Medicham (OU Antilead)

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DarXidE

DarXidE

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name: Medicham (OU Antilead)
move 1: Fake Out
move 2: Zen Headbutt
move 3: High-Jump Kick
move 4: Ice Punch
ability: Pure Power
item: Lum Berry
evs: 252 Attack, 252 speed, 4 HP
nature: Jolly

Why the set deserves to be on the site:
-Has great attack at 438 due to its fantastic ability, a decent speed to outspeed many key opponents such as Adamant Lucario, most Dragonite, and any neutral natured base 90 or lower.
-Counters almost every lead in the metagame.
-Gives your team a great offensive start.

Additional comments:
-Can give a great start to your match.
-Strong hitter and can even sweep unprepared teams.
-Can be a great late game sweeper as well.
-No current set like this.
-Lum Berry leaves it status free, and beats sleep inducing leads.

Teammates and Counters:
-A Scarf Tyranitar, Jirachi, or Flygon can be a good partner. First turn use Fake Out. Second turn switch to the pokemon you have partnered. Jirachi and Tyranitar are suggested because they have a 4x weakness and an immunity to psychic, respectively. Then u can KO with Pursuit, Iron Head, or hurt with u-turn and go back to medicham to KO with Fake Out, depending on the surcumstance.
-Mesprit, Uxie, and Cresselia counter this set well, although they are very rarely seen.
-A good Pursuiter or choice band scizor pairs well to get rid of bulky Psychic types.

Other Options:
-Bullet Punch can be used for extra priority, but its really not suggested.
-Another elemental punch can be used if you want to take care of certain pokemon, like gyarados, but ice punch is usually the best option.



Damage Calculations:

Fake Out vs. Standard Lead Azelf: 22.60% - 26.71%
Decent damage to have something else revenge kill.

Zen Headbutt vs. 252 HP / 0 Defense Machamp: 100.52% - 118.75%

Fake Out + Ice Punch vs. 252 HP / 80 Defense Roserade: 101.55% - 119.75%

Ice Punch vs. 252 HP / 0 Defense Dragonite: 108.81% - 128.50%

Hi-Jump Kick vs. 252 HP / 252 Defense Relaxed Swampert: 38.12% - 45.30% (Almost Always a 3HKO)

Hi-Jump Kick vs. 248 HP / 0 Defense Metagross: 44.08% - 52.07%

Fake Out + Ice Punch vs. 4 HP Aerodactyl: 106.62% - 126.16%
 
very little to low mid-game support due to middling speed and frail defenses

Doesn't beat the following common leads:
-Aerodactyl : still gets stealth rocks up, after your fake out, "wins" as they have SR up, and you don't (the loss of a suicide lead means nothing if the purpose was served)
-Swampert - as you 3-4HKO it, it has plenty of time to set up SR, and attack, sometimes twice, or Roar to scout
-Jirachi - FLINCCH
-Uxie: Screens in your face, or trick/status you
-Azelf: You break its sash, and fail to do much else, as you stated
-Infernape: It Fake Out + FBs you, you accomplish literally nothing
-Metagross: Takes lol damage from Fake Out, sets up rocks, and has time to retaliate
-Ninjask - Well it can Protect the Fake Out, though you'd likely switch to a Phazer anyway (who uses Ninjask anyway, this is a moot point)

Yeah so anyway High Jump kick is a terrible move, due to the chance of harming yourself if you miss >___>

I'm sorry I just don't see this making it on site
 
Decent damage to have something else revenge kill.
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So it doesn't do anything to Azelf. Gotcha.

Hi-Jump Kick vs. 252 HP / 252 Defense Relaxed Swampert: 38.12% - 45.30%
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Pitiful. It doesn't stop Swampert from setting up rocks and it can get one good EQ in to mess you up. The 3HKO isn't even guaranteed, which is actually pretty embarrassing for such a powerful Pokemon.

Hi-Jump Kick vs. 248 HP / 0 Defense Metagross: 44.08% - 52.07%
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88.5% - 104.6%

That's how much you're taking from Meteor Mash. If you don't die on the spot, Bullet Punch will finish you.

All this set does is highlight why no one uses Medicham in OU or even UU.
 
I've played a lead like this, but with Low Kick which is a more reliable move and which manage to 2HKO standard Metagross Lead (52.9% - 62.3%). It's less powerful against Swampert but this later will always win against Medicham so... However Metagross will always win the match up because Meteor Mash is almost an OHKO for sure and Bullet Punch will finish you.

Roserade Leaf Storm deals 107.6% - 127.1% on Medicham so it'll lose too.

With Fake Out + Fire Blast, it's almost a 2HKO for sure by Infernape.

So, I don't think that Medicham has a niche in OU with this set. Machamp will always be a better anti lead. And I think that Gallade can be a better Psychic / Fighting anti lead thanks to Steadfast and its higher special bulk.

Edit : 3 posts at the same time '-'
 
While I disagree with Ivysaur's analysis of the v. aerodactyl situation, I still have to pose the question-- why not use Machamp? Save for the fact that this beats Machamp, but then so does guts Hariyama.

This thing just does not seem tough enough or fast enough to stop enemy leads from simply . . . you know, attacking?
 
who cares if aero died and you dont have sr out? what the fuck are you switching into a medicham who you would assume have a sash (this set should really have a sash)? you're suer as hell not setting up on it
 
Vs. Azelf: Azelf destroys you, getting up SR and even firing an attack against you Fake Out+Ice Punch doesn't KO)

Vs. Aerodactyl: Dies to get up SR, so neutral (arguably Aero wins since it served its purpose)

Vs. Metagross: Lives your attack, Meteor Mash for OHKO

Vs. Swampert: Bulky enough to survive your attacks and set up SR

Vs. Machamp: I guess you win here.

So basically you lose against every lead besides Machamp. How exactly is this an anti-lead?
 
The other thing to keep in mind is that if Rotom-A or Gengar switches in on an obvious Hi Jump Kick, Medicham is going to be absolutely destroying itself, and considering that you have to rely on HJK for hitting Heatran, Megatross, Swampert with any sense of power, this set really doesn't have much going for it. At least when Machamp sees a Ghost switch in it doesn't automatically rape itself.

This is operating as a Machamp with more Speed (still not good speed so whatever, lol base 80), and slightly more power, but worse coverage, less accuracy, no lolconfusionhax, and a MASSIVE liability in the form of Hi Jump Kick missing. This gets a no from me, easily.

QC REJECTED (1/3)
 
This isn't THE worst antilead (I really wish leads weren't considered terrible just because they can't full stop leads designed to get off SR no matter what happens), it's still by pretty much any metric a worse Machamp. Also yeah yeah Roserade can sleep you, but at least Focus Sash means you're still rather frightening for something to come in on you. Hi Jump Kick is... a liability, but it's honestly overhyped in terms of being a problem. Sure you lose half your health, but you weren't living anyway so having lower HP isn't much of a concern.

Might want to add that Zen Headbutt destroys Rotom forever...
 
I'm getting tired of this, unless the anti-lead is the second coming of jesus im not going to accept it

QC REJECTED (2/3)
 
Along with all the other things others have said, Machamp hits most things for similar damage, and the confusion + massive bulk that Machamp has makes him much better.
 
Yeah, this is a worse Machamp, loses to literally everything other then Machamp.
Seems like anything would be better. What's with all the anti-leads going around?
 
This is directly outclassed by machamp/hariyama mainly due to the ability to 2hko swampert with a 100% move with decent defenses.
 
Why does everyone think that any pokemon with Trick and/or a priority move should get a lead set? -_-
 
kokoloko said:
Why does everyone think that any pokemon with Trick and/or a priority move should get a lead set? -_-
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Argueably, there are Pokemon that are theoritically and in reality fit for the lead and anti lead position, such as Machamp, Empoleon, Infernape, and surprinsly but very effectively Hariyama! These Pokemon all have the power to limit the number of set up opportunities an opposing lead could have, like Hariyama can manage a 2HKO or OHKO on most things and loses only to the occasional Metagross or rare Foretress. Since an anti lead's job is to either stop a lead or limit the number of opportunities to set up, Rapid Spinners are most spaciously paired up with them, so it's not a total loss if aerodactyl manages to SR. On the other hand, Medicham loses to a bunch of other things, so you may have a hand on that.
 
legendary_07 said:
Please explain how this set is not outclassed by Gallade.
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just as fast, but stronger, and better physical defense.

btw i have used low kick, and it's a lot better vs. lead metagross as it 2hko's

To everyone else:

i like him over machamp because he hits harder, and is a lot faster.

the common leads you can beat are Machamp, Smeargle, Aerodactyl, Metagross (Low Kick), Dragonite, Heatran, and sometimes Roserade, if they go for the Sleep powder, or if they are bulky. Yes, you do lose to Swampert, but to be honest, hes not as common of a lead as he used to be. against azelf, if u have a good partner like the one listed, you can win with them only getting SR up, or if they chose to use psychic, they get nothing and you win. So pretty much you only lose to Azelf and Swampert. Culber berry Azelf can beat machamp, as well as the increasingly popular choice banded lead, and against Swampert, Dynamic Punch does less than Hi-Jump Kick would do. He also has pitiful speed, while Medichams is actually decent. Focus sash could be an option to beat Roserade who leaf storm first turn.

Against the common leads Medicham beats, Machamp can sometimes win against opposing machamp, although anti lead vs. anti lead accomplishes cothing. Dragonite can beat machamp. Metagross is usually faster, so it has a good shot of setting up SR and exploding for the OHKO, which i would call a loss. Smeargle and Aerodactyl, Machamp wins. Heatran is outsped and OHKOd by Medicham, while it can either sacrifice itself for SR or OHKO with a specs Overheat or an Explosion, which would be a loss for Machamp.


Overall, it seems like Medicham beats the common leads better than machamp does.
 
DarXidE said:
the common leads you can beat are Machamp, Smeargle, Aerodactyl, Metagross (Low Kick), Dragonite, Heatran, and sometimes Roserade.
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You lose to Metagross and Roserade. You also lose to Azelf, Jirachi and Swampert / Hippowdon. You don't get Rocks up. I could just use Machamp / Hariyami, beat more stuff, be bulkier, have more mid-game utility (switch in on Blissey without dying instantly to Rotom-A), have better coverage and hit harder / have confusion.
 
sorry for double post

Ice-eyes said:
You lose to Metagross and Roserade. You also lose to Azelf, Jirachi and Swampert / Hippowdon. You don't get Rocks up. I could just use Machamp / Hariyami, beat more stuff, be bulkier, have more mid-game utility (switch in on Blissey without dying instantly to Rotom-A), have better coverage and hit harder / have confusion.
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You beat metagross, as low kick is always a 2hko and you outspeed. I also said you beat roserade who sleep powder first turn, or the bulkier ones who lead, as you can outspeed them, and fake out scouts it for you.

ok i lose to Azelf, Jirachi, Swampert/Hippowdon you say? 3 out of however many is not bad at all. except, vs. those leads, Medicham gets the advantage. He can Fake Out Jirachi to scout its item, as well as Fake Out Azelf to remove its sash, while some Azelfs can also beat machamp, and Jirachi will flinch it as well. Swampert and Hippowdon, i do lose to. but they are not used very often at all, and machamp cant hit them as hard as medicham can anyway.

I'd also like to add that if Rotom were to switch in, Zen Headbutt can 3HKO it while Lum Berry protects you from will-o-wisp. Now without Hi Jump Kick, you dont take damage from the switchin, which isnt too much anyway. Thunderbolt wont OHKO, and you're faster than all rotoms that arent a +speed nature or scarfed, who you 2HKO.
 
Gallade has a better typing, movepool and stats than Medicham! Also, Gallade fares better against most leads, getting a clean 2HKO Metagross and OHKO Swampert; and he is bulky enough to take attacks from the Special side, like Roserade´s Leaf Storm.

I cannot see how this set is not outclassed by Gallade, who is sturdier and is not dead weight against stall-teams. Like most people have said, Medicham loses to most leads, and for an offensive team, there are way better anti-leads than this.
 
legendary_07 said:
Gallade has a better typing, movepool and stats than Medicham! Also, Gallade fares better against most leads, getting a clean 2HKO Metagross and OHKO Swampert; and he is bulky enough to take attacks from the Special side, like Roserade´s Leaf Storm.

I cannot see how this set is not outclassed by Gallade, who is sturdier and is not dead weight against stall-teams. Like most people have said, Medicham loses to most leads, and for an offensive team, there are way better anti-leads than this.
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Gallade has the same typing as Medicham, and the only things in its movepool it has over Medicham are Leaf Blade and Close Combat, although like i said, swampert isnt even that common. It also has lower attack, and is only bulkier on the special side, so i dont see how it has better stats.

Also, idk how he's a "deadweight" against stall teams. Rotom can beat gallade just as it can medicham, but medicham hits it harder and is stronger.

also, Medicham CAN get a clean 2hko on metagross with low kick.
 
Medicham might be able to beat Roserade and go some damage to Rotom, but why can't Machamp, who doesn't really give a shit about its low Speed (loldynamicpunch), do this job better? At least it has a chance at ensuring that Swampert, nor Hippowdon can get Stealth Rock up. Hell, Hariyama gives more momentum to its team .-.

Also:
DarXidE said:
although like i said, swampert isnt even that common.
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| 5 | Swampert | 47551 | 4.89 |
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Wut?
 
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