Earlier this week, Aislinn and the rest of the OU council unlocked our open mic thread to discuss Sleep's effect on SV OU throughout the generation and if action should be taken to address it. While Darkrai has been at the forefront of discussion as the most egregious Sleep user available due to its access to Bad Dreams, an immensely valuable Speed tier, and powerful boosting in Nasty Plot, it has also been similarly argued that the issue does not just stem from Darkrai, but from Sleep in the tier outright.
Here we will be having a more focused discussion on how to proceed with this proposed issue, and assess if it is even a problem at all. Below, solutions will be listed and briefly described. For more details regarding earlier discussion, please visit this thread!
__
Relevance
Sleep itself is a complicated subject, as while it is elaborately intertwined with RNG, there has been a great deal of discussion as to whether the Sleep Clause needs to be touched, and if doing so would be a bad idea on principle. The Sleep Clause's design and implementation in modern generations centers around precedent set in Pokemon Stadium 1 & 2, a Gen 1/2 battle simulator designed and published by Nintendo. With this mod that has been officially endorsed in past generations, it has been passed down as a generally agreed upon compromise to limit the degree of which Sleep's variance can shake up games while preserving a major mechanic. However its in-congruence with future installments have led many to question the integrity of it due to its inability to be replicated on cartridge, and if it is just an archaic relic of a different era in tiering philosophy that ought to be abandoned completely. Though with no pressing incentive to have a dialogue about it and because Pokemon Showdown is where nearly all Smogon play is localized regardless, it has been left untouched as of this post.
However, in recent months, the variance involved with Sleep in its current state has become a far more prevalent factor in high level SV OU play as a result of Hypnosis and Sleep Powder, inaccurate sleep moves that are widely distributed to fast setup sweepers like Iron Valiant, Darkrai, and Hisuian Lilligant, and see additional usage on Pokemon like Alolan Ninetales that can easily fish for it and enable volatile wallbreakers. In particular, their presence on Pokemon like these has been widespread in the past week as a result of the extremely high reward involved with these moves and optimizations to reduce the variance involved with their inaccuracy. Options that can leverage some misses such as a held Focus Sash or dual Screens can aid in landing these moves more consistently and allow these dangerous Pokemon to muscle through nearly any check, especially as Gholdengo and Gliscor are the only Pokemon immune to Hypnosis compared to Sleep Powder and the accurate Spore. At best, it is an empty fishing attempt that completely wastes a Pokemon, and at worst, it is a gambit that can define games if the numbers fall in their favor. In SV OU this is extremely apparent, as the tier's best users were not available in previous generations, but the fundamental problem is still replicable in oldgens and different formats. Amoonguss embodies this as a multigenerational Pokemon whose main sets center around usage of Spore, and it can very easily execute the move with its great resistance profile, access to Regenerator, and solid all-around bulk. In SV OU specifically it has often run a Red Card, adding an additional layer of RNG that can potentially lead to a key Pokemon being put to Sleep with no turns burnt off. As a result of all of these factors coming to a head, Sleep is more hotly debated than it has been in years, leading to the OU council to believe that it is worthy of more formal discussion.
___
Solutions
Solution 1: Upgrade the Sleep Clause
A very easy solution to this problem is to upgrade the Sleep Clause to a blanket ban on direct Sleep-inducing moves. This has been hovered among the council as the immediate option, and has been a popular solution in the community for a while. Because of Hypnosis's increased usage on the ladder as well as moves like Sleep Powder and Spore also existing, there is more direct evidence that would favor taking this route by suggesting that the clause in its current state is not sufficient at mitigating it at its worst.
There are counterarguments being made about it setting dangerous precedent on tiering status infliction in general, as Paralysis and moves like Scald both introduce a degree of game-warping variance to the game (although this can be contested by the fact that Sleep specifically has been officially claused, making it harder to compare with other RNG-based tools in the metagame). Additionally, it has been argued that the clause itself is perfectly sufficient at limiting the frequency of Sleep's worst moments and that taking this route would lead to unneeded collateral toward more balanced Sleep users like Breloom.
Solution 2: Do Nothing
Some council members and members of the community have also expressed that this is a non-issue and that the strategy, while popular, remains inconsistent to a degree where it is generally undesirable at a high level. Inconsistency can spell doom, especially if the strategy is entirely defined by factors outside of the player's control and are layered with RNG. However, taking this route doesn't necessarily mean ignoring the problem, as it can also mean evaluating individual Pokemon as opposed to the clause at large.
___
Last but not least, a survey will be launched next week which will include questions about Sleep-inducing moves, the Sleep Clause, and Darkrai where you will be able to directly voice your thoughts on the matter in a quantified setting. Thank you!
Here we will be having a more focused discussion on how to proceed with this proposed issue, and assess if it is even a problem at all. Below, solutions will be listed and briefly described. For more details regarding earlier discussion, please visit this thread!
__
Relevance
Sleep itself is a complicated subject, as while it is elaborately intertwined with RNG, there has been a great deal of discussion as to whether the Sleep Clause needs to be touched, and if doing so would be a bad idea on principle. The Sleep Clause's design and implementation in modern generations centers around precedent set in Pokemon Stadium 1 & 2, a Gen 1/2 battle simulator designed and published by Nintendo. With this mod that has been officially endorsed in past generations, it has been passed down as a generally agreed upon compromise to limit the degree of which Sleep's variance can shake up games while preserving a major mechanic. However its in-congruence with future installments have led many to question the integrity of it due to its inability to be replicated on cartridge, and if it is just an archaic relic of a different era in tiering philosophy that ought to be abandoned completely. Though with no pressing incentive to have a dialogue about it and because Pokemon Showdown is where nearly all Smogon play is localized regardless, it has been left untouched as of this post.
However, in recent months, the variance involved with Sleep in its current state has become a far more prevalent factor in high level SV OU play as a result of Hypnosis and Sleep Powder, inaccurate sleep moves that are widely distributed to fast setup sweepers like Iron Valiant, Darkrai, and Hisuian Lilligant, and see additional usage on Pokemon like Alolan Ninetales that can easily fish for it and enable volatile wallbreakers. In particular, their presence on Pokemon like these has been widespread in the past week as a result of the extremely high reward involved with these moves and optimizations to reduce the variance involved with their inaccuracy. Options that can leverage some misses such as a held Focus Sash or dual Screens can aid in landing these moves more consistently and allow these dangerous Pokemon to muscle through nearly any check, especially as Gholdengo and Gliscor are the only Pokemon immune to Hypnosis compared to Sleep Powder and the accurate Spore. At best, it is an empty fishing attempt that completely wastes a Pokemon, and at worst, it is a gambit that can define games if the numbers fall in their favor. In SV OU this is extremely apparent, as the tier's best users were not available in previous generations, but the fundamental problem is still replicable in oldgens and different formats. Amoonguss embodies this as a multigenerational Pokemon whose main sets center around usage of Spore, and it can very easily execute the move with its great resistance profile, access to Regenerator, and solid all-around bulk. In SV OU specifically it has often run a Red Card, adding an additional layer of RNG that can potentially lead to a key Pokemon being put to Sleep with no turns burnt off. As a result of all of these factors coming to a head, Sleep is more hotly debated than it has been in years, leading to the OU council to believe that it is worthy of more formal discussion.
___
Solutions
Solution 1: Upgrade the Sleep Clause
A very easy solution to this problem is to upgrade the Sleep Clause to a blanket ban on direct Sleep-inducing moves. This has been hovered among the council as the immediate option, and has been a popular solution in the community for a while. Because of Hypnosis's increased usage on the ladder as well as moves like Sleep Powder and Spore also existing, there is more direct evidence that would favor taking this route by suggesting that the clause in its current state is not sufficient at mitigating it at its worst.
There are counterarguments being made about it setting dangerous precedent on tiering status infliction in general, as Paralysis and moves like Scald both introduce a degree of game-warping variance to the game (although this can be contested by the fact that Sleep specifically has been officially claused, making it harder to compare with other RNG-based tools in the metagame). Additionally, it has been argued that the clause itself is perfectly sufficient at limiting the frequency of Sleep's worst moments and that taking this route would lead to unneeded collateral toward more balanced Sleep users like Breloom.
Solution 2: Do Nothing
Some council members and members of the community have also expressed that this is a non-issue and that the strategy, while popular, remains inconsistent to a degree where it is generally undesirable at a high level. Inconsistency can spell doom, especially if the strategy is entirely defined by factors outside of the player's control and are layered with RNG. However, taking this route doesn't necessarily mean ignoring the problem, as it can also mean evaluating individual Pokemon as opposed to the clause at large.
___
Last but not least, a survey will be launched next week which will include questions about Sleep-inducing moves, the Sleep Clause, and Darkrai where you will be able to directly voice your thoughts on the matter in a quantified setting. Thank you!
