.

Theoretically, if you time every single switch perfectly so that whenever :Garganacl:

uses Block, you swap in Tera Ghost :Great Tusk:

or

, you could stall out Block or Recover since both moves only have 8 PP. This is because :Garganacl:

has to cut its HP by 50% and Recover every time it uses Curse since you will probably Knock Off its Leftovers with :Great Tusk:

immediately. If you can manage to swap in :Great Tusk:

when

uses Curse at low HP or runs out of Recover PP, you would be able to KO it.

Additionally, if you swap in Tera Ghost :Great Tusk:

on the turn :Garganacl:

uses Block, you do not take any damage, allowing you to use Rest or burn 1 Rest turn on the following turn while taking only Salt Cure or Curse damage in return, but not both. If you can pull this off all 8 times without losing any of your Pokémon that are critical to the matchup, then you would be able to win.

However, these counterplay options are admittedly not ideal. Tera Ghost + Block :Garganacl:

has a very favorable matchup against this stall team, although it is not necessarily an automatic loss as shown above. With that being said, Tera Ghost + Block :Garganacl:

is also not very common on the ladder post-HOME. However, I did encounter it and beat it a few times pre-HOME. If you start encountering Tera Ghost + Block :Garganacl:

more often, a few counterplay options are:

Include pivot moves on Regenerator Pokémon, such as Chilly Reception :Slowking:

and/or U-Turn :Cyclizar:

.
Change the Tera Type of one of the Regenerator Pokémon that does not have a pivot move to Tera Ghost.
Include a Taunt + Tera Ghost user, such as :Great Tusk:

.

If you were to include these changes, you would be able to beat Tera Ghost + Block :Garganacl:

every time. Simply scout for Block by switching between your Regenerator Pokémon that have pivot moves and/or Tera Ghost when :Garganacl:

uses Salt Cure. As soon as Block is revealed, either switch between your two Regenerator Pokémon that have pivot moves or use Tera Ghost on the Regenerator Pokémon that does not have a pivot move and swap between it and your one regenerator Pokémon with a pivot move.

Taunt + Tera Ghost :Great Tusk:

would also prevent :Garganacl:

from using anything but Salt Cure, at which point :Great Tusk:

would be able to win that matchup easily and/or switch out to :Alomomola:

to be Wish passed without fear of :Alomomola:

being Blocked.

I hope this helps. Feel free to let me know if you or anyone else has other questions on this team or stall in general.

1LDK · Jul 8, 2023

SupaGmoney said:
Bonus Drifblim Stall Team + Zamazenta Suspect Test Requirements

Hey, uh, I loaded my first match after a 3/4 week hiatus (uni + rough stuff in my life) and my first match is against this team, and I got my life drained so hard I don't wanna play again for another 3 weeks. Its a really excellent team and I had no counterplay for it, great job in putting the play style back in the business, and mad respect for driftblim goated shenanigans. Here is the replay if your interested, like I said, I'm rusty, tired and not a good player at all, so it was badly played, still, seems like a good showcase of the team

SupaGmoney · Jul 15, 2023

1LDK said:
Hey, uh, I loaded my first match after a 3/4 week hiatus (uni + rough stuff in my life) and my first match is against this team, and I got my life drained so hard I don't wanna play again for another 3 weeks. Its a really excellent team and I had no counterplay for it, great job in putting the play style back in the business, and mad respect for driftblim goated shenanigans. Here is the replay if your interested, like I said, I'm rusty, tired and not a good player at all, so it was badly played, still, seems like a good showcase of the team

Hey 1LDK, I hope everything is going well. Nice to hear from you and I appreciate the compliments.

I watched the replay and I thought you played well, but as you saw :Drifblim:

is just surprisingly good in this meta. It has a real niche on stall and there are a number of things it can do besides just beating :Ursaluna:

.

For example, it has the potential to check almost every single physical attacker in the meta. Here's :Drifblim:

clutching a 1v2 against Bulk Up :Great Tusk:

and Supreme Overlord boosted Black Glasses :Kingambit:

after

had KO'd

.

.

I'm working on building a stall team that really features :Drifblim:

as the star and does well on the ladder. When that happens, I'll be sure to post it here. For the time being, the Bonus :Drifblim:

Stall team is still a very solid team for anyone who wishes to start experimenting with :Drifblim:

themselves.

Let me know if anyone has questions about :Drifblim:

, the RMT team, or stall in general.

Sagat92 · Jul 16, 2023

Hey SupaGmoney !
I've started playing on showdown a few weeks ago and the only way I'm getting fun is playing stall, kinda weird I know ... lol
The thing is, I'm actually stucked @ kinda low ELO, well as I said earlier, I'm playing ' strategic pokemon ' since 2-3 weeks so it's not a shame I guess lol
I've seen someone facing you a few days ago, while streaming and your team was different from the ones on the thread, which team would you recomand for a guy who wants to learn stall and improve my skills?
If there are some videos, tips, replays I could watch from Youtube etc let me know

Thanks, and keep pushing

SupaGmoney · Jul 17, 2023

Sagat92 said:
Hey SupaGmoney !
I've started playing on showdown a few weeks ago and the only way I'm getting fun is playing stall, kinda weird I know ... lol
The thing is, I'm actually stucked @ kinda low ELO, well as I said earlier, I'm playing ' strategic pokemon ' since 2-3 weeks so it's not a shame I guess lol
I've seen someone facing you a few days ago, while streaming and your team was different from the ones on the thread, which team would you recomand for a guy who wants to learn stall and improve my skills?
If there are some videos, tips, replays I could watch from Youtube etc let me know

Thanks, and keep pushing

Hello Sagat92, thanks for commenting.

Glad to hear that you enjoy stall. I too primarily enjoy playing stall for a number of reasons. In my opinion, stall this generation requires the most meta and builder knowledge to pilot successfully. Contrary to popular belief, due to the imbalance between offense and defense in this meta, stall is actually an extremely skill-demanding playstyle in Gen 9 OU.

I'm always testing new teams and strategies, so it's likely that you saw me testing a different team than the one in this thread.

With that being said, there are four well-proven public stall teams in Gen 9 OU post-HOME. The :Great Tusk:

and

teams in this thread, Weirdhamster's :Ditto:

team, and my latest :Cyclizar:

team which was featured in the most recent Teams of the Week. You really can't go wrong with any of them.

In my experience, the :Great Tusk:

team (https://pokepast.es/1d35f9d5f5a16c9f) is the easiest to pilot on the lower ladder because it's the most forgiving if you make a mistake and it has the broadest defensive coverages out of the four teams, which is important for when you run into unexpected Pokémon sets.

I think the best resources to learn about Gen 9 OU stall are the RMTs that have been posted by other stall players. Here are a few of the most prominent ones:

Highv0ltag3's and juliusfunnel's Ultimate Stall
My Hazard Stack stall
This RMT
Weirdhamster's Ditto Stall

In each RMT you will find tips on how to play stall as well as replays of 1900+ ELO games featuring those stall teams which you can learn from.

Additionally, I encourage everyone to join the stall Discord (https://discord.gg/5kesazdPxF). There are plenty of very good stall players including myself in that server who are more than happy to help you and anyone who joins learn how to build and play stall.

Finally, I just wanted to give a little teaser for a new RMT that I will be releasing very soon that will explain my :Cyclizar:

stall team in depth (https://pokepast.es/da93d61274b0440b). Following the inclusion of my team in the Teams of the Week, fellow stall player knexhawk was able to reach an ELO of 2100+ on the Gen 9 OU ladder with it, proving that hyper offense's former greatest enabler :Cyclizar:

is now a stall staple post-HOME. Stay tuned!

Let me know if there are any more questions.

SV OU PEAKED #2 (2107 ELO) – Regen Stall

Join Big Stall: https://discord.gg/78WzPupPkg

formerly LT83AQ Lou

Banned deucer.

Banned deucer.

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The losing man with a winning hand

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