Project Counter That Pokemon! [Battle Time!]

[Tressed]

Counter That Pokemon!
approved by Aragorn the King
OP stolen from Halcyon.

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How it works

This project will focus on the construction of two separate teams, both bent on completely countering the other. The way this will be done is simple. Each team will pick a Pokemon one at a time alternating as follows: Team 1 picks, then Team 2 picks, then Team 2 picks, then Team 1 picks, then team 1 again, and so on until both teams have six Pokemon. At the beginning of every round, the Pokemon you pick should be one that does its best to counter the Pokemon (that’s plural btw!) that the other team picked in the previous rounds. This takes considerable amounts of team building skills, as it is important to simultaneously pick Pokemon that can counter whatever the opposing team picks while still trying to maintain synergy and prevent the other team from picking effective counters themselves. NOTE WHEN I SAY TEAM 1 AND TEAM 2, I MEAN THE POKEMON TEAMS. PEOPLE PARTICIPATING IN THIS PROJECT WILL BE ABLE TO DO SO FOR BOTH TEAMS.

Each round will have two periods: a nomination period and a voting period. During the nomination period, new users as well as veterans can nominate whatever Pokemon they feel will best suit the team relative to the opposing team (for the first round, it will just be a Pokemon that Team 1 will want to build around). I encourage people to discuss the different nominations during this time. After all, if we don’t have solid discussions about which Pokemon is best suited for the team, it will be very difficult to pick the best choice. After a few days of nominations, the voting period will begin. Voting will last two days, after which the following round will begin. Only those with a post count greater than or equal to 25 will be allowed to vote. This may seem “elitist” or unfair to newer users, but it is only a measure to prevent people from making alternate accounts or getting their friends to sign up just to vote for their Pokemon (this has happened before, btw).

Once the two teams have been created, I will elect two battlers to have the teams combat each other in a best of three series to see which team has truly countered the other!

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Rules

Nominations must be serious in nature. I don’t to see anyone making fake nominations for teams built around Stunfisk or anything of the sort. That being said, if you want to use an underrated Pokemon or one that may be considered “bad” in normal play, yet does a good job countering the opposing team, that is perfectly okay.

No insulting others for their opinions on what Pokemon is best. The standard OU forum rules about flaming apply to this thread as well. If you insult users, you may face infractions, so just be respectful to your fellow users n_n

All nominations must have solid reasoning as to why that Pokemon should be chosen. I’m not asking for a novel, but at least a paragraph explaining why you think your set is best is necessary. Any nomination without an explanation to go with it will be disqualified (don’t worry though I’ll let you know through PM if your description is unsatisfactory and you will be given a chance to expand on it n_n)

Each person only gets one nomination per round. You can't just post three or four counters every round hoping that yours will be picked. Just submit the one you believe is best suited to counter the given Pokemon.

NO SLASHES ALLOWED ON YOUR MOVESETS. Otherwise, the opposing team's "counter" might end up not being a counter at all.


Please feel free to PM me if you have any questions!

With that said, I hope you enjoy Counter That Pokemon!​

 

[Tressed]

Team ArchPhantom

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Gengar @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 29 HP / 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Sludge Wave
- Focus Blast
- Icy Wind

Garchomp @ Rocky Helmet
Ability: Rough Skin
EVs: 248 HP / 168 Def / 92 Spe
Impish Nature
- Dragon Tail
- Earthquake
- Stealth Rock
- Rest

Bisharp @ Blackglasses
Ability: Defiant
EVs: 252 Atk / 52 SpD / 204 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Knock Off
- Iron Head
- Sucker Punch
- Pursuit

Latias @ Latiasite
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 248 HP / 212 Def / 44 Spe
Bold Nature
- Calm Mind
- Roost
- Hidden Power [Fighting]
- Stored Power

Klefki @ Leftovers
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 4 Def / 252 SpD
Careful Nature
- Thunder Wave
- Magnet Rise
- Spikes
- Play Rough

Clefable @ Leftovers
Ability: Magic Guard
EVs: 252 HP / 68 Def / 188 SpD
Calm Nature
- Moonblast
- Calm Mind
- Ice Beam
- Soft-Boiled

Team Bludz

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Dragalge @ Black Sludge
Ability: Adaptability
EVs: 248 HP / 232 SpD / 28 Spe
Calm Nature
- Toxic Spikes
- Scald
- Sludge Wave
- Draco Meteor

Victini @ Choice Scarf
Ability: Victory Star
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- V-create
- Bolt Strike
- U-turn
- Final Gambit

Keldeo @ Choice Specs
Ability: Justified
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Scald
- Hydro Pump
- Secret Sword
- Icy Wind

Landorus @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Stealth Rock
- Knock Off
- Earth Power
- Hidden Power [Ice]

Sableye @ Sablenite
Ability: Prankster
EVs: 252 HP / 112 Def / 144 SpD
Careful Nature
- Knock Off
- Will-O-Wisp
- Recover
- Foul Play

Dragonite @ Lum Berry
Ability: Multiscale
EVs: 252 Atk / 4 Def / 252 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Dragon Dance
- Dragon Claw
- Extreme Speed
- Fire Punch

 

[Random Passerby]

Oh, this project is finally back. I feel that for the first pick, we should choose a Pokemon that can cause offensive pressure on the opponent. Also, this Pokemon should not be easily played around (since that's just asking to get hard-countered). Therefore, the first Pokemon I nominate is Gengar, the Pokemon who has been OU since RBY.

Gengar @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 29 HP / 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Sludge Wave
- Focus Blast
- Icy Wind

Gengar's unique STAB combo of Ghost + Poison allows it to hit almost all the Pokemon in OU neutrally while providing Super Effective coverage on some of the metagame's defining threats such as Mega Metagross, Lati@s, Mega Altaria, Clefable and Mega Diancie. Focus Blast rounds out the coverage by OHKOing Tyranitar and Bisharp who can switch in freely and Pursuit trap Gengar otherwise. In the last slot, Icy Wind is chosen to hit Specially Defensive Gliscor who can wall Gengar otherwise.As a bonus, Icy Wind also hits Dragons and Landorus-I while slowing down Choice Scarf users (and Tornadus-T). However, Gengar can also run utility moves such as Taunt, Destiny Bond and Will-O-Wisp (I can change this depending on feedbacks). Remember that Gengar has base 110 Speed and 130 SpA with an almost unresisted STAB combo so the opponent will be forced to go the defensive route, which is what we want to force.

 

[firehusky]

Here's my nomination :]

ZARD Y

Charizard @ Charizardite Y
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fire Blast
- Solar Beam
- Focus Blast
- Roost

Zard Y is very hard to counter so it should make for a great first pokemon. Nothing much to say, it has pretty limited counters which can easily be taken care of with team support. Standard set.

 

[pika pal]

Here's my nomination :]

ZARD Y

Charizard @ Charizardite Y
Ability: Blaze
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
- Fire Blast
- Solar Beam
- Focus Blast
- Roost

Zard Y is very hard to counter so it should make for a great first pokemon. Nothing much to say, it has pretty limited counters which can easily be taken care of with team support. Standard set.

Zard Y could certainly make a good Pokemon, but I don't think it should be our first, mostly because it is a Mega. Considering how versatile some of the available Megas are right now, being able to save that for later could prove useful for the team's options in including counters. If we indeed want Zard Y, I'd say try to build a team that either covers its counters or forces the opponent to pick mons weak to Zard-Y first, which eases our choice in Zard-Y's support.

 

[quagback2qc]

I nominate G̶i̶r̶i̶t̶i̶n̶a̶-̶O̶ Tyrantrum as the first pokemon. This might be an odd nomination, but Tyrantrum, if played correctly, is extremely difficult to counter. Al most nothing can, because CB Head Smash 2HKO's everything except for Chestnaught and Hippo, which are taken out by Outrage. In fact, CB Head Smash is so difficult to counter, that Mega Slowbro with max def investment is 2HKO'ed after Rocks. It's pretty obvious to see how difficult it is to counter Tyrantrum, plus, it would add some spice to this thread.

So, without further ado:

Tyrantrum @ Choice Band
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 Def
Adamant Nature
- Head Smash
- Outrage
- Superpower
- Toxic

So, in conclusion: Pretty basic set. Toxic is an option if the Tyrantrum is about to be taken out, or switching in late game. Almost impossible to counter, and its counters can be beaten pretty easily with good team support.

 

[Anduril]

I nominate G̶i̶r̶i̶t̶i̶n̶a̶-̶O̶ Tyrantrum as the first pokemon. This might be an odd nomination, but Tyrantrum, if played correctly, is extremely difficult to counter. Al most nothing can, because CB Head Smash 2HKO's everything except for Chestnaught and Hippo, which are taken out by Outrage. In fact, CB Head Smash is so difficult to counter, that Mega Slowbro with max def investment is 2HKO'ed after Rocks. It's pretty obvious to see how difficult it is to counter Tyrantrum, plus, it would add some spice to this thread.

So, without further ado:

Tyrantrum @ Choice Band
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 Def
Adamant Nature
- Head Smash
- Outrage
- Superpower
- Toxic

So, in conclusion: Pretty basic set. Toxic is an option if the Tyrantrum is about to be taken out, or switching in late game. Almost impossible to counter, and its counters can be beaten pretty easily with good team support.

Agreed, but I think Earthquake or even Aerial Ace to lure Chesnaught would be better instead of Toxic.

 

[Red Cat]

Nice to see this project get revived. Hopefully it moves along faster this time so it doesn't limp to the finish line like the last one. Here is my nomination:

Keldeo @ Choice Specs
Ability: Justified
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Secret Sword
- Hydro Pump
- Icy Wind

I should get an A for originality here. Specs Keldeo doesn't need a whole lot of explanation as it is difficult to wall and has good speed with decent bulk, so there are not a ton of choices for Team 2 to pick to check or counter Keldeo, especially since most Pokemon don't like Scald burns.

Agreed, but I think Earthquake or even Aerial Ace to lure Chesnaught would be better instead of Toxic.

The players battling each other will know the other team's sets, so lures won't work here. If Aerial Ace is a move on Tyrantrum, Chesnaught will not be picked for the other team to counter it.

 

[Voltage]

Nice to see this project get revived. Hopefully it moves along faster this time so it doesn't limp to the finish line like the last one. Here is my nomination:

Keldeo @ Choice Specs
Ability: Justified
EVs: 4 Def / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Scald
- Secret Sword
- Hydro Pump
- Icy Wind

I should get an A for originality here. Specs Keldeo doesn't need a whole lot of explanation as it is difficult to wall and has good speed with decent bulk, so there are not a ton of choices for Team 2 to pick to check or counter Keldeo, especially since most Pokemon don't like Scald burns.

Was going to make a post about SpecsKeld but this really does pretty much speak for itself here. Hits like a monster truck on speed.

 

[OverlordDerp]

In the same vein as Tyrantrum (thx for taking my nomination, quagback2qc :/), I want to nominate something that is already both scary and common, but with a set that is seldom seen in favour of its more cookie-cutter sets.

Landorus (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Earth Power
- Sludge Wave
- Knock Off
- Rock Slide

Knock Off and Rock Slide rip apart Landorus's usual checks like stallbreaker Talonflame, RestTalk Gyarados, Tornadus-T and even Chansey to some extent. This, in turn, makes it very hard to check or wall. Landorus's incredible movepool is already one of the reasons it's rated so highly, so I figured it would make a very solid first-pick nomination.

 

[urban]

Oh, this project is finally back. I feel that for the first pick, we should choose a Pokemon that can cause offensive pressure on the opponent. Also, this Pokemon should not be easily played around (since that's just asking to get hard-countered). Therefore, the first Pokemon I nominate is Gengar, the Pokemon who has been OU since RBY.

Gengar @ Life Orb
Ability: Levitate
EVs: 252 SpA / 4 SpD / 252 Spe
Timid Nature
IVs: 29 HP / 0 Atk
- Shadow Ball
- Sludge Wave
- Focus Blast
- Icy Wind

Gengar's unique STAB combo of Ghost + Poison allows it to hit almost all the Pokemon in OU neutrally while providing Super Effective coverage on some of the metagame's defining threats such as Mega Metagross, Lati@s, Mega Altaria, Clefable and Mega Diancie. Focus Blast rounds out the coverage by OHKOing Tyranitar and Bisharp who can switch in freely and Pursuit trap Gengar otherwise. In the last slot, Icy Wind is chosen to hit Specially Defensive Gliscor who can wall Gengar otherwise.As a bonus, Icy Wind also hits Dragons and Landorus-I while slowing down Choice Scarf users (and Tornadus-T). However, Gengar can also run utility moves such as Taunt, Destiny Bond and Will-O-Wisp (I can change this depending on feedbacks). Remember that Gengar has base 110 Speed and 130 SpA with an almost unresisted STAB combo so the opponent will be forced to go the defensive route, which is what we want to force.

I really like the idea of using Gengar because it's the only pokemon to be OU through all the generations. I also think Gengar could generate some interesting choices as far as counters go because there are a variety of things that can be used as a counter.

In a similar vein, I'm not sure about using CB Tyrantrum because it really only has a couple hard counters, namely Hippo and Chesnaught and this could severely limit team building for the second team. Though I will admit Hippo is a pretty versatile mon for balance teams.

Specs Keldeo seems like an interesting choice, but I'm concerned with it being somewhat prediction reliant and cursed with what is kind of a middling speed for the current metagame. That being said, almost nothing likes taking specs boosted attacks from a powerful mon like keld, so I think it could make a viable first mon.

Note: I know I can't currently vote, but I just wanted to throw my thoughts out there.

Edit: OverlordDerp's nomination of mixed Landorus-I seems cool too. Talk about no safe switch-ins.

 

[pika pal]

Agreed, but I think Earthquake or even Aerial Ace to lure Chesnaught would be better instead of Toxic.

I don't think the purpose of a lure will be served in this project, because one thing that lends to a lure's success is not being common enough to expect it. The entire point of this project is knowing the teams as they're constructed and building them to counter each other.

 

[SparksBlade]

sorry if i got it wrong, but do we do mindless cting here? i mean, hp ice exca cos the opp team picked lando? shouldn't we use sets that are viable in the meta as a whole as well? i mean there are many ways to counter a mon w/o using gimmicks. Aerial Ace or EQ over Toxic on a banded set completely makes sense, and just because we're gonna ct here, shouldn't mean we ignore actually good sets.

 

[Tressed]

sorry if i got it wrong, but do we do mindless cting here? i mean, hp ice exca cos the opp team picked lando? shouldn't we use sets that are viable in the meta as a whole as well? i mean there are many ways to counter a mon w/o using gimmicks. Aerial Ace or EQ over Toxic on a banded set completely makes sense, and just because we're gonna ct here, shouldn't mean we ignore actually good sets.

In a standard format, you would pick sets that work consistantly against a wide variety of teams. For this project, however, there's only one matchup that matters. I don't mind substandard or strange sets, so long as they have a purpose. And remember, sets are determined by voting. If you disagree with a set, you're free to post suggestions to change it, post your own variant of a set, and vote for something else.

Nominations must be serious in nature. I don’t to see anyone making fake nominations for teams built around Stunfisk or anything of the sort. That being said, if you want to use an underrated Pokemon or one that may be considered “bad” in normal play, yet does a good job countering the opposing team, that is perfectly okay.

In Tyrantrum's case, it'll rarely be using it's fourth moveslot anyways. Odd options like Toxic are perfectly viable.

 

[Red Cat]

In the same vein as Tyrantrum (thx for taking my nomination, quagback2qc :/), I want to nominate something that is already both scary and common, but with a set that is seldom seen in favour of its more cookie-cutter sets.

Landorus (M) @ Life Orb
Ability: Sheer Force
EVs: 4 Atk / 252 SpA / 252 Spe
Naive Nature
- Earth Power
- Sludge Wave
- Knock Off
- Rock Slide

Knock Off and Rock Slide rip apart Landorus's usual checks like stallbreaker Talonflame, RestTalk Gyarados, Tornadus-T and even Chansey to some extent. This, in turn, makes it very hard to check or wall. Landorus's incredible movepool is already one of the reasons it's rated so highly, so I figured it would make a very solid first-pick nomination.

This set is walled by Skarmory and the pink blobs since you lack Focus Blast. The problem I have with Landorus-I as the first pick is that while there are no hard counters to every possible set, any 1 set has numerous counters which will obviously get picked by the other team. Besides, Landorus-I was the first pick the last time this project was done, so I'd like to see this go in a different direction this time.

I nominate G̶i̶r̶i̶t̶i̶n̶a̶-̶O̶ Tyrantrum as the first pokemon. This might be an odd nomination, but Tyrantrum, if played correctly, is extremely difficult to counter. Al most nothing can, because CB Head Smash 2HKO's everything except for Chestnaught and Hippo, which are taken out by Outrage. In fact, CB Head Smash is so difficult to counter, that Mega Slowbro with max def investment is 2HKO'ed after Rocks. It's pretty obvious to see how difficult it is to counter Tyrantrum, plus, it would add some spice to this thread.

So, without further ado:

Tyrantrum @ Choice Band
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 Def
Adamant Nature
- Head Smash
- Outrage
- Superpower
- Toxic

So, in conclusion: Pretty basic set. Toxic is an option if the Tyrantrum is about to be taken out, or switching in late game. Almost impossible to counter, and its counters can be beaten pretty easily with good team support.

With the set you have right now, Doublade is an easy first pick for Team 2.

 

[Asterus]

I nominate G̶i̶r̶i̶t̶i̶n̶a̶-̶O̶ Tyrantrum as the first pokemon. This might be an odd nomination, but Tyrantrum, if played correctly, is extremely difficult to counter. Al most nothing can, because CB Head Smash 2HKO's everything except for Chestnaught and Hippo, which are taken out by Outrage. In fact, CB Head Smash is so difficult to counter, that Mega Slowbro with max def investment is 2HKO'ed after Rocks. It's pretty obvious to see how difficult it is to counter Tyrantrum, plus, it would add some spice to this thread.

So, without further ado:

Tyrantrum @ Choice Band
Ability: Rock Head
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 Def
Adamant Nature
- Head Smash
- Outrage
- Superpower
- Toxic

So, in conclusion: Pretty basic set. Toxic is an option if the Tyrantrum is about to be taken out, or switching in late game. Almost impossible to counter, and its counters can be beaten pretty easily with good team support.

Superpower should probably be earthquake, as it hits most (if not all) of superpower's targets without the stat drop and hits new targets. For example without earthquake M-gross can switch in and force you out, but with only a little prior damage you can OHKO it. Superpower does allow you to hit steel types carrying a balloon/levitate though, which is nice and why it usually fills my forth slot. Toxic is ok but the funny thing is as you said, there is next to nothing you can't 2HKO. But I won't debate the forth slot because:

In Tyrantrum's case, it'll rarely be using it's fourth moveslot anyways. Odd options like Toxic are perfectly viable.

 

[Tressed]

Given a lack of recent activity, I'm going to accelerate the schedule a little bit. Tomorrow, April 10th, will be the last day for submitting a set for Team 1. On the 11th, voting will open up, so if you have a mon you'd like to submit, get it in before then.

 

[Random Passerby]

So, we now have 5 Pokemon to choose from. I will just post my thoughts on all 5 here.

Gengar : Fast and hard-hitting Pokemon with its dual STAB hitting almost everything in OU neutrally. Its typing and ability also gives it important resistances to Poison, Ground and Fighting. However, Gengar is frail and may need a slow U-Turn or double switch to come in safely.

Mega Zard Y: I won't deny that Zard Y is a great wallbreaker but the opportunity cost of using another Mega in ORAS is really high. Furthermore, picking a Mega as the first pick lets Team 2 to hard counter it, wasting its potential. Furthermore, if we pick Zard Y now, we would be forced to put a Spinner or Defogger on the team immediately, constraining team building. I say, we shall wait to use the Mega slot just in case Team 2 builds a team that is incredible vulnerable to a certain threat.

Keldeo: Who hasn't used Specs Keldeo yet? Keldeo possesses a great Speed tier and extremely spammable STAB combo of Water and Fighting. It can also burn switch-ins with Scald. The one thing I don't like about Keldeo is its checks and counters are difficult to wear down (Tornadus-T, Amoonguss and Slowking have Regenerator, Lati@s and Celebi having Recover) and Keldeo can't do much to them even with its coverage moves.

Tyrantrum: No comment. Haven't used it before.

Landorus-I: Life Orb + Sheer Force makes this Pokemon extremely difficult to find answers for, especially with Rock Slide hitting Zapdos and Gyarados Super Effectively. Good Speed tier and power. Not much flaws either (seriously, why is this not Ubers again?).

 

[bludz]

Metagross @ Metagrossite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 SpD
Jolly Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Zen Headbutt
- Hammer Arm
- Grass Knot

Probably the best Mega Evolution in OU right now (Mega Alt has made a push lately), and for good reason. This thing has few outright counters and checks a vast majority of the offensive metagame while also destroying many defensive cores. While I think it might not necessarily be the best move to choose a Mega Evo as the first pokemon for a team in this project, I think this one is certainly worth the nomination. It would also force team 2 to run a defensive mon such as Slowking or Skarmory, or force their own Mega in Mega Scizor which is much easier to counter. Grass Knot is the move that makes Metagross the most difficult to counter, beating typical switch-ins such as Slowbro, Hippowdon and Quagsire. This pokemon has great speed, bulk, power, and coverage, making it the ideal starting point for building a team that is difficult to counter.

 

[Random Passerby]

I like the idea of this thread, so ill provide a nomination that delivers a challenge, due to its immense offensive power and coverage to destroy the common play styles like balance and even stall!

Gardevoir @ Gardevoirite
Ability: Trace
EVs: 24 Def / 232 SpA / 252 Spe
Modest Nature
- Taunt
- Hyper Voice
- Psyshock
- Focus Blast

I would use a Timid Nature to outspeed Jolly Bisharp and Excadrill which can be problematic since they can hit you very hard with STAB Steel moves. With that said, picking Mega Gard first is just asking for it to be hard-countered since both players counter-team each other so the good match-up situation against Stall which Mega Gard boasts is not that easy to achieve in this project.

Metagross @ Metagrossite
Ability: Clear Body
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Spe / 4 SpD
Jolly Nature
- Meteor Mash
- Zen Headbutt
- Hammer Arm
- Grass Knot

Mega Metagross, possibly the 2nd best Pokemon in the metagame (behind Lando-I), is a good Pokemon with very few flaws. However, when we have no idea on what the opponent team is made up of, revealing all of its moves makes it less dangerous as the current moveset means it can be checked with Lando-T, Jirachi, Mega Scizor, Gliscor, Slowking and Mega Charizard X so it is inadvisable to pick it this early as the opponent will adjust their team to not be easily be taken advantage of by Mega Meta.

 

[Random Passerby]

Modest still out speeds Bisharp and Jolly Ecadrill is never seen on a viable set unless it is scarfed, in which case you wont out speed any way. Your last statement is literally redundant, as the whole purpose of this project is to counter the opposing team. Your goal is to provided a relevant Pokemon that can hurt or handle a lot of the meta game and then check or counter them (iirc). Going by your logic this project should not even exist, as there is no current Pokemon in the meta that can not be countered or checked and seeing how the purpose is to counter/check this said Pokemon it does not matter what offensive threat you put here, it will be check or countered. Gardevoir will also potential check or handle some of the opponents future Pokemon, so assuming that we dont decide to pick 6 counters and/or checks for Gardevoir it should be able to boast its prowess eventually. Sorry if I misinterpreted you, but what you have said does not follow or abide by the purpose of this thread, through my eyes at least. I would also like to apologizes for the over use or "Counter and Check" lol.

I meant Mega Gard can outspeed them before Mega Evolving. Jolly Nature is actually quite viable for Excadrill as this allows it to at least speed tie with opposing Excadrill and outspeed +2 Gyarados under Sand and outspeed neutral-natured based 100s .

I really think you don't know what I was trying to say over there. All of us knows that every Pokemon has checks and counters, but the problem with Mega Gardevoir is it flourishes against Stall and some balance builds but struggles against Offense due to its middling Speed. You make it sound as if I claim Mega Gard will be useless in this project when I make no such statements or even imply it; I'm just trying to say choosing it now instead of later allows the opponent to either use a different playstyle to adapt or pack a simple counter to it (say, Victini or Jirachi) and make Mega Gard difficult to utilize. Remember, this project is based on Counter Teaming each other so match-ups, especially early on counts for a lot. Of course Mega Gard may be able to check other Pokemon down the line, I'm not saying it can't but by that point of time we might be able to pick a more versatile Mega that can suit the team better.

 

[bludz]

Mega Metagross, possibly the 2nd best Pokemon in the metagame (behind Lando-I), is a good Pokemon with very few flaws. However, when we have no idea on what the opponent team is made up of, revealing all of its moves makes it less dangerous as the current moveset means it can be checked with Lando-T, Jirachi, Mega Scizor, Gliscor, Slowking and Mega Charizard X so it is inadvisable to pick it this early as the opponent will adjust their team to not be easily be taken advantage of by Mega Meta.

This is about counters though, not checks. There are few outright counters to this moveset and it pretty much forces Team 2 like I said to choose from some passive pokemon, a scarfer, or Mega Scizor. If they decided to go with a check the problem is that then while trying to counter the other members of the team they still have to fit another check to Metagross.

BTW I do prefer your nomination of Gengar though, since it almost forces a Chansey or AV user since nothing else really counters it. Checks like Ttar and Bisharp will be easy to counter.

 

[Snowy]

I meant Mega Gard can outspeed them before Mega Evolving. Jolly Nature is actually quite viable for Excadrill as this allows it to at least speed tie with opposing Excadrill and outspeed +2 Gyarados under Sand and outspeed neutral-natured based 100s .

I really think you don't know what I was trying to say over there. All of us knows that every Pokemon has checks and counters, but the problem with Mega Gardevoir is it flourishes against Stall and some balance builds but struggles against Offense due to its middling Speed. You make it sound as if I claim Mega Gard will be useless in this project when I make no such statements or even imply it; I'm just trying to say choosing it now instead of later allows the opponent to either use a different playstyle to adapt or pack a simple counter to it (say, Victini or Jirachi) and make Mega Gard difficult to utilize. Remember, this project is based on Counter Teaming each other so match-ups, especially early on counts for a lot. Of course Mega Gard may be able to check other Pokemon down the line, I'm not saying it can't but by that point of time we might be able to pick a more versatile Mega that can suit the team better.

I was unclear of what you were trying to say in your last comment due to it having a shrouded context, this however is more understandable. I agree with what you said for the most part, baring the claim that the implementation or usage of counter styling or counter Pokemon will hurt the teams and/or Pokemons develop in this project. As I stated previously holes and opportunities will open up later through the building process and sliding any Pokemon into the starting spot will present similar issues and limitations in the beginning as well. Meaning that a lack of focus should be drawn around these opening potential Pokemons defiant weaknesses, but what they can provide and do under the current circumstances of the meta. Other than that a lot of what you said in your recent text block, holds sufficient value and i'm personal more favorable to a non mega to be firstly used, as the flexibility that a mega can provide is absurd and defiantly beneficial. I just want to state and show how limitless this can actually be with the use of any Pokemon and that being counter styled or counter in general, is not a problem that should be restricting the choice of our first Pokemon due to the reasons I stated. Other than that i'm looking forward to seeing the main nominations to come and also seeing the future teams come together.

 

[Red Cat]

I'll give my brief opinions on each of these since it looks like there will not be any more submissions.

Gengar: There are not that many counters to it, but Chansey is still a pretty good counter for Team 2 since Gengar cannot do anything to Chansey and Chansey will have free turns to use Wish or Heal Bell which is a problem for Team 1. Team 1 could use a trapper to beat Chansey, but there are limited options for that and trappers are very easy to check, so this in effect gives Team 2 momentum because Team 2 would be dictating the picks for Team 1 instead of the other way around. Another problem with Gengar is that its pitiful bulk means it is of no use checking fast megas.

Mega Charizard Y: This is a bad first pick because like Gengar, it is walled by Chansey, but you are using your mega slot on it. Specially defensive Hippowdon and Latias are also options for Team 2. Mega Charizard-Y is also easily beat by faster threats.

Tyrantrum: The set does not have many counters, although Doublade is a hard stop to it. The lack of speed and poor defensive typing means that Team 2 can go on the offensive to beat it which is bad for Team 1.

Keldeo: My nomination. Even its checks and counters do not like Scald burns which is something to take into account. Keldeo's good speed and decent bulk limit the offensive options of Team 2 because Keldeo can check many of them. The biggest problem with Keldeo is that Specs requires good prediction.

Landorus: Like I said before, the set is walled by Skarmory and Blissey which means free turns for them to Wish, Heal Bell, set up hazards, and Defog depending on what you use. The speed of Landorus means that Team 2 could also pick its own Specs Keldeo to not only check Landorus, but put a ton of offensive pressure on Team 1.

Mega Metagross: I usually think picking a mega with the first pick is bad, but Mega Metagross is so good all around that it might be a good pick. There are not many good counters to this set, but Victini resists all of Mega Meta's moves and can hit back very hard.

Mega Gardevoir: I do not like this pick much at all. Team 2 can easily go on offense here and take advantage of Mega Gardevoir's relatively low speed (especially with Modest nature) and poor bulk. It is definitely not worth burning the mega slot on.

 

[firehusky]

Your post kinda makes it sound like anything that is walled by skarmory, blissey, or chansey is not a good pick, which is not true. Your post also makes it sound like anything with bad speed and bad bulk is not a good pick. First of all, skarmory, blissey and chansey are all easily trapped and removed by gothitelle. Also remember that we are trying to pick a pokemon that is hard to counter; pretty much everything has counters and being walled by skarmory or chansey isn't necessarily bad.