★ RU Stage 3.1 - Boom Boom Pow (Toxtricity Banned | April Shifts)

[Feliburn]

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It's finally time for RU's first suspect test of the 9th generation. This time we've decided to start with one of the most controversial Pokémon in the tier: Toxtricity.

Toxtricity's main appeal lies in its insane raw power + coverage that make it way too hard to handle. And with the newly added terastalization, Toxtricity can become a normal type, making Boomburst (the most spammable move) hit even harder thanks to the tera boost. It also has coverage to hit one of its most famous checks, Palossand, with a Punk Rock boosted Snarl, just showing how hard it is to switch in to it. Despite seeing less usage after the Light Clay ban, Toxtricity can also run Shift Gear sets that make it harder to revenge kill, as well as have Drain Punch in order to recover health if the opponent is trying to check you with a Blissey or a Copperajah. And as of lately, we've seen Choice Scarf sets that abuse the previously mentioned Normal Tera to pick surprise kills with ease. Surprisingly enough, Toxtricity also has fewer issues switching in than in the previous generation, as poison/electric resists quite a lot of the common attacks used in this tier from Pokémon like Revavroom, Klefki, Kilowattrel, etc.

While the other side of the coin says that the meta is not that kind to Toxtricity to let it rampage as free as it would like to. Most common teams lately have enough breakers that are faster, and that can KO Toxtricity, while the slower teams see more issues against it, but still have Blissey as the best possible answer for the Choice Specs set. While we mentioned that its typing is not bad to switch in, its bulk really limits it to how much it can take. At the end of the day, it'll be up to the community to decide if Toxtricity is a presence that overbears people who worry too much about checking it, or if it's just another one of those breakers you can just outpressure with a strong enough team.

We'd appreciate if you could post your thoughts below, as it makes it easier for the less knowledgeable players to follow the discussion, and educate themselves. However, keep in mind that - as is standard for the forum - one-liners and posts lacking substance are subject to deletion and, in extreme cases, may lead to infractions.

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Tagging Kris and Marty to announce it on the RU ladder, thank you both!

minimum games needed

GXE	minimum games
78	50
78.2	49
78.4	48
78.6	47
78.8	46
79	45
79.2	44
79.4	43
79.6	42
79.8	41
80	40
80.2	39
80.4	38
80.6	37
80.8	36
81	35
81.2	34
81.4	33
81.6	32
81.8	31
82	30

Suspect information:

• There will be no draws allowed for any potential qualifiers. If you qualify with draws, your suspect requirements will not count, and you will not be allowed to vote. There is no way to actively enforce ties to prevent abuse, so they will be disallowed. Use stall at your own risk.
• All games must be played on the Pokémon Showdown! RU ladder on a new alt with the following format: "RUT9 (nickname)”. For example, RUT9 Felimelo or RUT9 ajkaffhjkfashfa.
• Do NOT impersonate other people in your ladder alt, do NOT use any usernames which are offensive, flame-baiting, or targeting specific users, and do NOT use usernames which could be interpreted as breaking any of the username rules on Pokemon Showdown! Failure to abide to this will result in you being barred from voting in this suspect, and potential infractions.
• The suspect test will last for two weeks, ending on Friday, March 31st. 11pm - 5

/!\ NOTICE /!\ RU will not be tolerating any form of voting manipulation. Any attempt to manipulate votes can result in an infraction, loss of eligibility to vote in the current test, and loss of the Tiering Contributor badge. While we won't necessarily enforce super strict punishment, this won't be tolerated and will be handled accordingly. Voting manipulation can simply be described as attempting to get people to vote a way on the test in inappropriate manners. Bribing with teams to vote a certain way, directly messaging people to vote a certain way, publicly announcing "vote this way" all fall under voting manipulation. For more query, feel free to PM me or EviGaro.

 

[EonX]

So, Toxtricity. Arguably the strongest wallbreaker in the tier. What's your best counterplay against it and how reliable is it? Well, let's see.

: This is probably the most obvious answer. Pallosand is immune to Boomburst and Volt Switch, can use a SpDef spread to avoid the immediate OHKO from Snarl with Spikes up, and takes resisted damage from the odd Sludge Bomb. However, SpDef Palossand is not the best special wall in the tier; not by a long shot as it tends to struggle with most other common special attackers. Rotom-H can Tera Blast Water, Kilowattrel can also Tera it or simply throw out Hurricanes for decent chunks, and the likes ot Tatsugiri, Arboliva, and Rotom-Mow naturally do well against it unless it were to Tera. However, if Palossand decides to Tera, it will lose the Boomburst immunity it relies on to check Toxtricity. So, Palo is relatively reliable at handling Toxtricity, but it has to run SpDef to be safe against Specs Snarl and is generally overwhelmed by other common special attackers in the tier if it goes this route, which means you're likely using Revavroom, Blissey, or some other special tank alongside it.

: The age old answer to pretty much any brute force special attacker, it shouldn't come as a surprise that Blissey pops up as a check to Toxtricity. However, Blissey lack a Volt Switch immunity and will generally need to be paired with 1-2 Pokemon that are immune to it as a result. This results in some dangerous 50/50s for the Blissey user as switching to their Volt Switch immunity on Boomburst is resulting in a dead mon unless it's Palossand. Alternatively, switching to Blissey on a Volt Switch keeps the Toxtricity user in the driver's seat and it's not like clicking Boomburst on an incoming Blissey is a bad plan, especially if Toxtricity is already Tera Normal as it does 43% minimum, meaning a mandatory Soft-Boiled to avoid the 2HKO on next switch in, which means the Toxtricity user is still in control despite Blissey tanking Boomburst. Blissey has the option to Tera Ghost, and if it does this, it basically becomes impossible for Toxtricity to KO and a well-timed Thunder Wave on an already Tera'd Toxtricity will result in it being outsped by virtually everything and rendered much less useful. Overall, Tera Ghost Blissey is probably the safest way of dealing with Toxtricity, but considering how much Blissey tends to love Tera Fairy for the Fighting and Dark resists, there's certainly an opportunity cost to using this Tera type in order to better handle Toxtricity.

: The 2 SpDef Steels that aren't weak to Snarl are certainly capable of switching into Boomburst once... however, that's the problem for them. They're soundly 3HKOed WITHOUT Toxtricity needing to Tera and their lack of reliable recovery means that Toxtricity will break through them next switch in unless they're Tera Ghost, in which case, Toxtricity can simply Volt Switch to chunk them. So yeah, I'm not really counting our Steel types as options to handle Toxtricity as, even if they Tera Ghost to dodge Boomburst entirely, they're still Volt Switch fodder

I'd list Mudsdale, but it takes 83% minimum from Boomburst. Definitely not a switch in. So, it's pretty obvious that defensive counterplay to Toxtricity is pretty limited thanks to its raw power. Does that make it broken? Not necessarily. Throughout the history of RU, there's been plenty of offensive threats capable of tearing up slower teams with relative ease. BW had Druddigon and XY/ORAS had Exploud just as examples, however I want to focus on Exploud as the comparisons are quite good with it and Toxtricity. Both spam Boomburst and resisting the move typically isn't enough as slower resists are easily 3HKOed for the most part, which makes it a real challenge to deal with defensively. However, what about offensive counterplay? Are there offensive Pokemon capable of switching into at least one of its moves once and snatching back momentum from the Toxtricity user? As it turns out, yes there are... well, kind of.

: Chief among these is Gardevoir as its Trace ability means it will also gain Punk Rock and actually reduce the power of Toxtricity's best move, Boomburst, to such a level that Toxtricity needs to win a messy 50/50 based on Tera. Assuming Toxtricity has not yet Tera'd, it still does enough to 2HKO Gardevoir on the switch, but is obviously outsped and OHKOed by Psychic. If it Tera's to Normal, it drops the Psychic weakness, dodges the OHKO, and KOs back due to Gardevoir taking Boomburst on the switch. However, Gardevoir could also Tera to Fairy and threaten a near OHKO with Moonblast if Toxtricity Teras as well looking to dodge the OHKO from Psychic. The availability of Tera obviously can swing this in favor of either participant. The big reason Gardevoir is so solid as an offensive response is that it commonly runs Scarf and has a higher Speed tier than Toxtricity, meaning that sneaky Scarf variants of Toxtricity can't get one over on it like Scarf Toxt can with most other offensive threats.

: As a faster Ground-type, Krookodile is quite capable of leveraging its immunity to Overdrive and Volt Switch in order to force out Toxtricity or swiftly KO it with a powerful STAB Earthquake. Of course, Krook has nowhere near the bulk needed to handle Boomburst and is absolutely screwed if it turns out that Toxtricity is Shift Gear and it sets up on the switch to suddenly outspeed even Scarf Krookodile. Worth noting that the secondary Dark typing lets Krook resist Snarl as well should its team feature a Tera Ghost Pokemon, such as Blissey or Revavroom. So Krook isn't bad, but it is OHKOed by Specs Boomburst and will absolutely have the tables turned on it by a Shift Gear on the switch.

: With its sky high base 125 Speed and Volt Absorb ability, Kilowattrel can happily switch into a Volt Switch or Overdrive to stifle Toxtricity's momentum. However, much like Krookodile above it, its frailty and lack of a Boomburst resistance leads to it having similar issues. This can be remedied by utilizing Tera Ghost as the Tera obviously does not rid Kilowattrel of its ability of Volt Absorb and also makes it immune to Boomburst. The issue with this is that Snarl is still an OHKO after Tera and Ghost Tera also doesn't really aid Kilowattrel offensively as it generally will prefer Water to supplement its STABs. So, similar to Krookodile, Killo does a great job of deterring Toxtricity from using Volt Switch or Overdrive, but it will need something else to deter Boomburst as it has no hope of surviving it.

As you may have noticed, there's no offensive Boomburst resistance listed... uh, that's because there are none pre-Teras. Even Gardevoir, the rare case of an offensive Pokemon not being OHOed by Boomburst takes 47% minimum, meaning it is 2HKOed with Stealth Rock up and there's often no immediate way to offensively punish a Toxtricity using Boomburst as there's simply a void of faster Pokemon that resist the move to stomach it once and take back momentum from Toxt. This is also primarily only accounting for Choice Specs sets as Toxtricity is perfectly capable of using Throat Spray Shift Gear or Choice Scarf sets effectively. Shift Gear may not be able to throw out Boomburst immediately like the choice sets can, but its not like our Grounds are good initial switch ins, which means it can pretty freely throw out Volt Switches early to maintain / gain momentum. The Scarf set, while uncommon compared to Specs in particular, shores up the offensive matchup issues Toxtricity can run into as it can simply use some of its key resistances and "good enough" bulk to take at least 1 resisted hit to find its way in and harass opposing offensive teams make it more versatile and dangerous than XY/ORAS Exploud, the subject I feel many veteran RU players will compare it to. It also doesn't help that the tier is pretty limited in offensive Steel and Rock types that aren't completely run over by Toxtricity's Electric STAB moves and it's not like Toxt will be complaining if it's forced to use Volt Switch early on due to something like Blissey or a Tera Ghost mon is present to hinder its Boombursts.
Does this mean Toxtricity needs to be banned? On paper, yes. However, there's one thing any powerful Pokemon has to do in order to actually do its damage; get on the field. And this is where Toxtricity can have problems. Its decidedly average Speed tier means that most teams will have 2-3 Pokemon, at worst, that outspeed Toxtricity and many offensive teams will have 4-5, at worst, that do the same. This is where Toxtricity can find itself struggling as it will sometimes be force to wait to come in until one of its teammate is KOed before it can shatter the ears of one of the opposing Pokemon.

 

[Stories]

It's hard for me to tell if Toxtricity is broken or not, because I ran into maybe 2 or 3 when getting voting reqs, and one of them was Assault Vest with Nuzzle... and besides that they were admittedly played extremely poorly so it's still difficult to gauge how good it is on the ladder. In tournaments, although I haven't really watched too many sets, I haven't seen Toxtricity dominating there either, and when I use Toxtricity myself, it feels largely reliant on Terastallization and hard reads to do what it claims to do. I think a lot of Toxtricity's broken qualities are very much so "on paper" and much more difficult to actually pull off in a game to game basis, but nonetheless when Toxtricity hits the field, at worst, its opponent has to make a proper read or they will simply lose a Pokemon. I don't think this is so different compared to the likes of Choice Specs Gardevoir or Flame Orb Heracross, so I would like to shift the blame to the Pokemon that let these breakers so effortlessly hit the field:

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These assholes are the root of all problems in this metagame. Virtually unblockable pivoting with the offensive prowess to actually force switches on top of great bulk and speed. Passive Pokemon like Blissey and Umbreon just get Nasty Plotted on, and Special tanks like Dragalge, Goodra, and Frosmoth all lack recovery and get worn down very easily with Will-O-Wisp burns, Volt Switch, and entry hazards. These Pokemon have 0 true checks, and even fewer Pokemon that can stop a Volt Switch, as all Ground-types in the tier are complete setup fodder and fold to even unboosted Overheats and especially Leaf Storms. Kilowattrel preforms similar pivoting, but its terrible bulk and reliance on Hurricane and Terastallization to do damage makes it feel far less oppressive in my eyes. Volt Absorb Kilwattrel actually would serve as a decent Rotom pivot, especially Rotom-Mow as it resists Leaf Storm, or so you would think, but a +2 Leaf Storm actually OHKO's Kilowattrel.

Having joined Smogon playing SSNU, I'm all too familiar with Rotom terrorizing a metagame, and we took the route of banning every single breaker that Rotom-Mow enabled until we realized that they could simply be replaced, while Rotom's role as an unstoppable pivot could not be replaced. Speaking from a place of experience, please ban both forms of Rotom, Heat and Mow. I know Double Suspect tests aren't very conventional, but this is a perfect opportunity for one in my eyes. As for Toxtricity, I'm still on the fence about it, but I don't see myself voting to ban it at this point.

 

[Sneakyplanner]

I'll mostly just repeat what I said in the last NP thread: there is nothing toxtricity excels more at than kicking you while you're down. Steels aren't an answer since the only steel that does anything in return is copperajah, which is super easy to switch into, while they are 3hko'd in return by boomburst, and ghosts that aren't palossand will just die to one overdrive. When you're winning and have a faster wallbreaker in play then you can feel safe against it, but when you're playing from behind it can feel absolutely impossible to beat since switching into it requires a sacrifice more often than not. I believe that toxtricity is an unhealthy presence in the tier for this reason, matchups with it feel very lopsided and once they tip in toxtricity's favor the game is effectively over. Toxtricity isn't the strongest pokemon in the tier but I believe it is the one with the most negative impact.

 

[Yourwelcomethanku]

My main issue with Toxtricity is not that I think it is in of itself too unmanageable, but its effect on building. Your team better have Palossand or Blissey or some combination of soft checks. This is made worse by the dynamic of what set Toxtricity is? Some Pokemon may be acceptable checks to one set but not to another. For example, many Pokemon like Krookodile and Mismagius can take one of Toxtricity's STAB moves and check a Choice Specs set; however, they're inadequate offensive checks to Shift Gear. Going hard into Goodra or Mudsdale might be necessary to check a Shift Gear set, but it would be bad to get hit by a Specs Boomburst immediately. Palossand checks Choice Specs well, forcing it to Snarl, but a Shift Gear set with Snarl can bulldoze past it. Blissey is a solid check to Toxtricity, tho you may need to save Terastallization to Tera Ghost Blissey so that you don't lose to Shift Gear + Drain Punch. It feels like you need an Electric immunity, and a Normal immunity or Blissey or fat Normal resist to be safe against Toxtricity, unless you're running a team that's rather offensive. Palossand is not really a great Pokemon and the fact that it gets good usage I think is a testament to how strong Toxtricity is. I learn towards banning Toxtricity due to how it limits building.

 

[Dabombo789]

So I believe that Toxtricity is by fare the strongest special attacker in tier. It's Boomburst is powerful enough with Punk Rock and its Base Power, but once specs, hazard support and Tera Normal are added it becomes really dangerous. The two best checks for it are Blissey and Pallosand because Blissey is Blissey and Pallosand prevents a read volt switch and is immune to boomburst. But after that checks get tricky Klefki and Revaroom can tank two non-Tera boombursts but with spikes and Tera it becomes an uncomfortable guessing game. While it is true that a fast pokemon with strong stab or strong super-effective moves and can OHKO Toxtricity that is not who Toxtricity is switching in on. It will switch in on a pokemon that is slower or one that can't tank or can't do solid damage and obliterate it. The only pokemon who can avoid a volt switch or Boomburst OHKO is Pallosand and a snarl on the switch will secure a 2HKO. Even though the Specs set is by far the best it isn't the only one and the shift gear set gives a nasty suprise to Pallosand. And put it drain punch and Blissey is also in for a treat. Overall I believe that Toxtricity is toxic for the tier and should be banned.

 

[CheesyBrie]

So, I don't know anything about the RU meta right now, but I wanted to ask/throw out some ideas that seem okay on paper (but they might be awful).

The first is Pupitar. A specially defensive one with eviolite is resistant/immune to all of Toxtricity's STAB (including tera boomburst).
I don't really know what else Pupitar brings to the table (I guess I'm basically theorymonning), but I wanted to ask if anyone has given the only(?) Rock/Ground type this generation a chance?

The second is Soundproof. I assume Abomasnow is only ever used for Snow teams under the Snow to do Snow things. Would it have a niche as a soundproof mon, or is it only actually good for snow?

Third, Electrode? Just in general Soundproof Electrode is immune to almost everything Toxtricity can do, and resists volt switch. Sure they can switch out, but the only thing that outspeeds electrode is a scarfer, so you could maybe get chip and pivot with a Volt Switch of your own? It also seems generally useful with the new influx of water types, but I don't really know.

Again, I don't actually have any replays of any of these doing anything, I'm just wondering if anyone has tried these as checks to Toxtricity, and then if they do literally anything else against teams without Toxtricity.

 

[Stories]

So, I don't know anything about the RU meta right now, but I wanted to ask/throw out some ideas that seem okay on paper (but they might be awful).

The first is Pupitar. A specially defensive one with eviolite is resistant/immune to all of Toxtricity's STAB (including tera boomburst).
I don't really know what else Pupitar brings to the table (I guess I'm basically theorymonning), but I wanted to ask if anyone has given the only(?) Rock/Ground type this generation a chance?

The second is Soundproof. I assume Abomasnow is only ever used for Snow teams under the Snow to do Snow things. Would it have a niche as a soundproof mon, or is it only actually good for snow?

Third, Electrode? Just in general Soundproof Electrode is immune to almost everything Toxtricity can do, and resists volt switch. Sure they can switch out, but the only thing that outspeeds electrode is a scarfer, so you could maybe get chip and pivot with a Volt Switch of your own? It also seems generally useful with the new influx of water types, but I don't really know.

Again, I don't actually have any replays of any of these doing anything, I'm just wondering if anyone has tried these as checks to Toxtricity, and then if they do literally anything else against teams without Toxtricity.

If you have to use Pokemon beyond even the realm of consideration of viability to check something then that does not make that 'something' any healthier for the tier even if you technically can check it with Pupitar..

 

[CheesyBrie]

If you have to use Pokemon beyond even the realm of consideration of viability to check something then that does not make that 'something' any healthier for the tier even if you technically can check it with Pupitar..

Right, I guess I was wondering why they aren't viable? Like I can sort of see why, but I was wondering if anyone has tried it (so I don't have to lol)

 

[Stories]

Right, I guess I was wondering why they aren't viable? Like I can sort of see why, but I was wondering if anyone has tried it (so I don't have to lol)

truthfully beyond checking specific one or two things, these Pokemon are just terrible into the rest of the metagame and/or just lack the stats or movepool to accomplish anything outside of its one specific job. Sure Pupitar can check Toxtricity and maybe even Rotom-Heat, but in a metagame where many of the best Pokemon are Fighting-, Water-, and Grass-types, its going to be a complete liability outside of the few Pokemon it can switch into and force out, not even really making any progress. Abomasnow is a good Pokemon in RU, because of Snow Warning. Take that away and it's suddenly a Pokemon with mediocre stats and a terrible typing. Electrode can come in on Toxtricity sure, but what is it doing after? It's movepool screams "I was born in gen 1" and while Toxt can't Boomburst it, any other moves will cleanly 2HKO while Electrode lacks any offensive or defensive presence.

 

[Fish Gaming]

So, Toxtricity. Arguably the strongest wallbreaker in the tier. What's your best counterplay against it and how reliable is it? Well, let's see.

: This is probably the most obvious answer. Pallosand is immune to Boomburst and Volt Switch, can use a SpDef spread to avoid the immediate OHKO from Snarl with Spikes up, and takes resisted damage from the odd Sludge Bomb. However, SpDef Palossand is not the best special wall in the tier; not by a long shot as it tends to struggle with most other common special attackers. Rotom-H can Tera Blast Water, Kilowattrel can also Tera it or simply throw out Hurricanes for decent chunks, and the likes ot Tatsugiri, Arboliva, and Rotom-Mow naturally do well against it unless it were to Tera. However, if Palossand decides to Tera, it will lose the Boomburst immunity it relies on to check Toxtricity. So, Palo is relatively reliable at handling Toxtricity, but it has to run SpDef to be safe against Specs Snarl and is generally overwhelmed by other common special attackers in the tier if it goes this route, which means you're likely using Revavroom, Blissey, or some other special tank alongside it.

: The age old answer to pretty much any brute force special attacker, it shouldn't come as a surprise that Blissey pops up as a check to Toxtricity. However, Blissey lack a Volt Switch immunity and will generally need to be paired with 1-2 Pokemon that are immune to it as a result. This results in some dangerous 50/50s for the Blissey user as switching to their Volt Switch immunity on Boomburst is resulting in a dead mon unless it's Palossand. Alternatively, switching to Blissey on a Volt Switch keeps the Toxtricity user in the driver's seat and it's not like clicking Boomburst on an incoming Blissey is a bad plan, especially if Toxtricity is already Tera Normal as it does 43% minimum, meaning a mandatory Soft-Boiled to avoid the 2HKO on next switch in, which means the Toxtricity user is still in control despite Blissey tanking Boomburst. Blissey has the option to Tera Ghost, and if it does this, it basically becomes impossible for Toxtricity to KO and a well-timed Thunder Wave on an already Tera'd Toxtricity will result in it being outsped by virtually everything and rendered much less useful. Overall, Tera Ghost Blissey is probably the safest way of dealing with Toxtricity, but considering how much Blissey tends to love Tera Fairy for the Fighting and Dark resists, there's certainly an opportunity cost to using this Tera type in order to better handle Toxtricity.

: The 2 SpDef Steels that aren't weak to Snarl are certainly capable of switching into Boomburst once... however, that's the problem for them. They're soundly 3HKOed WITHOUT Toxtricity needing to Tera and their lack of reliable recovery means that Toxtricity will break through them next switch in unless they're Tera Ghost, in which case, Toxtricity can simply Volt Switch to chunk them. So yeah, I'm not really counting our Steel types as options to handle Toxtricity as, even if they Tera Ghost to dodge Boomburst entirely, they're still Volt Switch fodder

I'd list Mudsdale, but it takes 83% minimum from Boomburst. Definitely not a switch in. So, it's pretty obvious that defensive counterplay to Toxtricity is pretty limited thanks to its raw power. Does that make it broken? Not necessarily. Throughout the history of RU, there's been plenty of offensive threats capable of tearing up slower teams with relative ease. BW had Druddigon and XY/ORAS had Exploud just as examples, however I want to focus on Exploud as the comparisons are quite good with it and Toxtricity. Both spam Boomburst and resisting the move typically isn't enough as slower resists are easily 3HKOed for the most part, which makes it a real challenge to deal with defensively. However, what about offensive counterplay? Are there offensive Pokemon capable of switching into at least one of its moves once and snatching back momentum from the Toxtricity user? As it turns out, yes there are... well, kind of.

: Chief among these is Gardevoir as its Trace ability means it will also gain Punk Rock and actually reduce the power of Toxtricity's best move, Boomburst, to such a level that Toxtricity needs to win a messy 50/50 based on Tera. Assuming Toxtricity has not yet Tera'd, it still does enough to 2HKO Gardevoir on the switch, but is obviously outsped and OHKOed by Psychic. If it Tera's to Normal, it drops the Psychic weakness, dodges the OHKO, and KOs back due to Gardevoir taking Boomburst on the switch. However, Gardevoir could also Tera to Fairy and threaten a near OHKO with Moonblast if Toxtricity Teras as well looking to dodge the OHKO from Psychic. The availability of Tera obviously can swing this in favor of either participant. The big reason Gardevoir is so solid as an offensive response is that it commonly runs Scarf and has a higher Speed tier than Toxtricity, meaning that sneaky Scarf variants of Toxtricity can't get one over on it like Scarf Toxt can with most other offensive threats.

: As a faster Ground-type, Krookodile is quite capable of leveraging its immunity to Overdrive and Volt Switch in order to force out Toxtricity or swiftly KO it with a powerful STAB Earthquake. Of course, Krook has nowhere near the bulk needed to handle Boomburst and is absolutely screwed if it turns out that Toxtricity is Shift Gear and it sets up on the switch to suddenly outspeed even Scarf Krookodile. Worth noting that the secondary Dark typing lets Krook resist Snarl as well should its team feature a Tera Ghost Pokemon, such as Blissey or Revavroom. So Krook isn't bad, but it is OHKOed by Specs Boomburst and will absolutely have the tables turned on it by a Shift Gear on the switch.

: With its sky high base 125 Speed and Volt Absorb ability, Kilowattrel can happily switch into a Volt Switch or Overdrive to stifle Toxtricity's momentum. However, much like Krookodile above it, its frailty and lack of a Boomburst resistance leads to it having similar issues. This can be remedied by utilizing Tera Ghost as the Tera obviously does not rid Kilowattrel of its ability of Volt Absorb and also makes it immune to Boomburst. The issue with this is that Snarl is still an OHKO after Tera and Ghost Tera also doesn't really aid Kilowattrel offensively as it generally will prefer Water to supplement its STABs. So, similar to Krookodile, Killo does a great job of deterring Toxtricity from using Volt Switch or Overdrive, but it will need something else to deter Boomburst as it has no hope of surviving it.

As you may have noticed, there's no offensive Boomburst resistance listed... uh, that's because there are none pre-Teras. Even Gardevoir, the rare case of an offensive Pokemon not being OHOed by Boomburst takes 47% minimum, meaning it is 2HKOed with Stealth Rock up and there's often no immediate way to offensively punish a Toxtricity using Boomburst as there's simply a void of faster Pokemon that resist the move to stomach it once and take back momentum from Toxt. This is also primarily only accounting for Choice Specs sets as Toxtricity is perfectly capable of using Throat Spray Shift Gear or Choice Scarf sets effectively. Shift Gear may not be able to throw out Boomburst immediately like the choice sets can, but its not like our Grounds are good initial switch ins, which means it can pretty freely throw out Volt Switches early to maintain / gain momentum. The Scarf set, while uncommon compared to Specs in particular, shores up the offensive matchup issues Toxtricity can run into as it can simply use some of its key resistances and "good enough" bulk to take at least 1 resisted hit to find its way in and harass opposing offensive teams make it more versatile and dangerous than XY/ORAS Exploud, the subject I feel many veteran RU players will compare it to. It also doesn't help that the tier is pretty limited in offensive Steel and Rock types that aren't completely run over by Toxtricity's Electric STAB moves and it's not like Toxt will be complaining if it's forced to use Volt Switch early on due to something like Blissey or a Tera Ghost mon is present to hinder its Boombursts.
Does this mean Toxtricity needs to be banned? On paper, yes. However, there's one thing any powerful Pokemon has to do in order to actually do its damage; get on the field. And this is where Toxtricity can have problems. Its decidedly average Speed tier means that most teams will have 2-3 Pokemon, at worst, that outspeed Toxtricity and many offensive teams will have 4-5, at worst, that do the same. This is where Toxtricity can find itself struggling as it will sometimes be force to wait to come in until one of its teammate is KOed before it can shatter the ears of one of the opposing Pokemon.

I personally used Earthquake Bronzong to check Tox, since nobody expects it, Bronzong is bulky enough to tank a few hits from the special set, and the shift gear set is also somewhat accounted for too.

Bronzong @ Leftovers
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Gyro Ball
- Body Press

 

[pomfpomfpluff]

Alright so I just finished getting my reqs by using this stall team and it was pretty easy overall aside from edge mega haxx cases. Turns out that packing two specific checks to one of the most centralizing mons in the tier which therefore makes said mon a non issue during team preview is a pretty good way of farming reqs :3 (no seriously this is the 3rd time in a row this has worked on stall while I've done reqs). Anyhow Toxtricity is extremely stupid and I'm gonna explain why that's been the case in my experience.


Choice Specs

Toxtricity @ Choice Specs
Ability: Punk Rock
Tera Type: Normal
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest / Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Overdrive
- Boomburst
- Volt Switch
- Snarl / Sludge Bomb / Toxic

Note: The following set(s) will have moves listed based on what I've seen throughout the suspect test.

This is the most spammed Toxtricity set on the ladder and it's not even close, since it's extremely low risk and has a low skill ceiling, but also rewards both safer and riskier playstyles. RU has like no good Ground types that can take on Specs consistently, since only one of them has reliable recovery and none of them have good spdef. Palossand is definitely the best check and runs Spdef mainly because of how dominant Toxtricity is, but even those variants can be dispatched quite easily by just clicking Snarl twice. Blissey meanwhile being the 2nd best choice has to defensive Tera AND be paired with a Ground type to reliably check it, which is just absurdly restrictive from a teambuilding standpoint. Gardevoir is a mon that I've seen mentioned here but it's kinda bad at it's job between the rare Sludge Bomb and the fact that it's usually used as a staple scarfer who doesn't enjoy taking many hits, but it is a rare example of an offensive check.

I have a lot of experience when it comes to attempting to build more balance oriented teams in the RU tier and every time I tried to distance myself from the "use Spdef Palossand or Blissey + Ground type" formula I've noticed that out of all the Electric Types Toxtricity was by far the biggest issue. The Rotom Appliances are atleast not incentivised to spam their secondary STABs 24/7 and also don't hit nearly as hard. Speaking of annoying pivots that's another thing that fixes one of this set's main issues, lack of defensive utility. Looking at the top 5 VR mons 3 of them have a pivoting move and going down even further the number just keeps increasing, which alongside the fact that Toxtricity acts as both a Volt User and a breaker leads to infuriatingly difficult to intercept Volt-Turn cores that don't require as much investment from a teambuilding slot as usual.

Now this set of course still has a few flaws attached to it. The defensive utility as previously mentioned is basically nonexistant outside of mega fat teams that consist of mons that can't touch it regardless, which makes it particularly bad at taking on offensive teams. It's also extremely Tera reliant on top of that to actually get those juicy OHKOs it thrives on, but I wouldn't say that being the tiers best Tera Abuser is a big downside personally. Overall I'd say that a lot of this sets main issues are generally either solved by proper team support or are so minor that they basically don't count.


Shift Gear

Toxtricity @ Life Orb / Throat Spray
Ability: Punk Rock
Tera Type: Normal
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Shift Gear
- Overdrive
- Boomburst
- Drain Punch / Snarl

I've essentially already touched on all the general issues I have with Toxtricity and most of them apply to this set aswell. Shift Gear basically just baits offense into thinking that they're gonna have an easy time beating Specs and then smacks them with a Boomburst that just obliterates entire teams with no effort put in. You're basically trading longevity and the ability to effortlessly break through defensive cores for a better matchup against offense, which imo is pretty swell. Issue is that setting up is a pain since again, bad defensive utility, so there's actually a semblence of trade off here (shocking for a Toxtricity set I know).

My main issue with Shift Gear is that it does a good job of covering for Specs variants which can force otherwise unideal situations since you can't really revenge kill it through normal means because it's faster than base 100 Scarfers while using a Modest Nature and can live most formes of priority. Finding setup opportunities would be hard on paper, but since it can take a lot of the choice locked hits in the tier like for an example Scarf Flamigo Brave Bird/Close Combat and Scarf Gardevoir Moonblast and use them as setup fodder it's not nearly as hard as itr'd seem on paper. Toxtricity basically gets to choose between what does and what doesn't counter it by just swapping between two sets.


So TLDR; Toxtricity restricts building to a point where a lot of teams basically need to use the same small brigade of checks in order to not immediately fold against it. It gets to pick and choose it's own counters by swapping between two sets and a few moves while also decimating 90% of the metagame with just 3 moveslots taken up. The opportunity cost attached to it is basically nonexistant since we have a ton of good pivots around and it's by far the best Tera abuser in the tier. I also find that it basically contributes nothing positive to the tier whatsoever and only serves to force specific mons on certain teams. I will be voting BAN on this mon.


Also a small sidenote about some hypotheticals. I think that the main issue behind Toxtricity is that we have like no Ground types that actually check it which leads to the same Grounds being spammed, which would not be as big of an issue if Toedscruel dropped next month. Since Toedscruel is pretty ass in UU atm and has been pretty middling usage wise I could see Toxtricity becoming a bit easier to deal with in April if Toedscruel drops. This is of course only a hypothetical solution that's not applicable til next month, but depending on how the tier shakes up a non ban wouldn't be the worst thing ever.

 

[ihbst]

Why is Toxtricity broken?

Its extremely powerful boomburst/volt switch combination makes its choice specs set really hard to switch into. Why shouldn't Toxtricity be banned? it is hard to find an opportunity to come in, and it can be a momentum drain if your move gets blocked. The specs set can deal some serious damage, but both of its most powerful moves have a type immune to it.

Shift gear throat spray Toxtricity's power is about equal to the specs set if you have throat spray up and it can only use throat spray once, but it can boost its speed. The post above describes it well(better vs offense than specs but weaker against defense). It can be hard to stop if it gets going, but it needs a turn to set up shift gear and the first sound move is weaker. If it switches after using a sound move, it can never recover the boost. Even if it gets the 2 turns to set up, it doesn't sweep easily unless the opponent team is heavily damaged.

There are a few other niche sets, but specs and shift gear throat spray are the main ones.

My final thought is that Toxtricity is high risk/high reward, so I will be voting dnb if I qualify/

sidenote but the real problem is rotom heat/mow and maybe kilowattrel since its secondary powerful move(in this case its STAB) has no type immunity, making volt switch harder to switch into

 

[sage_yt]

​

It's finally time for RU's first suspect test of the 9th generation. This time we've decided to start with one of the most controversial Pokémon in the tier: Toxtricity.

Toxtricity's main appeal lies in its insane raw power + coverage that make it way too hard to handle. And with the newly added terastalization, Toxtricity can become a normal type, making Boomburst (the most spammable move) hit even harder thanks to the tera boost. It also has coverage to hit one of its most famous checks, Palossand, with a Punk Rock boosted Snarl, just showing how hard it is to switch in to it. Despite seeing less usage after the Light Clay ban, Toxtricity can also run Shift Gear sets that make it harder to revenge kill, as well as have Drain Punch in order to recover health if the opponent is trying to check you with a Blissey or a Copperajah. And as of lately, we've seen Choice Scarf sets that abuse the previously mentioned Normal Tera to pick surprise kills with ease. Surprisingly enough, Toxtricity also has fewer issues switching in than in the previous generation, as poison/electric resists quite a lot of the common attacks used in this tier from Pokémon like Revavroom, Klefki, Kilowattrel, etc.

While the other side of the coin says that the meta is not that kind to Toxtricity to let it rampage as free as it would like to. Most common teams lately have enough breakers that are faster, and that can KO Toxtricity, while the slower teams see more issues against it, but still have Blissey as the best possible answer for the Choice Specs set. While we mentioned that its typing is not bad to switch in, its bulk really limits it to how much it can take. At the end of the day, it'll be up to the community to decide if Toxtricity is a presence that overbears people who worry too much about checking it, or if it's just another one of those breakers you can just outpressure with a strong enough team.

We'd appreciate if you could post your thoughts below, as it makes it easier for the less knowledgeable players to follow the discussion, and educate themselves. However, keep in mind that - as is standard for the forum - one-liners and posts lacking substance are subject to deletion and, in extreme cases, may lead to infractions.

​

Tagging Kris and Marty to announce it on the RU ladder, thank you both!

minimum games needed

GXE	minimum games
78	50
78.2	49
78.4	48
78.6	47
78.8	46
79	45
79.2	44
79.4	43
79.6	42
79.8	41
80	40
80.2	39
80.4	38
80.6	37
80.8	36
81	35
81.2	34
81.4	33
81.6	32
81.8	31

i been using tox since day one of ru and it's counter by pallo blissy or any over pokemon who can take it and tox is not very slow but for an elec type at least and frail and hard to get in (nvm snarl sometimes counter pallo but if you don't miss)

 

[Deez Is The Way]

Who else thinks toxtricity is getting banned

 

[Feliburn]

Hey all, I've been wondering how to go about this post for a while, but I wanna start some discussion.

Firstly, I agree with most of what was said in this post:

Why is Toxtricity broken?

Its extremely powerful boomburst/volt switch combination makes its choice specs set really hard to switch into. Why shouldn't Toxtricity be banned? it is hard to find an opportunity to come in, and it can be a momentum drain if your move gets blocked. The specs set can deal some serious damage, but both of its most powerful moves have a type immune to it.

Shift gear throat spray Toxtricity's power is about equal to the specs set if you have throat spray up and it can only use throat spray once, but it can boost its speed. The post above describes it well(better vs offense than specs but weaker against defense). It can be hard to stop if it gets going, but it needs a turn to set up shift gear and the first sound move is weaker. If it switches after using a sound move, it can never recover the boost. Even if it gets the 2 turns to set up, it doesn't sweep easily unless the opponent team is heavily damaged.

There are a few other niche sets, but specs and shift gear throat spray are the main ones.

My final thought is that Toxtricity is high risk/high reward, so I will be voting dnb if I qualify/

sidenote but the real problem is rotom heat/mow and maybe kilowattrel since its secondary powerful move(in this case its STAB) has no type immunity, making volt switch harder to switch into

I've already mentioned a lot that I think Toxtricity is not the classic overpowered mon that can be used in every team and just 6-0s you or wins games. It's not as easy to use in teams in the current meta, and it relies on Tera a lot to get the notable KOs that surprise the tier. I'm not saying it's bad, but it's the classic example of a Pokémon, just how ihbst said, that is high reward when it works. Most of the comments I see are "on paper" arguments that, as valid as they are, don't translate well to actual practice. I know most people who have played at a higher level can vouch for the lack of Toxtricity used, and it's not because people aren't using it, they simply can't spam it as freely as they'd like. Scarf sets imo are the easiest to slap because they are harder to revenge kill, and still hit surprisingly hard.

I wanna get a bit into the Rotom forms. I don't think Mow is broken at all because grass coverage is decently handled in this tier. Most of them were mentioned by Togkey previously, and there are some more than work as decent Storm switchins (I implore people to explore Bronzong more as a Pokémon, it's not bad). Idk how I feel about the whole "it enables breakers by Volt Switching" well so do many mons with momentum moves like Parting Shot Revavroom, the uturners and other volt switch users like Kilowattrel. I think people just have a really strong impression on Rotom-Heat, and it translates to Rotom-Mow by default.

Now onto Rotom-Heat, more of a controversial mon to talk about. Fire coverage is scarier than Grass atm, and its resistances are better suited for the metagame. But I'll just try to talk from experience rather than anything else: as someone who mainly uses BO and faster oriented teams, dealing with and using Rotom-Heat does not make me feel like I'm at either an advantage or at a disadvantage than the person in the opposite side (using it vs not using it). Whenever I'm using Rotom-Heat I need to be wary of not letting myself be at -2 after using an Overheat because then I easily become set up fodder, and whenever I'm playing vs it, the lack of recovery and how much it's forced to take hits just does not make me feel pressured at all. I've been using a lot of Arboliva which does a lot with normal coverage (even grass coverage hits super hard depending on the set), Copper can run rock coverage for it, as I've seen copper used as a non rocker lately. I won't really list too much because that's not the point here, but from my experience playing, all I can say is Rotom-Heat is a fantastic mon but nothing I'd consider banworthy. I can't really put into words how I feel about the mon, cause a lot of it is just in practice observations and my specific playstyle. I know people who use slower teams probably struggle more, but I think if ur hoping to check a Rotom with a Blissey and not expect to be volted on and have a breaker come in for free, then I think ur not adapting to the current meta. If ur gonna tell me that it's unhealthy that a mon is preventing a style from being used more, then just remember this entire generation has been unkind to slower teams in most tiers I've touched. At some point I think the way we view the structure of the game has to be updated with what we are given.

Hopefully we can see more comments on Tox and the Rotom forms, cause I know my word isn't absolute and I can be proven wrong, but this is how I feel about the current state of the metagame.

 

[Sneakyplanner]

The main thing I learned from my suspect run is that RU ladder is weird and makes no sense. I ran into so few toxtricities that I wouldn't be surprised if it dropped to NU, and somehow the most common team archetype is stall. Playing 60 games on ladder didn't really help me understand toxtricity at all

I've given my thoughts on toxtricity earlier in the thread and they remain largely unchanged. If you can get a 2-1 lead early on, then toxtricity might just be able to carry you to victory, and if you don't then it can struggle to safely switch in. It's still threatening even when playing from behind though, and its typing is surprisingly good at keeping it from being revenge killed by common pokemon like Flamigo and mowtom. I don't think that toxtricity is too reliant on tera to succeed; even our specially defensive steels are 3hko'd by boomburst and if it does tera then it just ohkos everything that doesn't resist. ghost types, even Palossand, are all one prediction away from being evaporated (are ghosts already evaporated?), so they are unable to counter Toxtricity in the long term. And of course there are the times where you guess that it's choice specs, switch in a sacrifice and then feel your soul get torn from your body as it clicks shift gear. I don't believe Toxtricity is the strongest pokemon in the tier, but it is the most unhealthy and therefore I will be voting to ban it.

Now to talk about other things I actually did learn in my ladder run:
Rotoms :
The rotoms are the other broken pokemon in discussion right now, and I could definitely agree with heattom being banned. We just don't have ground types that can take an overheat and if you let it get a nasty plot up then there are no safe plays. I was carried really hard by heattom in my suspect run, and it allowed me to play so sloppily knowing I had a win condition in the back. It can even beat blissey if it's at full health. Mowtom isn't quite at the same level as toxtricity and heattom in my eyes though. Scarf mowtom can be a pain due to threatening ground types with the unexistence storm and we don't have any steelixes or flygons to take it neutrally, but that is still prediction reliant and there are switch ins like arboliva that can take any hit. Our mowtom problem would be solved overnight by UU letting Toedscruel find a happy home.

Stall : For the past few days it has felt like stall is the most common archetype on ladder. Yourwelcomethanku must have secretly indoctrinated the ladder, because Blissey and Altaria were on a majority of teams that I faced in my last week on ladder. I believe this is in large part because toxtricity and heattom are threats which can only be kept in check by Blissey, but also it's just because having Blissey down in a tier without OU levels of special threats was always bound to become a problem. Alomomola and Blissey are impossible to break together, I don't think stall is a balance problem yet, but it could very well become one in the future.

Salazzle : This thing is lowkey S tier, or at least it would be if Altaria and Blissey weren't at 50% usage. There are a few pokemon running around running mono-fairy coverage that give salazzle easy entry, and it has a lot of viable movesets. Knock off is great when paired with klefki spikes, encore has a dozen fun uses such as forcing a toxic on a team with blissey and nasty plot is a nasty sweeper. Only being outsped by Kilowtatrel and Weavile is an added bonus. I can't wait to run Salazzle on a team where half the pokemon don't have to be anti-toxtricity measures and I can use encore salazzle with good pivots.

 

[Seed Sower]

Just finished getting my reqs. It seems like the ladder has warped in the opposite direction to specifically deal with Toxtricity... I saw a lot more Palossand and Blissey than I did Tox during my run.

Blissey is one thing, but the fact that SpDef Palossand of all Pokemon - which I find super mediocre outside of stopping Tox - is seeing such high usage is clear evidence how constraining it is on teambuilding. I echo what others have said in that Tox isn't broken in a vacuum, but it begets niche, specific answers and guessing games to stop it from OHKOing or 2HKOing the entire tier. It can even muscle pass some of these niche checks with stuff like Snarl and Drain Punch; to me, that only further cements how gross it is in the tier rn. I'll be voting ban.

 

[TH1N3 H4MM3R]

how does it feel that two of ur main defensive backbones yeeted themselves out of ur tier

 

[Sneakyplanner]

how does it feel that two of ur main defensive backbones yeeted themselves out of ur tier

Bad, pretty bad. Well except for alomomola, I feel alright about that one leaving. With heattom and the taurii gone I don't see a way that toxtricity can stay in the tier. The offensive powerhouses faster than toxtricity just got a lot weaker, and that was the best argument against banning.

 

[WilhelmTheOkay]

April 2023 RU changes:

Alomomola moved from RU to UU
Rotom-Heat moved from RU to UU
Tauros-Paldea-Aqua moved from RU to UU
Tauros-Paldea-Blaze moved from RU to UU

Brute Bonnet moved from UU to RU
Indeedee moved from UU to RU

-:
+:

So the Rotom-Heat problem solved itself and some key defensive mons went along with it to the wild UU yonder (with Toxtricity looking likely to join them in five days) and Indeedee-M and Brute Bonnet have come on down. I don't really have much of an opinion on Indeedee, but I do like Brute Bonnet.

So Brute Bonnet is here and successfully managed to dodge the Fire Tauros matchup but still finds itself in a bit of an unfriendly environment with Flamigo and Toxtricity still at the top of the usage table. However, Brute Bonnet will have the highest Atk in the tier, really good defensive stats, STAB Sucker, and Spore. Still waiting to actually use this guy in RU at the moment, but I just wanted to see what else other people are thinking about Brute Bonnet and the metagame as a whole without the Tauri, Alomomola, and Rotom-Heat.

 

[whateew]

So Brute Bonnet is here and successfully managed to dodge the Fire Tauros matchup but still finds itself in a bit of an unfriendly environment with Flamigo and Toxtricity still at the top of the usage table. However, Brute Bonnet will have the highest Atk in the tier, really good defensive stats, STAB Sucker, and Spore. Still waiting to actually use this guy in RU at the moment, but I just wanted to see what else other people are thinking about Brute Bonnet and the metagame as a whole without the Tauri, Alomomola, and Rotom-Heat.

I really like it ! It has a nice match up on our defensive walls, and while losing to the bird isn't great, it gets a lot of mileage when paired with rocky helm for chip. It forces a lot of switches, so I've been running it with lefties right now and I love it. I wonder if maybe banded / booster energy trailblaze could be a usable set lol

 

[Feliburn]

So let's talk a bit about the tier...

Firstly, Toxtricity has been banned from RU!

If people were unsure as to what to vote, I'm sure losing 3 of our better offensive mons surely made them think Toxtricity had no place in this tier.

Next, the tier shifts:

We lost both Tauros forms and Rotom-Heat, all of which were considered to be top tier presences in RU. It'll be interesting to see what offensive options get better after the shifts.

Alomomola also left the tier, which was a tool used in stall and slower teams to pass wishes. Not sure how much it affects the playstyle, but I'm guessing the slot of a wish passer will be used by Vaporeon in teams were mola was a decent fit. Tho not having regenerator makes the playstyle a bit more awkward.

Next, we got Indeedee and Brute Bonnet. Two potent hitters that will surely shake the entire tier. Indeedee opens up the possibility of more offensive terrain based teams, while Brute Bonnet is a potent tool for sun teams, and it's looking to be a good breaker outside of them as well.

What do you think about these drops? What mons do you think will get better?

 

[Sneakyplanner]

We lost both Tauros forms and Rotom-Heat, all of which were considered to be top tier presences in RU. It'll be interesting to see what offensive options get better after the shifts.

The pokemon I think get better because of this are the wallbreakers in that 90-100 speed range. There are now officially no pokemon at base 100 in RU, and this helps pokemon like Arcanine, Krookodile/bruxish and the new Indeedee a lot. I think Bruxish especially benefits from this due to it filling a similar niche to banded water bull. Scarf Krook and Indeedee (primeape too, maybe) now seem like they are the scarfers to use if you want something faster than the likes of gardevoir and flamigo.

Bulk up bull sets look very hard to replace since there isn't really anything else that can match their power while having solid bulk. Heracross stands out to me as something that might become better now that it's the fastest fighting type with trailblaze. Heracross can just sweep entire teams with one good trailblaze, and now there are no bulls to intimidate it.

Rotom-heat leaving has at least put that discourse on pause for a month or two. There is no replacement for a pivot with a strong typing that can also just win the game with 1 nasty plot boost. Rotom-mow occupies a similar niche, but not really. It's harder to break teams with mowtom due to its STABs being easier to resist. Maybe we see more nasty plot mowtoms or see arcanine rise a bit as an offensive fire type.

Next, we got Indeedee and Brute Bonnet. Two potent hitters that will surely shake the entire tier. Indeedee opens up the possibility of more offensive terrain based teams, while Brute Bonnet is a potent tool for sun teams, and it's looking to be a good breaker outside of them as well.

Brute bonnet is a very welcome addition to the tier. Some common thoughts I've had when trying to build in the past month have been that there are no grass types to be immune to arboliva's leech seed and few reliable ghost/dark resists. Brute bonnet has a very convenient defensive typing... if you ignore all those weaknesses. Bonnet can be used defensively against arboliva, rotom-mow or krookodile (until it clicks a coverage move) that can also deal a lot of damage. Sucker punch is also some very strong priority that can help in an emergency, though it's priority that turns into a rough 50/50 against cetitian. I think the other grasses are going to see a rise in usage too because now you need to have a plan to deal with spore.

Indeedee is tricky to compare to gardevoir. Indeedee has higher neutral damage thanks to psychic terrain as well as an immunity to prankster thunder wave, but lacks the wonderful coverage of stab moonblast and mystical fire for klefki. Indeedee's speed tier looks really good since it's faster than the big cluster of pokemon in the 80-92 range Indeedee seems like a scarf garde that is a bit weaker but is actually faster than the other scarfers.

 

[Fabi_ODST]

Tier shift season again baby! Even though we lost both tauros forms, we gained an incredible mon in Ungabo.... Brute Bonnet, which is honestly the mon I was waiting for. Finally! A mon that threatens the most common defensive cores while not being dead weight (debatable) against offense <3 It's also our first physical grass type (well, abomasnow can be physical, but most just spam blizzard) since the tier's creation, which is nice. The set I've been using is:

Brute Bonnet @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Protosynthesis
Tera Type: Dark
EVs: 164 HP / 252 Atk / 92 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Substitute
- Seed Bomb
- Close Combat
- Sucker Punch

I feel sub + 3 attacks with wish support is the way to go. You cover most of the top 10 used mons while having tera sucker punch to dent/pick off revenge killers. 164 HP allows it to make 101 HP subs, so your subs are not broken by seismic toss. The speed EVs are still a WIP. You need at least 44 to outspeed base 60s like Abomasnow, but the rest are up to you (with 92 you outspeed base 65s like komala, but idk how useful is that). I was thinking of using loaded dice + bullet seed, but idk how that calc goes against mudsdale, so I went with boots + seed bomb.

All in all, I'm exited to see how the tier evolves with the new additions, and we also have some new toys in decidueye and samurott to look forward to.