SS OU Nihilego Kartana Offense

https://pokepast.es/4681d9fb7230bc93

Team I built and got to 1700s with.
Working ok but I feel like I'm going to plateau as I get higher on the ladder
First proper post on here, so any general advice taken too :)

ladder name is blip blipperson

(Nihilego) @ Power Herb
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 80 HP / 176 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Meteor Beam
- Grass Knot
- Sludge Wave
- Power Gem


This Pokémon was chosen because I believe its quite underrated in the current metagame.
I chose the power herb set, because it's an easy to achieve win condition in a lot of games (EVd to Beast Boost Speed)
I tested a lot of different sets, Meteor Beam, Sludge Wave and Grass Knot are 3 non-negotiable move slots, but the last one was tough.
Power Gem ended up being the most consistent!
This mon wins a lot of games on the spot once the opposing team is sufficiently chipped


(Tornadus-Therian) @ Heavy-Duty Boots
Ability: Regenerator
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Hurricane
- Taunt
- U-turn
- Knock Off

This was chosen as a blanket check to a lot of physical attackers, but also as an anti-lead to the rife Landorous.
It can taunt before the opposing Landorous rocks or toxics and then knock it off, providing crucial chip for Nihilego to clean later.
Taunt is also great for shutting down Mew, denying veil, webs and stopping Calm Mind users like Fini and Clef!


(Heatran) @ Air Balloon
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Eruption
- Earth Power
- Magma Storm
- Toxic

This was orginallly a Magenzone but I decided to use this popular set instead for the removal of steels for Nihilego's sweeps. Perhaps the Air Balloon set is slightly redundant seeing as the team isn't really weak to Landorous, although it's a nice counter to opposing Heatran on an otherwise Heatran weak team.
I decided to go with double fire move because of the need to remove steels even when at low health.
Toxic isn't clicked that often, but it's been great for trapping with Magma Storm on occasion.

(Kartana) @ Life Orb
Ability: Beast Boost
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Knock Off
- Sacred Sword
- Leaf Blade

The physical breaker for the team. A lot of teams are very weak to Life Orb Kartana, and while it may not get a lot of opportunities to Swords Dance on this type of team, it doesn't really need to, because it's main purpose is to break everything down so that Nihilego can sweep. The team is also quite weak to stall otherwise and this is one of the few remedies to that.


Tapu Fini @ Leftovers
Ability: Misty Surge
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Moonblast
- Taunt
- Nature's Madness


Quite a lame Fini set, but the team was incredibly weak to rain, weavile, and urshifu, and this was an easy check to all 3. This is why physical bulk was maximised. That being said, it's a lot of roles to compress onto one mon with no recovery, so perhaps Toxapex would be better served here instead? The combination of moves chosen has been pretty effective, with Nature's madness doing big chip for Nihilego to sweep later.


landorous (Landorus-Therian) @ Leftovers
Ability: Intimidate
EVs: 252 HP / 164 Def / 92 SpD
Impish Nature
IVs: 29 Spe
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- U-turn
- Knock Off

Landorous. The standard smogon EVs (Can take 2 +1 grassy glides from Rillaboom etc). This is used as the Teams Stealth Rocker and Electric check. I opted for Knock Off over Defog or Toxic because I feel a Landorous without Knock Off just sits there a lot of the time and is too passive. I decided to reduce the IVs quite a bit for the slow u-turns, especially seeing as I wasn't too worried about outspeeding Heatran because of my own Heatran
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Hi ciarzy, welcome to Smogon! I am locking your RMT for the time being as the forum rules require that you provide at least three lines of descriptions for each Pokemon to explain their roles. Please read the rules carefully and look at Team Showcase to see the detail we require. PM me with updated descriptions, and I will be happy to unlock this. Also, feel free to PM me if you need help or have any question. Have a nice day!

To PM someone on Smogon, go over their name on any of their post. It will display a little pop-up with a summary of their profile. Then, hit the "Start conversation" button and you will be able to write a PM just like you write a regular thread.
1646780881070.png

Why did you choose this Pokemon?
What do the EV spreads do and why do you have it?
What are all 4 moves for?

This thread is now unlocked, thanks!
 
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hey, this team looks pretty strong but has a couple easily resolvable weaknesses, both offensively and defensively

1. offensive strengthening
:heatran: --> :magnezone:
changing this to a more focused magnezone offense gives you more wallbreaking tools and a more synergistic offensive core to support kartana and nihilego better. by eliminating ferrothorn, melmetal, corviknight, and any other annoying steel-types, you can more easily get the value you want out of ur offense without having to predict around or be walled by some of these.

2. ghost resist, speed control
:tornadus-therian: --> :weavile:
dragapult outspeeds and wreaks havoc on this entire team. by carefully using the hp of your own lando, magnezone, and weavile, you can still take on what torn checks (kartana, some grounds) while being able to withstand the assault of shadow balls using weavile. having a reliable way to outspeed and ohko other torn is also extremely helpful for your kartana. if youd prefer to keep the tornadus approach there's a good similar team on samples atm using a similar yet bulkier nihi + zone + torn + melmetal structure as well

3. hazards organization
there are a few ways to proceed with ur hazards here, each with their own benefits and drawbacks. lacking defog here can leave you vulnerable to a lot of standard ferrothorn BOs: i'll leave it up to you to figure out which works best for u and stick with it
  • defog lando, rocks nihilego, utility/cm fini: rocks nihilego has less of the immediate sweeping power compared to 4a variants, not to mention its strain in keeping rocks up vs defog lando
  • rocks lando, defog fini, speed boosting 4a nihilego: lose out on some of the offensive potential from fini but get to keep the sweeping nihilego
  • defog + rocks lando, cm/utility fini, speed boosting 4a nihilego: although it seems like you get to have your cake and eat it too, fog rocks lando sucks vs other lando and heatran, and often doesn't accomplish what you want it to in practice but looks nice on paper
here are some more similar magnezone offensive structures used in SPL: feel free to experiment with some of the smaller differences there, like the usage of slowbro > fini, a scarfed (or even timid) kartana/lele instead of your SD variant, or the variety of different non-defogging fini sets you can use
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8ou-603037
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8ou-600603
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8ou-604019
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8ou-604677
 
hey, this team looks pretty strong but has a couple easily resolvable weaknesses, both offensively and defensively

1. offensive strengthening
:heatran: --> :magnezone:
changing this to a more focused magnezone offense gives you more wallbreaking tools and a more synergistic offensive core to support kartana and nihilego better. by eliminating ferrothorn, melmetal, corviknight, and any other annoying steel-types, you can more easily get the value you want out of ur offense without having to predict around or be walled by some of these.

2. ghost resist, speed control
:tornadus-therian: --> :weavile:
dragapult outspeeds and wreaks havoc on this entire team. by carefully using the hp of your own lando, magnezone, and weavile, you can still take on what torn checks (kartana, some grounds) while being able to withstand the assault of shadow balls using weavile. having a reliable way to outspeed and ohko other torn is also extremely helpful for your kartana. if youd prefer to keep the tornadus approach there's a good similar team on samples atm using a similar yet bulkier nihi + zone + torn + melmetal structure as well

3. hazards organization
there are a few ways to proceed with ur hazards here, each with their own benefits and drawbacks. lacking defog here can leave you vulnerable to a lot of standard ferrothorn BOs: i'll leave it up to you to figure out which works best for u and stick with it
  • defog lando, rocks nihilego, utility/cm fini: rocks nihilego has less of the immediate sweeping power compared to 4a variants, not to mention its strain in keeping rocks up vs defog lando
  • rocks lando, defog fini, speed boosting 4a nihilego: lose out on some of the offensive potential from fini but get to keep the sweeping nihilego
  • defog + rocks lando, cm/utility fini, speed boosting 4a nihilego: although it seems like you get to have your cake and eat it too, fog rocks lando sucks vs other lando and heatran, and often doesn't accomplish what you want it to in practice but looks nice on paper
here are some more similar magnezone offensive structures used in SPL: feel free to experiment with some of the smaller differences there, like the usage of slowbro > fini, a scarfed (or even timid) kartana/lele instead of your SD variant, or the variety of different non-defogging fini sets you can use
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8ou-603037
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8ou-600603
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8ou-604019
https://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/smogtours-gen8ou-604677
Thank you so much! Just reached a 1768 peak and I've also noticed I'm incredibly weak to rain :( - something i'll have to iron out too
 
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