Jirachi (Cosmic Power)

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Mizu

Hiya! I'm peering in and leaving my mark with a nice set I've been testing over Shoddy. It's been causing havoc among the battles I've played, and the screams of frustration make me weep happy tears of joy.
Hopefully you'll all like it as much as I do. :3

Status: Proofreading needed! ^^

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Jirachi Analysis

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[SET]
name: Cosmic Power
move 1: Cosmic Power
move 2: Wish / Substitute
move 3: Fire Punch
move 4: Toxic
Item: Leftovers
Nature: Careful
EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SpD

[SET COMMENTS]
<p>Jirachi has a reputation for being the most annoying Pokémon ever created, and this set supports this claim. The goal is to accumulate as many Cosmic Power boosts as possible before wearing anything down by using Toxic. Because of Jirachi's amazing 100/100/100 defenses, Wish, and brilliant typing; it normally has no problem setting up more than one Cosmic Power.</p>

<p>This Jirachi is easy to use, but it can't be put into a team that won't make the best use out of it. This Jirachi works best on stall teams, preferably teams with Sandstorm.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>An EV spread of 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SpD allows Jirachi to survive a +2 Close Combat from Infernape. Three Cosmic Powers can turn an Adamant Choice Band Tyranitar's Earthquake into a 3HKO. This Jirachi can be a reliable counter to powerful sweepers once it has accumulated a few boosts, and proceed to wear them down via Fire Punch or Toxic.</p>

<p>Toxic and Wish form the crux of this set, as with Cosmic Power, it allows Jirachi to avoid being KO'd by most of its common counters. Substitute can be used if you really want to avoid status or just want a buffer against some attacks to allow Jirachi to score some more boosts. Fire Punch is the main attack as it allows Jirachi to hit any Steel-type that is immune to Toxic. However, you must be wary of Heatran who completely walls this set and can take Fire Punch for a free boost. No Speed EVs are necessary on this set, although if you care more about outspeeding certain threats and setting up, feel free to rearrange the EVs as you see fit. </p>

<p>Even though this Jirachi is very difficult to take down, some notable counters do exist. Sleep Talk + Roar Suicune provides a lot of problems, taking negligible damage from all your moves bar Toxic (which it removes using Rest), and can also Roar away your stat boosts. Skarmory does a similar job, abusing your turns of set up by Spiking the field and then Whirlwinding you away. It can also Roost off any damage you inflict with Fire Punch. Heatran is easily the most threatening Pokemon to this set, who is immune to both Jirachi's attacking moves and can hit back with a powerful Earth Power or STAB Fire-type move. Tentacruel also causes problems, being immune to Toxic, resisting Fire Punch and setting up Toxic Spikes in your face.
Most of these counters and similar ones like it can be taken down by a Choice Scarf Magnezone. Beware that both Jirachi and Magnezone share Ground- and Fire-type weaknesses, so pairing these two with a Bulky Water like Swampert or a Flying-type, such as Salamence or Gyarados, is a good idea. Heatran can be dealt with by a bulky Tyranitar, who has the added bonus of setting up Sandstorm.</p>

<p>Jirachi also fears Pokémon who set-up, even though most of them fear Toxic. Swords Dance Scizor is the most notable threat, being immune to Toxic and taking Jirachi down with Superpower, but it must be wary of being OHKOd by Fire Punch. Dragon Dance Tyranitar can switch in on Fire Punch and set up, hitting back hard with Earthquake, although Toxic will eventually take its toll.</p>
 
You should probably clean up all of the slashes on the set. Most of the ones you have mentioned are not even needed. I'd like to suggest this moveset in the place of the one you have:

move 1: Cosmic Power
move 2: Wish / Substitute
move 3: Fire Punch
move 4: Toxic

(make sure you run a Careful nature with the above set, not Calm)

This moveset still focuses on using Cosmic Power and the stalling ability with Toxic and Wish, but I removed some of the moves you don't need/are not effective. Psychic, even though it has STAB, does not help Jirachi with Toxic, as most of the common Steel-types immune to Toxic resist it by 4x (think Jirachi, Bronzong, Metagross). It does hit Poison-types, but really, Poison-types are not dominant in the OU metagame. I don't think Protect is useful on this set. You're going to have to use Protect over Fire Punch or Toxic, but those two moves are pretty important for this set to actually work. I guess it helps with Toxic stalling, but it really doesn't need to be on there. Doom Desire is not the most effective move out there, so I don't see why it should be listed as well. I also removed Thunder Wave, because Jirachi needs Toxic in order to actually do something and not be left helpless. I slashed in Substitute with Wish instead of slashing it with Toxic, because, again, you need Toxic.

So basically, I suggest you should use this alternative moveset because it still relies on Toxic damage and Fire Punch to hurt the Steel-types immune to Toxic (bar Heatran who walls you to no end), which is what I assume this set is supposed to do. Speaking of Heatran, you need to mention a way to deal with it. It can set up easily against you and you can do absolutely nothing to it.

Overall, I think this set is not that bad. I can see how annoying and frustrating it will be to take down this Jirachi if you lack powerful STAB moves. Cool stuff Mizu, and welcome to Smogon!
 
Cosmic Power + ToxicStall is indeed quite interesting, and definitely Fire Punch would be necessary to kill any steels/breloom that resist it.
I'll test it out on Shoddy tomorrow before making my own comments as a Jirachi abuser, but here's a proofread for now. I'll also edit in Fuzznip's new set.

Edit
remove

also, when writing analyses, try to avoid making the Pokemon in question seem more amazing than it is.

Mizu said:
[SET]
name: Cosmic Power
move 1: Cosmic Power
move 2: Wish / Substitute
move 3: Fire Punch
move 4: Toxic
Item: Leftovers
Nature: Careful
EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SpD

[SET COMMENTS]
<p>Jirachi has a reputation for being the most annoying Pokémon ever created, and this set is no different. The goal is obviously to accumulate as many Cosmic Power boosts as possible before wearing anything down using Toxic.</p>

<p>Because of Jirachi's amazing 100/100/100 defenses, Wish and brilliant typing, it normally has no problem setting up more than one Cosmic Power. Critical Hits are the only things that can take Jirachi down when it has +6 defenses so there is no need to worry.</p>

<p>This Jirachi is easy to use, but it can't be put into a team that won't make the best use out of it. This Jirachi works best on stall teams, most notably Sandstorm teams.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]
<p>An EV spread of 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SpD allows Jirachi to survive a +2 Close Combat from Infernape, and can OHKO back with Psychic. Three Cosmic Powers can turn an Adamant Choice Band Tyranitar's Earthquake into a 3HKO. This Jirachi can be a reliable counter to powerful sweepers once it has accumulated a few boosts and wear them down.</p>

<p>[[I'm re-writing this whole paragraph as the set itself has changed.]] Toxic and Wish form the crux of this set, as with Cosmic Power, it allows Jirachi to avoid being KO'd by most of its common counters. Substitute can be used if you really want to avoid status or just want a buffer against some attacks to allow Jirachi to score some more boosts. Fire Punch is the main attack as it allows Jirachi to hit any Steel-type that is immune to Toxic. However, you must be wary of Heatran who completely walls this set and can take Fire Punch for a free boost.
No Speed EVs are necessary on this set, although if you care more about outspeeding certain threats and setting up, feel free to rearrange the EVs as you see fit. </p>

<p>Even though this Jirachi is very difficult to take down, some notable counters do exist. First and foremost is Magnezone. Jirachi can do nothing to harm it outside of Fire Punch, although if you've stacked a few Cosmic Powers Magnezone can't do much to you either (barring a critical hit). Sleep Talk + Roar Suicune provides a lot of problems, taking negligible damage from all your moves bar Toxic (which it removes using Rest), and can also Roar away your stat boosts. Skarmory does a similar job, abusing your turns of set up by Spiking the field and then Whirlwinding you away. It can also Roost off any damage you inflict with Fire Punch.
Most of these counters and similar ones like it can be taken down by a Choice Scarf Magnezone. Beware that both Jirachi and it share Ground- and Fire-type weaknesses, so pairing these two with a Bulky Water like Swampert and a Flying-type like Skarmory is a good idea.
CP Jirachi also fears Pokémon who set up, even though most of them fear Toxic. Sword's Dance Scizor is the most notable threat, being immune to Toxic and taking Jirachi down with Superpower, but must be wary of being OHKOed by Fire Punch. Dragon Dance Tyranitar can switch in on Fire Punch and set up, hitting back hard with Earthquake, although Toxic will eventually take it's toll.
Gliscor can switch into Earthquake, Superpower and the occasional Fire move aimed Jirachi's way.</p>
Click to expand...

Seems cool, though.
 
Fuzznip said:
You should probably clean up all of the slashes on the set. Most of the ones you have mentioned are not even needed. I'd like to suggest this moveset in the place of the one you have:

move 1: Cosmic Power
move 2: Wish / Substitute
move 3: Fire Punch
move 4: Toxic
Click to expand...

I support Fuzznip's motion here. Slashes can be necessary but are in general annoying to look at.

Since 2 Pokemon give Fire move + Toxic trouble (ignoring the Natural Curers Starmies and Blissey and Celebi), Heatran and Tentacruel, I would mention anything that lures them out and beats them early game is good for you. Perhaps a simple Dugtrio reference is good enough (helps against Blissey as well).

Another option is to add a slash on the second move here for HP Ground. Tentacruel doesn't have reliable recovery, and HP Ground can 2hko Heatran, so it's a legitimate "useful for this particular set" option.

Food for thought.
 
Tentacruel doesn't cause this set problems. It gets burned due to Serene Grace Fire Punch and succumbs to burn while not dealing enough damage to be a threat.

Rest-talkers are the real threat here. Anything that rest-talks can take your attacks and then PP stall you with the sleep turns. Machamp, Gyara, Swampert, and Rotom-H immediately come to mind.
 
[SET]
name: Cosmic Power
move 1: Cosmic Power
move 2: Wish / Substitute
move 3: Fire Punch
move 4: Toxic
Item: Leftovers
Nature: Careful
EVs: 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SpD

[SET COMMENTS]
<p>Jirachi has a reputation for being the most annoying Pokémon ever created, and this set supports this claim. The goal is to accumulate as many Cosmic Power boosts as possible before wearing anything down by using Toxic. Because of Jirachi's amazing 100/100/100 defenses, Wish, and brilliant typing; it normally has no problem setting up more than one Cosmic Power.</p>

<p>This Jirachi is easy to use, but it can't be put into a team that won't make the best use out of it. This Jirachi works best on stall teams, preferably teams with Sandstorm.</p>

[ADDITIONAL COMMENTS]

<p>An EV spread of 252 HP / 176 Def / 80 SpD allows Jirachi to survive a +2 Close Combat from Infernape. Three Cosmic Powers can turn an Adamant Choice Band Tyranitar's Earthquake into a 3HKO. This Jirachi can be a reliable counter to powerful sweepers once it has accumulated a few boosts, and proceed to wear them down via Fire Punch or Toxic.</p>

<p>Toxic and Wish form the crux of this set, as with Cosmic Power, it allows Jirachi to avoid being KO'd by most of its common counters. Substitute can be used if you really want to avoid status or just want a buffer against some attacks to allow Jirachi to score some more boosts. Fire Punch is the main attack as it allows Jirachi to hit any Steel-type that is immune to Toxic. However, you must be wary of Heatran who completely walls this set and can take Fire Punch for a free boost. No Speed EVs are necessary on this set, although if you care more about outspeeding certain threats and setting up, feel free to rearrange the EVs as you see fit. </p>

<p>Even though this Jirachi is very difficult to take down, some notable counters do exist. Sleep Talk + Roar Suicune provides a lot of problems, taking negligible damage from all your moves bar Toxic (which it removes using Rest), and can also Roar away your stat boosts. Skarmory does a similar job, abusing your turns of set up by Spiking the field and then Whirlwinding you away. It can also Roost off any damage you inflict with Fire Punch. Heatran is easily the most threatening Pokemon to this set, who is immune to both Jirachi's attacking moves and can hit back with a powerful Earth Power or STAB Fire-type move. Tentacruel also causes problems. Most of these counters and similar ones like it can be taken down by a Choice Scarf Magnezone. Beware that both Jirachi and Magnezone share Ground- and Fire-type weaknesses, so pairing these two with a Bulky Water like Swampert or a Flying-type, such as Salamence or Gyarados, is a good idea. Heatran can be dealt with by a bulky Tyranitar, who has the added bonus of setting up Sandstorm on the playing field.</p>

<p>Jirachi also fears Pokémon who set-up, even though most of them fear Toxic. Swords Dance Scizor is the most notable threat, being immune to Toxic and taking Jirachi down with Superpower, but it must be wary of being OHKOd by Fire Punch. Dragon Dance Tyranitar can switch in on Fire Punch and set up, hitting back hard with Earthquake, although Toxic will eventually take its toll.</p>



That's what I noticed, hope i helped, good luck.
 
If fire punch is a primary option, then Swords Dance Scizor is not a threat.

Editing off SoT, "Heatran can be dealt with by a bulky Tyranitar, who has the added bonus of setting up Sandstorm on the playing field." ---> Remove "on the playing field".
 
I don't see how surviving a +2 Close Combat from Infernape is relevant, as Jirachi is OHKO'd by Fire Punch.

Also, remove the tidbit about Swords Dance Scizor -- it's not a threat. You may want to mention that Swords Dance Lucario can set up on you if it does not switch in on Fire Punch.

Finally, EV Jirachi to outspeed Adamant Breloom! 16 Speed EVs will do.
 
You may want to mention that Swords Dance Lucario can set up on you if it does not switch in on Fire Punch.
Click to expand...

well if it comes in after a cosmic power, you 2HKO it with Fire Punch. You Fire Punch, it Swords Dances, you suvive Close Combat and finish it with Fire Punch. So yeah, it can weaken you but it won't beat you so it's probably only worth saying "Lucario can set up a Swords Dance and hit hard with Close Combat"
 
I just had a conversation with Seven Deadly Sins regarding this set, we both question this set's effectiveness. For instance, Heatran destroys this set, Infernape sets up on it, and others such as Substitute / Lum Berry Kingdra and Calm Mind Jirachi are able to set up as well with little problems.

I would like to see this thread moved to Quality Control if possible.
 
Cosmic Power has always been terrible. This set does no damage to anything that isn't weak to Fire, and even on the odd chance you get it set up, you'll just get CHed or run out of health depending on your choice in move 2. Terrible set.
 
Hey guys, Maybe as a partner to take out Fire/Steel Pokemon, CB Dugtrio could be a cool partner for this set. Takes out pretty much every Pokemon mentioned as a problem and absolutely destroys Heatran. Anyway, just a thought, but anything with sub could be a real problem, although thats pretty obvious.
 
Setsuna. said:
I just had a conversation with Seven Deadly Sins regarding this set, we both question this set's effectiveness. For instance, Heatran destroys this set, Infernape sets up on it, and others such as Substitute / Lum Berry Kingdra and Calm Mind Jirachi are able to set up as well with little problems.

I would like to see this thread moved to Quality Control if possible.
Click to expand...

I used this set (Save with Psychic instead of Fire Punch and running a Calm nature) on a sandstorm team, and it seemed to be fairly effective. It'd of course lure out Steel types, which were then taken out by my Magnezone.
I ran Psychic over Fire Punch 'cos of STAB and also 'cos not many Pokemon resist Psychic/Poison save for Steel types.
I bowed to the better judgment of the community though when they told me that Fire Punch would run better.
 
Moving this thread to QC. I also wanted to mention that I think this set is actually promising, and I would like to see some logs from Mizu please.
 
This is already in other options on the on site Jirachi why is there a need to make a set when with just a little logic is easy enough to build anyway?
 
i think this set is useless but why not try perhaps twave/iron head/sub/cosmic power with a more offensively minded spread to stay around for a while but still be an offensive threat. i'm not sure how successful it would be but this set really just sits around and doesn't do too much damage, when another set can give twave support and a kill or two with iron head being a reliable attack.

im not suggesting that this would be viable but its something to test and see if cosmic power could be useful on a set that revolves around sitting around and recovering health - if you noticed, my suggestion is really just the subflinch set with cosmic power over fire punch.

at the end of the day, i think this set is just not good enough to be a real threat but with some testing, we can see if perhaps cosmic power can be slashed on a different one.
 
Agreeing with Philip, the set certainly has potential. It's like Stockpileopotomas, but with more balanced defenses and the ability to boost higher. Lack of a phazing move hurts, though.

This set needs to be paired with a reliable phazer, such as Suicune, to take on boosting threats that take little damage from Jirachi's moves.
 
I think that hippowdon should get a mention as a partner because it can take care of threats like heatran and t-tar with STAB EQ and sets up sandstorm and SR. Also has access to roar which can help ease prediction with this set
 
@Mizu, I would like to emphasize on what Philip said: can you show us some logs of you using this set? Thanks. As for right know, I'm leaning towards rejecting the set, but I'll wait for those logs anyways.
 
Logs were requested almost a month ago, and a week later I bumped this topic to emphasize on what we requested. At the time being, we have still not seen the information we asked for. Therefore, I´m locking this thread under inactivity.

Please feel free to try again in the future.
 
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