ORAS OU Lunatricks: Partial Trick Room Offense (Peaked 1913, Top 20)

Twelfth · Oct 21, 2016

Introduction

As we reach the actual end of the generation, I've finally created a team I'm pretty happy with. I think it's a blast to play, and has some amazing matchups against popular strategies. I wanted to share the team and the building process with everyone as an example of a pretty out-there team that has had some success. I would like to apologize in advance for the dissertation; I like this team and have a lot to say about it. Also, if anyone has built a better ORAS trick room team, I'm interested in seeing it.

I started making this team after accepting that my initial trick room attempt was, while fun, Really Pretty Bad. Despite that realization (and despite trick room's reputation as a gimmick), I had faith in the power of Mega Heracross and Lunar Dance Cresselia. So, I tried again…

Teambuilding Process

I started with this trio. I really appreciated Mega Heracross and Crawdaunt’s offensive synergy, by which I mean ability to OHKO most of the tier. Cress provided excellent support for the primary plan of hitting everything with absurdly strong physical attacks. The previous version of this team had a hard time against Birdspam and certain physically defensive pokemon, though. I decided to add something that could beat Mega Pinsir, Talonflame, Skarmory, and Clefable. I also decided I wanted a fast attacker to revenge kill stuff, despite still planning on using the other slots for a dedicated trick room team.

Choice Scarf Heatran seemed like what I wanted, switching into Will-O-Wisp, dealing a bunch of damage with Overheat, posing a big problem for Birdspam, and outspeeding everything important. I felt I had a solid start to a team, but I now needed to check a lot of boxes with only two pokemon. I needed two more trick room users that between them could set Stealth Rocks, switch into Specs Keldeo, and take a Knock Off when Heracross wasn't able. I tried Celebi, Diancie, Porygon2, Whimsicott, and even Aromatisse. It was a dark time, and the team never quite worked. I eventually decided that I needed to rework, and made two Good Decisions.

First, I cut Mr. Vorpal the Crawdaunt (may he someday forgive me). Second, I decided to forgo the full trick room plan in favor of a more hybrid team style, keeping the HeraCress package and adding one offensive secondary setter. This allowed significantly more freedom when it came to checking threats and interacting with hazards. I tried a number of configurations here, was having a hard time finding anything that won more than Crawdaunt.

I eventually settled on these two pokemon. I first thought of Bisharp as a weaker Crawdaunt that could take hits, function outside of trick room, and threaten fairies. After testing, though, I realized punishing defog was incredibly helpful to the team, so I went even further down that road and added a spinblocker. Cofagrigus was the obvious choice for his combination of bulk and reasonable offensive presence. I tried Hoopa, which underperformed massively, and quickly settled on this pair.

For all the reworking I had done, I was still massively weak to Keldeo and still needed rocks. The obvious answer was Celebi, which did an excellent job checking Keldeo, died to U-turn and Pursuit, compounded my dark/ghost/fire weaknesses and was generally not worth it. Since I had a fighting immunity and two resists, I decided all I really needed was a pokemon that could tank specs Keldeo’s Hydro Pump and set rocks, which left me with Ferrothorn, Empoleon, Cradily and Seismitoad. I decided I really did want the fire resist (and to not instantly die if I read Keldeo wrong) so I settled on Seismitoad. I was originally disappointed in having to use this weird toad, but it ended up being far better than I expected, and the team was finished.

Team Explanation

Don’t be fooled by Cresselia and Seismitoad, this is a very offensive team. The usual plan is to set rocks and prevent the opponent from removing them with Bisharp and Cofagrigus, while looking for openings to rip holes in opposing teams using Mega Heracross, Bisharp, and Heatran. This team contains immunities to Ground, Electric, Water, Fire, Fighting, Normal, Psychic, and Poison moves, helping it punish choice-locked pokemon and bring its threats in safely.

If the opponent stumbles and gives up a free turn, Cofagrigus can use nasty plot, set trick room, and singlehandedly ruin many teams. If that’s not possible, Cresselia or Cofagrigus set up the room for Heracross, which has its way with offensive teams lacking Talonflame or Mega Pinsir. Once the enemy has been sufficiently worn down, Cresselia can use Lunar Dance to bring in a healthy Heracross for a final sweep. Alternatively, Cofagrigus can set trick room and try to clean by itself. Against more defensive teams, Cofagrigus or Heracross can often do a lot of damage by themselves. In these cases Cresselia acts as a second copy of the biggest threat, and trick room is frequently unnecessary.

Of course, in pokemon things rarely go according to plan. One of my favorite aspects of this team is its ability to find creative paths to victory, making use of Cresselia’s bulk, Cofagrigus’s Mummy, and Bisharp’s Sucker Punch to get out of tight spots. When I lose with this team I can almost always point to gameplay errors; I’ve never felt that I lost due to an unwinnable matchup.

I’ve tried to outline the responsibilities of each team member below, but there are enough odd ways of dealing with particular threats that I’m sure I won’t manage to list them all. If you aren’t sure how the team handles a particular threat, ask and I will hopefully have an answer.

The Team

Pinkus (Heracross) (M) @ Heracronite
Ability: Moxie
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Pin Missile
- Bullet Seed
- Close Combat
- Rock Blast

The star of the show; this team would not function without Mega Heracross. With 515 attack and four accurate base 120+ power moves, it is incredibly difficult to wall, and trick room support does away with the obvious answer of revenge killing. Heracross’s job is to hit as many times as hard as it can until it’s worn down too much to stay in. It then hangs out in the back at 11% or whatever until the opposing team is weakened enough to fold to a second assault. For this reason it should be played aggressively early game, but not aggressively enough that it has a chance to actually die.

Heracross is also the key to beating many stall teams, doing its best to aggressively double switch into a position where it can nuke something. It is the team’s best / only answer to substitute, often removing the sub and the pokemon with the same multihit move. Finally, Heracross is a fantastic switch in to the Knock Offs that threaten the trick room setters, taking around 20% from adamant LO Bisharp.

There are also a few unique aspects of this bug that, while situational, can give the team an edge. The first is that most of its moves (including its main stab) do not make contact, preventing it from being worn down while it slowly kills Landorus-t with Bullet Seed. Second, it ignores focus Sashes and the occasional sturdy pokemon, making it occasionally a fun anti-lead and preventing Alakazam from being any sort of threat. Third, trick room support allows Heracross to actually abuse Moxie if it can come in on and KO a weakened foe, making it truly unstoppable or at least removing Landorus-t’s intimidate drop. Finally, and most situationally, Heracross’s moves have stupidly high PP with the exception of Close Combat. Pin Missile can be used 32 times and Bullet Seed 48. It shouldn’t really come up, but it’s comforting to not have to worry about it.

Item: Self-explanatory.

Spread: Mega Heracross has beefy 80/115/105 defenses, and Trick Room support allows him to abuse them with full HP investment. Maximum attack and minimum speed allow it to tear through many teams under trick room, while still out-speeding many stall pokemon.

+1 252+ Atk Dragonite Outrage vs. 248 HP / 8 Def Mega Heracross: 291-343 (80.1 - 94.4%)
252 SpA Choice Specs Keldeo Hydro Pump vs. 248 HP / 0 SpD Mega Heracross: 256-303 (70.5 - 83.4%)
252+ Atk Mega Heracross Close Combat vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Skarmory: 160-189 (48 - 56.7%) -- 87.5% chance to 2HKO

Moves:
- Pin Missile
- Close Combat
- Rock Blast

Standard. Two 120+ base power STAB moves and a 125 base power rock move for excellent coverage.

- Bullet Seed

I am convinced this is better than Swords Dance on this team for the following reasons:

There is no time to set up SD and then attack under trick room.
Outside of trick room Hera is revenge killed too easily to make boosting worth it.
It OHKOs Manaphy.
It 2HKOs Suicune. Pin Missile cannot.
It OHKOs sub CM Keldeo through a sub.
It OHKOs Azumarill
It OHKOs Rotom-W after rocks so Hera isn’t forced out by will-o.
It OHKOs Diancie and Terrakion without the defense penalty of CC.
It wears down Lando-t without risking the rock blast miss
It hits 2HKOs non-bold Clefable without risking the miss.
It OHKOs Quag, which threatens to burn + recover and would ignore SD.
It easily 2HKOs Quag while burned.
It 2HKOs Hippo and is not punished by Whirlwind.

Pretty Guardian (Cresselia) @ Mental Herb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Moonblast
- Moonlight
- Lunar Dance

Cresselia is frequently disparaged in OU for being too passive, too much of a momentum sink, having unreliable recovery with low PP, blah blah. These are all valid complaints, but they do not extend to Cresselia’s use on this team. There is one thing Cresselia does better than anything else in the tier, and that is avoid being OHKOd. Not Being OHKOd and Mental Herb together guarantee trick room, which usually guarantees Mega Heracross the opportunity to do serious damage. It is usually quite possible to set up trick room, mess their team up a bit with Heracross, and wait until the late game to bring Cresselia back in for the real sweep. Bringing a powerful sweeper in at full health for free with speed control is the opposite of killing momentum.

In addition to this primary role, Cresselia is an amazing physical wall and catch-all panic button. Mega Charizard X somehow at +2? Garchomp at +6??? It’s ok, Cresselia isn’t OHKOd by either of those even after rocks, just set up trick room and bring in something to remove the threat. Are Heatran and Bisharp dead and modest Mega Gardevoir / Mega Charizard Y now ready to sweep your slow team? Neither comes close to KOing Cresselia, steal the momentum and turn the threat into a Heracross sweep.

Nothing holds a candle to Cresselia when it comes to this niche support role. Its ability to do double duty as a massive wall and a sweep enabler allow this team to function at all in the hard-hitting OU metagame.

Item: Mental Herb is a necessity. Nine games out of ten it will do nothing but make you take extra Knock Off damage. That one time, though, it wins you the game all by itself. Don’t forget that it stops Encore in addition to Taunt.

Spread: Cresselia is just about the bulkiest pokemon legal in OU. I am using a physically defensive set to check threats like Mega Charizard X, Azumarill, Breloom, Dragonite, Excadrill, Garchomp, Kyurem-Black, Landorus, Mega Lopunny, Mega Medicham, and Mega Metagross, oh look it’s the whole tier. Seriously though, many players do not understand how fat this moon duck is. Minimum speed ensures Cresselia will have the chance to Lunar Dance against as much of the tier as possible.

252+ Atk Choice Band Tyranitar Crunch vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Cresselia: 282-332 (63.6 - 74.9%)
252+ SpA Choice Specs Hydreigon Dark Pulse vs. 248 HP / 8 SpD Cresselia: 332-392 (74.9 - 88.4%)

Moves:
- Trick Room
- Lunar Dance

These are the important moves. This set avoids Cresselia's momentum issues by performing the hardest-core pivot in the tier. Cresselia might be usable on this team with only these two moves.

- Moonlight

Yes, it has terrible PP and is ruined by weather. It also recovers a little under one Mega Diancie’s worth of HP. Moonlight lets Cresselia wall stuff like Weavile (yes, really) and LO Diggersby, and more importantly lets it stay healthy enough to set trick room multiple times in a game. Let’s not forget that it also occasionally heals more than 50%; Cress can technically stall out all 8 of modest Mega Charizard Y’s Fire Blasts due to the sun boost.

- Moonblast

I’m convinced that Moonblast is the correct attacking move on Cresselia. It 2HKOs Mega Medicham and Breloom unconditionally, Mega Lopunny and Weavile with some chip damage, and gets 3HKOs on many other mons that Cress wants to be in against, including Dragonite post-multiscale, SD Garchomp, Latios, Keldeo, Terrakion, and sometimes Kyurem-Black. Being able to hit Mega Sableye for ~30% is much better than doing zero. It also OHKOs Hydreigon after rocks and LO damage.

Pele (Heatran) (F) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 24 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA / 228 Spe
Timid Nature
- Overheat
- Flash Cannon
- Earth Power
- Stone Edge

This team needed help beating many of the things Choice Scarf Heatran beats, so here it is. The surprise factor of the scarf is definitely increased by the fact that this is a trick room team, frequently leading to free kills. Even without being sneaky, though, the set checks threats like Mega Gardevoir, Mega Charizard Y, Mega Pinsir, Mega Scizor, Mega Altaria, Mega Diancie, Mega Metagross, Mega Manectric, Raikou, Talonflame, and Volcarona. It further provides some crucial 4x resistances that make switching around to bring in a trick room setter much easier, and threatens support pokemon that can be a problem for the team such as Skarmory, Klefki, bold Clefable and Amoonguss. Finally, in some cases Heatran will be able to clean with Flash Cannon, or just come in repeatedly and nuke with Overheat once its resists are worn down. I consider this pokemon incredibly versatile for a scarfer, and I don't think there are any other options to fill its role on the team.

Item: This Heatran is here to be fast. No other options.
Spread: Standard scarftran, though I moved 4 EVs from HP to Def for for better SR damage as I have no hazard removal and it tends to switch in and out repeatedly.
Moves:
- Overheat
- Flash Cannon
- Earth Power
- Stone Edge

Standard set. Overheat is an exceptional move when you’re sitting at 406 Spe and 359 SpA. Stone Edge is the least accurate move on this team, but it is necessary to stop Mega Charizard Y from setting everything I care about on fire.

Wiseau (Cofagrigus) (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Mummy
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 Def / 30 SpA / 30 SpD / 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Nasty Plot
- Shadow Ball
- Hidden Power [Fighting]

Get it? Wiseau? Because he makes The Room? Hahaha! Anyways, I think Cofagrigus is pretty good right now for three reasons:

1. Here’s a complete alphabetical list of the OU pokemon that resist Shadow Ball: Bisharp, Chansey, Mega Lopunny, Tyranitar, Weavile. Of these, only Chansey survives a +2 Hidden Power Fighting after rocks.

2. Many powerful threats in OU rely on their abilities. Cofagrigus thinks it's pretty funny to take away abilities like Scrappy, Huge/Pure Power, Aerilate/Pixilate, Gale Wings, Technician, Regenerator, Serene Grace, and Poison Heal.

3. I’m pretty sure Cofagrigus is the only non-mega Ghost bulky enough to carry on the ancient tradition of spinblocking in this Age of Defog.

On this team, Cofagrigus is responsible for blocking rapid spin, switching into Secret Sword from Keldeo trying to hit Seismitoad, sweeping frail offensive teams, 6-0ing Wondertrio by itself, setting up on Mega Lopunny, checking physical pokemon that have the abilities listed above, and occasionally even setting up trick room for Heracross.

Item: Cofagrigus massively appreciates the passive recovery while it is setting up and attempting a sweep, and also enjoys dying less quickly to the statuses it frequently suffers. Sometimes, while the opponent scrambles to stop Shadow Ball from killing all their friends, it gets enough HP back to set trick room up a second time.

Spread: Standard trick room spread. This coffin has respectable bulk, surviving specs Keldeo’s Hydro Pump and Flare Blitz from +1 Mega Charizard X. With a Quiet nature and 252 SpA EVs it hits a reasonable 317 SpA, enough to comfortably OHKO Weavile and Bisharp with Hidden Power Fighting, and 2HKO all psychic types in the tier apart from specially defensive Mew/Jirachi.

Moves:
- Trick Room
- Nasty Plot
- Shadow Ball

Standard tools of the trade. Many, many teams have nothing to switch into a +2 shadow ball.

- Hidden Power Fighting

This is far more beneficial to the team than Will-O-Wisp, allowing Cofagrigus to actually sweep instead of coming in, crippling something, and being forced to leave / dying to CB Crunch. If you've somehow managed to knock off Chansey's eviolite, this will 2HKO at +6, but generally you should be switching to Heracross or Bisharp soon as you suspect Chansey is on her way.

Rhineland (Bisharp) (F) @ Life Orb
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 30 Spe
- Knock Off
- Iron Head
- Sucker Punch
- ~~Psycho Cut~~ Swords Dance

Bisharp is fully in its element on this sort of team, functioning well against multiple playstyles either in or out of trick room. Its main jobs are to punish defog, check troublesome fairies, and force out threatening faster pokemon when trick room isn’t up. It can also sweep in some cases where Heracross has some trouble, such as against bulkier fairies, ghosts, Landorus-t, Talonflame, and Mega Pinsir. Occasionally it does other cool stuff like spinblocking with Sucker Punch or grabbing attack boosts from secondary-effect stat drops. Not much more to say, this pokemon is great on offense.

Item: It’s Life Orb. Life Orb is good.

Spread: Bisharp benefits much less than Heracross from increased bulk, but HP is still the best place for the extra EVs. Max HP lets it survive stuff like Moonblast from +2 Clefable and two Draco Meteors from LO Latios after SR damage (it will still die to LO damage in both cases, however). The remaining 8 EVs go to Def to minimize priority damage from Talonflame, Mega Pinsir, Dragonite, and Azumarill. The odd speed IVs are to outspeed CB Tyranitar in trick room and outspeed Clefable out of it.

Moves:
- Knock Off
- Iron Head
- Sucker Punch

Standard Bisharp moves, standard for a reason. Adamant Bisharp hurts things even outside of trick room.

- Swords Dance / Psycho Cut / Low Kick

This one I’m still undecided on. I’ve enjoyed using Psycho and I haven’t consciously missed Swords Dance while doing so. Either way, this is the least-used move on the team, so it likely won’t make or break much. As with Heracross, there is simply no time to be setting up under trick room, but unlike Heracross Bisharp has powerful priority to use when trick room runs out. Psycho Cut allows Bisharp to power through Keldeo while sweeping, which I’ve found valuable. Knock Off + Psycho Cut also kills defensive Amoonguss, something Bisharp cannot achieve with Knock Off + Iron Head, and punishes Breloom if it tries to come in on Knock Off to force Bisharp out. Low Kick kills opposing Bisharp, 2HKOs Ferrothorn, OHKOs Heatran after SR, and does more to Mega Scizor than Knock Off. I would appreciate advice on this slot.

Agastya (Seismitoad) (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Knock Off
- Scald
- Earthquake

I was originally very skeptical of this toad. Despite the solid typing and ability, its stats seemed underwhelming and I did not have much confidence in its ability to function on an offensive OU team. After using him for a while, though, I realized I failed to account for a few things.

1. Its resistances and immunities aren’t just good, they’re excellent. Being immune to Electric and Water is significantly better than resisting them, thanks to the existence of Scald and Volt Switch. Resisting Rock, Fire, and Steel is icing on a cake with a single weakness.

2. He just has all the good moves. STAB Earthquake, STAB Scald, Knock Off, and Stealth Rock are all excellent, and this guy just crams them all onto its toad self, inconveniencing your foes mightily.

3. He has more physical bulk than Clefable, and fewer weaknesses. He’s got 95 attack, the same as Clefable’s special attack, and a higher base power STAB move. Some teams do not have a clean way to kill him, and have to suffer through Scald burns and Knock Offs in order to wear him down.

Seismitoad’s main responsibilities are setting rocks and preventing Keldeo from spamming Hydro Pump. It also completely beats several pokemon one-on-one, such as Mega Manectric, most Mega Metagross, Bisharp, Excadrill, Gengar, Gliscor, Heatran, Hippowdon, Jirachi, Hippowdon, Landorus-t, Magnezone, Raikou, and Weavile. It can also cripple some defensive pokemon that are unable to touch it, such as Rotom-W and Zapdos. In many games it does solid work as a hard-switch pivot, status absorber, Knock Off support, or good old fashioned death fodder. Also, between this guy and trick room, the team ended up with a great matchup against rain.

Item: Leftovers is good on defensive pokemon.

Spread: Max defense to avoid the 2HKO from specs Secret Sword and because Seismitoad checks special attackers with immunities as opposed to resistances. Relaxed nature instead of Bold because there is not much worth outspeeding and it’s nice to hit as hard as possible with EQ and Knock Off. Also, Trick Room.
Moves:
- Stealth Rock
- Scald
- Earthquake
- Knock Off

Standard Seismitoad set. Knock Off over Toxic because the team wants games to go fast, and removing Leftovers from pokemon like Clefable and Skarmory greatly benefits Heracross.

Threats

Hydreigon: Modest Life Orb Fire Blast Hydreigon OHKOs Cofagrigus, Bisharp, and Mega Heracross, has a roll to OHKO Seismitoad after rocks, and 2HKOs Cresselia and Heatran. It takes a piddling 30% from Sucker Punch and just under 50% from Flash Cannon. Cresselia's Moonblast has a chance to OHKO after rocks and LO damage, so catching it as it switches in is one way to prevent a sweep. Barring that, the best option is to hit it twice with Heatran and hope it doesn't have roost, or in the worst case send out Cresselia and pray Dark Pulse doesn't flinch.
Hazard Stacking: While the team definitely does not auto lose to hazards, five grounded pokemon and no hazard removal means that very aggressive play is needed to prevent spikes from deciding the game. This can be achieved by preventing them from going up (often by repeatedly bringing in Heatran to threaten Skarmory or Klefki), or by gaining some sort of advantage while the opponent spends turn stacking spikes, such as getting Heracross in under trick room, or boosting with Cofagrigus.

Manaphy: If the opponent can preserve Manaphy until Cresselia and Heracross are weakened, there is little this team can do about it. If it has taken some chip damage, the combination of Heatran's Earth Power and Bisharp's Sucker Punch can stop it, but this is not reliable. To prevent this, Cress should be kept healthy until Manaphy tries to set up, and other steps should be taken to weaken Manaphy so Bisharp can kill it. For example, it's often correct to stay in with Heracross on Manaphy's Scald, hitting offensive Manaphy for ~58% with Bullet Seed after a burn. This removes a huge threat and the burn can be removed by Cresselia later.

Volcarona: A Volcarona set of Fire Blast, Bug Buzz, and HP Ground has a good chance to OHKO the entire team besides Seismitoad at +1. Bisharp can save me, but it's not a sure thing. The best way of preventing this is keeping up stealth rocks, as everything on the team can either set up trick room or kill Volcarona at 51% as it tries to boost.

Replays!

Conclusion

If you read all of that you’ve got too much free time. Thank you though, and I’d appreciate any feedback you can offer. I really think this team is a lot of fun, and I’m happy to answer any questions people have about it. I’m almost certain I managed to leave something out even after writing far too much, so let me know about that as well. Finally, if anyone decides to try this team out, tell me how it goes! I feel like this team is better than I am at pokemon, so I’d be curious to know how it goes for people who are better players than I am.

Alright, said way too much. Later, ORAS.

Pinkus (Heracross) (M) @ Heracronite
Ability: Moxie
Shiny: Yes
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 0 Spe
- Pin Missile
- Bullet Seed
- Close Combat
- Rock Blast

Pretty Guardian (Cresselia) @ Mental Herb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Def / 8 SpD
Relaxed Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Moonblast
- Moonlight
- Lunar Dance

Pele (Heatran) (F) @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Flash Fire
EVs: 24 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpA / 228 Spe
Timid Nature
- Overheat
- Flash Cannon
- Earth Power
- Stone Edge

Wiseau (Cofagrigus) (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Mummy
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Def / 252 SpA
Quiet Nature
IVs: 0 Atk / 30 Def / 30 SpA / 30 SpD / 0 Spe
- Trick Room
- Nasty Plot
- Shadow Ball
- Hidden Power [Fighting]

Rhineland (Bisharp) (F) @ Life Orb
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 248 HP / 252 Atk / 8 Def
Brave Nature
IVs: 30 Spe
- Knock Off
- Iron Head
- Sucker Punch
- Swords Dance

Agastya (Seismitoad) (M) @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 248 HP / 8 Atk / 252 Def
Relaxed Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Knock Off
- Scald
- Earthquake

Twelfth · Oct 25, 2016

Shoutout to blunder for using the team wrong <3
Still looking for any feedback as well!

atomicnumber18 · Oct 26, 2016

Can you explain how you overcome landerous T especially bulkier varients? I've been trying out this team and landorous consistently gives me problems.

Twelfth · Oct 26, 2016

atomicnumber18 said:
Can you explain how you overcome landerous T especially bulkier varients? I've been trying out this team and landorous consistently gives me problems.

Interesting, I've never had trouble with defensive Lando using this team. Toad doesn't take much from him and can Scald for a ton, Heatran outspeeds and does ~70% with Overheat, it can't touch Cress. Bisharp punishes Intimidate.

The main way you kill Lando-t in practice though is by hitting him with Bullet Seed when he switches into Heracross: -1 252+ Atk Mega Heracross Bullet Seed (5 hits) vs. 252 HP / 240+ Def Landorus-T: 105-125 (27.4 - 32.7%) -- approx. 88% chance to 3HKO after Stealth Rock. Lando can hit back for 20% with EQ or 25% with Stone Edge. Don't be afraid to let Hera get worn down as it kills its own "counters," as your plan is often to bring him back in at full under TR. Also don't forget that Hera has an attack stat of 343 after Intimidate, which is higher than Weavile.

Punxsutawney Phil · Oct 26, 2016

Hey! Nice to see Trick Room in OU do well. It is viable, people just have to be creative.

I can't really give you advice until I've tried out your team myself, but I will try it out.

mikekap · Oct 30, 2016

First of all really unique team, loving the sick synergy between Bish and Cress. I think Guts would be a good alternative to moxie, making Hera somewhat of a status absorber while dishing massive damage in normal form. Haven't really abused moxie while playing with this team though, so I 'll give you the benefit of doubt. Love ~~stealing~~ using this team!

Twelfth · Oct 30, 2016

mikekap said:
First of all really unique team, loving the sick synergy between Bish and Cress. I think Guts would be a good alternative to moxie, making Hera somewhat of a status absorber while dishing massive damage in normal form. Haven't really abused moxie while playing with this team though, so I 'll give you the benefit of doubt. Love ~~stealing~~ using this team!

Thanks! My decision to use Moxie over Guts came down to it usually being correct to Mega right away, making either ability extremely situational. Non-mega Hera really hates switching in on stuff:

252 Atk Life Orb Weavile Icicle Crash vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Heracross: 218-257 (60 - 70.7%)
252 Atk Life Orb Weavile Icicle Crash vs. 248 HP / 0 Def Mega Heracross: 152-179 (41.8 - 49.3%)

If you want to abuse Guts, you need to bring him in on a definite Will-o/Toxic (which they may not even use due to Heatran/Bish) and then not mega evolve, which dramatically reduces your damage output on everything but CC:

252+ Atk Guts Heracross Bullet Seed (3 hits) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Rotom-W: 186-222 (61.3 - 73.2%)
252+ Atk Mega Heracross Bullet Seed (5 hits) vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Rotom-W: 280-330 (92.4 - 108.9%)

252+ Atk Guts Heracross Close Combat vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Rotom-W: 216-255 (71.2 - 84.1%)
252+ Atk Mega Heracross Close Combat vs. 248 HP / 252+ Def Rotom-W: 193-228 (63.6 - 75.2%)

Even CC doesn't do much more due to Mhera's absurd base attack. Apart from all this, Cofa / Cress / Toad are all fine at absorbing statuses. As far as I can tell it's better to completely disregard Hera's starting ability unless you're under TR, not yet Mega, and they have something in you're pretty sure they will sac. Whenever I get Hera burned it's by accident, it was probably already Mega'd, and now the plan is wait for a good Lunar Dance opportunity.

Punxsutawney Phil · Nov 6, 2016

So I tried out the team for a bit and I have to say, it's great. I initially saw a lot of flaws in it, but after trying to change things around, I only performed worse. The team just works well together. As you said, losses are due more to suboptimal play than to matchup. I don't really have any good advice, and I'm not going to pretend to know what I'm doing by suggesting some needless change anyway. I just wanted to say this is a fun and very viable team.

vso · Nov 6, 2016

If you find hydreigon a bit too terrifying then go with a spread of 152 special attack 252 hp and 148 def to ohko hydreigon after stealth rock 156 SpA Cresselia Moonblast vs. 4 HP / 0 SpD Hydreigon: 288-340 (88.3 - 104.2%) -- guaranteed OHKO after Stealth Rock.

DoubleOD · Nov 8, 2016

I tried this team out. It's very fun to play with. I went something like 24-2 with it and it has so many diverse and unpredictable threats that usually something just outright beats your opponent's team.

...and then I faced Toxic Spikes Tentacruel stall and got completely demolished. Utterly destroyed. I simply had no chance from the start. I agree with the OP that Spikes are not a problem if you play around them well enough but Toxic Spikes left me completely helpless.

(I didn't save a replay of that game. Here's a fun unrelated replay for you using your team: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ou-472157903)

ORAS OU Lunatricks: Partial Trick Room Offense (Peaked 1913, Top 20)

Most viable in OU?

Cofagrigus

Cresselia

Seismitoad