Registeel (Substitute)

[Flora]

Registeel

Status: L&O.

[SET]
name: Substitute
move 1: Substitute
move 2: Focus Punch
move 3: Iron Head
move 4: Thunder Wave
item: Leftovers
nature: Adamant
evs: 252 HP / 252 Atk / 4 Def

Why this set deserves to be on-site:

- Substitute + Thunder Wave = annoying to the foe if bulky Ground-types aren't present. If so, they usually have no reliable recovery so a Focus Punch + entry hazards will usually wear them down.

- Alongside Sub, Focus Punch and Iron Head combine well, dealing reasonable damage or flinching foes to death. This works well factoring in Registeel's bulk and resistances.

- No similar set on-site.

Additional Comments:

- Haven't really used any other modifications; I don't think there's any other moves/EVs I would use.

- Mostly abuses Thunder Wave's chance of paralyze to succeed (and beat Pokemon it's not really supposed to beat, such as defensive Arcanine).

- Leftovers is used because Registeel wants to retain its bulk for more Substitutes and walling; Life Orb would hurt too much.

- Most other Pokemon don't have reliable recovery, so they will be weakened eventually overtime for Registeel to dominate them. Even some other Pokemon who resist both Focus Punch and Iron Head (most notably Rotom) will possibly lose.

- Earthquake over Focus Punch, thanks to The Cicada, can help deal more damage to Arcanine and Blaziken. It also helps against Drapion and Qwilfish. The trade-off for using Earthquake is no more reliably killing Dark- and Normal-types, as well as more damage overall on neutral targets.

- Wants entry hazards, mainly Stealth Rock, to weaken Fire-types. Toxic Spikes... not so much because it conflicts crazily with Thunder Wave.

Teammates and Counters:

- Bulky Ground-types (Claydol, Donphan, Torterra, Steelix, even Nidoking) are solid counters to this set, taking little damage from Focus Punch/Iron Head and being immune to T-wave. As such, Milotic helps, but against Torterra, Mesprit does well (and helps against the others as well).

- Milotic is somewhat troubling. On one hand, its Surfs doesn't break Registeel's Substitute. But on the other, Thunder Wave enhances Milotic's Defense, making it more difficult to kill with Focus Punch. Milotic takes 26.5% - 31.3% from Focus Punch without Marvel Scale activated though. And... Recover is annoying. It's better to Thunder Wave and run off to a special attacker. Venusaur and Nasty Plot Toxicroak helps out here. Oh, Slowbro/Slowking wall this Registeel as well. Specially defensive Tangrowth can help out against them and Milotic.

- Fighting-types look threatening, but they're beatable actually by this Registeel. Poliwrath is the only threatening Fighter if it gets in while Registeel Substitutes and uses Substitute itself. Some of the mentioned partners (Venusaur, maybe Milotic, Mesprit) help against Poliwrath. Don't mention Hitmonlee... it takes 85.5% - 100.8% from Focus Punch so it'll probably die after Stealth Rock + Life Orb recoil.

- Rotom, especially SubSplit versions, is a great partner to Registeel, defeating Moltres, other Rotom, and Milotic (given the scenarios), as well as having great defensive synergy and the ability to weaken each other's counters.

- Wish is helpful but not necessary. Leafeon's good for this.

Random Damage Calculations

These aren't suppose to be "impressive". And... yes, entry hazards help.

• Focus Punch against Morning Glory Arcanine: 42.7% - 50.4% (Intimidate negated by Clear Body) (2-3HKO).
• Focus Punch against 252/0 Azumarill: 37.1% - 43.8% (3HKO).
• Focus Punch against 160/0 Cloyster: 52.7% - 62.6% (2HKO).
• Focus Punch against 0/4, 7 HP IV Sceptile: 68.9% - 81.3% (2HKO).
• Focus Punch against 140/32 Rhyperior: 35.7% - 42.4% (3HKO sadly).
  
• Iron Head against 16/0 Heracross: 41.6% - 49.2% (will do more because of Close Combat) (2HKO because of Defense drop).
• Iron Head against 252/252 Impish Hitmontop: 24.7% - 28.9% (4-5HKO).
• Iron Head against 4/0 Mesprit: 31.9% - 37.9% (3-4HKO).
• Iron Head against 4/0 Mismagius: 57.6% - 67.9% (2HKO).

 

[The Cicada]

Those calcs......... are quite impressive (for Registeel). I like the way this set looks, will begin testing asap.


Edit: Alright i have been testing this out for a while now and it is really good. I tried Earthquake over Focus Punch for a while, and it worked pretty well. With Earthquake, Registeel can 2HKO Arcanine all the time, and is also quite helpful for other Fire-types. Earthquake should be either mentioned in AC or slashed from my experience.

 

[Flora]

Those calcs......... are quite impressive (for Registeel). I like the way this set looks, will begin testing asap.


Edit: Alright i have been testing this out for a while now and it is really good. I tried Earthquake over Focus Punch for a while, and it worked pretty well. With Earthquake, Registeel can 2HKO Arcanine all the time, and is also quite helpful for other Fire-types. Earthquake should be either mentioned in AC or slashed from my experience.

Earthquake could work out. Moltres of course still walls Registeel, and Houndoom is still OHKOed... Blaziken is still 2HKOed (74.4% - 87.7%) but otherwise that's more damage against Blaziken. I still prefer using Focus Punch's 50 more Base Power overall but yeah, I'll mention it in AC for Arcanine or reliability. Thanks for testing!

 

[EonADS]

A couple of things I've noticed while playing around with this:

-SubSteel pretty much requires entry hazzard support (excepting Toxic Spikes, which would interfere with Thunder Wave) to work, but if it has that, your opponent is in for a buttload of problems.

-SubSplit Rotom is one of SubSteel's greatest teammates. Not only can it defeat Moltres, Opposing Rotom, and Milotic; but it also has excellent synergy with Registeel and can weaken both of their respective counters with Sub + Pain Split.

-Wish support, though not required, is defenitely beneficial if you plan on using SubSteel as the centerpiece of the team. Unfortunately, most UU/NU Wish supporters don't have the right typing to work with Registeel, and thus it's not a main option.

That's about the size of it. So far, I'm loving the set, it's definitely an under-appreciated niche for Registeel.

 

[Flora]

A couple of things I've noticed while playing around with this:

-SubSteel pretty much requires entry hazzard support (excepting Toxic Spikes, which would interfere with Thunder Wave) to work, but if it has that, your opponent is in for a buttload of problems.

-SubSplit Rotom is one of SubSteel's greatest teammates. Not only can it defeat Moltres, Opposing Rotom, and Milotic; but it also has excellent synergy with Registeel and can weaken both of their respective counters with Sub + Pain Split.

-Wish support, though not required, is defenitely beneficial if you plan on using SubSteel as the centerpiece of the team. Unfortunately, most UU/NU Wish supporters don't have the right typing to work with Registeel, and thus it's not a main option.

That's about the size of it. So far, I'm loving the set, it's definitely an under-appreciated niche for Registeel.

Thank you for playtesting and commenting on this set!

Okay, I'll give a good mention of SR and/or Spikes. They do definitely help, especially against Arcanine. edit: forgot Toxic Spikes conflicts with Thunder Wave badly, so I'll mention that.

Yeah, Rotom's a really nice partner due to being immune to Ground and Fighting. I'll emphasize on SubSplit though, which I haven't done. edit: actually, I never mentioned Rotom? Wow, lol, yeah, Rotom's added now.

Wish is definitely helpful due to the lack of recovery. Leafeon is actually a pretty good Wisher with this Registeel because of how threatening Ground-types are. Fire-types may hurt but at least they can be paralyzed (Camerupt... is like never seen too).

edit: oops, I forgot to talk about a mod about this. IDK if it's "needed" or not but I don't mind this sitting here waiting for their comments.

 

[EonADS]

^You're welcome. Also, Leafeon is the Wish supporter I tested with this set, but I found Arcanine to be a problem too often for my liking. I guess it can still work, though.

 

[Jubilee]

Tested this set out this afternoon on PL and it works surprisingly well.
It obviously isn't Registeel's best set but it still keeps some of its great bulk and has a nice surprise factor, and it still abuses its tank sets ability to paralyze everything it can.
Definitely needs a teammate that can handle bulky grounds and water types like Milotic and Venusaur respectively.
Is still a nice check to Mismagius taking 94-112 damage from +0 HP Fighting, 125-148 from +2 Thunderbolt, unfortunately +2 HP Fighting is a 2HKO. Behind a sub HP Fighting-less Spiritomb, special Venusaur, Exeggutor, and Uxie cant touch it to just name a few, while crippling them with T-Wave, and possibly flinching them to death from Iron Head. It is also strong enough to break standard Rhyperior's substitutes. (Iron Head does 117-139). Overall its definitely a decent set Registeel can use while still remaining bulk.

 

[SlimMan]

Tested this set out this afternoon on PL and it works surprisingly well.
It obviously isn't Registeel's best set but it still keeps some of its great bulk and has a nice surprise factor, and it still abuses its tank sets ability to paralyze everything it can.
Definitely needs a teammate that can handle bulky grounds and water types like Milotic and Venusaur respectively.
Is still a nice check to Mismagius taking 94-112 damage from +0 HP Fighting, 125-148 from +2 Thunderbolt, unfortunately +2 HP Fighting is a 2HKO. Behind a sub HP Fighting-less Spiritomb, special Venusaur, Exeggutor, and Uxie cant touch it to just name a few, while crippling them with T-Wave, and possibly flinching them to death from Iron Head. It is also strong enough to break standard Rhyperior's substitutes. (Iron Head does 117-139). Overall its definitely a decent set Registeel can use while still remaining bulk.

Milotic isn't a bulky Ground and Venusaur isn't a bulky water. Unless respectively got a new meaning...

Can you give us some percents here? Please and thank you.

And while I'm not disagreeing with you, "its best set" is a pretty subjective phrase.

 

[Jubilee]

Milotic isn't a bulky Ground and Venusaur isn't a bulky water. Unless respectively got a new meaning...

Can you give us some percents here? Please and thank you.

And while I'm not disagreeing with you, "its best set" is a pretty subjective phrase.

If you read my post you'd see that I said "Definitely needs a teammate that can handle bulky grounds and water types like Milotic and Venusaur respectively." Meaning Milotic and Venusaur can handle bulky ground-types and bulky-water types respectively and can be a good teammate to this set. I can see how my post could've been a little confusing though, could've been better worded on my part.

+0 Mismagius Hidden Power Fighting (leftovers): 25.8%-30.7%
+2 Mismagius Thunderbolt (leftovers): 34.3%-40.6%
Registeel Iron Head against standard Rhyperior: 28.8%-34.2%
Registeel Iron Head against standard Mismagius: 57.6% - 67.9%

 

[SlimMan]

If you read my post you'd see that I said "Definitely needs a teammate that can handle bulky grounds and water types like Milotic and Venusaur respectively." Meaning Milotic and Venusaur can handle bulky ground-types and bulky-water types respectively and can be a good teammate to this set. I can see how my post could've been a little confusing though, could've been better worded on my part.

+0 Mismagius Hidden Power Fighting (leftovers): 25.8%-30.7%
+2 Mismagius Thunderbolt (leftovers): 34.3%-40.6%
Registeel Iron Head against standard Rhyperior: 28.8%-34.2%
Registeel Iron Head against standard Mismagius: 57.6% - 67.9%

My bad. I get pseudo-dyslexic sometimes, and I totally missed the word "like". Sorry.

And thank you for those calcs.

 

[Flora]

Thanks Jubilee for the comment.

This is for sure not Registeel's "best defensive set" but offensively, this is a different story. RestTalkCurse can't utilize Thunder Wave and SubPunch and acts as a status absorber as well as as a late-game sweeper, so it's a different role from SubSteel. There's an "Offensive Curse" set sitting around here too, but it doesn't utilize Thunder Wave and mostly seems to Explode on counters after a Curse, unlike SubSteel. I believe this set is one of Registeel's most safest sets that can deal good damage while support the team with Thunder Wave.

 

[Warped Worlds]

I think I will test this later if I have time. I remember running a Sub/Thunder Wave Magnezone, and I really enjoyed that.

It also reminds me of the Sub Thunder Wave Jirachis which have been successful in the OU environment for some time.

 

[uragg]

EDIT: QC REJECTED 1/2, interesting and not useless but I don't think it's good enough to merit a set. standard wall does walling better, and lure sets do that better, and this doesn't really mesh the two positives that well.

eh...I'm kind of iffy on this set. When I tested it, I never really felt that this set had any huge advantages over the standard support set, and it actually needs a lot more team support to function. Substitute is an awesome move and eases prediction, but with something as offensively anemic as Registeel it still doesn't help to break down much. I would rather just paralyze the Fire-type switch-in on the switch and have a free moveslot for something else than spend 19% of Registeel's health just to weakly Focus Punch Donphan/Torterra/Rhyperior. This set also loses out on bulk, and Registeel is such a defensive behemoth that having to bring additional walls to cover threats that it would normally beat (SubSplit Rotom, SubNP Missy, Alakazam) makes the team really stallish, which isn't good because it's not like Registeel is a devastating sweeper.

Basically, I just don't see the merits of this set over the standard. Being able to dent Rhyperior is cool, but a BaitSteel set would probably work better for that. This set isn't bad by any means since Registeel is a great Pokemon, but I'm leaning toward rejecting it because it simply can't do that much that the standard set couldn't, while sacrificing a good amount of bulk and overall utility. I'm also thinking that Toxic Spikes would work really well with this, as they add pretty significant damage to the Ground-types that trouble Registeel and can also wear down Milo and Slowbro if you can get both layers. However that strategy would seem to work just as well with the standard so...

 

[Flora]

Thanks for trying out the set uragg!

Yeah, I guess this set's a bit gimmicky. I can't really question you well since you've already rejected, but this was a set that I felt I could slap on any of my teams (mainly, balanced teams) and it could still do its job decently (paralyze and do more damage than the standard). I've felt that Registeel was doing most of the supporting by what's mentioned in the parenthesis. Perhaps the more experienced people can't really find a use for this set while the lower level people can against each other. IDK though because the people I've faced certainly didn't seem bad at all.

Well, one more rejection or a turn of events will do.

edit: Thund, if your set turns out better than this, I'll take it and see if it'll be approved or something.

edit: If Thund has absolutely no interest in testing this set, then I'd like this set rejected. Thanks everyone for posting!

 

[Thund91]

And here I thought only I used Substitute Registeel....Although mine was completely different, with Expert Belt and Earthquake/Ice Punch to lure and OHKO Fire-types and Dugtrio back in the day. Ahhh the memories. :p

Either way, it would be nice if Sub Regi can reinvent itself and actually be considered viable. I'll try and test this if I have time. Also, a pretesting note: Toxic should probably be slashed with Thunder Wave. This way you can status bulky Ground-types like Donphan and also defeat shit like Slowbro and non Resttalk Milotic one on one. Just an observation.

 

[Oglemi]

Flora, if you still feel this should be rejected, I'll be glad to move it. Unless other QC members say otherwise. Opinions?

Edit: Fair enough.

 

[Flora]

Flora, if you still feel this should be rejected, I'll be glad to move it. Unless other QC members say otherwise. Opinions?

I VMed Thund and it seems he still has intentions on testing this set and different modifications of it. I'll let it wait out a bit longer.

 

[Flora]

Okay, I've decided. I'm going to self-reject my own set on the basis of this set being luck-based (I'm pretty sure Bluewind said that such sets shouldn't deserve to be on-site, and I know he didn't really say this, but with an exception of some like parafusion Lanturn) and that Heracross shouldn't be mentioned (which was what sparked me to writing this since it could "beat" any non-RestTalk Heracross). This set "works", but it shouldn't get its own set on-site. So, this thread's basically finished and I'll have Relicanth replacing it soon. Sorry Thund, no testing for you.

 

[Oglemi]

Very well then. If Thund ends up thinking it does deserve a set, he or anybody else is free to appeal for this to be placed back in QC.

Moving.