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Pokémon Goodra [REVAMP]

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Goodra | #706
[Smogon OU Analysis | Serebii | Bulbapedia]​
Base Stats : 90 HP / 100 Atk / 70 Def / 110 SAtk / 150 SDef / 80 Spe
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Ability 1 : "Sap Sipper" - Attack is raised by one stage when the Pokémon is hit by a Grass-type move. User receives no damage from Grass-type attacks.
Ability 2 : "Hydration" - All status problems: Burn, Paralysis, Sleep, Frozen and Poison, are healed when raining.
Hidden Ability : "Gooey" - Contact with the Pokémon lowers the attacker's Speed stat.
Click to expand...
Notable Moves
Outrage | Dragon Pulse | Aqua Tail | Power Whip | Ice Beam | Thunderbolt | Earthquake | Sludge Wave | Fire Blast | Focus Blast | Rock Slide | Dragon Tail | Acid Armor | Counter | Curse | Iron Tail | Draco Meteor
Click to expand...

Overview - **finally revamped!**
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Frankly put, Goodra is a very interesting 600 BST pseudo-legendary Pokémon. Unlike its more aggressive draconic brethren, Goodra seems to emphasize a whole lot more on bulk, specifically Special bulk. Goodra still possesses a respectable 100/110 offense stat but its base 150 Special Defense is what really sets it apart. Considering the base power nerfs to various Special Attack moves and the introduction of the amazing Assault Vest, Goodra's niche as a special tank is more than viable in this generation. But that's not all. Goodra has a movepool almost as large as its pot-belly - ranging from Ice Beam to Earthquake, Goodra is seriously a difficult Pokémon to safely switch into. And if Goodra's movepool isn't enough to wow you, check out its abilities. Hydration is pretty subpar this generation due to the Drizzle nerf, but its still usable on rain-dedicated teams. Sap Sipper and Gooey are the real highlights however. Getting an Attack boost from switching into Spore, Sleep Powder, Giga Drain, etc while boasting Grass immunity is pretty interesting to say the least. Gooey slows down the opposition should they choose to make a contact move on Goodra ; this can prove to be fatal to the opposition if their Pokémon relies on Speed to win the game.
However, despite its versatility and bulk, Goodra is definitely a Pokémon with flaws. It possesses a subpar base 80 speed alongside a poor base 70 Defense stat. This makes Goodra extremely susceptible to Physically-based Pokémon - and considering just how many new Physically-based threats we have in Generation VI, things aren't looking too hot for Goodra. Goodra also lacks a reliable recovery which is a huge hindrance to any defensively-oriented Pokemon. To add insult to injury, Goodra is susceptible to every form of entry hazard - Stealth Rock, Spikes, Toxic Spikes, you name it.

Movesets - **credits to darkie !**
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Assault Vest Tank
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name: Assault Vest Tank
move 1: Draco Meteor
move 2: Fire Blast
move 3: Sludge Wave
move 4: Earthquake
ability: Sap Sipper
item: Assault Vest
nature: Quiet
evs: 248 HP / 252 SpA / 8 SpD

Moves
========
- draco meteor is goodra's strongest attack and allows it to do a lot of damage while taking very little.
- for example, with the given set, Goodra can take any offensive OU Dragon's Draco Meteor while OHKOing at the same time (with the exception of defensive Latias, Zygarde, and opposing Goodra):
252 SpA Choice Specs Latios Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 4 SpD Assault Vest Goodra: 300-354 (78.1 - 92.1%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 SpA Choice Specs Latios Draco Meteor vs. 252 HP / 4+ SpD Assault Vest Goodra: 270-320 (70.3 - 83.3%) -- guaranteed 2HKO

- fire blast hits ferrothorn, klefki, other steels, etc. anything weak to fire
- sludge wave hits faires
- since heatran completely walls this set, Earthquake is great

Set Details
========
- maxing spA lets goodra really function as a tank by being able to dish out a ton of damage
- quiet nature reinforces that, while sassy allows it to take less damage. 252 SpA from base 110 still hits pretty hard
- 248 evs for stealth rock

- sap sipper gives goodra an immunity, which is extremely welcome on a pokemon with no recovery, allowing it to come in virtually unscathed on a predicted grass attack. it's also immune to spore and other grass type status moves because of this!
- assault vest makes the set but leftovers is also an option


Personal Opinion
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While Goodra may not be the most offensively potent Pokemon in XY, Goodra has definitely carved itself a niche into the OU metagame, an impressive feat for any Pokémon. That being said, Goodra should always be played to its strengths - tanking hits and dishing out damage. Due to its very specific build, Goodra has some trouble breaking out of its "comfort zone" and applying new strategies.
However, as the metagame changes, so do the Pokémon. Does Goodra have any other niches/roles it can successfully fulfill, without being outclassed? If so, what kind of sets? Discuss!
 
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I have actually tested a Goodra similar to this one and it does not work very well at all. Simply put, with Drizzle nerfed rain stall is not too potent anymore. After 5 or 8 turns, your Goodra suddenly is bulkless, and you give all the momentum to your opponent. You can also be caught in a situation where you need to use rest on the last turn of Rain, and because of how move resolve the rain will peter out before you hydration kicks in, leaving you asleep. I've also tried Goodra who has Rain dance itself, but this gives it poor coverage. Dragon + Fire is good coverage, but you are actively weakening one of your moves by using rain dance. I think Goodra has a lot of potential, but not as a hydration wall. Unfortunately it came one gen too late for that. I'm looking into its ability Gooey and seeing how that could be used as a supportive defensive pivot.
 
Interesting. Also, Goodra's stat distribution is quite new for a Pseudo-Legendary (for what I remember, Hydreigon's distribution focus on SAtk).

Looking at him, it is quite obvious that his true abilities actually lie in a Rain-based team.
 
ArkWelder said:
I have actually tested a Goodra similar to this one and it does not work very well at all. Simply put, with Drizzle nerfed rain stall is not too potent anymore. After 5 or 8 turns, your Goodra suddenly is bulkless, and you give all the momentum to your opponent. You can also be caught in a situation where you need to use rest on the last turn of Rain, and because of how move resolve the rain will peter out before you hydration kicks in, leaving you asleep. I've also tried Goodra who has Rain dance itself, but this gives it poor coverage. Dragon + Fire is good coverage, but you are actively weakening one of your moves by using rain dance. I think Goodra has a lot of potential, but not as a hydration wall. Unfortunately it came one gen too late for that. I'm looking into its ability Gooey and seeing how that could be used as a supportive defensive pivot.
Click to expand...

I'm going to have to seriously change up the tank set. Thank you~
If you get a Gooey set before I make one, please let me! I'll post it up
 
I'm going to be honest here, Goodra is completely disappointing. Being a SpDed-based Dragon with Hydration-Rest is cool and all, but I'm finding it really hard for this Pokemon to actually do anything. It's Attack is simply bad and it's Special Attack is solid but simply not as strong as it used to be. Goodra might've been cool in OU in 5th Gen but I simply can't see it working with Drizzle nerf and fairies walking around in addition to the obvious old threats like Ferrothorn.
 
Fire Blast + Hydration are this guys only saving Grace really, as otherwise I can't see much of a reason to use this guy, despite how cool he is. The Rain nerf certainly isn't helping him, and he isn't exactly the strongest Pokemon out there attacker wise. It's SDef is pretty impressive, and I can see it being a pretty cool way to check threats like Rotom-W, Starmie, Greninja, and maybe even Keldeo in the near future, but I really don't see it being too amazing.
 
So far, the best role for Goodra in OU seems as a special tank. Max HP / Max SpA with maybe a few Speed EVs to outspeed some defensive Pokemon. Checks Water-, Fire-, and Electric-types (which can't do shit back with the nerf to Hidden Power Ice), hits very hard from the special side and with awesome coverage, and can also drop the Speed of dangerous physical attackers on a whim to help the team, with the Gooey ability (eg. sacrifice Goodra against +1 Dragon Dance Dragonite so that the rest of your team can deal with it afterwards).
 
I'll revamp this entire thread definitely guys thank you.
I'm hoping more Goodra information will come in so I can make some solid sets
 
Do you know if Gooey works both ways? For example, if Goodra uses Outrage (a contact move) will it lower the speed of whatever it hits? That could certainly be interesting for Goodra. It doesn't get Dragon Dance though and it's got a better Special Attack and Special movepool.

As it stands, I agree with everyone else. The Hydration train came last gen and now its long gone. Goodra will be alright but...yeah.
 
I dunno. That sap sipper looks like it could have potential as a spore blocker so its a pretty good check on brelooms and ammongus without toxic plus the attack boost from it is kinda nice tho its still situational.
 
ito said:
I dunno. That sap sipper looks like it could have potential as a spore blocker so its a pretty good check on brelooms and ammongus without toxic plus the attack boost from it is kinda nice tho its still situational.
Click to expand...

Then again, just use any Grass-type to do the same thing. Use a Grass/Poison-type and they'll block Toxic too!
 
Maybe include Sludge Bomb for coverage against Fairy types. Although it generally has bad coverage, it also hits Celebi, which is good if you're running it with Focus Blast, since you'd otherwise be walled by Fairies. The 30% poison chance is also nice for Hydration + Rest stall.
 
Potential Revamps:
  • I'll get rid of Hydration and put in place a set built around Sap Sipper. Seems like Hydration just isn't going to pull strings this Gen
  • Sludge Bomb will be considered
  • Honestly the superior ability is Gooey. It's just a matter of when it will be legal
 
This thing isn't bad, not outstanding, but not terrible either. Reminds me a little bit of Hydreigon in that it gets loads of coverage moves, but it lacks the speed to make it a top tier sweeper. I would highly recommend something like earthquake on a separate set, maybe something mixed or something, since its nice coverage, and you hit special walls a bit harder, Special Tank is prolly its best set tho.
 
I think Goodra gets rain dance from its pre evo but would it take up a move slot space for hydration?

EDIT: Didn't read there is already rain dance on the list my bad.

What about a special wall like

200 hp/252 spd/52 speed
Ability: Hydration
Item: Leftovers
Moveset
-Rain Dance
-Rest
-Toxic (if TM 06 still exists)
-Dragon type move
Counters: Fairies block Dragon type moves but not toxic with a exception of Mega Mawile and Kleftki due to being steel typing and immunity to dragon, also noting Ferrothorn Eats Toxic and dragon moves like a boss unless Goodra Packs Fire move but If there is a Drizzle toad on your team another rain support with a Weather rock to make up for its nerf then Replace Rain dance with a move that's viable, I haven't used it myself yet however I'l catch it, breed it and train it when I get further progress with my Pokémon X game
 
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Um, I'm wondering why everyone is going with dragon-fire coverage considering goodra works better under rain due to hydration, even if muddy water is the only special water move of note so far? Dragon/Water (Rain boosted water at that hopefully) scores perfect neutral coverage on everything but

-Ferrothorn
-Empoleon
-Azumarril

Only two of those pokemon have any business in OU whatsoever, with azumarril up for debate due to the rain nerf (empoleon can stay UU). If you really need to, use fire blast as well and take a care when you set up rain, leaving a move pool to look like this (I have not the knowledge of EV's for OU, so adjust accordingly)

-Muddy water
-Fire blast
-Dragon pulse/draco meteor
-Rest

LO tank set. Actually if goodra gets focus miss, replace fire blast with that. Pity about the weather nerf, but certainly something for bulky offense to consider.
 
With gooey couldn't goodra run some sort of mixed wall? Or at least specially focused but physically defensive enough so that any physical attack has to wade through -2 speed before bringing it down.
 
Goodra is going to receive heavy competition from Latias and in my opinion I don't think it will win that competition. Both are very similar as Sp. Def oriented Dragons with high special attack stats. Let's compare:

Goodra:
Type: Dragon
80 / 95 / 80 / 115 / 140 / 90
Ability: Hydration / Sap Sipper / Gooey

Latias:
Type: Dragon / Psychic
80 / 80 / 90 / 110 / 130 / 110
Ability: Levitate

So Goodra just barely has more special attack than Latias with 5 base stat points more and a bit more special defense with 10 base stat points more. Goodra also beats out Latias by the largest margin in its attack stat by 15 points. This is really underwhelming however considering that Goodra will stay specially based and won't use that attack unless it is a mixed set. Unforuntately for Goodra, the rain-turn nerf came and I can't see Hydration used reliably with effectively six turns to use it if you switched in Politoed and then switched it back out to Goodra. Damp Rock Politoed is more favored to offensive rain strategies. Sap Sipper is neat for a Spore immunity, but come on you already resist Grass. Gooey doesn't offer any merit defensively, which is Goodra's primary focus.

Now let's check out Latias. It has 10 more physical defense than Goodra and it actually uses that stat to sponge hits against Fighting-types (Keldeo and Breloom). But the real killer is the speed stat: Latias is 20 points higher at base 110! Latias' speed stat has been key this gen to its success because it makes it a much more potent offensive threat outspending everything and it makes sure it doesn't need to get hit twice when switching in. Latias also beats out Goodra in the resist depart. As much as I give Latias crap for being so damn easy to Pursuit trap sometimes, that Psychic typing is key to it being a much more potent defensive threat: especially against top tier threats like Keldeo and Breloom. In addition, Levitate is better than any of Goodra's ability because it gives it a Spikes immunity (prevents it from getting worn down) on type to an immunity against EQ. Also Latias has reliable recovery with Recover or Roost, I haven't seen that with Goodra (yet) outside of HydraRest (goodra looks like a poke who would get recover though).

So yeah, Goodra is going to have to show us something more significant to be a real game changer in OU. It would totally outclass Latias IMO if it were Poison / Dragon. seriously why aren't you poison / dragon you have "goo" in your name. shows how much a fail it is already
 
Yeah, not being weak to Pursuit will be one of the main pros of Goodra over Latias. Its hidden ability also helps differentiate it a little bit. Oh, and of course now with the Hidden Power nerf Latias is going to be serious Spikes bait, giving to Goodra another advantage over it (Fire Blast). But overall, Latias is going to be the special tank of choice, unless Goodra gets some reliable recovery and maybe some other good moves too (Aromatherapy maybe?).
 
Latias and Goodra do have very similar traits but I think I outlined MixTank Set.
Because Goodra has a higher Attack stat along with some interesting physical moves, Goodra can go mixed and tank, something Latias cannot do.
Goodra also is Pursuit-Trap free which is a huge plus for any Pokemmon.
Goodra also possess more variety in terms of ability while Latias is stuck with Levitate.
This is a bit of speculation but seeing how Goodra is a tissue slug Pokemon and how pretty much every pseudo-legendary receives a healing move move, I would have to say that Recover is probably not too far off. Now if Goodra doesn't get Recover or Slack off then Latias will have a huge upper-hand in tanking. But if Goodra can grab a recovery move such as Recover or Slack Off, Goodra will definitely have enough tools to differentiate itself from Latias and maybe even outperform ... (?)
 
PillsburyDoughBoy beat me to the punch. Goodra is kind of outclassed by Latias, who comes with a resistance to Fighting type moves and an immunity to Ground type moves. She is also significantly faster and has a bit more movepool options.

What Goodra really needed was Bulk Up/Curse/Calm Mind. If he had any of those moves, he could have been a much bigger threat thanks to the Hydration + Rest shenanigans. I think Gooey has some cool potential for more offensive teams that need a good pivot.

Goodra @ Leftovers
Ability: Gooey
EVs: 252 HP / 144 Def / 112 Spd
Bold Nature
- Dragon Pulse
- Fire Blast
- Focus Blast
- Sludge Bomb / Ice Beam / Thunderbolt

The idea is to switch in on a contact move from something, and lower their speed. That would essentially be like giving you a Choice Scarf, and from there you can attack with a wide variety of moves for some big damage. The speed and bulk could be reworked to deal with specific things. Its just some food for thought for now, since Gooey hasn't been released as of yet.
 
TEzeon said:
PillsburyDoughBoy beat me to the punch. Goodra is kind of outclassed by Latias, who comes with a resistance to Fighting type moves and an immunity to Ground type moves. She is also significantly faster and has a bit more movepool options.

What Goodra really needed was Bulk Up/Curse/Calm Mind. If he had any of those moves, he could have been a much bigger threat thanks to the Hydration + Rest shenanigans. I think Gooey has some cool potential for more offensive teams that need a good pivot.

Goodra @ Leftovers
Ability: Gooey
EVs: 252 HP / 144 Def / 112 Spd
Bold Nature
- Dragon Pulse
- Fire Blast
- Focus Blast
- Sludge Bomb / Ice Beam / Thunderbolt

The idea is to switch in on a contact move from something, and lower their speed. That would essentially be like giving you a Choice Scarf, and from there you can attack with a wide variety of moves for some big damage. The speed and bulk could be reworked to deal with specific things. Its just some food for thought for now, since Gooey hasn't been released as of yet.
Click to expand...

Very interesting set! I actually like how you're using Gooey. Biggest problem : Goodra is really frail. It needs to be switching into Close Combats, Mach Punches, Brave Birds, ExtremeSpeeds in order to fully abuse Gooey. Could you post some calculations to show us how well the spread works?

And I agree that Goodra needs a boosting move. GameFreak always shows some consideration for the pseduo's, so I feel like Goodra will gain either Work Up, Calm Mind or Bulk Up. Maybe even Dragon Dance :D

**Questions + Response Section Updated**
 
I don't actually think weather teams will be poor due to the nerf of auto-weather abilities. I've seen a lot of people saying this, however, I remember in Gen IV UU Rain Dance teams were very prominent at one point, and Damp Rock was voted on as a result iirc. My point is, it was possible for rain to be very useful in a metagame with no Drizzle Pokemon at all, so I'm sure weather can still be viable this gen.
 
I use a RestTalk Goodra, which is surprisingly effective, thanks to its gargantuan Special Defense.

Goodra @ Leftovers
Ability: Sap Sipper
EVs: 144 SAtk / 252 HP / 88 SDef
Modest Nature
- Dragon Pulse
- Sludge Bomb/Flamethrower
- Rest
- Sleep Talk

It's pretty weird using Sludge Bomb, considering it more or less sucked last generation. Steel types are a definite counter though, so Flamethrower can be used in place. If you want to abuse Sap Sipper's attack boosts, physical moves with attack EV's can be used instead. I prefer using the special set because Goodra doesn't have to rely on a boost to deal decent damage.
 
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