What If? - Alternate Timelines (On Hiatus!)

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Amamama's list is pretty good. I do think it's important that Volt Switch and Sucker Punch are Defining Moves- they both really lean into enabling and abusing Stakeout.

I'd like to see Zing Zap and Supercell Slam added to the list - theyre weak/unreliable, yes, but Wild Charge is just terrible and I doubt anyone will ever run it. Having these other two gives stat submissions the freedom to go fully physical, which is a nice option to have.

Lastly I think Taunt could be a valuable option here - Stakeout encourages the opponent to stay in, and if we are in against something that isn't weak to either of our STABs, setting up may be considered a better option than switching. I assume we aren't going to have insane attacking stats due to the power of Stakeout, so Kingambit, Chuggalong, Dragonite, or Raging Bolt could potentially use us as set-up opportunities.
 
back at it again
CAP AT 5 Providence.png

Dawdoll
The Sprite Pokemon
Ghost/Fairy

Based on Cupid, that one Rube Goldberg machine in Ghost Trick, and haunted dolls.
 
So it seems we are kinda all in agreement that coverage for a powerful CAP like AT Miasmaw is probably safer to ixnay and just lean into the viability of our powerful STAB combo so with that, here is the defining moves list:

Required (for Physical Spreads): Electric STAB (Zing Zap, Supercell Slam), Dark STAB (Knock Off, Sucker Punch)
Required (for Special Spreads): Electric STAB (Thunderbolt), Dark STAB (Dark Pulse)
Required (for ALL Spreads): Volt Switch

Optional: Jaw Lock and U-turn (for physical spreads), Thunderclap (for special spreads), Taunt (for all/mixed spreads)
Click to expand...

And now we are onto stat spread submissions! Below is AT Miasmaw's Stat Limits so try your best to reasonably stay within the limits.
Limits:

Physical Sweepiness: Limit is 140
Physical Tankiness: Limit is 100
Special Sweepiness: Limit is 140
Special Tankiness: Limit is 150

BSR: Limit is 575
Click to expand...
I have also made some BSR penalties for those that wanna include any of the optional moves listed above.
Jaw Lock -15 BSR
U-turn -10 BSR
Thunderclap -5 BSR
Click to expand...
I am gonna give this stage ~72-96 hours so have fun!
 
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kenn said:
So it seems we are kinda all in agreement that coverage for a powerful CAP like AT Miasmaw is probably safer to ixnay and just lean into the viability of our powerful STAB combo so with that, here is the defining moves list:



And now we are onto stat spread submissions! Below is ST Miasmaw's Stat Limits so try your best to reasonably stay within the limits.I have also made some BSR penalties for those that wanna include any of the optional moves listed above.I am gonna give this stage ~72-96 hours so have fun!
Click to expand...
Is this a copypaste from Miasmaw's BSR limits? Wasn't BSR revised after Miasmaw? Should we use the old BSR formula/spreadsheet, and if so can you post a link to the old sheet? Because I'm getting a 458 BSR from something like Glalie with base 80 stats across the board.

With the new formula we wouldn't need a "mask" over the secondary attacking stat, and BSR should be normalized to average BST of all mons.
 
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I don’t think it makes sense to use the old bsr sheet, as we are trying to build for sv.
I think we should try to approximate these limits for a new bsr sheet.

These are the numbers I get when I plug in my OG Miasmaw Spread.
85 HP 135 Atk 60 Def 115 Spa 85 Spd 89 Spe 569 BST
133.59 PS 121.52 SS 70.42 PT 93.88 ST 558.92 BSR
 
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Time to sub something to provoke others to sub something.
I haven't really done any calcs, but I do find this spread incredibly funny.
If you want to prevent this sub your own
HP 130 / Atk 150 / Def 67 / SpA 170 / SpD 108 / SPE 25 (BST 650)
PS 85.24
SS 99.32
PT 99.32
ST 148.23
BSR 571.21

Ok I'm gonna do one calc bc funny
252+ Atk Stakeout Morpeko Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Equilibra: 400-472 (98 - 115.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock
 
HIC, it's IC, time for a spread. I did not intend for it to look this much like regular Miasmaw but it be.

HP 99 / Atk 112 / Def 42 / SpA 105 / SpD 137 / SPE 85 (BST 580)
PS 104.84
SS 102.64
PT 58.01
ST 148.84
BSR 546.64

Spread assumes U-Turn

Here be calcs, all equally important:
252 Atk Stakeout Morpeko Supercell Slam vs. 40 HP / 0 Def Hemogoblin: 331-390 (100 - 117.8%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 Atk Stakeout Morpeko U-turn vs. 32 HP / 4 Def Roaring Moon: 362-428 (100.8 - 119.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO
+4 252+ Atk Snaelstrom Aqua Jet vs. 0 HP / 0 Def Morpeko: 339-399 (100 - 117.6%) -- guaranteed OHKO
252 SpA Stakeout Morpeko Dark Pulse vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Great Tusk: 186-220 (50.1 - 59.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
4 SpA Cresceidon Moonblast vs. 0 HP / 0 SpD Morpeko: 140-168 (41.2 - 49.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
 
HP 104 / Atk 135 / Def 80 / SpA 116 / SpD 95 / SPE 50 (BST 580)
PS 93.80
SS 87.52
PT 99.66
ST 115.64
BSR 527.96
High offenses make AT Miasmaw a massive physical threat, being able to deal significant damage to resisted switch-ins with Stakeout, while having special offense which provides room for mixed sets that our typing incentivises. Speed is low to punish fast U-turn pivots and provides additional value to Sucker Punch. Defenses allow us to take at at least one super-effective hit in most cases but don't enable us to stay in for a significant period.
252 SpA Stakeout Morpeko Dark Pulse vs. 0 HP / 4 SpD Great Tusk: 199-234 (53.6 - 63%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Stakeout Morpeko Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 40 HP / 0 Def Hemogoblin: 183-216 (55.2 - 65.2%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
252 Atk Stakeout Morpeko Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Equilibra: 337-397 (82.5 - 97.3%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO after Stealth Rock
0 SpA Equilibra Earth Power vs. 0 HP / 100 SpD Morpeko: 234-276 (67 - 79%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
60 Atk Dragapult U-turn vs. 0 HP / 252 Def Morpeko: 102-122 (29.2 - 34.9%) -- 9.5% chance to 3HKO
0 Atk Landorus-Therian U-turn vs. 0 HP / 252 Def Morpeko: 128-152 (36.6 - 43.5%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
 
Okay so it has been a hot minute (irl was busy af prepping to host Thanksgiving and whatnot) but it is time for us to vote on AT Miasmaw's stats!

HP 130 / Atk 150 / Def 67 / SpA 170 / SpD 108 / SPE 25 (BST 650) by Amamama
HP 99 / Atk 112 / Def 42 / SpA 105 / SpD 137 / SPE 85 (BST 580) by Iron Crusher
HP 104 / Atk 135 / Def 80 / SpA 116 / SpD 95 / SPE 50 (BST 580) by Scepticskep

And here are the options without any formatting:

Amamama's HP 130 / Atk 150 / Def 67 / SpA 170 / SpD 108 / SPE 25 (BST 650)
Iron Crusher's HP 99 / Atk 112 / Def 42 / SpA 105 / SpD 137 / SPE 85 (BST 580)
Scepticskep's HP 104 / Atk 135 / Def 80 / SpA 116 / SpD 95 / SPE 50 (BST 580)

Reminder that it is a single bold vote!

It is also time to vote on AT Raja 2's art! Below are the options

Scepticskep's Calcelium
Yu_IOTJ's Gheite
YamiTheYin's Dawdoll

And here is the strawpoll for that!

Voting ends in ~24 hours!
 
With 8 votes (each! crazy lol) congratulations goes to Iron Crusher for AT Miasmaw's stats and YamiTheYin for AT Raja 2's art!

Now I will open art submissions for AT Miasmaw while also introducing our next AT which is...

:chuggalong::sv/chuggalong::chuggalong:
What if Chuggalong's item of choice was Berries?
:kee berry::salac berry::liechi berry::petaya berry::maranga berry:

While this particular item wasn't slated during ST Chugg's process, it was a fairly popular discussion topic during Chuggalong's CA in CAPcord and in the room so I figured we'd go down this path and see what fruit we can bare for AT Chugg 2.

We shall start by discussing typings and I wanna propose a couple of questions to answer while discussing particular type combos:
​
1) Do we wanna focus on a particular Berry or keep it as open as possible for potential use of multiple kinds of Berries?

2) Should we account for the fact that certain abilities related to Berries thrive in certain conditions? Why or why not?

Discussion will last ~72-96 hours on this!
 
IT'S STARFING TIME BABY

Nah uh. With Chug we went with one of the clearest and most direct routes to activate our item, and we should probably do that here too. Almost every mon that was designed around berries doesn't run them. Berries are usually just hella outclassed by better items. But there are some really nice tools that berry builds get, so we need to make use of those. Berries are consumable, so unless we're specifically running Harvest (and perhaps even then), this is probably an offense or HO mon.

To answer Kenn's questions:

1) I think the process will very quickly end up coalescing around one specific berry regardless of what we do. I'll talk about some builds below to illustrate that.
2) I don't think we should. Harvest in sun for example is nice but doesn't really mesh with Sun's playstyle super well. I'll talk about that below.

Here are some builds I see:
  • We actually have made a CAP that consistently uses berries, which is Cawmodore. Belly Drum Sitrus sets are probably the most consistent and reliable berry users that exist. That's one really strong route we could go. Other means of cutting your health in half (Steel Beam or ghost Curse for example) don't really lend themselves to berry usage and are usually just a way to get off the field faster. Berry: Definitely Sitrus
  • Another route is basically a Stuff Cheeks + stat berry sweeper. Stuff Cheeks is kinda busted and negates the "pinch" activation condition for these berries, which is really what makes them viable. This would likely need to be paired with some other setup move. Berry: likely Salac; maybe Petaya or Liechi or starf depending on ability and stat bias
  • Last route I'll discuss is some kind of Harvest shenanigans coupled with some way of avoiding getting knocked off. This kind of automatically has stally elements, but it could be some kind of aggressive sub user for example. It's hard for me to see building specifically around sun being worthwhile in this case. Turns of sun are precious; an offensive mon probably wants to be hitting as hard as possible (i.e. running a choice item), and a defensive harvest user might not be making the best use of the sun turns. Just fishing for the proc is probably good enough. Berry: likely Sitrus.
    • If by some miracle Harvest can activate after a Stuff Cheeks, that should be the build because that sounds cool as fuck.

Belly Drum Sitrus berry user has been done quite a bit, so I personally think we should build around some kind of Stuff cheeks sweeper. I'm gonna suggest Psychic/Fighting on the basis that it grants STAB on Stored Power and Body Press lol. I think this typing was also one of the runners up for Chug which is neat
 
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