It's a plant! It's a tree! No! It's Sudowoodo! (Sudowoodo discussion)

Missingno. Master

Missingno. Master

First off, I checked- there IS another Sudowoodo discussion, but it hasn't been touched since January.

http://serebii.net/pokedex-dp/185.shtml (the dude's dex entry at Serebii.net)

Atk 100, SpAtk 30, Def 115, SpDef 65, Spd 30, HP 70

Abilities; Rock Head/Sturdy

Type; Rock

Moves;
Physical;
Wood Hammer
Flail
Low Kick
Rock Slide
Sucker Punch
Double Edge
Hammer Arm
Focus Punch
Earthquake
Return/Frustration
Brick Break
Fling
Explosion
Thunderpunch
Fire Punch
Ice Punch

(the last three- only from Pokemon Emerald)

Special (Yeah, because he'll REALLY be using that 30 base Sp.Atk.);
Hidden Power. Seriously, that's it.

Support;
Rock Polish
Stealth Rock
Sub
Swagger
Rest
Torment
Sandstorm
Toxic
Block
Calm Mind

Physical movepool rocks. Special movepool- heck, I can barely even call that a movepool. Just as well, though, given Sudowoodo's unusable Special Attack. Support looks pretty decent. Alright, let's see what the fake tree can do.

Sudowoodo @Life Orb
Brave (+Atk, -Spd)
EVs; 252 Atk, 252 Sp. Def, 6 Def/HP
Ability; Rock Head
Double Edge
Wood Hammer
Hammer Arm
Rock Slide

Use on a Trick Room team. With Brave and no Speed EVs, I highly doubt anything not named Shuckle or Munchlax will be able to outspeed him in Trick Room. Take advantage of Rock Head with Double Edge and Wood Hammer. Hammer Arm lowers speed, but Sudowoodo will only find that helpful. And Rock Slide for STAB and lack of a better choice (Stone Edge has worse accuracy and less PP, and given Sudowoodo's lackluster Sp. Def, he can't afford to miss that much).



Sudowoodo @Iron Ball
Brave (+Atk, -Spd)
EVs; 252 Atk, 252 Sp. Def, 6 Def/HP
Ability; Rock Head
Fling
Thief
Facade
Wood Hammer

Again, only for a Trick Room team. Fool around with your opponent's items. Fling the Iron Ball for massive damage, then steal another item with Thief. Facade's there in case you wind up stealing a Toxic Orb or something. Wood Hammer for power.

Sudowoodo @Leftovers
Sassy (+Sp.Def, -Spd)
EVs; 252 HP., 252 Sp. Def, 6 Def
Ability; Rock Head
Calm Mind
Stealth Rock
Double Edge/Wood Hammer
Sandstorm/Rock Slide

Tank Sudowoodo. Its beefy defense needs no further enhancement. Go with Sassy, and use Calm Mind and Sandstorm for the Sp.Def. boost. Then Stealth Rock, and do what you can with Double Edge or Wood Hammer. alternatively, you could put Rock Slide over Sandstorm, and have Hippowdon or T-tar supply the sand.
 
That bulky Sudowoodo isn't very good, if you want the sandstorm boost, just use it in conjunction with Tyranitar.

Why waste a moveslot on sandstorm, when you can have an extra move for type coverage?
 
Sudowoodo will only see the light of day in Trick Room teams, but even there is sorely outclassed by other rock types such as Rhyperior, Tyranitar, and Golem.
 
Sudowoodo's my favorite Pokemon, so I'll just have to recommend a moveset that focuses on what he does best:

Sudowoodo
Rock Head
Brave/Relaxed (depends on Damage calculations, go Brave if Relaxed can't kill the same stuff)
252 Attack, 252 Defense, 6 HP

Wood Hammer
Stone Edge (shame he doesn't get Head Smash)
Sucker Punch
Ice Punch/Earthquake/Hammer Arm

Wood Hammer should beat up Whiscash and Quagsire, though Gastrodon is problematic since it uses Special attacks. Sucker Punch can surprise faster Pokemon, especially Psychics or Ghosts. The fourth move is your choice: Earthquake and Hammer Arm give stuff like Aggron and Bastiodon problems, though Ice Punch can handle Altaria.

EDIT: My 666th post is in a Sudowoodo discussion? o.O
 
basch2020 said:
Sudowoodo will only see the light of day in Trick Room teams, but even there is sorely outclassed by other rock types such as Rhyperior, Tyranitar, and Golem.
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Not completely. (Non recoil) Wood Hammer and a lower speed means that it has tools for dealing with enemy Waters, Rocks, and Grounds that the others do not possess. Mono Rock typing, while certainly not the most desirable typing, does allow Sudowoodo to survive Grass and Water hits in a Sandstorm, something that Golem and Rhyperior will not always be able to boast.

Oh, and Sudowoodo can also Explode, which is definitely cool. I'd say it could be somewhat effective in a Trick Room setting with an all-out attacker moveset.
 
Wood Hammer and the elemental punches makes him quite an unpredictable force in Trick Room/Sandstorm Teams. Rhypherior and Swamperts don't like Wood Hammer, Torterra doesn't like Ice Punch, and his movepool gives him excellent coverage over the predicatble SE/Quake that most Rock or Ground types use.
 
harle1012000 said:
Wood Hammer and the elemental punches makes him quite an unpredictable force in Trick Room/Sandstorm Teams. Rhypherior and Swamperts don't like Wood Hammer, Torterra doesn't like Ice Punch, and his movepool gives him excellent coverage over the predicatble SE/Quake that most Rock or Ground types use.
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They may not like these moves, but I'm fairly sure they're 2HKOs, and Sudowoodo needs OHKOs (it's not as bulky as it may seem). Please correct me if I'm wrong; I'd love to see Sudowoodo OHKO some stuff, and I'm hoping for an evolution named Fibark in the next gen (Zirconia and Pyrite).

Choice Band would help it significantly, though.
 
cb earthquakes and the like is probably an ohko on this guy sadly, but he does have some cool moves. i don't have time to do calcs right now but wood hammer/ice punch can probably do a crapload to alot of walls (hippowdon, rhyperior, swampert, gliscor etc etc). i wouldn't forget sucker punch either.

obviously alot of guys are probably better choice band/life orb users, but i'm pretty sure the fake tree has a place somewhere.
 
Swimrunner said:
cb earthquakes and the like is probably an ohko on this guy sadly, but he does have some cool moves. i don't have time to do calcs right now but wood hammer/ice punch can probably do a crapload to alot of walls (hippowdon, rhyperior, swampert, gliscor etc etc). i wouldn't forget sucker punch either.

obviously alot of guys are probably better choice band/life orb users, but i'm pretty sure the fake tree has a place somewhere.
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In my first post in the topic, I mentioned Pokemon that are not so common, since I think he'll end up in the lower tiers. He'll see some use in Competitor when everybody gets sick of Standard, since he can be a decent Choice Bander.
 
I was talking to my friend about this the other day...

Sudowoodo should get an evolution next series of Pokemon. This time, Grass/Rock. Remember Salamence's Dex Entry? It stated that after longing to fly in the skies so much, it's DNA changed and it grew wings. Perhaps Sudowoodo's evolution will be Grass/Rock because after learning how to imitate trees perfectly, it evolved and became a tree instead of just an imitation.

In the evolution, he should look somewhat like a Pine Tree or Ent (A Race of Living Trees, such as the Ents seen in the 2nd and 3rd LotR Movie.)

Also in the evolution, he should again have Wood Hammer as a relearn attack, but this time, it'll have STAB. Also, it should learn Head Smash in its evolution, which will be amazingly powerful and useful.

A Pokemon that actually makes use of Rock Head would be nice to see. The only Pokemon we ever see with Rock Head are usually bulky Pokemon that are supposedly supposed to use it with the never seen Double-Edge. Powerful STAB attacks with no recoil? We don't have one, save for Relicanth, which makes very good use of Rock Head, but despite that it lacks the appropriate stats to make use of it.

Grass/Rock is also a good typing, getting rid of a lot of eachother's weaknesses. Its only weaknesses are Ice, Fighting, Bug, and Steel. I wish Torterra had this typing instead of Grass/Ground, because it gives way too many weaknesses and it has very little coverage. (Flying Pokemon are immune to Ground and resistant to Grass)

Of course, being a living tree, it should be very slow, 50s possibly. It should also get nearly no Special Attack. Attack should rise 10 points to 110 but Defense should go up by a lot. Special Defense should stay the same though. HP should go to 90.

Sudowoodo got a great attack, Wood Hammer, but GameFreak needs to expand on Sudowoodo and make him a more attractive choice.
 
Striker said:
I was talking to my friend about this the other day...

Sudowoodo should get an evolution next series of Pokemon. This time, Grass/Rock. Remember Salamence's Dex Entry? It stated that after longing to fly in the skies so much, it's DNA changed and it grew wings. Perhaps Sudowoodo's evolution will be Grass/Rock because after learning how to imitate trees perfectly, it evolved and became a tree instead of just an imitation.

In the evolution, he should look somewhat like a Pine Tree or Ent (A Race of Living Trees, such as the Ents seen in the 2nd and 3rd LotR Movie.)

Also in the evolution, he should again have Wood Hammer as a relearn attack, but this time, it'll have STAB. Also, it should learn Head Smash in its evolution, which will be amazingly powerful and useful.

A Pokemon that actually makes use of Rock Head would be nice to see. The only Pokemon we ever see with Rock Head are usually bulky Pokemon that are supposedly supposed to use it with the never seen Double-Edge. Powerful STAB attacks with no recoil? We don't have one, save for Relicanth, which makes very good use of Rock Head, but despite that it lacks the appropriate stats to make use of it.

Grass/Rock is also a good typing, getting rid of a lot of eachother's weaknesses. Its only weaknesses are Ice, Fighting, Bug, and Steel. I wish Torterra had this typing instead of Grass/Ground, because it gives way too many weaknesses and it has very little coverage. (Flying Pokemon are immune to Ground and resistant to Grass)

Of course, being a living tree, it should be very slow, 50s possibly. It should also get nearly no Special Attack. Attack should rise 10 points to 110 but Defense should go up by a lot. Special Defense should stay the same though. HP should go to 90.

Sudowoodo got a great attack, Wood Hammer, but GameFreak needs to expand on Sudowoodo and make him a more attractive choice.
Click to expand...

That's exactly what I'm thinking! :)

I'm thinking he should evolve in a Pinocchio style manner (have some "item", like a Fairy Wish or something, so he evolves by wishing to be a real tree, but gets stuck halfway or something).

That is for the 5th gen (Zirconia and Pyrite), so we have to focus on making him good right now in the UU environment. He seems to do pretty well in that, though, given his variable movepool, including the Punches.


Perhaps this moveset could work for prediction fiends:

Sudowoodo
Adamant
252 Attack, 252 Defense, 6 HP

Sucker Punch
Focus Punch
Stone Edge
Wood Hammer
 
Striker said:
We don't have one, save for Relicanth, which makes very good use of Rock Head, but despite that it lacks the appropriate stats to make use of it.
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News to me...Relicanth is bulky as heck and its Head Smash is strong as Rampardos's Stone Edge.

Either way save 'ifs' and musts' for another thread, this thread is supposed to be about Sudowoodo's use 'now'.
 
While I'm not sure what tier it will end up being in, I can bet you that Ramparados and Marowak will be a heck of a lot more powerful in an aggressive Standard trick room team than Sudowoodo, as both can OHKO just about anything as long as trick room is active. Unfortunately, once the trick room is gone, they will bite the dust to almost anything immediately due to poor defenses (although Sudowoodo can live for a bit longer, it still has the same problem due to junk sp def). Sudo's type coverage is nice, but just overpowering things is not something to be overlooked. In lower tiers, though, I can imagine Sudowoodo being a lot of fun to use (as long as ramparados isn't legal in the same tier).

I miss the good old days of being a noob and thinking that tree was heck-a-good. I really do think that Gamefreak needs to give him an evolution, as absolutely nothing is a greater slap in the face than being beaten up by a dancing tree. ^_^
 
Teferi said:
While I'm not sure what tier it will end up being in, I can bet you that Ramparados and Marowak will be a heck of a lot more powerful in an aggressive Standard trick room team than Sudowoodo, as both can OHKO just about anything as long as trick room is active. Unfortunately, once the trick room is gone, they will bite the dust to almost anything immediately due to poor defenses (although Sudowoodo can live for a bit longer, it still has the same problem due to junk sp def). Sudo's type coverage is nice, but just overpowering things is not something to be overlooked. In lower tiers, though, I can imagine Sudowoodo being a lot of fun to use (as long as ramparados isn't legal in the same tier).

I miss the good old days of being a noob and thinking that tree was heck-a-good. I really do think that Gamefreak needs to give him an evolution, as absolutely nothing is a greater slap in the face than being beaten up by a dancing tree. ^_^
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What about Sandstream Trick Room teams? A lot of slow Pokemon can also benefit from Sandstream, including Sudowoodo. I suppose it could survive a hit with the aid of Special Defense EVs, though we'll have to run some damage calculations to be sure.

EDIT: Although Rampardos can also benefit, I'm pretty sure most Rampardos users run Focus Sash and Rock Polish, rendering the added Special Defense somewhat moot.
 
I think I used to run Low Kick with Sudowoodo actually as it messed up alot of popular pokemon that Sudowoodo had no other real way of dealing with.
 
Footnote said:
Snorlax and Rhyperior jump to mind.
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Wouldn't it be better to hit Rhyperior with Wood Hammer, though? Low Kick is situational, though I guess it could work as a surprise Tyranitar/Snorlax combo. However, several bulky physical walls (Swampert, Rhyperior, Hippowdon) are hit harder by Wood Hammer.
 
adman2 said:
Wouldn't it be better to hit Rhyperior with Wood Hammer, though? Low Kick is situational, though I guess it could work as a surprise Tyranitar/Snorlax combo. However, several bulky physical walls (Swampert, Rhyperior, Hippowdon) are hit harder by Wood Hammer.
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That's very true. I suppose it's mostly for heavy Normal and Steel types, which, aside from Snorlax, aren't all that common.
 
adman2 said:
It can hit Tyranitar hard, but what else did it work on?
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Snorlax was the main reason, it used to be more prominent back in Advance and Focus Punch just didn't cut it with the charge wheras Low Kick would mow it down. Of course Wood Hammer does negate the need for Low Kick on most rock types. (This success with Suodowoodo actually had me trying out Low Kick with Primeape eventually)

What I used to use it for was Milotic, Kingdra, Cloyster, Snorlax, Rhydon, Cradily, Tyrannitar, Blissey, Steelix, Swampert. Surprisingly Low Kick hit Milotic practically as hard as STAB Rock Slide did but without a chance of missing. It also hit quite alot of bulky UU's which I'd see since although I played OU's my team was made of UU's.

Actually the advent of Wood Hammer and Stone Edge have made it mostly redundant now you point it out. On the neutral things Stone Edge is much stronger...and most of the coverage things Wood Hammer does better now. Even with T-tar although Low Kick hurts more Wood Hammer will probably still OHKO leaving only Snorlax, Slaking...both probably see less usuage now and Blissey which is abit meh since Stone Edge now outpowers it.
 
Forsety said:
Snorlax was the main reason, it used to be more prominent back in Advance and Focus Punch just didn't cut it with the charge wheras Low Kick would mow it down. Of course Wood Hammer does negate the need for Low Kick on most rock types. (This success with Suodowoodo actually had me trying out Low Kick with Primeape eventually)

What I used to use it for was Milotic, Snorlax, Rhydon, Cradily, Tyrannitar, Blissey, Steelix, Swampert. Surprisingly Low Kick hit Milotic as hard as STAB Rock Slide did but without a chance of missing. It also hit quite alot of bulky UU's which I'd see since although I played OU's my team was made of UU's.

Actually the advent of Wood Hammer and Stone Edge have made it mostly redundant now you point it out. On the neutral things Stone Edge is much stronger...and most of the coverage things Wood Hammer does better now. Even with T-tar although Low Kick hurts more Wood Hammer will probably still OHKO leaving only Snorlax, Slaking...both probably see less usuage now and Blissey which is abit meh since Stone Edge now outpowers it.
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Even with Choice Band, Sudowoodo doesn't guarantee an OHKO on Dragon Dance Tyranitar (the variant least geared to Defense) with Wood Hammer.
 
Ah I didn't bother checking that out. Then I guess Low Kick still has abit of usefulness in the current environment.
 
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