Data Pokemon Sun/Moon Battle Mechanics Research

Kadabrium said:
so electrified status moves ignore type immunity but not ability based ones?
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Thunder Wave has always been the only status move that respects type immunities. (So if Normalize Delcatty uses Thunder Wave then it hits Ground types but not Ghost types.) In particular this is why Corrosion Salazzle can hit Steel types with Poison Gas or Toxic - it's not the type immunity that it bypasses but the status immunity. (So in Hackmons a Corrosion user could poison a Steel type using Twineedle.)
 
Is there any way of telling whether a Steel/Poison type would remove toxic spikes on switch-in? (Current Showdown! code doesn't remove them, but this poster was surprised by that behaviour.)
 
sumwun said:
If a question on this thread gets ignored, does that mean people are researching it or it's really getting ignored?
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It's mostly that a lot of these are really low priority. Things that only apply to OMs or randbats tend to slip through the cracksx especially this far into the gen with (likely) every major mechanic discovered at this point.
Ex I've been meaning to try and look into all the Anticipation changes but its such an irrelivant ability that i keep forgetting to finish it up.
 
Defensive damage calculation for Grassy Terrain is currently implemented incorrectly (for sure on the damage calculator, not 100% sure on Showdown). I'm reporting it in this thread first because I need someone who can analyze the damage formula code in-game to confirm where it should actually be.

Grassy Terrain is currently stored in the damage calculator as a move with variable base power, akin to Low Kick or Water Spout. As a result, like Low Kick or Water Spout, when the BP of those moves is 60 or below, Technician can activate. However, this is NOT the case for Grassy Terrain-weakened Ground-type attacks. For example, a Hitmontop's Technician EQ in Grassy Terrain versus 252 HP Arcanine, according to the damage calculator, would get the boost and deal this damage:

Note that these rolls are for single battles at level 50.
252+ Atk Technician Hitmontop Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Arcanine in Grassy Terrain: 92-110 (46.7 - 55.8%)
(92, 94, 94, 96, 96, 98, 100, 100, 102, 102, 104, 104, 106, 106, 108, 110)

However, this Battle Video demonstrates Earthquake not getting the Technician boost, resulting in a set of these rolls: RSGG-WWWW-WWW6-ELVN

252+ Atk Hitmontop Earthquake vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Arcanine in Grassy Terrain: 62-74 (31.4 - 37.5%)
(62, 62, 64, 64, 64, 66, 66, 68, 68, 68, 70, 70, 70, 72, 72, 74)

The Battle Video demonstrates this expected range.

I have been unable to pinpoint the location of where the Ground-halving effect should be taking place from personal testing. If I had to guess, I would say it would be either with the other Terrain modifiers (which in the damage calculator is immediately following Doubles spread damage reduction and weather), or as a separate base power modifier with others such as Helping Hand, Sheer Force, Analytic, etc. If someone who knows how to locate and navigate the damage formula could confirm this, that'd be awesome (also if someone is willing to update the Gen 5 guide to the damage formula / write a new one, you'd be an amazing person).

As an aside, if someone could confirm where the 1/4 damage interaction of Z-moves into Protect occurs, that'd also be amazing.
 
Siggu said:
Spectral Thief is a really weird move, stealing stats in ways it would normally be prevented, the stats theft not working like Heart Swap...
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It basically acts like a targeted Haze that does damage, and boosts your stats instead of resetting them.

Speaking of Spectral Thief, I can also confirm it boosts your stats by the number of boosts stolen, rather than by boosting you to your opponents level
i.e. +2 Attack Marshadow attacking +1 Attack whatever becomes +3 Attack Marshadow.

Spectral Thief is completely overpowered and I LOVE IT.
 
Given how odd Spectral Thief works... what happens if Marshadow has a stat at -1 and at the same time the opponent has that same stat at +1 when Marshadow uses Spectral Thief? Does it get to +0 or +1?
 
If feint targets a pokemon with dazzling/queenly majesty, will it break the protection of that pokemon or will it fail? What if a pokemon with Dazzling/Queenly Majesty uses wide guard and the partner is hit by feint, does that break protection for both pokemon on the field? I can't seem to find any information regarding new feint mechanics.
 
Mijzelffan said:
If feint targets a pokemon with dazzling/queenly majesty, will it break the protection of that pokemon or will it fail? What if a pokemon with Dazzling/Queenly Majesty uses wide guard and the partner is hit by feint, does that break protection for both pokemon on the field? I can't seem to find any information regarding new feint mechanics.
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http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7customgame-559461560

Both dazzling and queen's majesty block feint.

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7doublescustomgame-559465230

It's also blocked even if another mon is targeted in doubles
 
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urkerab said:
Is there any way of telling whether a Steel/Poison type would remove toxic spikes on switch-in? (Current Showdown! code doesn't remove them, but this poster was surprised by that behaviour.)
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I did a bit of testing around with this to see why it didn't remove them. I first tested to see if it was due to the type changing after the effect of any hazards were applied, but it was applied before so that wasn't the issue. I then tried it with a pokemon that was initially immune and changed it type to poison+not steel, in this case ground, and they absorbed them.

I think its something actually to do with the mons immunity acting before, so due to it being immune to toxic spikes they don't act or effect the mon meaning that it can't absorb them; that's at least what I think unless someone with a rom hack can help?

Also apologies for the double post :x
 
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Yogibears said:
It does still bounce them, but they don't effect the user if the user was a dark type due to it still being counted as priority.
http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7ou-561628036
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This is actually a bug; if one reads the OP of this thread, one sees that this has been tested in-game, and the only time a bounced move will be considered Prankster-boosted is if the bouncer is a Prankster mon that used Magic Coat.
 
PursuitOfHappiny said:
Idk if this issue has been brought up yet but apparently Moltres still resists fighting after using Burn Up and Roost. Is this a bug?

http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/gen7customgame-563609084
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It should deal super-effective damage.

After Burn Up, Moltres should turn into pure Flying, not ???/Flying. After Roost, it should become a Normal-type.

(Although now that I think of it, it's such a specific situation it's better to check in cartridge. Someone with a Moltres to check this?)
 
Afaik Moltres should take neutral damage from fighting type attacks after Roost, because Roost doesn't turn the user into a normal type, it just makes them losing the flying type, so that the pokemon effectively is ??? type after Roost instead of Flying.

In this metronome battle http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/rom-gen7arceusmetronomebattle-85657 the opponent rolled Shell Trap and it "fired" instantly instead of setting the trap first. Is this how it works on the cartridge?
 
If Copycat is used by a Pokemon with Prankster (e.g. Liepard) on an opposing Dark-type Pokemon, and the move called is an attacking move, does the move fail?
 
Delta 2777 said:
If Copycat is used by a Pokemon with Prankster (e.g. Liepard) on an opposing Dark-type Pokemon, and the move called is an attacking move, does the move fail?
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Yes, any time any move is called by the status move of a Prankster Pokemon, all priority-immune targets and Dark-types will be immune to that move, even if it's an attack move. This includes Assist, Copycat, Nature Power, Sleep Talk, etc., and even Magic Coat.
 
ok so quirky question, but this is something that **kind of** pertains to dou so I want to ask it

In gens 5 and 6, once a pokemon reached insanely high speeds, they bypassed trick room and went first no matter what. In bw the exact speed stat where the bug started to occur was 1809, and it seems the exact number was never discovered in oras, all though it seems to start somewhere between 1776 and 3552 according to bughouse's math. I just want to know if this is still a thing in SuMo, more for proper mechanics sake then due to it affecting competitive play.

gen 6 post for more info: http://www.smogon.com/forums/threads/battle-mechanics-research.3489239/page-52#post-5212167

also tagging Marty since he was the one who helped find the mech last gen n_n
 
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