Mario Kart Mafia (NOC) END: VILLAGE WINS

[Celever]

So you're either a lying mafia or Barty just wanted to stay in the game longer so he claimed a power role, I am still very much inclined to go for the former so I would like, well pretty much exactly what Houndoomsday said (gee, thanks for the ninjask). Explain barty's behavious fully please.

 

[Acklow]

i would like you to attempt to explain barty's behavior in addition to your scumreads, why did he act so irrationally?

Honestly give me time... ><. I'm at work right now on my iPad and its not like I can type out a to;dr on that without you guys grinding questions. I know the position I am in, so I don't need you all bandwagoning on me when there's already an. entire page devoted to calling Barty out. Expect a response in a few hours. tyvm

 

[Acklow]

*tl;dr... autocorrect ftw...

 

[Spiffy]

I'd really like more votes on Celever until he stops ignoring me. Did I miss a response that answered all my questions? Like wtf

 

[Aura Guardian]

I had stuff that needed doing, and couldn't concentrate on this. Now, time for Metal Sonic and Marquis/Snaquaza, and their interactions with barty the beetle.

@Metal Sonic
Steps down from doing the "#1 scumhunter" thing because the host ordered him not to. Then he sets himself against Marquis for pretending to have Metal Sonic's play style. Or something like that. Then he encourages Celever and hints that Celever is acting scummy. From glances at Celever's posts... I sort of agree. However, at this point, I'm suspicious (slightly) of him. He later makes some reads (see below). After that, he calls out Houndoomsday for misrepresenting what MS cannot do per host order.

Metal Sonic Interactions
In response to stepping down, barty gives MS credit for past games. After I'm suspicious of him, he posts seven reads: Marquis scum, me null, and barty null-town among them. Later drops barty to null-scum, and is read as slightly town by barty. Next, drops barty to scummy, and sets himself against barty later.
Conclusion: Productive member of the game, and ... I'm gonna say slightly town for now. If barty/Acklow is town (not likely
--------------------------------------

@Marquis / @Snaquaza
Kicks off RVS with a slightly controversial strategy, then demands that I RVS, too (... going over this is getting a little repetitive, don't you think?). Then Marquis goes on a lengthy reply to nearly everyone, including me (btw, the main follow-up was if you stood by the Jalmont scum claim, instead of admitting it was a joke. And the results spoke for themselves, so the follow-up for that half would have been stupid on my part). Later sets himself against the Jalmont wagon. Upon Snaquaza subbing, does lots of summaries to understand what's happening.

Marquis/Snaquaza Interactions
barty says that Marquis might be inexperienced or trying to clean himself by acting that way in response to the controversial RVS, then later says he could be mafia or village. When replying en mass, he declares that he thinks barty is acting scummy. barty then continues in what I think should be dubbed "player commentator" role, which... ugh. barty has been voted by Marquis by this time. After Metal Sonic's reads, he posts a chunk of stuff asking Metal Sonic to... step it up? and barty to not be defeatist and is a bit indecisive regarding whether the last one there means scummy or new.
Conclusion: Outspoken enough to be leaning town, unless barty/Acklow is SOMEHOW village.

Also, @Solar Vapor has not yet come close to defending himself to my satisfaction. However, gonna say FoS on Celever for that recent post.

Ultimate conclusion from this: I've mentioned I think barty/Acklow is scum, right? Yes, I have. But I suppose his sub, Acklow, should be given a better chance to defend himself.

One of these days, I should go through the entire thread to scumread everyone, only concise instead of elaborate.

 

[Snaquaza]

okay, srry for late, but something terrible just happened (well it is for me), so I might not get my reads done today, I hope I can give them tomorrow though

 

[Acklow]

Ok, so let's get the show on the road. (this is a tl;dr, so have fun reading!!~)

Let me begin with this premise:

Day 1 in most NOCs, especially on Smogon as of late, have been filled with the MOST AMOUNT OF BRAIN DAMAGE I HAVE EVER SEEN.

That's right folks, brain damage. Retardedness. Idiocy.

And no, I'm not directing this at those who enjoyed their short time of RVS, trolling most of those who wanted to take the game seriously, but the ones who actually took those trolls seriously. I'm looking directly at you Celever. The first person who in all of the game called Marquais out for troll voting by saying he was noob mafia trying to force a lynch. SERIOUSLY? Like, SERIOUSLY? Are you that dense? It is blatantly obvious that everybody up to your first post, was in fact, trolling and jerking around. I'm sorry to drop the ball on you, but from here on out I will prove that you overreact to a lot of things. Mind you I still like you as a person, but god damn you can be dense. In other words: STOP TRYING SO HARD.

I applaud Spiffy for seriously trying to defend the RVSers, but honestly you could've just straight up told Celever she was being trolled.

Barty post numero uno:

I have to say, both Spiffy and Celever here has a point.
Like Celever said, it is visible that Marquis either has little experience with a mafia game, or is acting like a idiot to either clean or keep him safe (Yes, I read most of that games post a few days ago, Metal Sonic, and I am looking at you...). I also agree that ALL of this wild, mostly unreasoned voting is in some ways only helping the Bowser Boys through causing a feeling of subspicion in all of us. The fact that we also use grudges from previous mafia games as a reason to put lynch votes on people is, in my honest opinion, completely brainless. Of course, we might get lucky, but I still think we should think this through, even though it causes the risk of the Bowser Boys to eliminate some of our members.

That said, Spiffy also has a point in that by not using our votes, we lose our "most powerful tool", and that by only providing suspicion on one target or no target at all (even though it is reasoned), it can be seen that the person doing this could most likely be attempting to have us Mario Crew not do any sort of action before we have agreed on one single target, and that this agreement could be manipulated by the BB in order to get a member of the MC mistakenly lynched day one.

However, seeing as I have not played for a LONG time (extra emphasis on long), and that I have only played one previous mafia game (where I actually got handed a possible win if I survived :D) I don't consider myself as skilled at reading people as some of the others in this game is. Although I do consider Marquis as a possible BB, I'm not going to use my lynch vote yet, until we have more information.

Honestly nothing suspicious or unusual here. Barty just pointing out the truths in two disagreeing players' statements. I think he honestly also is very dense and couldn't tell that there was much tomfoolery going about with the RVSers. Let me establish here that Barty's play is that of a noobie. He has never played in an NOC afaik on Smogon, so I will not be easy on his posts, even though I'm subbing in for him. He will show in the content in most of his posts a sort of vagueness and overgeneralization that makes him look scummy. However, it's the overreactions of players that turn him into the prime suspect. Let's continue (oh it get's good):

Ok Metal, I'll give you credit for attempting your strongest to help the town eliminating all mafia in the previous games, no matter how odd the method has been.
And I agree. You have done a good effort in the past, especially in the RNG mafia (only mentioned because it is the one I read for fun), even though the fact that it could be hard for the rest of the town to understand your true intensions.
Also, the fact that you mentioned this, made me think twice about Marquais. He could, like belived by some, be a BB, but he could just as easily be a member of the MC, who wants to get something done. Anyway, I hope you get treated better for what you have done in the future Metal. And sorry for calling you out as an example in my first post.
Now, let's do what we can, both as a team and as individuals, to eliminate these BBs.

BtB just complimenting MS (in the beginning). It could be viewed as buddying, but I think if you look at it from a noob's perspective, he's just giving MS respect for MS's efforts in previous games (as much as I personally disliked MS's playstyle in those games and felt that they caused mucho brain damage). Now about the Marquis thing - I think I already established that BtB is dense. He was calling Marquais out for the RVS. Honestly the wording in this post is just annoying the heck out of me right now. Next!!

Of course, I can actually understand why you see my "passive backseat cheerleading" as an efficient attempt of, if I was a BB, to both clean myself and attempt to provide someone who ties the town together, and therefore leading into a role which makes it easier for a possible BB to both survive until the end and as a result, win while nobody actually would suspect me of being a BB. Of course, this is all hypothetical. The main difference between this and the truth is that I read nowhere in my role PM of being a BB.
Another of the primary reasons you have written for the suspicion against me is how I've not done "any interactions or pro-town actions of his own", and although the fact that my only mafia experiences are through the underground mafia and the StarCraft 2 custom game Mafia, I've not done much such attempts to make any sort of alinment analysis before. However, as an attempt to put my perspective on what I can see from the posts currently made, I will do my best to make one.
@Marquis: You did make the first post today, and with the clear intention of initiating either a mass vote on a single person, or to initiate a RVS. Based on your later posts (by this, I mean the WoT above this), I see that a RVS was your goal, and you did manage to make your view on the major posts until now visible. You have gone a bit defensive after the RVS-noobiness, but I honestly consider you a MC, although this is a noobs analysis.
@Houndoomsday: You have, in my opinion, made a strong vote early in order to attempt to get more information from Marquis, which has in its own ways provided some reading that I believe to be strong. All in all, I think that your posts do not show any BB traits as of yet, but as stated earlier, I'm a noob at this and its still early in the game.
I might not have made the most detailed analysis, and it is still early in the game, but I have decided to agree with you all. Making minor votes to be lifted after a response that can aid in providing more information on individuals seems to be a plausible solution at this point in the game. The people I'd like to have a response from would be Solar Vapor and FireMage. As Houndoomsday has already provided a pressure based vote on Solar Vapor, I'll go ahead and vote FireMage, I'd like to hear what you say.
Finally, for all of you who think this might be a suspicious, sudden switch of my initial attitude, I'm still gonna provide a supportive role for us MC, but as stated above, we also need more opinional statements. I'm only trying to help us as a group.

1st Paragraph and 2nd Paragraph...um...no comment. Honestly this is an extremely nooby/scummy pgraph. If you look at it from an "oh this guy is scummy point of view," then that will be prime rib with A1 sauce right there. However, note this: he has only been in 2 mafias in the past, Underground Mafia (which was a multifaction Standard game with OC) and some StarCraft 2 Mafia which was probably on another forum. In other words, HE HAS NO EXPERIENCE WITH NOC. This guy spouts walls of crap, and expects to be understood. Unfortunately if you don't know what you're talking about, it's all fluff in the end. Sorry BtB, but you need to work on your posts. Haha.

He starts calling users out starting with Marquais (learn to spell the username right dude). Honestly there's little to no content in this stuff other than him speculating on the "strength" of votes and posts. Well fuck man, I think we got ourselves a winner here. The best part is in paragraph 5 after calling out other users. "but I have decided to agree with you all." WELL THEN. I think that speaks for itself right there... Man, I'm almost regret having to sub in for this guy. The pressure vote imo is ok. So no qualms about that. Well anyways let's keep going (this, by the way, will be the best part):

By noob, I'm referring to myself.
I do see the point in what you say, and in fact, you're right. When it comes to the wording in my previous posts, I have been a bit of a idiot. And although I can easily claim to be a part of the MC, the only people sure are myself and eagle. My posts, made to attempt to unite the MC, have had the effect on you that it seems as a nooby attempt to clean myself from suspision. If someone like you, who seem to not have that many games of experience just by looking at your postcount, believes the latter to be the true story, what will then a skilled mafia player think? Of course, the posts are out. I made a mistake which can cause me to be mislynched at day 1. All because of the same reasoning you placed in your last posts.
Why, did you ask? Because I happen to be a noob, and as a result, I used the inclusive vocabulary in a way that made my position suspicious. Perhaps it would be smarter to go the "full short sentence noob way", although I'm sure it would make people like you suspect that I used it to copy from previous games, in order to clean myself.
If you consider me a BB, then go ahead. I've already done the damage to myself, and now all attempts of my trying to prove my innocence to you would only help increase the suspicion. Of course I can't claim a certain role, but I'll tell you this: If you lynch me, you will regret it.
However, if you don't lynch me, I will do my best in order to help the MC win this game. Trust me, I hope to win this just as much as you do.
I know I'm not providing any sort of direct proof that I should not be lynched, but trust me on this one; I made a mistake, and all I ask for is a second chance, which can in turn lead to a positive effect on the MC.
EDIT: I'm to go to bed now. I'll be back in about 10 hours, so please don't lynch me by then.

P1: mang I don't even know. I don't even know. First he admits he's a fool. Then he attempts to belittle Marquais (who btw, I believe to be an experienced Mafia player judging by most of his posts even with his trolling taken into account) by pointing out the guy's post count LOL. He tries to explain that he sucks at wording things and speculates what would happen if he played by only typing out one-liners. Probably wouldn't be L-2 for sure if he refrained from trying to so hard.

P2: Ok, this is the best part. He says that he can't go back on what he's said in the past. This is true. He made himself an idiot. Question is, will he continue doing so? Well let's see:

"Of course I can't claim a certain role, but I'll tell you this: If you lynch me, you will regret it."

Ok. Here's the problem. The ambiguous wording. He's pretty much just restating the rules here:

11. You cannot reveal your role name (character) or any flavour which would imply your role name. You can, however, reveal your ability.

"Well that still doesn't mean he didn't just soft-claim." Well actually it doesn't mean anything! Here's why: he is a noob. He blatantly states that he is village in one of his earlier posts. I honestly don't understand what his rationale was, but he just does. Considering this, he says that if he gets lynched you, the people who are reading this post, would regret lynching him. This is because he's village. Nothing wrong with that right? No, but the problem is not in the fact that he says this, it is how he says it. "If you lynch me, you will regret it." Well tickle me pink and hand me a pickle, he just threatened everyone in the game right? That must mean he's a power role right? OBVIOUSLY. /insert sarcasm. Being new, his understanding is, is that if he dies, he loses. He doesn't want to lose. Nobody does. But he says he's village, so in the purposes of benefitting the village he says this. I honestly can't see why he would say this if he was mafia other than the fact that he wants to cover his ass. Does he look that smart that he would do such a thing? I don't think so.

Ok so I'm done ragging on him for now. I think I've done enough to prove that he is an idiot. An honest and kind, but absolutely stupid idiot (yes this is me being redundant and beating a dead horse into the ground). I don't think that if he was mafia that he would draw so much attention without anyone of his mafia buddies helping him out early on. Which, if you look into everybody's post in this thread, there is not a soul that looks to be helping the poor guy out. So now that I've established his stupidity, let's go onto the main course. Yup this was only an appetizer:

.
Barty the beetle posts like someone incredibly new to mafia, and I'd think that someone who had been in at least one NOC mafia or even read one before would understand how important the use of votes is at ALL stages of the game. Keeping this in mind, I would heavily suggest that everyone in this game who has not played/read NOC before should read an NOC game to get an idea of how the village should operate. That means you, FireMage. Of course, Mafia have been winning NOC games recently, but that's another matter.
barty actually does look scummy to me because he keeps asserting himself as MC but "no one can be sure of that", and he then goes on to heavily emphasize how new he is and closes with "go ahead and lynch me" -- and says vaguely that we'll regret it. This looks like a vague power role claim to me, and I have to say that if I were in his position with a power role, I would definitely avoid pulling the power role card until there was a great deal more lynch pressure--or I'd run the risk of calling attention to myself from the mafia and getting nightkilled. (Just like how I got nightkilled night 1 of RNG NOC v_v) He also seems overly intent on justifying what he's doing when he's not checking the thread.

This guy. Alright, I scan the whole thread up until I reach this post. And this is the first person who mention BtB being a power role. Alrighty then. BtB didn't EVEN SAY HE WAS A POWER ROLE. Why is it that you automatically assume that BtB is a power role? Is it based on what he said? I think that if it wasn't blatantly obvious BtB was a noob, then you would realize the guy was just restating the rules. Unless you tl;dred it just like most other players in this game. Sure you say it's looks like a "vague power role claim," so I won't nag you there. In fact you only brought the idea up, so I won't get on your case any further. The problem is that other players jumped on this idea and so hey now we have a bandwagon on a person who didn't even claim power role.

I just hope Barty isn't a power role since I can realistically see him getting lynched today.

I swear, you better be kidding me. This is the 2nd post that falsely assumes that Barty could be PR. Why? Nothing has been said about him being so thus far. Also considering the fact that nothing in the signups thread or in the rules state that the roles were randomized can we explicitly expect him to have been assigned to a PR.

Barty post more and don't be so defeatist, that hurts the game regardless of alignment. Granted it could be seen as new instead of just plain scummy, but I feel you should be defending yourself a bit more as town
Woodchuck's vote on Barty was pretty opportunistic though calling for more pressure with already a few votes on him especially given the fact that he's even deliberately presenting himself to the game as an easy lynch

Someone who speaks my language. Thank God this guy had the guts to say this. Woodchuck's vote is uncalled for. Although BtB presents himself as a noob, which Woodchuck acknowledges at first, it does not mean he's lynch-worthy. Oh sure he has a sucky defense, but honestly doesn't mean he's scum. Woodchuck does a 180 turn after saying that BtB is a noob and is making risky plays, then he goes on to lynch BtB, starting this whole situation with BtB becoming L2.

Just saying, but barty appears to be a similar time znoe to me judging from what time he went to bed 2 days ago, and he said he would check out CAP, ASB and minecraft before checking back here. This means he either forgot about this game or was lurking, but I don't think anyone can play minecraft for 8+ hours...

You jest.

"Get your final questions in the next 45 minutes!"
"Actually nvm I'll answer them in like 8 hours"
This just seems like he wants to ask his mafia buddies how to answer this. Unvote Blackhawk, Lynch Jalmont.
@Blackhawk11 please give an honest read on Jalmont, assessing him etc..
@barty the beetle Your posts right now are absolute BS. You are the only person in this game everyone has decided you are scummy, except for.. Aura Guardian and FireMage in the least. Something to note is Spiffy early in the game, where he says "barty is my most confident town read!" where Solar Vapor rightly pointed out that he makes Spiffy look good but then not using the adivce Spiffy said. The other two people I noted are simply inactive. I mentioned Aura Guardian because the only time he mentions Barty is to say "I agree with the claims but don't vote him" and that is it. I am going to say here though, giving a list of reads where every result is null or null-town except for a bandwagon is: 1) Absolutely useless and 2) It makes you seem like you have no idea what is going on -- you'd like that, wouldn't you.
I may post more tomorrow/a drink etc.

Bitch please. He told the truth, albeit ever so slightly. He was done in like 20-30 min and you posted 40 minutes after he said he was signing off in 45. You can't expect everyone in the game to be a tryhard like you. You posted walls of text attempting to "create a positive self-image." Give me a break. Not too mention you try to put buddy Spiffy with BtB just because he mentioned barty EARLY IN THE GAME. And then you state the obvious: "2) It makes you seem like you have no idea what is going on..." Well no shit Sherlock. He doesn't. He's a noob and made some seriously stupid moves. So it'd be no wonder he doesn't know what's going on.

Anyways, most of the posts onward are either bandwagon votes or posts about other players. Up until a few posts and then this one:

I'd prefer that Barty doesn't go to L-1, actually. If he's mafia, he might just self-hammer and deprive us of discussion.

Well please. Since I'm subbing in for the poor fella, should I just self-hammer? I can do that for you if you'd like. It'd put me out of my own misery for having to sub into a game filled with brain damage (bar some experienced players like Spiffy and A_G). And then this happens:

Ok, including what I mentined above, it seems I'm, for now at least, just a vanilla villager.

GDI. He's done it yet again. The guy just doesn't know how to read. If it wasn't for the fact that roles can't publically be posted I would be damned if I couldn't turn this around just by straight up quoting Eagle4. There is NOTHING in my role PM that even states that there's a chance of anything changing. I swear, this is like watching Scary Movie 4, it's that bad. Maybe I COULD bring out the popcorn and just sit by as I get lynched.

Basically he is saying he is useless until later in the game. He also says he doesn't know how to act under pressure, but if you don't say anything why would we not lynch you? Say something and it might clean yourself, otherwise we could lose an important role. And besides, just tell us what your role is, if it is a good role and if we have a safeguard he will probably protect you from a night kill.

Ok, you caught me. I'm a power role. /sarcasm. Seriously, he never explicitly said he was a PR. But your first statement is true (sort of). He/I is/am useless until I take over for this moron and prove he's clean. At this point BtB has dug his/my own grave so deep you would need more than just a ladder to get me out. Thankfully my irl job deals with climbing on roofs all the time so I know how to get around heights.

Oh my God I can not believe people are endorsing putting a claimed power role at L-1.

My thoughts exactly, except I'm not a PR. I'm vanilla. GG.

Inb4 more tryhards pester me with questions.

Alright. I think this is enough for my /rant.

Time to /endrant.

 

[Acklow]

Gawd damn that is a wall of text. I feel bad for posting that much.

 

[Acklow]

Fuck I'm starting to sound like Yeti.

 

[Acklow]

Man I hate to keep posting but self-reflection moment here: I must sound like a complete jerk so I apologize if I sound condescending but honestly some of you need to wake up and smell the coffee.

 

[Spiffy]

@Acklow what do you think of @Celever? Do you think it is scummy that he has ignored my questions I'm post #159 (I think it's that one) even after I reminded him several times. Same question for @Jalmont, @Snaquaza, and @Houndoomsday.

 

[Snaquaza]

Spiffy, I am giving scumreads on everyone tomorrow, first it would be today, but for me something terrible happened (although it might not be terrible for others)

 

[Acklow]

You mean

This post?

Sure I can answer your question. I honestly find that scummy. This is why:

@Spiffy Yes I was using "you" subjectively as the whole town.
Something I find interesting is you say that lynching is the most valuable tool, and NOW you want to be cautious with it. i understand (now ;)) that it was RVS earlier but still.
Maybe people aren't responding to me as they can't find anything overly wrong with me, I don't know why you are looking into m posts so much but not looking as much at other people. Give reads on Houndoomsday, Aura Guardian, Jalmont and Blackhawk please. Obviously you think that former 3 are town because you asked for reads, but go more in-depth please.
If you don't mind me asking why are you focusing on me for this game?
Let's have a think why I voted you... because I find you scummy, because I am responding to you and seeing scumminess in the post? I meant to vote you in the above post, that was pretty clear. Tell me if you want me to respond to anything else, I think I covered everything.

Ok, so my issue here is that although she brings up a good point in that you did say that lynching is a valuable tool, the problem with her reasoning is that she is getting it all twisted. It's BECAUSE it is a valuable tool that you need to be cautious about lynching. Now that's an issue most definitely and it doesn't mean she's scum just based on that. What's scummy in this whole post is that she feels cornered by your constant prodding of her. Yes I would be too. I'm sure anyone would be. But the problem is that she doesn't provide a sufficient response. It's like she's dodging the question here. Now mind you this is an earlier post but if you look later on, the same logic follows through. She questions why Spiffy keeps prodding her. Spiffy asks her some reasonable questions. And then to top it all off, after putting her vote on Spiffy (which happened before these shenanigans begin), she posts this:

Actually you know what, I'm just going to accept the flip-flop and say that I handled the pressure badly and started accusing you of things that you didn't really do. Unlynch Spiffy

Honestly? I just read the next few pages and all I see are one-liners and constant pressure on BtB. Nothing that answers your questions at all. I'm sorry @Spiffy that you had to be ignored. I really am.

And for anyone who thinks this is buddying, this is just me answering what Spiffy's question was. I personally will provide my own scumreads when I actually have the time to sit down and sift through what little gold there is in this massive pile of garbage.

 

[Acklow]

Oh you know what, I don't know who BtB voted. Just in case, I'll Unvote for now to be safe.

 

[Snaquaza]

I thought it was Fire Mage, but not 100% sure

 

[cxinlee]

Right now I cant confirm about barty being mafia so I'll unvote

 

[Acklow]

Why do you insist that he is a "claimed power role" when 1. It's a softclaim 2. Its vague 3. He later says he's a vanilla villager?


I personally surmise that he's a vanilla villager with one of those silly items that you get in the Mario Kart boxes and we're being led on a wild goose chase here.

Just read this post. GDI Metal Sonic you are psychic. I think my opinion of you is rapidly starting to shift towards a positive view.

 

[Houndoomsday]

spiffy you already asked me this a couple of pages ago, but ill answer you again because obviously stuff is changing. i feel like you are tunneling celever (though i cant really talk though- but please bear with me, this is my first game)

bigass post

im just going to analyze both of you since #159 onwards. so 159 is obviously you calling him out, etc, etc. then, celevers first response is already suspicious imo. he basically says "sorry spiffy cant answer", then throws in "barty is vigilante". this obviously is going to divert attention from his lack of answers, and it worked well. then celever is back on in post 179 and sort of explains his vigilante assumption (not well, but celever is pretty damn noob and his answer was more stupid than anything else imo). then he adds a bunch of fluff asking barty what his ability was and telling me why we didnt need a vote. which contributes nothing. at all. then celever promises spiffy answers yay! rofl then right after celever posts about barty tunneling us when he is the main culprit. so not really helping the village. unvoting spiffy under some flimsy stuff and tries to avoid questions. then doesnt even put his money where his mouth is when he does put l-1 on barty until me and ms put some slight pressure on him. after than tunnels barty some more. then spiffy comes in and starts whining about putting a pr claim at l-1 and honestly i think thats a bit scummy. if mafia hammers then we might lose a power role but we get a basically confirmed lynch d2, and losing a noob pr isnt the end of the world. celever comes in with another signature one line answer.

now then spiffy comes up with a very scummy post #198. im going to post a couple of the sentences i found strange.

Anyway, this barty lynch has been handled very poorly. I understand that it is mostly his fault for being so vague about his role, but a lot of us have tunneled barty so hard that there exists pretty much no other lynch option. What happens when he claims? Everyone will unvote and we'll be back to square one.

this is what stood out to me the most. he claims and yes we all unvote. but square 1? hell no! we get a claim to analyze, tons of posts about barty to analyze, etc etc. we have an UNLIMITED DEADLINE. An experienced player like you of all people should know that. in addition, having 2 votes on 6 players will not even be close to the pressure of 6 votes on one player. however you did a good job of recognizing and attempting to stop tunneling, so im not going to say that excerpt was super scummy or anything, but it set off a couple of bells.

bullying someone to vote for someone else doesn't sit well with me and doesn't seem village-motivated.

rofl is bullying saying "there is no risk at putting him at l-1"? because that seems like quite an exaggeration. then again this is probably just OMGUS, but please it was not close to bullying.

damn 1 page down

page 5: spiffy again is a tad scummy #205. just because you think someone is probably vanillager doesnt mean you shouldnt stop putting pressure on them... again an experienced player should mean a d1 vote does not mean you want them to lynch... celever does a couple more posts (re: barty), but they dont have much content as usual, bringing up items is kind of distracting but somewhat productive i guess (just a sidenote my role references something i will assume are items but doesnt give much info at all). spiffy posts again, but its just "celever answer me". i get that you want him to answer but in the meantime you arent helping the village. beyond a couple paragraph length posts you dont contribute anything to the village this page. rofl celever does a couple more 1-liners about barty, not helping at all. then answers woodchuck in a very cop-out answer (im indecisive!!!!). seems like a scum answer... then celever bitches at barty some more. spiffy still hasnt posted much and goes "i agree w/jalmont", which seems lazy.

page 6 is boring but spiffy just bitches and celever bitches.


here are condensed reads of you two and your interactions:

celever: you have definitely had time. you post at pretty much all the times of the day. if you spend 10 minutes a question for spiffy thats less than an hour, and you obviously have spent at least an hour posting itt (though your posts dont really reflect that tbh). your refusal to answer spiffy is worrying and i have to think thats scummy. on your obsession with barty i dont have as much of a problem, unlimited deadlines mean that sort of behavior is pretty acceptable and i have to agree with your reads (except the jalmont barty me thing, still makes no sense tbh)

spiffy: i know you want celever to answer your questions. that doesnt mean you dont have to stop helping the village. in addition you dont really talk much about the main topic, barty, except to complain about him being l-1 which because im reading barty as scum is suspicious, but i mean you have been contributing some. overall im going to read slightly scum but that could easily change. also the fact this is the second time you have tagged me and other people to whine about celever not answering is a little offputting but it was like 3 days ago so im probably just reading too far into this lol

@cxinlee hey man! :) :) :)

@all if someone reminds me/wants me to, ill post reads on everyone tomorrow, dont feel like doing it at all.

also i just got back from 6 hours of watching a powerpoint. i am absolutely frazzled. if anything in this doesnt make sense just tag me and ask me to explain, i dont feel like proofing this or anything.

 

[cxinlee]

@Houndoomsday hi :)

@Metal Sonic: Says that he gives up being #1 scumhunter in the beginning, and says hes going to be extra lame and ordinary. Puts pressure on jalmont by voting him, but withdraws and votes barty because he thinks jalmont's defense was good and barty was really suspicious. Right now it's almost impossible for me to tell his role, so right now he is null for me.

@marquis/@snaquaza: Most of their posts weren't exactly pro-town. Same applied to snaquaza, his "scumread" post was more of a summary of what happened and didn't actually give any ideas of who the mafia could be. Now he suspects me, but doesn't seem to have a reason for it. I cant get solid evidence that he is a bowser boy, I think he is null mafia for now.

 

[Woodchuck]

Unvote
Good to have a fresh pair of eyes and someone who isn't a complete greenhorn. I guess I did start the bandwagon on barty? I can't deny that I was the first one to interpret "lynch me and you'll regret it" as a softclaim, but I honestly thought that no one could possibly be so stupid as to word their sentence like that and NOT expect people to read it as a softclaim. It's a shame barty didn't respond to the pressure and instead subbed out, but I guess we can have someone who actually posts with reason so we're not confusing "noob town" with "scum". I'm still not totally convinced but we've (read, I've) neglected reading other people so moving on from BtB / Acklow would be a good idea for now.

@Houndoomsday was Spiffy really tunneling Celever? Celever's been dodging Spiffy's questions the whole time, and since the last page or so has basically been Celever dodging and barty johning, there wasn't much to miss by tunnelling. I think. I'll try and go back and read but I've been a bit pressed for time lately. Celever is also the scummiest person in the game to me right now, so I'm still waiting on him to post.
Vote Celever

 

[Spiffy]

this is what stood out to me the most. he claims and yes we all unvote. but square 1? hell no! we get a claim to analyze, tons of posts about barty to analyze, etc etc. we have an UNLIMITED DEADLINE. An experienced player like you of all people should know that. in addition, having 2 votes on 6 players will not even be close to the pressure of 6 votes on one player. however you did a good job of recognizing and attempting to stop tunneling, so im not going to say that excerpt was super scummy or anything, but it set off a couple of bells.

What do you mean by analyzing "posts about barty"? I mean yeah, we have all of the posts that are in the thread to work off of, but that's not what I meant by "back to square 1". There could have been so much more going on while the barty wagon was occurring. So many players were focusing on the barty fiasco and no one was pressuring anyone else, so we wouldn't have (and don't have) any other reactions under pressure to analyze because no one has really felt the pressure of multiple votes on them other than barty and Celever. And what is there to analyze about a claim? Sure, we can speculate on whether it's true, but I sure as hell would not be willing to lynch anyone that claimed a power role so early unless there was a counter claim. I understand that we have an unlimited deadline, but I, and I'm sure several other players, don't want this game to last forever, so while you're right that we have as much time as we want and waste any, I don't want to be on Day 1 forever.

rofl is bullying saying "there is no risk at putting him at l-1"? because that seems like quite an exaggeration. then again this is probably just OMGUS, but please it was not close to bullying.

The "bullying" was more directed at Metal Sonic, sorry for the confusion.

page 5: spiffy again is a tad scummy #205. just because you think someone is probably vanillager doesnt mean you shouldnt stop putting pressure on them... again an experienced player should mean a d1 vote does not mean you want them to lynch...

If Metal Sonic thinks a player is a vanillager, Metal Sonic should not be voting for that player. Especially after barty the beetle seemed to think he had responded to everyone's wishes ("for now I'm a vanillager"). I pointed that out because I thought it could be a scum slip. And there was plenty of pressure on barty at that time so that's no excuse to be voting for someone you think is a vanillager. Keep in mind that was all Metal Sonic even did; nothing about his scumreads or reads of anyone else other than barty.

spiffy posts again, but its just "celever answer me". i get that you want him to answer but in the meantime you arent helping the village. beyond a couple paragraph length posts you dont contribute anything to the village this page.

There was only one post where I solely posted to get Celever to respond to me, but it was an effort to keep everyone aware that Celever was ignoring me purposefully, which is obviously anti-town. It was frustrating that so many people said "yeah Celever does seem scummy" but did nothing to act on it and let him continue ignoring my questions that I kept reminding him of. I guess I should have said that?

spiffy still hasnt posted much and goes "i agree w/jalmont", which seems lazy.

When did I agree with Jalmont? I actually did the opposite; Calling him out for not posting when his head wasn't on the chopping block.

in addition you dont really talk much about the main topic, barty, except to complain about him being l-1 which because im reading barty as scum is suspicious, but i mean you have been contributing some.

I will not encourage the tunnelling on someone who I thought had claimed a power role (I did not anticipate his apparent idiocy). I didn't find him too suspicious other than the fact he was being so vague about his claim, which I attributed to the fact that he didn't understand what everyone wanted from him due to his newness. Although I shouldn't have excused this behavior for that reason alone, so you're right in a sense.

also the fact this is the second time you have tagged me and other people to whine about celever not answering is a little offputting but it was like 3 days ago so im probably just reading too far into this lol

I tagged you because like I said, many people pointed out Celever's scumminess but went right back to shifting your focus barty, who I thought had claimed a power role at the time. I thought that was odd.

Regarding @Acklow's explanation and his claim that he is not a power role, I can say that I was not expecting that! However, I don't see mafian Acklow contradicting what everyone thought of barty when it would just be easier to claim a power role and have a basically 100% chance of surviving the day bar any counter claim. So at the moment I believe his story, and I look forward to his list of reads!

Tagging @Jalmont again because I see him active around Circus Maximus and hopefully the more I piss him off the more likely he will post.

 

[Eagle4]

Votecount 1.6 - Holding down the B button

Acklow: (3) Snaquaza, Blackhawk11, Celever, Woodchuck, Houndoomsday, Celever, Metal Sonic, Celever, cxinlee
Celever: (3) Spiffy, Spiffy, cxinlee, Blackhawk11, Woodchuck
cxinlee: (1) Acklow, Aura Guardian, Celever, Jalmont
Aura Guardian: (1) Snaquaza, Solar Vapor, Blackhawk11, Spiffy
Solar Vapor: (1) Houndoomsday, Jalmont, Aura Guardian
Jalmont: (0) Snaquaza, Spiffy, Celever, Acklow, Metal Sonic, Celever
No Lynch: (0) cxinlee
Blackhawk11: (0) Acklow, Celever
Woodchuck: (0) Houndoomsday, Spiffy
Metal Sonic: (0) Woodchuck, Spiffy, Houndoomsday
Spiffy: (0) Celever, Celever
Snaquaza: (0) Jalmont, Solar Vapor, Houndoomsday

Not voting: Acklow, Celever, cxinlee

 

[Houndoomsday]

What do you mean by analyzing "posts about barty"? I mean yeah, we have all of the posts that are in the thread to work off of, but that's not what I meant by "back to square 1". There could have been so much more going on while the barty wagon was occurring. So many players were focusing on the barty fiasco and no one was pressuring anyone else, so we wouldn't have (and don't have) any other reactions under pressure to analyze because no one has really felt the pressure of multiple votes on them other than barty and Celever. And what is there to analyze about a claim? Sure, we can speculate on whether it's true, but I sure as hell would not be willing to lynch anyone that claimed a power role so early unless there was a counter claim. I understand that we have an unlimited deadline, but I, and I'm sure several other players, don't want this game to last forever, so while you're right that we have as much time as we want and waste any, I don't want to be on Day 1 forever.

eh, still not completely buying it. while i get your concern about spending this much time on barty, most NOC D1's last 10+ days, spending 2 or 3 pressuring a potential mafia is acceptable to me. i do appreciate you spending the time to explain the logic behind these thoughts, i think we will have to agree to disagree, as both sides make sense to different players

There was only one post where I solely posted to get Celever to respond to me, but it was an effort to keep everyone aware that Celever was ignoring me purposefully, which is obviously anti-town. It was frustrating that so many people said "yeah Celever does seem scummy" but did nothing to act on it and let him continue ignoring my questions that I kept reminding him of. I guess I should have said that?

i count 5+?

Just a reminder @Celever, please answer all of my questions too. I will respond to the most recent posts when I'm not on my phone.

@Celever just because you unvoted me doesn't mean you still don't have to answer my questions.

You saying "Actually, you know what" made me think you were changing your mind and just avoiding the trouble of answering me by unvoting.

I look forward to it!

@Celever let me know when you'll stop ignoring my questions.

I'd really like more votes on Celever until he stops ignoring me. Did I miss a response that answered all my questions? Like wtf

@Acklow what do you think of @Celever? Do you think it is scummy that he has ignored my questions I'm post #159 (I think it's that one) even after I reminded him several times. Same question for @Jalmont, @Snaquaza, and @Houndoomsday.

however now i do get your logic. i think it was a communication issue, regardless you cant accuse us of tunneling barty and then do the same thing to celever.

When did I agree with Jalmont? I actually did the opposite; Calling him out for not posting when his head wasn't on the chopping block.

my bad

I will not encourage the tunnelling on someone who I thought had claimed a power role (I did not anticipate his apparent idiocy). I didn't find him too suspicious other than the fact he was being so vague about his claim, which I attributed to the fact that he didn't understand what everyone wanted from him due to his newness. Although I shouldn't have excused this behavior for that reason alone, so you're right in a sense.

having a hard time buying the noob excuse (this is my first game too...) but its nothing i can argue for/against, only barty really knows if he is playing badly or scummy (or both).

I tagged you because like I said, many people pointed out Celever's scumminess but went right back to shifting your focus barty, who I thought had claimed a power role at the time. I thought that was odd.

understandable

regardless i dont want to be arguing semantics (like the tunneling shit) when we have better things to do, like scumhunting. now that you have fleshed out all of your logic, i feel like you are closer to a null role. sometimes i am getting weird vibes from you but some of the points you brought up are hard to dispute.

 

[Houndoomsday]

@Eagle4 dont thin acklow is at L-1 anymore ;)

also can you update the op w/subs to i can keep them straight without digging through the thread? thanks!

 

[cxinlee]

I cant tell what role celever is right now, but im going to vote celever to put some pressure until he gives a satisfactory answer to spiffy's questions.