Weezing Discussion

porygon3

http://www.pokemonelite2000.com/sprites/dpmfa/dpmfa110.png

Imo, Weezing is a very overlooked physical wall. It's got good typing and stats, and enough moves to make a good moveset

Traits
Levitate: Ground type attacks won't work on Weezing
Great trait, gets rid of 1 of his 2 weaknesses.

Stats
HP: 65... Atk: 90... Def: 120... SpAtk: 85... SpDef: 70... Speed: 60
The speed is pretty bad, its slower than things like Tyranitar and Skarmory. HP isn't too good either, but then again it has Pain Split. Other than that, and a below-average SpDef, its got great stats. 120 Def is the same as Cresselia, 90 Atk lets it use stuff like Explosion and Gyro Ball, while 85 SpAtk lets it use its many Special attacks.

Physical Movepool
Tackle
Assurance
Self-Destruct
Double Hit
Explosion
Frustration
Return
Facade
Secret Power
Thief
Payback
Giga Impact
Gyro Ball
Natural Gift

It's got alot of choices, but Explosion is the only one that really stands out. But its used more for its Special attacks than for its physical ones.

Special Movepool
Smog
Sludge
Sludge Bomb
Hidden Power
Hyper Beam
Thunderbolt
Thunder
Shock Wave
Flamethrower
Fire Blast
Dark Pulse
Psywave
Psybeam

It's got some good stuff here too. Thunderbolt, Fire Blast, etc.

Support Movepool
Poison Gas
Smokescreen
Haze
Destiny Bond
Memento
Toxic
Sunny Day
Taunt
Protect
Rain Dance
Double Team
Torment
Rest
Attract
Endure
Will-o-Wisp
Flash
Captivate
Sleep Talk
Swagger
Substitute
Screech
Pain Split
Grudge
Spite
Curse

ALOT of good things here too. WilloWisp isnt really needed except to support the rest of the team, Destiny Bond is good but Weezing is kinda slow, Pain Split is great recovery

Movesets:
Weezing @ Leftovers
Bold/Relaxed (+Def, -Atk/Spd)
Fire Blast
Thunderbolt
Pain Split
Explosion/Filler

You could do Relaxed if you don't want to weaken the Explosion, I havent done any damage calcs to see if its any big deal. Anyway, Fire Blast is used because 85 accuracy is good, but Thunder isnt used because 70 is bad. Pain Split for healing

Weezing @ Leftovers
Bold (+Def, -Atk)
Will-o-Wisp
Pain Split
Haze
Fire Blast/Thunderbolt

This is more of a support role; WilloWisp to lower stuff's Atk and psuedo-haze. Pain Split, again, for healing. Haze to help against stuff like SDGarchomp, DDTar, etc. (and it doesn't die to those things, in ADV my max atk Adamant Belly Drum'd Charizard did about 70% to a Weezing).

Weezing @ Choice Specs
Modest (+SpAtk, -Atk)
Fire Blast
Thunderbolt
Explosion
Dark Pulse

Just for laughs. Dark Pulse to hit ghosts harder and stuff. Its worth noting that this would most likely kill the common starts; Weavile can't do a thing to you and Fire Blast hits it hard, Thunderbolt is 4x against Gyarados, Dark Pulse is super effective against Gengar, and Explosion can most likely kill any of them (except Gengar) and Salamence.
 
I vaguely remember there being a weezing thread not to long ago, but I could be wrong...

well weezing is a pretty cool physical tank, and has lots of options. He's still a good heracross counter, (although gliscor kind of beats him there now).

I would say will-o-wisp is pretty essential however, because not being a steel type, he has no rock/normal/dragon resist, which is pretty problematic in the metagame full of CBRhyperiors and CBGarchomps. Weezing has a pretty tough time getting around with CBOutrage potentially 2HKOing and other things like that, so i think he may have become a bit less viable, a little like snorlax has become, in that physical hitters are hitting alot harder than they used and it takes som good resistances to manage.
 
I have always prefer Wheezing over skarmory because my teams are very fast and risky so I dont have time for stealth rock/spikes. You should have hidden power ice here too to murder sallamence n friends
 
No mention of Will-o-Wisp in the various sets?

Weezing is a fairly interesting pokemon. It's not too good on its own, but it can provide excellent coverage for a team as a 6th member. Does your team otherwise find Gyarados and Heracross, or something else, problematic? Weezing will plug that hole for you.
 
Black Sludge > Leftovers so those rare Trickers can have a nasty little surprise.

I've seen Weezing used expertly by some people, though I can never get it to work right. It's a shame too, seeing as how it was my favorite Kanto Pokemon based on looks x( The fact that it counters most Fighters amazingly is enough to make it OU, imo.
 
Weezing is clearly the boy. I'll be running:

- Thunderbolt
- Fire Blast
- Will-o-Wisp
- Explosion

I considered Sludge Bomb, but ultimately the better coverage provided Thunderbolt will likely serve better in the long run. You know the rest. Also, anything that can boom, should boom. Its just a cool move.
 
Familiar Trainer said:
Black Sludge > Leftovers so those rare Trickers can have a nasty little surprise.

I've seen Weezing used expertly by some people, though I can never get it to work right. It's a shame too, seeing as how it was my favorite Kanto Pokemon based on looks x( The fact that it counters most Fighters amazingly is enough to make it OU, imo.
Click to expand...

Wow, I never saw Black Sludge before. How much does that heal?

Surgo, I guess that could be the last move on the first set, or instead of 1 of the attacks. On the last set, its not there because I never liked status moves on Choice pokemon, but it's always an option for people who are into that kind of thing
 
Again, I'm new, so bare with me if I'm just stupid for mentioning the following:

Isn't there already an ongoing Weezing discussion:
http://www.smogon.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15897

In any case:
Weezing @ Black Sludge
Nature: Bold / Impish
EVs: 252 HP / 180 DEF / 76 Sp.ATK(or ATK)
- Will-O-Wisp
- Pain Split
- Thunderbolt / Explosion
- Haze

Usually Max HP sucks with Pain Split, but without it, Weezing won't last long. It's basically Support (as Surgo already mentioned), so it's not expected to do much direct offense.
Those Sp.ATK EVs however will allow it to do something more than just WALL.
In regards to the offense move, Still not sure if TBolt is the best way to go...Perhaps you can change the Nature to Impish and give it Explosion for the Coup De Grais.
 
Black Sludge > Leftovers so those rare Trickers can have a nasty little surprise.
Click to expand...
This is not true. I would never use Black Sludge over Leftovers unless I was under an item clause. The reality is that once they trick the Black Sludge off of you, they're just going to trick it back onto some other member of your team and you'll have it stuck there.
 
weezing was better when heracross was one of the biggest, if not the biggest, physical pokemon. now you have to worry about taking swords danced dragon claws, and under sandstorm, wow is not gonna be hitting garchomp very frequently : (
 
That's why most of the Weezing (or Dusknoir for that matter) movesets I've seen lately don't run it at all: from what I've seen haze / FB / T-Bolt / Pain Split is the most common set used in 4th gen.
 
I've been considering Explosion over Haze recently but unfortunately, I don't know how much Att it would need to put a dent in Blissey. It's just countered a bit by her with 2 Specials and somewhat recovery move and Haze only annoying her if she had Calm Mind, and even then they would predict a Haze from Weezing.
 
Weezing wasn't all that overlooked back in the third generation era, I definitely used him a lot, he had his flaws but was still a great Will-o-Wisper, not sure how he fares in the DP generation though.
 
In RSE, Weezing needed 176 attack evs to ohko a Blissey with 252 hp and 252 def and a +def nature 100% of the time, but I don't know how many needs now with the damage formula change.
 
Surgo said:
This is not true. I would never use Black Sludge over Leftovers unless I was under an item clause. The reality is that once they trick the Black Sludge off of you, they're just going to trick it back onto some other member of your team and you'll have it stuck there.
Click to expand...

Good! You've taken life from your opponent and you've now pressured them into using it again.

Not to mention if they waste a Trick just to get Black Sludge back to who they Trick'd it off of.
 
Familiar Trainer said:
Black Sludge > Leftovers so those rare Trickers can have a nasty little surprise.
Click to expand...
LocoUser said:
Wrong. Once they get the Black Sludge, they'll just Trick it back onto another member
Click to expand...
Link to topic with above quote.

If it needs any more explanation, when the tricker gets the black sludge, he still has trick. He can then switch it onto one of your sweepers making them lose Life orb / Leftovers / Choice scarf/band/specs, or maybe another tank giving them regular HP loss instead of HP gain.

EDIT: Ah, didn't see Surgo's post.
 
with the exception of Explosion/Haze, Levitate, and Black Sludge, what does Weezing do that Dusknoir can't? It seems like they both usually have the same basic movesets, taking advantage of good Def (and in Dusknoir's case, good SpD) and the Will-o-Wisp/Pain Split Combination. is 15 extra base points in speed and HP enough to make Weezing viable over Dusk? i'm not sure.
 
Poison typing with levitate to switch in to Close Combat (from Heracross) and Earthquake is what Weezing has that Dusknoir doesn't.

Good! You've taken life from your opponent and you've now pressured them into using it again.
Click to expand...
And then you start losing HP from one of your other pokemon as they trick it back onto you..
 
Surgo said:
Poison typing with levitate to switch in to Close Combat (from Heracross) and Earthquake is what Weezing has that Dusknoir doesn't.


And then you start losing HP from one of your other pokemon as they trick it back onto you..
Click to expand...

Wouldn't Dusknoir's Ghost typing make him even better to switch into Close Combat against? Though I do give Weezing points for being better against EQ (why can't Dusknoir levitate?).
 
While Dusknoir could be considered "better" because it's immune to fighting, Weezing just takes a little bit of damage and forces Heracross to switch out because of the defense drop (unless they want to risk getting Fire Blast'd). Earthquake is neutral against Dusknoir but NVE against Weezing, same with Megahorn. Dusknoir also doesn't carry a move that would handle Heracross.

Dusknoir is good, dont get me wrong, but against Heracross Id rather have Weezing
 
Well, Dusknoir can get Fire punch, but unless you're specifically trying to coutner heracross or another Fire-weak pokemon, I think Ice or thunderpunch would be better on Dusknoir.

Alright, here's what my Weezing is running.

@Leftovers
~Pain Split
~Haze
~Thunderbolt
~Fire Blast

I'm wondering it Will-o-wisp would be better over haze. I already have a poke with WoW (Dusknoir), so I'm not sure how necessary it is.
 
porygon3 said:
While Dusknoir could be considered "better" because it's immune to fighting, Weezing just takes a little bit of damage and forces Heracross to switch out because of the defense drop (unless they want to risk getting Fire Blast'd). Earthquake is neutral against Dusknoir but NVE against Weezing, same with Megahorn. Dusknoir also doesn't carry a move that would handle Heracross.

Dusknoir is good, dont get me wrong, but against Heracross Id rather have Weezing
Click to expand...


Weezing takes no damage at all from earthquake...because he has levitate. However, he will take damamge if the opposing pokemon has moldbreaker which makes your ability not activated.
 
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