Lucario + Focus Sash.. ehh wtf?

MiroFTW

So I posted this a while ago on the Focus Sash + Lead pokemon thread. Don't have the link so you'll have to search for it yourself if you want to take a look at it. But this is basically what I posted for a lead pokemon.

Lucario @ Focus Sash - "Sashrio"
Trait: Inner Focus
Nature: Jolly/Naive/Hasty
IVs: 0/31/0/0/0/31 (speed last)
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spd / 4 Satk?

-Swords Dance
-Reversal
-Bullet Punch / Extremespeed
-Stone Edge / Close Combat

Basically, Swords Dance first turn. And then use an assortment of moves to sweep with. Weavile dies to the BP if it stays in.

The good thing about Lucario is that it's immune to Sandstorm so TTar can't dent the Sash first turn. In addition, this doesn't even have to be a starter. Because of its nice resistances and Sandstorm immunity, this thing can switch in later.

As for its moveset: Reversal to clobber any non-Ghosts. In this case, I'd choose Bullet Punch over Extremespeed because of STAB (not sure how this works out in the damage formula though). Stone Edge is for the flyers (aka Gyara) but a STABed CC hurts also.

Aside from the obvious Skarm/Phazer weak, what do you people think?
 
Well, Lucario's speed isn't that great so you won't be outspeeding much things. Extremespeed won't hurt even after a swords dance, specially things like Aerodactyl.

Well, it can work, but with all those sucker punch/fast pokemon/choice scarfers out there I would not use it.
 
It's pretty neat. It's just that... :/ isn't Lucario suppose to be slow or something? It learns Agility though, that'll probably help it. Though if you use Agility you no longer use Swords Dance, obviously. But meh, seems pretty nice.
 
Hill said:
Well, Lucario's speed isn't that great so you won't be outspeeding much things. Extremespeed won't hurt even after a swords dance, specially things like Aerodactyl.

Well, it can work, but with all those sucker punch/fast pokemon/choice scarfers out there I would not use it.
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i guess this is very situational in a sense. a STAB-ed (non SD) CC will do this to a max IV, no EV aerodactyl:

Defender HP: 301
Move Damage: 250 - 294

A BP would finish it off later.

You can even do a reversal without a SD if you think the opposing pokemon's going to hurt you badly.
 
shadysback321 said:
You can have a Swords Dance set, then a Endure Set, but mixing them both + Focus Sash = eh.
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granted this is more oriented towards the subreversal-er set. by taking out substitute/endure and replacing it with focus sash, you get a free moveslot for something else. granted you lose the item slot which salac berry would normally occupy, its a high-risk, high reward set based on prediction that gives an edge more towards offense then speed after a SD. 90 base speed isn't TOO shabby, but IMO, enough to get by other pokemon like Skarm, and Non-CS Heracross

there are weaknesses to it, but that can be said about every pokemon. and finally... why not?
 
Epistaxis said:
Hmmm. Doesn't Bulletpunch+Extremespeed+Reversal cover everything in the game?
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It hits everything, but you still have to watch out for other people using Quick Attack moves as well, and it might not hit everything hard enough. All these Quick Attack moves give me an idea for this joke hacked Deoxys set (if anybody would actually be willing to hack it; I don't even have a Deoxys)

Deoxys Speed Form
Speed Boost
Timid Nature
252 Special Attack
252 Speed
6 HP

Quick Attack
Aqua Jet
Bullet Punch
Mach Punch
 
Epistaxis said:
With swordsdance they can at least do a bit before lucario dies. >.<
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It would do something, but the Quick Attack moves are still a bit weak. I'd consider other Lucario sets, since they'd know what you're trying after the Focus Sash goes off, and switch to Dusknoir, who can then finish him off with Shadow Sneak.

EDIT: Lucario would likely use a Quick Attack-type move, so Dusknoir is not restricted to finishing him with Shadow Sneak.
 
1 HP Lucario is a novel idea; arguably what he is most useful for this generation. I don't understand why you would want to lead with him, though. It takes moderate damage from most things, which is bad if you intend to lead with Focus Sash. Lucario usually won't get KO'ed in turn 1, but will get KO'ed in turns 2 or 3 if he stays in. Unless he can somehow outrun most starters and take advantage of Substitute, Focus Sash is meaningless for starting Lucarios.
 
I don't know, what Focus Sash attempts to do can be done by Endure, and you can also have Salac for the Reversal Sweep. Endure/Crunch/Swords Dance/Reversal, after a Swords Dance Reversal always OHKO's Skarmory.
 
But you can pull an agility or sworddance before you die, which is better than salac, and no more limits your moveset than having endure. Granted, KOs that aren't on-hit and stealth rock and stuff will ruin it...
 
Alright, time to answer a few questions.

Tinnacious said:
Is Lucario that fragile to begin with? Am I missing something?
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No, base 70 def and sdef with pretty good resistances make this able to take a hit. give it 0 iv's in def/sdef/hp, then think again.

Mustang said:
I would just attach a Choice Scarf. At least then it could sweep Heracross and possibly Gengar...
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Choice scarf limits its moveset severely. BP + SD does hurt also, mind you.

CoolTrainer20 said:
I don't know, what Focus Sash attempts to do can be done by Endure, and you can also have Salac for the Reversal Sweep. Endure/Crunch/Swords Dance/Reversal, after a Swords Dance Reversal always OHKO's Skarmory.
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That's where the beauty of this set comes in; you don't even have to go to the Endure just to get a speed boost. Bring it on something that you know can probably kill your Lucario and CC / SD if they think you're going to switch. Bullet punch/extremespeed to finish off whatever HP is left.

The problem with skarm is that you have to set up for it when it will almost guaranteed whirlwind you away. At least with this set, you can go straight to a CC before the whirlwind comes. (and this thing will outspeed neutral skarm)
 
Orwell said:
It takes moderate damage from most things, which is bad if you intend to lead with Focus Sash. Lucario usually won't get KO'ed in turn 1, but will get KO'ed in turns 2 or 3 if he stays in.
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This is the biggest problem. I run Lucario with max Attack and near max Speed with just the spare EVs going to HP, and despite the lack of attention towards defenses it's yet to be OHKO'd when I've used it, while it's regularly in 2HKO range.
 
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