Is This Gen 5? RU Fighting Spam (Peaked #8)

[Styx14]

Hey guys, my name is Styx. I’m a longtime battler on PS and just recently decided to make an account on Smogon. I made this team a couple months ago and just got around to laddering as high as I could with it. I currently have peaked at number 8 and have the potential to climb higher but I decided to call it once I hit top 10.

Quick disclaimer: This team, in no way, looks like it should work but for whatever reason, it just does. Who needs a switchin to an S-Rank mega or a resist to the one type preventing this team from winning easily. But seriously, this team was designed around a flawed concept from the beginning (basically because I was proving a point to a friend who said it wouldn't work) and a team with 3 of the same type mons in addition to having to rely on a 3 mon defensive core to cover the entire metagame and all support needs simply will not be able to cover everything. This team is the result of much laddering and is tailored to what I perceived as the most common threats while on the climb. Despite its apparent lack of synergy, this in an incredibly fun team that works surprisingly well. Enjoy and thanks for reading :)

Proof of Peak

While perusing the RU Cores forum, I came across a cool fighting spam core consisting of Banded Sawk, Scarf Medicham and SD Cobalion. With the rise of Fairy typing in this gen, Fighting types everywhere took a huge hit. So, wanting to prove a point that fighting types still are beastly, I decided to make a fighting spam team.

Team Building Process:

The team obviously started with the three aforementioned fighting types:

There was a specific note on that core to bring something that can take care of Spiritomb because it gave that core all kinds of problems and a 100% counter to Spiritomb is Aromatisse so it was the next addition:

After that, I needed a rocker who could take fairy and basically other hits in general and Mega Steelix make a great option as Fairy and Steel types synergize relatively well:

Finally, I needed a fire type switchin because my entire team just loses to any hard hitting fire type in general, so Qwilfish took up the last spot of my defensive core:

Unfortunately, something on the team didn’t feel quite right so I decided to put a banded Gallade over Sawk for the stab zen headbutt in addition to having a second trick user on the team:

The defensive core still seemed to be lacking as I was incredibly weak to fighting spam *cough* got swept by Medicham and Gallade *cough*. To remedy that, I made Aromatisse defensive, changed Qwilfish to spdef Drapion to compensate for no longer having anything to take special hits, and changed Steelix to defensive Seimitoad to give myself a fire type switch-in:

I felt the team was at its best as I was able to climb up to top 50 with relative ease. However, before I could complete my climb, Cobalion got banned to UU, completely decimating the synergy on my team because I lost my way of defeating AmoongMola cores and my Glalie switchin. So I replaced it with an S-Rank Mega that could keep up the offensive pressure on the team, Mega Glalie:

I just felt dirty all over as I had gone against my beliefs and original stance of making the team with offense consisting of only fighting types, so, despite the fact it left me utterly defenseless against Mega Glalie, I changed my own Glalie to an SD Virizion (and, coincidentally, the team has not lost with Virizion in this spot):

The Team:

Virizion @ Lum Berry
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Close Combat
- Leaf Blade
- Zen Headbutt Stone Edge (ss234 and fran17)

The set-up sweeper. Set is completely standard so no real reason to talk much about it. This thing functions as a set up sweeper (duh) and a way to deal with the AmoongMola core. While not having the same typing or fairy killing ability as its brother, Virizion still is a huge threat that can set up on a moment’s notice and, with lum berry, completely decimate a weakened team. Its speed is perfect as it outspeeds all of those base 90-100s that populate the tier. Also, its fantastic special bulk comes in handy a really surprising amount. Additionally, Stone Edge allows Virizion to revenge Delphox and hit Togetic for SE damage.

Gallade @ Choice Band
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Close Combat
- Zen Headbutt
- Knock Off
- Trick

Despite this things brief time in NU, underestimate this things power at your own peril. It’s speed stat, while kinda pitiful, is actually handy when facing defensive pokemon, the very things Gallade is used to take down. If you doubt its power, just take a look at a couple of these calcs:
252+ Atk Choice Band Gallade Close Combat vs. 120 HP / 136 Def Alomomola: 322-379 (64.2 - 75.6%)
252+ Atk Choice Band Gallade Close Combat vs. 252 HP / 0 Def Mega Steelix: 300-354 (84.7 - 100%) -- 6.3% chance to OHKO
252+ Atk Choice Band Gallade Zen Headbutt vs. 252 HP / 252+ Def Aromatisse: 186-219 (45.8 - 53.9%) -- 93.4% chance to 2HKO after Stealth Rock and Leftovers recovery
Plus, having a second tricker is a fantastic way to cripple defensive teams.

Medicham @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Pure Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- High Jump Kick
- Zen Headbutt
- Trick
- Poison Jab

The cleaner of the team. Medicham gives this team a little bit of speed control, being the scarfer and all, and functions as a fantastic late game sweeper/revenge killer. The only move that isn’t completely standard on this set is Poison Jab and, to be fair, I just put that there as a way to try to deal with Fairy types in some way. The ultimate decision to go with scarf Medi and band Gallade as opposed to vice versa (they have the same speed and comparable attack stats) was the ability to defeat alomomola on the switch in and ability to spam the banded fighting move without worry. High Jump Kick just had too much of a drawback for me to rely on it to kill alomomola, plus Medicham is able to run a jolly nature while still hitting hard while Gallade would sacrifice a lot of power to be scarf.

Aromatisse @ Leftovers
Ability: Aroma Veil
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
- Moonblast
- Aromatherapy
- Wish
- Protect

My flygon counter, my status healer, my wish passer, my obligatory Fairy type in a gen 6 metagame, blah blah blah. Aromatisse works as my own counter to fighting spam in addition to being a counter to flygon, which would decimate this team otherwise. Additionally, I can leave my hard hitters in on things with status to get off crucial damage, only to have Aromatisse just heal off that damn scald burn, or whatever they got hit with. However, the biggest thing that Aromatisse does for this team is to lure in the opposing Steel-type, at which point, I double switch into Gallade for what is essentially a free kill. However, despite mainly using it as a pivot, Aromatisse is a nice safety net to have at the end of the game if I need to wall something that nothing else on my team can beat. Oh, and this thing reks Spritiomb who would otherwise give me a very bad time.

Seismitoad @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 164 Def / 92 Spe
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic
- Earth Power

Needed a fire resist, needed a rocker, needed something to switch into Mega Steelix, and something to deter volt switching. Seismitoad fit every single one of those needs so he was slapped here on the team. Seismitoad is really nice because in the frequent lead matchup of Seismitoad vs Mega Steelix, Toad basically gets free rocks because the opponent does not want their Mega Steelix maimed that early in the battle. Toxic is amazing for wearing down any pesky pokes that can take a fighting type attack from one of my offensive core and Scald is just Scald and thus is spammable.

Drapion @ Black Sludge
Ability: Battle Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 120 SpD / 136 Spe 248 HP / 160 SpD / 96 Spe (ss234)
Careful Nature
- Knock Off
- Poison Jab
- Taunt
- Toxic Spikes / Pursuit (fran17)

Drapion is this team’s way of dealing with stall, for the most part. Taunt and Knock Off are a phenomenal combination to wearing down the opposing team to where one of my fighters can clean up or punch a huge whole. Toxic Spikes, while incredibly matchup dependent, can sometimes win you the match, or at least give you a gigantic advantage based on one turn. Another option over toxic spikes is pursuit, which allows you to get heavy damage off on, if not outright ko, Delphox and Meloetta. Poison Jab is my way of taking out the fairies that annoy this team so much and, while dark typing nullifies the resistance, Drapion is still able to take a fairy hit while dealing out enough damage to where my fighting types can take care of the rest. However, the Dark typing does grant me immunity to Psychic types to where the opponent has to think twice about clicking psychic/shock and keeps them from spamming that move against my team. The speed is to outspeed neutral natured base 80s considering I couldn’t really think of a more relevant speed tier to hit.


Threatlist:

Mega Glalie: I have literally no switchins to this thing. The times I have faced it, I have beaten it through residual damage and revenge killing. Basically, if this gets in on something slower, something dies. This team's way of dealing with Mega Glalie is kinda reminiscent of taking on a bully by letting him punch you in the face until he breaks his hand

Mega Camerupt: Toad can switch in, but only once. Luckily this thing is slow so all of my team outspeeds and 4 of 6 can hit it really hard.

Delphox: With the right move, it can kill something on my team. Set scouting is necessary to deal with this although it is worn down very easily. Scarf set doesn’t hit hard enough and the lorb set is very revenge killable

Clawitzer: Dents this team hard, however, its speed makes it manageable. Generally have to revenge kill although Gallade and Virizion can switch in (the latter on everything except Ice Beam)

Tyrantrum: I don’t care about resists, this thing hits HARD. Usually have to use Toad or Aromatisse to deal with it but both take huge damage from Outrage and Head Smash respectively

Braviary: Basically, if banded, gets a kill every time it’s in on something slower but easily worn damn and revenge killed. If scarf, the Toad and Aroma handle it decently


Replays:

vs Theleprechaun before Cobalion kicked the bucket:

Drapion Breaking Down Stall: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ru-247612735
Glalie Replay vs Colonel Dong: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ru-249676359
Glalie Replay vs tehy: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ru-249776400
Defensive Core + Gallade Putting in the work: http://replay.pokemonshowdown.com/ru-250986326

Importable

Medicham @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Pure Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- High Jump Kick
- Zen Headbutt
- Trick
- Poison Jab

Gallade @ Choice Band
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Close Combat
- Zen Headbutt
- Knock Off
- Trick

Virizion @ Lum Berry
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Close Combat
- Leaf Blade
- Stone Edge

Aromatisse @ Leftovers
Ability: Aroma Veil
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
- Moonblast
- Aromatherapy
- Wish
- Protect

Seismitoad @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 164 Def / 92 Spe
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic
- Earth Power

Drapion @ Black Sludge
Ability: Battle Armor
EVs: 248 HP / 196 SpD / 64 Spe
Careful Nature
- Knock Off
- Poison Jab
- Taunt
- Toxic Spikes

Defensive Version Importable (Suggested by Vapo)

Medicham @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Pure Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- High Jump Kick
- Zen Headbutt
- Trick
- Poison Jab

Gallade @ Choice Band
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Close Combat
- Zen Headbutt
- Knock Off
- Trick

Steelix-Mega @ Steelixite
Ability: Sand Force
EVs: 208 HP / 252 Atk / 48 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Heavy Slam
- Roar

Aromatisse @ Leftovers
Ability: Aroma Veil
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
- Moonblast
- Aromatherapy
- Wish
- Protect

Alomomola @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 120 HP / 136 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Scald
- Toxic
- Wish
- Protect

Drapion @ Black Sludge
Ability: Battle Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 196 SpD / 64 Spe
Careful Nature
- Knock Off
- Poison Jab
- Taunt
- Toxic Spikes

Momentum Version Importable (Suggested by 49)

Medicham @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Pure Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- High Jump Kick
- Zen Headbutt
- Trick
- Poison Jab

Gallade @ Choice Band
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Close Combat
- Zen Headbutt
- Knock Off
- Stone Edge

Virizion @ Lum Berry
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Swords Dance
- Close Combat
- Leaf Blade
- Stone Edge

Seismitoad @ Leftovers
Ability: Water Absorb
EVs: 252 HP / 164 Def / 92 Spe
Bold Nature
- Scald
- Stealth Rock
- Toxic
- Earth Power

Togetic @ Eviolite
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 248 HP / 184 Def / 12 SpA / 64 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 30 Spe
- Defog
- Roost
- Dazzling Gleam
- Baton Pass

Sneasel @ Life Orb
Ability: Pickpocket
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Pursuit
- Icicle Crash
- Knock Off
- Ice Shard

Shoutouts

Uncensored for showing me how to RMT
Jolt for constantly badgering me to get to top 10 before he would be remotely impressed with any team I use
Togevoir for just being damn sexy

 

[ss234]

SD viriz / band gallade / scarf medicham / toad / aromatisse / drapion

Hello there. This is a p cool team and I like the offensive synergy between the 3 fighting pkmn as they break down defensive cores and each others checks and counters nicely. In theory using aromatisse creates more problems than it solves on this type of team in that it opens you up more to threats like delphox and mega camerupt but you have ways of playing around them. Besides, any team that stacks fighting types is bound to be weak to something - that's just the price you pay for the really strong offensive synergy. One thing I will suggest is perhaps trying out scarf emboar over medicham. Emboar lacks the sheer power of medicham but you do have band gallade and reckless emboar is hardly weak. Importantly, emboar gives you a good answer to glalie which you are very weak to seeing as it 2hko's everything on your team and medicham / full health virizion are your only options to deal with it. Emboar also helps vs. houndoom and durant which both seem annoying as well. You're not really increasing the delphox weakness either as delphox cannot switch into a reckless flare blitz(it's 2hko'd).

One spread on drapion you could try is 248 HP / 196 SpD / 64 Spe. This spread gets the jump on adamant tyrantrum and a few other things such as modest exploud and is in general a nice speed tier to hit because lots of pkmn aim for that like subcm meloetta. You still retain some bulk which is nice. Oh and finally you could try out stone edge over zbutt on virizion. You lose out on hitting amoonguss but you are able to check delphox to an extent and considering that's such a dangerous pkmn to this team I think it's worth considering(it 1HKO's everything at +1 and you have no concrete way of actually revenge killing it without losing 2 pkmn). You still have band gallade and drapion to help out with the alomo / amoong core but if you feel like this weakens you against these fatter teams then stick with zbutt.

Changes:

Hide

Scarf medicham --> Scarf emboar

Hide

Emboar @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Reckless
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Superpower
- Wild Charge
- Sleep Talk / Fire Punch (this slot is filler anyway)

Change drapion spread to 248 HP / 196 SpD / 64 Spe

Zbutt --> Stone Edge on viriz (?)

Hope I helped and gl with the team.

 

[fran17]

Hello Styx14 nice team you've got there, it seems pretty solid, but I've some suggestions for you. On Virizion Stone Edge over Zen Headbutt, this will allow you to hit Togetic and Flying type in general much harder, and poison types have a low usage right now so you don't need ZHB that much. Emboar over Gallade can be an option to have a stronger wallbreaker with access to a priority so he can act as a rkiller too, and he's a good check to Durant that is pretty problematic for your team atm. On Medicham Baton Pass over Trick / Poison Jab can give you a way to keep up momentum. On Drapion follow the spread that ss234 suggested you and try to replace Taunt/Toxic Spikes for Pursuit so you can trap Psychic type as Delphox or Meloetta.
That's all I hope i was useful n_n

emboar set

Emboar @ Life Orb / Expert Belt
Ability: Reckless
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Superpower
- Sucker Punch
- Wild Charge

 

[Styx14]

SD viriz / band gallade / scarf medicham / toad / aromatisse / drapion

Hello there. This is a p cool team and I like the offensive synergy between the 3 fighting pkmn as they break down defensive cores and each others checks and counters nicely. In theory using aromatisse creates more problems than it solves on this type of team in that it opens you up more to threats like delphox and mega camerupt but you have ways of playing around them. Besides, any team that stacks fighting types is bound to be weak to something - that's just the price you pay for the really strong offensive synergy. One thing I will suggest is perhaps trying out scarf emboar over medicham. Emboar lacks the sheer power of medicham but you do have band gallade and reckless emboar is hardly weak. Importantly, emboar gives you a good answer to glalie which you are very weak to seeing as it 2hko's everything on your team and medicham / full health virizion are your only options to deal with it. Emboar also helps vs. houndoom and durant which both seem annoying as well. You're not really increasing the delphox weakness either as delphox cannot switch into a reckless flare blitz(it's 2hko'd).

One spread on drapion you could try is 248 HP / 196 SpD / 64 Spe. This spread gets the jump on adamant tyrantrum and a few other things such as modest exploud and is in general a nice speed tier to hit because lots of pkmn aim for that like subcm meloetta. You still retain some bulk which is nice. Oh and finally you could try out stone edge over zbutt on virizion. You lose out on hitting amoonguss but you are able to check delphox to an extent and considering that's such a dangerous pkmn to this team I think it's worth considering(it 1HKO's everything at +1 and you have no concrete way of actually revenge killing it without losing 2 pkmn). You still have band gallade and drapion to help out with the alomo / amoong core but if you feel like this weakens you against these fatter teams then stick with zbutt.

Changes:

Hide

Scarf medicham --> Scarf emboar

Hide

Emboar @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Reckless
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Superpower
- Wild Charge
- Sleep Talk / Fire Punch (this slot is filler anyway)

Change drapion spread to 248 HP / 196 SpD / 64 Spe

Zbutt --> Stone Edge on viriz (?)

Hope I helped and gl with the team.

The changes to Virizion and Drapion have been implemented. Thanks! As for the Emboar suggestion, I didn't mention this in the teambuilding process, but I tinkered with Emboar for a little while but what I didn't like was the fact that it had little to no longevity. Two of its best moves are incredibly recoil heavy, and its secondary stab leaves it unable to truly clean up a team because of the attack drop. Naturally I loved the idea of Emboar on paper, particularly because it provided an ice resist for Mega Glalie, but it's incredible lack of survivability made it not work on this team as well as Medicham. I appreciate the rate though!

Hello Styx14 nice team you've got there, it seems pretty solid, but I've some suggestions for you. On Virizion Stone Edge over Zen Headbutt, this will allow you to hit Togetic and Flying type in general much harder, and poison types have a low usage right now so you don't need ZHB that much. Emboar over Gallade can be an option to have a stronger wallbreaker with access to a priority so he can act as a rkiller too, and he's a good check to Durant that is pretty problematic for your team atm. On Medicham Baton Pass over Trick / Poison Jab can give you a way to keep up momentum. On Drapion follow the spread that ss234 suggested you and try to replace Taunt/Toxic Spikes for Pursuit so you can trap Psychic type as Delphox or Meloetta.
That's all I hope i was useful n_n

emboar set

Emboar @ Life Orb / Expert Belt
Ability: Reckless
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Atk / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Flare Blitz
- Superpower
- Sucker Punch
- Wild Charge

Changes to Virizion have been implemented. See previous reply for reasoning on Emboar. In regards to Medicham, I tried Baton Pass on it at first because it was the recommended set, but I never used it at all and I thought the slot could be used much better. Poison Jab is a much better option on Medicham (for this team at least) as it is the only move in my fighting type core that allows me to catch fairy types (usually on the switch) and hit them super effectively, pretty much crippling them for the rest of the battle to where I can spam fighting attacks and still kill it (it has a very good chance to 2hko completely defensive Aromatisse on the switch with factoring in rocks or poison and protect). As for Trick, Medicham is almost always the one between it and Gallade to Trick its choice item against a bulky team as I usually still need the power on Gallade, and tricking a stall team is incredibly useful and is basically my main way of handling it. On to Drapion, Taunt is a must on that set, plain and simple, or you cannot deal with defensive pokes at all, which is Drapions main roll really. With Tspikes, I can definitely see replacing them for Pursuit, but I have never had trouble really with Delphox and Meloetta (although I do acknowledge their potential to really hurt this team) and tspikes have straight up won me some matches. I think that move slot comes down to a matter of preference of the player. Thanks for the rate :]

 

[Vapo]

Hey Styx14, I really like your team! Fighting spam offense is a lot of fun to play with, but I do see a few issues with your team, mainly in your defensive core, so I'd like to make a few suggestions that will hopefully improve your team's effectiveness overall:

• I know it goes against the theme of your team, but I really would suggest switching out one of your fighting types for a flying resist. Your team, in its current state, is trashed by Braviary, whether it be Scarf / Band / Sub Bulk Up. All of its sets are difficult for you to deal with. I see Virizion as the weakest link in your offensive core, so I would suggestion changing Virizion -> Mega Steelix. I would run an offensive stealth rock set with a moveset of Stealth Rock / Earthquake / Heavy Slam / Roar and an EV spread of 208 HP / 252 Atk / 48 Spe with an Adamant Nature. Moveset is pretty self explanatory, with Roar allowing you to shuffle your opponent's team through Stealth Rock (and possibly Toxic Spikes) and prevent things from setting up on you. EV Spread maximizes damage output and bulk while speed creeping opposing Steelix and Mega Camerupts that may try to creep base 30s. Mega Steelix, on top of providing you with a solid answer to flying types, also demolishes Fairies like Togetic and Aromatisse that otherwise wall your offensive core. Mega Steelix is also a solid check to Mega Glalie and Tyrantrum, which you listed as threats to your team.
• Listed in your threatlist are Delphox, Mega Camerupt, and Clawlitzer. Since Mega Steelix provides you with Stealth Rock support, you no longer require Seismitoad. Since your bulky water slot does not have to be your stealth rocker as well, I would suggest changing Seismitoad -> Alomomola. I would run the standard mixed defensive spread of 120 HP / 136 Def / 252 SpD with a Calm Nature and a moveset of Scald / Toxic / Wish / Protect. This EV spread allows you to survive two hits from Clawlitzer and Delphox and have a decent chance to take two hits from Mega Camerupt, which means you can switch into these pokemon, wish up, and beat them 1v1. CM Delphox can set up on Alomomola if it runs that, but with the combination of Toxic / Scald / Protect, you can weaken Delphox to the point where you can revenge kill it with Medicham. Alomomola is also a fantastic switchin to Mega Glalie, surviving two Freeze-Dry's after rocks and beating it 1v1. While you already have a wish passer in Aromatisse, Alomomola passes considerably larger wishes, so it isn't that redundant in my opinion. If you really are against dual wish passers, you could change Aromatisse for Togetic, which would provide Defog support for your team. However, I think keeping things the way they are is a perfectly acceptable option.

Other than that, I think you have a really solid team that has obviously proven its effectiveness on the ladder. I understand my suggestions do go against the theme of the team, but I believe they will improve its overall performance, so I hope you try them out! Good luck :]

Team w/ Suggestions

Medicham @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Pure Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- High Jump Kick
- Zen Headbutt
- Trick
- Poison Jab

Gallade @ Choice Band
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Close Combat
- Zen Headbutt
- Knock Off
- Trick

Steelix-Mega @ Steelixite
Ability: Sand Force
EVs: 208 HP / 252 Atk / 48 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Heavy Slam
- Roar

Aromatisse @ Leftovers
Ability: Aroma Veil
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
- Moonblast
- Aromatherapy
- Wish
- Protect

Alomomola @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 120 HP / 136 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Scald
- Toxic
- Wish
- Protect

Drapion @ Black Sludge
Ability: Battle Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 196 SpD / 64 Spe
Careful Nature
- Knock Off
- Poison Jab
- Taunt
- Toxic Spikes

 

[col49]

yo

cute team boss; fan of fight spam myself, and this seems like a reasonable rendition of it here. what issues i observe, in addition to those mentioned by both yourself and raters, of this team stem primarily from what i observe to be an extraneous / suboptimal defensive backbone. what i mean by this is that, while your defensive core is moderately efficient in a different context, in this build it both lends itself to free turns for pokemon you lack 'real' counters for, in addition to lending itself to a poor match-up vs.spike-stack, which i dislike on an entirely grounded build. what's more, these passive facets concede free turns to wish-passers and so forth, thereby establishing a scenario wherein you feel pressed to utilize a drapion for the sake of improving stall match-up with what one might assume to be a team with a proficient stall match-up even without. in taking this route, i feel the team greatly restricts its offensive match-up, making proto-typical offense batteries (ex: durant / glalie / dragon / psychic) far more overbearing than it would with a more aggressive squad. that said, my suggestions will seek to establish a more dynamic and hazard-resilient build, ideally with a greater focus on the offensive match-up.

for one, i would greatly advocate the use of bp togetic over aromatisse here. this encompasses the changes i sought to relay in the previous paragraph; as it stands, i see aromatisse as a huge momentum drain for the team, extending games in a manner that does not tend to favour the team in the majority of match-ups, given its current lack of hazard control and more substantial defensive backbone would ultimately lead itself to being outlasted by more defensively oriented balance / stall. in contrast, togetic offers similar defensive functions for this team, while (imo) tending to improve the blind spots in this current build, providing the hazard control to allow for a better handle on the spike-stack match-up while not abandoning the kind of momentum you might seek in a defensive pokemon here.

with this change in mind, it is worth noting a fairly sizable hindrance on the mega-glalie handle, and while the team can fairly easily restrict the free turns presented to it, it does not make for an ideal scenario by any means, given your faster 'mons are either ice-weak or scarfed (which is just establishing an unnecessary window for your opponent to regain momentum). that said, i would very much consider the use of lo sneasel over drapion here, specifically a pursuit variant; as stated prior, i don't think this team should have issues with stall, with or without drapion, given how most builds with pack maybe 2 fight resists and a bold momo to handle them, which this team should bust through all the same w/appropriate play. sneasel seeks to play a more active role in the teams handle on offensive threats, picking off faster threats (scarfgon, scarf rotom-c, durant, etc.), and suppressing dangerous pokemon like lo delphox. with the addition of a tangrowth check / tspike remover in togetic (not passive, but something to work with), i feel many of the significant defensive functions drapion retained for this team are dropped, making most implications of this shift rather moot. the main loss to be observed here, imo, would be that you now need to play a bit more carefully when switching into sigilyph, though worst comes to worst, you can always pivot togetic to safely bring in sneasel as to pursuit trap.

moving on to minor points, i tend to dislike jab on scarf medicham, largely on the premise that it is far too weak to accomplish much; it can hit faeries for a mild amount of damage, yes, but it is an atrocious lock-in for scarf and tries to put your cleaner in a position of breaking that does not really suit it in the grand scheme of things. i would very much consider picking up baton pass here as an early-game momentum tool, which might also serve as an easier means of sorting a pursuit trap from sneasel. similarly, i do not like trick on cb gallade, as while trick is a tool meant for inhibiting defensive pokemon, it makes very little sense on a pokemon powerful to the point that it 2hkos pretty much anything with the proper coverage. normally, i would recommend leaf blade here, but given the context of this particular squad, i would think stone edge to be a rather solid option, offering a nice middle-ground option for hitting (for example) glalie whilst not potentially giving spiritomb a free turn. speaking of, i'd really think opting for a jolly gallade, if only for allowing the opportunity to speed tie other base 80's (the most prominent obviously being glalie pre-mega in this scenario).

best of luck bud, hope some of my suggestions were of use to you

sets

Togetic @ Eviolite
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 248 HP / 184 Def / 12 SpA / 64 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 30 Spe
- Defog
- Roost
- Dazzling Gleam
- Baton Pass

Sneasel @ Life Orb
Ability: Pickpocket
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Pursuit
- Icicle Crash
- Knock Off
- Ice Shard

 

[Styx14]

yo

cute team boss; fan of fight spam myself, and this seems like a reasonable rendition of it here. what issues i observe, in addition to those mentioned by both yourself and raters, of this team stem primarily from what i observe to be an extraneous / suboptimal defensive backbone. what i mean by this is that, while your defensive core is moderately efficient in a different context, in this build it both lends itself to free turns for pokemon you lack 'real' counters for, in addition to lending itself to a poor match-up vs.spike-stack, which i dislike on an entirely grounded build. what's more, these passive facets concede free turns to wish-passers and so forth, thereby establishing a scenario wherein you feel pressed to utilize a drapion for the sake of improving stall match-up with what one might assume to be a team with a proficient stall match-up even without. in taking this route, i feel the team greatly restricts its offensive match-up, making proto-typical offense batteries (ex: durant / glalie / dragon / psychic) far more overbearing than it would with a more aggressive squad. that said, my suggestions will seek to establish a more dynamic and hazard-resilient build, ideally with a greater focus on the offensive match-up.

for one, i would greatly advocate the use of bp togetic over aromatisse here. this encompasses the changes i sought to relay in the previous paragraph; as it stands, i see aromatisse as a huge momentum drain for the team, extending games in a manner that does not tend to favour the team in the majority of match-ups, given its current lack of hazard control and more substantial defensive backbone would ultimately lead itself to being outlasted by more defensively oriented balance / stall. in contrast, togetic offers similar defensive functions for this team, while (imo) tending to improve the blind spots in this current build, providing the hazard control to allow for a better handle on the spike-stack match-up while not abandoning the kind of momentum you might seek in a defensive pokemon here.

with this change in mind, it is worth noting a fairly sizable hindrance on the mega-glalie handle, and while the team can fairly easily restrict the free turns presented to it, it does not make for an ideal scenario by any means, given your faster 'mons are either ice-weak or scarfed (which is just establishing an unnecessary window for your opponent to regain momentum). that said, i would very much consider the use of lo sneasel over drapion here, specifically a pursuit variant; as stated prior, i don't think this team should have issues with stall, with or without drapion, given how most builds with pack maybe 2 fight resists and a bold momo to handle them, which this team should bust through all the same w/appropriate play. sneasel seeks to play a more active role in the teams handle on offensive threats, picking off faster threats (scarfgon, scarf rotom-c, durant, etc.), and suppressing dangerous pokemon like lo delphox. with the addition of a tangrowth check / tspike remover in togetic (not passive, but something to work with), i feel many of the significant defensive functions drapion retained for this team are dropped, making most implications of this shift rather moot. the main loss to be observed here, imo, would be that you now need to play a bit more carefully when switching into sigilyph, though worst comes to worst, you can always pivot togetic to safely bring in sneasel as to pursuit trap.

moving on to minor points, i tend to dislike jab on scarf medicham, largely on the premise that it is far too weak to accomplish much; it can hit faeries for a mild amount of damage, yes, but it is an atrocious lock-in for scarf and tries to put your cleaner in a position of breaking that does not really suit it in the grand scheme of things. i would very much consider picking up baton pass here as an early-game momentum tool, which might also serve as an easier means of sorting a pursuit trap from sneasel. similarly, i do not like trick on cb gallade, as while trick is a tool meant for inhibiting defensive pokemon, it makes very little sense on a pokemon powerful to the point that it 2hkos pretty much anything with the proper coverage. normally, i would recommend leaf blade here, but given the context of this particular squad, i would think stone edge to be a rather solid option, offering a nice middle-ground option for hitting (for example) glalie whilst not potentially giving spiritomb a free turn. speaking of, i'd really think opting for a jolly gallade, if only for allowing the opportunity to speed tie other base 80's (the most prominent obviously being glalie pre-mega in this scenario).

best of luck bud, hope some of my suggestions were of use to you

sets

Togetic @ Eviolite
Ability: Serene Grace
EVs: 248 HP / 184 Def / 12 SpA / 64 SpD
Bold Nature
IVs: 30 Spe
- Defog
- Roost
- Dazzling Gleam
- Baton Pass

Sneasel @ Life Orb
Ability: Pickpocket
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- Pursuit
- Icicle Crash
- Knock Off
- Ice Shard

I really appreciate the time and thought you put into this! I completely agree with everything you said about this team having very glaring and exploitable weaknesses, hence the disclaimer about how this team does not look like it should work at all. To be honest, aromatisse was chosen because I couldn't actively think of another viable fairy type wall to be used in that slot. Togetic is a fantastic option as it will retain momentum as well as controlling hazards. I will miss the wish support and the status removal the aromatisse provided because it allowed me to risk scald burns. I will definitely give it a shot though.

Sneasel, while losing the ability to get up tspikes, take hits, taunt, etc, really gives this team and much more offensive premise, which could be welcome, particularly with pursuit being able to get rid of those pesky psychics. You would actually be surprised at how well this team fairs in long term battles as is. Putting sneasel and togetic on the team would really make this team much more momentum focused and will change how the team is played (which could very well be incredibly nice for the team).

Stone Edge has been added to Gallade because, upon reading your recommendation, I realized that I never trick away my item anyway. As for the nature, this is completely personal preference, but I prefer the power of adamant over jolly considering I have the worst luck with speed ties.

Finally, given how the team has been changed to much more momentum based, I gave medicham baton pass to try it out. I might miss an type of poison attack on the team, especially considering I now have 4 fairy weaknesses, but we shall see. Thanks again!

Hey Styx14, I really like your team! Fighting spam offense is a lot of fun to play with, but I do see a few issues with your team, mainly in your defensive core, so I'd like to make a few suggestions that will hopefully improve your team's effectiveness overall:

• I know it goes against the theme of your team, but I really would suggest switching out one of your fighting types for a flying resist. Your team, in its current state, is trashed by Braviary, whether it be Scarf / Band / Sub Bulk Up. All of its sets are difficult for you to deal with. I see Virizion as the weakest link in your offensive core, so I would suggestion changing Virizion -> Mega Steelix. I would run an offensive stealth rock set with a moveset of Stealth Rock / Earthquake / Heavy Slam / Roar and an EV spread of 208 HP / 252 Atk / 48 Spe with an Adamant Nature. Moveset is pretty self explanatory, with Roar allowing you to shuffle your opponent's team through Stealth Rock (and possibly Toxic Spikes) and prevent things from setting up on you. EV Spread maximizes damage output and bulk while speed creeping opposing Steelix and Mega Camerupts that may try to creep base 30s. Mega Steelix, on top of providing you with a solid answer to flying types, also demolishes Fairies like Togetic and Aromatisse that otherwise wall your offensive core. Mega Steelix is also a solid check to Mega Glalie and Tyrantrum, which you listed as threats to your team.
• Listed in your threatlist are Delphox, Mega Camerupt, and Clawlitzer. Since Mega Steelix provides you with Stealth Rock support, you no longer require Seismitoad. Since your bulky water slot does not have to be your stealth rocker as well, I would suggest changing Seismitoad -> Alomomola. I would run the standard mixed defensive spread of 120 HP / 136 Def / 252 SpD with a Calm Nature and a moveset of Scald / Toxic / Wish / Protect. This EV spread allows you to survive two hits from Clawlitzer and Delphox and have a decent chance to take two hits from Mega Camerupt, which means you can switch into these pokemon, wish up, and beat them 1v1. CM Delphox can set up on Alomomola if it runs that, but with the combination of Toxic / Scald / Protect, you can weaken Delphox to the point where you can revenge kill it with Medicham. Alomomola is also a fantastic switchin to Mega Glalie, surviving two Freeze-Dry's after rocks and beating it 1v1. While you already have a wish passer in Aromatisse, Alomomola passes considerably larger wishes, so it isn't that redundant in my opinion. If you really are against dual wish passers, you could change Aromatisse for Togetic, which would provide Defog support for your team. However, I think keeping things the way they are is a perfectly acceptable option.

Other than that, I think you have a really solid team that has obviously proven its effectiveness on the ladder. I understand my suggestions do go against the theme of the team, but I believe they will improve its overall performance, so I hope you try them out! Good luck :]

Team w/ Suggestions

Medicham @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Pure Power
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Jolly Nature
- High Jump Kick
- Zen Headbutt
- Trick
- Poison Jab

Gallade @ Choice Band
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Close Combat
- Zen Headbutt
- Knock Off
- Trick

Steelix-Mega @ Steelixite
Ability: Sand Force
EVs: 208 HP / 252 Atk / 48 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Earthquake
- Heavy Slam
- Roar

Aromatisse @ Leftovers
Ability: Aroma Veil
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 Spe
Bold Nature
- Moonblast
- Aromatherapy
- Wish
- Protect

Alomomola @ Leftovers
Ability: Regenerator
EVs: 120 HP / 136 Def / 252 SpD
Calm Nature
- Scald
- Toxic
- Wish
- Protect

Drapion @ Black Sludge
Ability: Battle Armor
EVs: 252 HP / 196 SpD / 64 Spe
Careful Nature
- Knock Off
- Poison Jab
- Taunt
- Toxic Spikes

Thanks for the rate! Your suggestions really cover up some of the big holes that the team had to begin with. However, with the changes, my team became a little too defensive for my personal preference, but that's just me. I will add your suggestions as a potential version of the team that I think could be very successful. I made this team to prove a point (not for fun because who actually has fun playing pokemon) about fighting types and I believe by changing that, I will have lied to myself and everyone I loved *sniff* and I just can't go through that torment... not again....

But in all seriousness, I the team looks much more solid when the changes have been applied and i appreciate the rate :)

 

[MZ]

49's momentum version cant be used because two baton pass users rip
edit: also when I literally just copied the main version's importable drapion has too many EVs. Havent tried vapo's version but hopefully that works

 

[Styx14]

49's momentum version cant be used because two baton pass users rip
edit: also when I literally just copied the main version's importable drapion has too many EVs. Havent tried vapo's version but hopefully that works

I simply copied the drapions evs wrong when I was editing my post. Thank you for pointing that out. As for the baton pass problem, I have changed baton pass on medicham back to poison jab in order to keep from breaking that clause. Another option I might try is heal bell on togetic, keeping baton pass on medicham as that will allow me to be a little more reckless on my switchins. However, that ruins the ability to maintain momentum which 49 suggested in togetic so I will probably test with baton pass and go from there.

 

[Natural Talent]

This team is pretty cool not gonna lie. One problem with this team is you are disgustingly weak to Fletchinder. Your Fletchinder check is Seismitoad lmao. I would suggest using SpD Rhyperior over Seismitoad or an offensive set over one of your fighting types (maybe like band or sd ).

Second thing I saw was you have no ground resist... That could lead to problems vs scarfed flygon late game and what not. A strong Rhyperior could really sent your team.

The defensive team gets kicked in by banded Rhyperior , sub calm mind virizion, and calm offensive sigilyph where you check is basically drapion, and then sub calm mind meloetta.

The offensive team and main team is hurt by fletchinder, Exploud (breaking down your defensive core), Durant can get a bunch of kills with seis weakened and scarfed durant may just win with hazards up and seis dead.

Hope this helps

 

[Styx14]

This team is pretty cool not gonna lie. One problem with this team is you are disgustingly weak to Fletchinder. Your Fletchinder check is Seismitoad lmao. I would suggest using SpD Rhyperior over Seismitoad or an offensive set over one of your fighting types (maybe like band or sd ).

Second thing I saw was you have no ground resist... That could lead to problems vs scarfed flygon late game and what not. A strong Rhyperior could really sent your team.

The defensive team gets kicked in by banded Rhyperior , sub calm mind virizion, and calm offensive sigilyph where you check is basically drapion, and then sub calm mind meloetta.

The offensive team and main team is hurt by fletchinder, Exploud (breaking down your defensive core), Durant can get a bunch of kills with seis weakened and scarfed durant may just win with hazards up and seis dead.

Hope this helps

I realize that my team basically get 6-0'd by fletchinder but for whatever reason, I haven't faced one on the ladder. Scarfed flygon is not a problem as it doesnt have quite the damage output to be a severe threat and aromatisse is a 100% counter to it, even at half hp. I haven't see banded rhyperior at all as most of them are defensive. Additionally, as for the Rhyperior suggestion, while I agree that it would singlehandedly fix my fletchinder problem, it would leave me more weak to rhyperiors and mega steelix as seismitoad can switch in on both and threaten them out with STAB attacks at their weaker special defenses. Rhyperior takes around 40% average from spdef Mega Steelix eq while Toad takes around 30% and Rhy takes 48% from other rhyperior while Toad takes 40% average. I know that it is only a matter of 10% damage, but considering how often I have run into Rhyperior and Mega Steelix on the ladder compared to the incredible absence of fletchinder (probably due to mega steelix and rhyperiors prevalence lol), Seismitoad was the superior option that the time.

In terms of Exploud and threatening my team, while I agree that it is a threat, every one of my pokes outspeeds it bar Toad and Aromatisse. And if it gets a kill, then thats just a free switch into gallade. I agree that a very well played Exploud is a problem, but in my experience, the opponent has to make a lot of doubles for exploud to truly threaten me. Durant is indeed a problem, but it cant really switch in on anything as even moonblast will so 35-42% and it tends to wear itself out with lo/hazards etc.

Strong ground types are indeed a problem, forcing me to play around them very carefully, but virizion and scarf medicham usually are able to apply enough pressure and outspeed to take them out.

I promise im not trying to sound like a dick in this reply lol. I really appreciate the rate and the thought you put into it. I was simply explaining why I made some of the decisions I did with the team. Tbh, this team was not designed to be perfect. It was designed to prove a point that fighting types, in the fairy dominated generation, can still be gigantic threats aka my friend told me it wouldnt work so I hard to prove him wrong XD. Whenever you have 3 same type offensive mons and are left with only 3 slots for a defensive core, you obviously will have some holes. I simply made the best of what I had and altered the defensive core to best take on what I was facing on the ladder.

 

[Natural Talent]

I realize that my team basically get 6-0'd by fletchinder but for whatever reason, I haven't faced one on the ladder. Scarfed flygon is not a problem as it doesnt have quite the damage output to be a severe threat and aromatisse is a 100% counter to it, even at half hp. I haven't see banded rhyperior at all as most of them are defensive. Additionally, as for the Rhyperior suggestion, while I agree that it would singlehandedly fix my fletchinder problem, it would leave me more weak to rhyperiors and mega steelix as seismitoad can switch in on both and threaten them out with STAB attacks at their weaker special defenses. Rhyperior takes around 40% average from spdef Mega Steelix eq while Toad takes around 30% and Rhy takes 48% from other rhyperior while Toad takes 40% average. I know that it is only a matter of 10% damage, but considering how often I have run into Rhyperior and Mega Steelix on the ladder compared to the incredible absence of fletchinder (probably due to mega steelix and rhyperiors prevalence lol), Seismitoad was the superior option that the time.

In terms of Exploud and threatening my team, while I agree that it is a threat, every one of my pokes outspeeds it bar Toad and Aromatisse. And if it gets a kill, then thats just a free switch into gallade. I agree that a very well played Exploud is a problem, but in my experience, the opponent has to make a lot of doubles for exploud to truly threaten me. Durant is indeed a problem, but it cant really switch in on anything as even moonblast will so 35-42% and it tends to wear itself out with lo/hazards etc.

Strong ground types are indeed a problem, forcing me to play around them very carefully, but virizion and scarf medicham usually are able to apply enough pressure and outspeed to take them out.

I promise im not trying to sound like a dick in this reply lol. I really appreciate the rate and the thought you put into it. I was simply explaining why I made some of the decisions I did with the team. Tbh, this team was not designed to be perfect. It was designed to prove a point that fighting types, in the fairy dominated generation, can still be gigantic threats aka my friend told me it wouldnt work so I hard to prove him wrong XD. Whenever you have 3 same type offensive mons and are left with only 3 slots for a defensive core, you obviously will have some holes. I simply made the best of what I had and altered the defensive core to best take on what I was facing on the ladder.

I guess :/ the main point was about fletchinder tho. Fletchinder wins without much effort, and with it being a good mon and it gets decent usage it's a big problem, I was thinking on the team if you are feeling real af put some innovation. Rock slide > Poison Jab :].

I guess you are fine with being weak to it since you it is fighting spam lol

 

[g]

To be honest i really see the value of Zen Headbutt on your virizion on this kind of team and for this reason i would keep it and replace Poison Jab on Medicham itself for Rock Slide so that you keep a decent way to revenge kill Delphox and Sigilyph (2 massive threats). Not like Poison Jab has much use anyways i'd say.