Rev up those Psychic types!
I’m guessing it’ll use Poison Jab + Curse or Bulk Up. Discuss!
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7* Tera Raid Event: Tera Poison Swampert
- Thread starter Vengeance417
- Start date
Rev up those Psychic types!
I’m guessing it’ll use Poison Jab + Curse or Bulk Up. Discuss!
My expectation: Main moveset = liquidation/waterfall, earthquake, poison jab, and stone edge.
Curse/Bulk up are both possible, but gamefreak tends to reserve boosting more for pokemon that are weaker (eg Meganium), and Swampert is not weak. I expect Swampert to maybe get one scripted Curse/Bulk up boost. I also expect AOE sludge wave as a scripted attack.
Running calcs, I can’t figure out a way to get a reliable turn 1 OHKO. Krookodile anger point does not have enough juice. The next best shot for cheese is turn 2 OHKO by Deoxys-Attack. The composition is:
Deoxys-Attack (0/0-/252/252+/0/0) with specs using stored power on turn 2. 2 Phys def alcremie using decorate on Deoxys-A. Then 2 fake tears/acid sprays (I recommend intimidate phys def Mabosstiff).
+4 252+ SpA Choice Specs Deoxys-Attack Stored Power (180 BP) vs. -4 0 HP / 0 SpD Tera Poison Swampert: 12146-14292 (101.7 - 119.7% of 35x hp boss) -- guaranteed OHKO
The next best psychic nuke is Calyrex-Shadow rider, who just misses the reliable OHKO (68% chance to OHKO under the same conditions), so he need to use his bulk to tank an extra hit to Attack cheer himself.
Outside of coordinated team strats, I really don’t know. Levitate bronzong is probably a good support here.
Curse/Bulk up are both possible, but gamefreak tends to reserve boosting more for pokemon that are weaker (eg Meganium), and Swampert is not weak. I expect Swampert to maybe get one scripted Curse/Bulk up boost. I also expect AOE sludge wave as a scripted attack.
Running calcs, I can’t figure out a way to get a reliable turn 1 OHKO. Krookodile anger point does not have enough juice. The next best shot for cheese is turn 2 OHKO by Deoxys-Attack. The composition is:
Deoxys-Attack (0/0-/252/252+/0/0) with specs using stored power on turn 2. 2 Phys def alcremie using decorate on Deoxys-A. Then 2 fake tears/acid sprays (I recommend intimidate phys def Mabosstiff).
+4 252+ SpA Choice Specs Deoxys-Attack Stored Power (180 BP) vs. -4 0 HP / 0 SpD Tera Poison Swampert: 12146-14292 (101.7 - 119.7% of 35x hp boss) -- guaranteed OHKO
The next best psychic nuke is Calyrex-Shadow rider, who just misses the reliable OHKO (68% chance to OHKO under the same conditions), so he need to use his bulk to tank an extra hit to Attack cheer himself.
Outside of coordinated team strats, I really don’t know. Levitate bronzong is probably a good support here.
If you want a clean KO setup, then probably worth taking a cue from Ye Olde Cinderace 2t ft. RaidBro.
1x
Slowbro @ Weakness Policy
Ability: Oblivious
Tera Type: Psychic
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Nasty Plot
- Stored Power
3x
Quagsire @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
- Acid Spray
- Helping Hand
- Fling
- Chilling Water
Turn 1 everybody sprays down the Swampert while Slowbro Nasty Plots, Slowbro takes a leftovers, a Helping Hand, and an Attack Cheer to the face on turn 2, and then hits Swampert with one of these: +4 252+ SpA Slowbro Helping Hand Atk Cheer Stored Power (140 BP) vs. -6 0 HP / 0 SpD Tera Poison Swampert: 12296-14468 (103 - 121.2% of 35x hp boss) -- guaranteed OHKO
Even beyond the high coordination 2t setup that'll probably work, these are both probably solid options for the raid in general (though not these specific sets) since Slowbro has the bulk and setup to take on Swampert unless it's been given Knock Off, crazy buffing, or goes nuts with buff removal and Quagsire has the bulk and longevity to be a solid support through the entire fight.
Is there actually anything they can do that stops Feather Dance Espathra from stomping this easily?
Could give it Screech, which is significantly more annoying to reset, I guess? And Knock Off proper still hurts a little.
Latias/Latios seem like they could fair well here.
Metagross gets Magnet Rise which could be interesting if the AI doesn't know not to spam ground moves while using it.
Metagross gets Magnet Rise which could be interesting if the AI doesn't know not to spam ground moves while using it.
I refined the coordinated strat a bit, using Farigiraf.
Farigiraf is chosen because: 1) very available in both scarlet and violet, 2) just strong enough to always OHKO in this many turns, and 3) is bulky enough to take a hit. Slowbro misses the KO 7% of the time, and I don’t want to expose the alcremies to more turns of damage.
Mabostiff is chosen because intimidate greatly aids the average case. Maushold might also work because of friend guard. Everyone here should survive a crit crit, T0 EQ, and Mabo/Farigiraf survive an additional attack
Water / Ground / Poison is an obnoxious combo to work around.
I think Curse / Bulk Up are a given honestly, mainly cause Swampert doesn't really have much else to go with in first place.
Its movepool is pretty lacking outside stabs and generic coverage, and Damp isn't exactly doing anything.
I'd jump on the Slowbro and / or Latias train. (I don't trust Latios as much, less bulky and more prone to crit shenenigans)
If the timing between shield and debuff reset is big enough I can see the ostrich running it over though, expecially if it can copy a Bulk Up / Curse
I think Curse / Bulk Up are a given honestly, mainly cause Swampert doesn't really have much else to go with in first place.
Its movepool is pretty lacking outside stabs and generic coverage, and Damp isn't exactly doing anything.
I'd jump on the Slowbro and / or Latias train. (I don't trust Latios as much, less bulky and more prone to crit shenenigans)
A very early shield + debuff reset more or less.
If the timing between shield and debuff reset is big enough I can see the ostrich running it over though, expecially if it can copy a Bulk Up / Curse
I'll probably be bringing out the Reflect Bronzong build I used previously here, just slap Psychic on there for some chip damage while I block other damage from being done.
Levitate + Steel means I only really care about Water moves, but Sunny Day solves that problem pretty easily.
Levitate + Steel means I only really care about Water moves, but Sunny Day solves that problem pretty easily.
Espathra @ Shell Bell
Ability: Opportunist
Tera Type: Psychic
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Feather Dance
- Reflect
- Psychic Terrain
- Lumina Crash
The Espathra set I’ll initially make. Might mess around with Speed Boost + Calm Mind + Stored Power, but this seems more consistent.
Indeedee-F (F) @ Terrain Extender / Sitrus Berry
Ability: Psychic Surge
Tera Type: Psychic
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Reflect
- Helping Hand
- Psychic Terrain
- Charm
Female Indeedee can set up Psychic Terrain automatically, then support her team with Helping Hand, Reflect, Charm, and resetting Psychic Terrain. Might slot in Psychic over Reflect or Charm depending on which one is more common.
Calyrex-Shadow @ Shell Bell
Ability: As One (Spectrier)
Tera Type: Psychic
EVs: 4 HP / 252 Def / 252 SpA
Modest Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Reflect
- Psychic Terrain
- Nasty Plot
- Expanding Force
Stupid amounts of damage. Might need a bit of support, though, but we’ll see.
Water / Ground / Poison is pretty reasonable coverage, with exactly one resist in Giratina-Origin and reasonable super effective coverage, so I think we could expect a "support" move rather than a coverage move in the last slot.
- Knock Off hits Psychics super effective (and I'm not really sure how Knock works in raids, but I don't think any existing raids use it...)
- Amnesia slot 4 makes a lot of the Psychics worse from the start and complements a couple scripted Bulk Ups well
- Bulk Up (or Curse ig) gives us the ol' Infinite Setup, which would make Swampert a real pain
- Swampert gets both Counter and Mirror Coat to try to disrupt setup strategies, but this comes at the cost of potentially giving a lot of free turns away to "fair" strategies, so I don't expect either
- Special moves might show up? I think this one's a little weird. Doesn't seem likely, but not super unlikely.
- I also don't expect any debuff moves like Growl or Screech. They just don't seem likely idk
- Swampert also gets Yawn. I don't know if they'll do a Sleep raid right after another Sleep raid, but it sure would be obnoxious.
If something happens to disrupt the Psychics, my go-to based on theorymon is good old fashioned Annihilape.
Annihilape @ Shell Bell
Ability: Defiant / Vital Spirit
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 176 Atk / 252 Def / 80 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rage Fist
- Bulk Up
- Screech
- Taunt / Tera Blast??? / support moves for pubs like Coaching
The 80 Speed ensures you outrun neutral natured Swampert if it throws out a Bulldoze or Icy Wind at any point. The last slot doesn't really matter, but Tera Blast might be nice just as a 17th move to click if you run out of Rage Fists. Defiant is the default ability, but Vital Spirit stops potential Yawn strats. If Swampert has Bulk Up in its regular movepool, you should at least be able to match it, especially if Swampert doesn't wipe buffs late.
I think if there are no infinite Bulk Ups, Slowbro and Espathra are probably perfectly reliable answers; Poison Jab procs would be annoying for both, but if you can avoid them early then you can definitely just outheal them late when you're set up.
In the event that it infinitely Curses, there's one other thing that might be decent:
Dondozo @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
Tera Type: Psychic
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Curse
- Earthquake
- Tera Blast
- Substitute / Protect
It's pretty slow to get going, but 252 Defense means Swampert cannot break your Substitute even at neutral, or you can just go Protect and make sure you don't die on the wipe turn... which you can actually live through anyway:
+6 0+ Atk Swampert Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 252 Def Dondozo: 366-432 (82.9 - 97.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
- Knock Off hits Psychics super effective (and I'm not really sure how Knock works in raids, but I don't think any existing raids use it...)
- Amnesia slot 4 makes a lot of the Psychics worse from the start and complements a couple scripted Bulk Ups well
- Bulk Up (or Curse ig) gives us the ol' Infinite Setup, which would make Swampert a real pain
- Swampert gets both Counter and Mirror Coat to try to disrupt setup strategies, but this comes at the cost of potentially giving a lot of free turns away to "fair" strategies, so I don't expect either
- Special moves might show up? I think this one's a little weird. Doesn't seem likely, but not super unlikely.
- I also don't expect any debuff moves like Growl or Screech. They just don't seem likely idk
- Swampert also gets Yawn. I don't know if they'll do a Sleep raid right after another Sleep raid, but it sure would be obnoxious.
If something happens to disrupt the Psychics, my go-to based on theorymon is good old fashioned Annihilape.
Annihilape @ Shell Bell
Ability: Defiant / Vital Spirit
Tera Type: Ghost
EVs: 176 Atk / 252 Def / 80 Spe
Adamant Nature
- Rage Fist
- Bulk Up
- Screech
- Taunt / Tera Blast??? / support moves for pubs like Coaching
The 80 Speed ensures you outrun neutral natured Swampert if it throws out a Bulldoze or Icy Wind at any point. The last slot doesn't really matter, but Tera Blast might be nice just as a 17th move to click if you run out of Rage Fists. Defiant is the default ability, but Vital Spirit stops potential Yawn strats. If Swampert has Bulk Up in its regular movepool, you should at least be able to match it, especially if Swampert doesn't wipe buffs late.
I think if there are no infinite Bulk Ups, Slowbro and Espathra are probably perfectly reliable answers; Poison Jab procs would be annoying for both, but if you can avoid them early then you can definitely just outheal them late when you're set up.
In the event that it infinitely Curses, there's one other thing that might be decent:
Dondozo @ Leftovers
Ability: Unaware
Tera Type: Psychic
EVs: 252 Atk / 252 Def / 4 SpD
Adamant Nature
- Curse
- Earthquake
- Tera Blast
- Substitute / Protect
It's pretty slow to get going, but 252 Defense means Swampert cannot break your Substitute even at neutral, or you can just go Protect and make sure you don't die on the wipe turn... which you can actually live through anyway:
+6 0+ Atk Swampert Earthquake vs. 0 HP / 252 Def Dondozo: 366-432 (82.9 - 97.9%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
This is only if the supereffective weakening berry strategy will still work.
Shuca Berry
Water Absorb
Tera Ground
252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 HP
Adamant Nature
Earthquake
Chlling Water
Protect
Curse
And since Swampert is a physical attacker,those Intimidaters will come in clutch. This will only work if Swampert doesn't go for Earthquake before the 2nd Chilling Water though.
0+ Atk Tera Poison Swampert Earthquake vs. 6 HP / 252 Def Clodsire: 276-326 (68.6 - 81%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
And if you want to go even further
0 Atk Tera Poison Swampert Earthquake vs. 6 HP / 252+ Def Clodsire: 230-272 (57.2 - 67.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Now there is a chance he may have Ice Punch for ground types, but not only is it weaker than Earthquake, it's not STAB as well
0+ Atk Tera Poison Swampert Ice Punch vs. 6 HP / 252 Def Clodsire: 138-164 (34.3 - 40.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
Shuca Berry
Water Absorb
Tera Ground
252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 HP
Adamant Nature
Earthquake
Chlling Water
Protect
Curse
And since Swampert is a physical attacker,those Intimidaters will come in clutch. This will only work if Swampert doesn't go for Earthquake before the 2nd Chilling Water though.
0+ Atk Tera Poison Swampert Earthquake vs. 6 HP / 252 Def Clodsire: 276-326 (68.6 - 81%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
And if you want to go even further
0 Atk Tera Poison Swampert Earthquake vs. 6 HP / 252+ Def Clodsire: 230-272 (57.2 - 67.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Now there is a chance he may have Ice Punch for ground types, but not only is it weaker than Earthquake, it's not STAB as well
0+ Atk Tera Poison Swampert Ice Punch vs. 6 HP / 252 Def Clodsire: 138-164 (34.3 - 40.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
I don't think that Swampert would pick resisted Poison over a neutral Earthquake or particularly needs Ice Punch to hit ground types effectively.This is only if the supereffective weakening berry strategy will still work.
Shuca Berry
Water Absorb
Tera Ground
252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 HP
Adamant Nature
Earthquake
Chlling Water
Protect
Curse
And since Swampert is a physical attacker,those Intimidaters will come in clutch. This will only work if Swampert doesn't go for Earthquake before the 2nd Chilling Water though.
0+ Atk Tera Poison Swampert Earthquake vs. 6 HP / 252 Def Clodsire: 276-326 (68.6 - 81%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
And if you want to go even further
0 Atk Tera Poison Swampert Earthquake vs. 6 HP / 252+ Def Clodsire: 230-272 (57.2 - 67.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Now there is a chance he may have Ice Punch for ground types, but not only is it weaker than Earthquake, it's not STAB as well
0+ Atk Tera Poison Swampert Ice Punch vs. 6 HP / 252 Def Clodsire: 138-164 (34.3 - 40.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
I do not expect Yawn because it would be counterproductive with poison.
A handful of 6-star raids have Knock Off. I don't think it gets the boost since raid bosses can't remove items other than with Incinerate at least.
I just realized Ice coverage would be somewhat redundant because he's a water type.
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The Raid AI seems to basically treat type resist berries as a resistance. Ground/Poison double resists Poison and Water Absorb makes it immune to Water, so unless it has any other attack that is unresisted, it'll still go for Earthquake against that setup.This is only if the supereffective weakening berry strategy will still work.
Shuca Berry
Water Absorb
Tera Ground
252 Atk / 252 Def / 252 HP
Adamant Nature
Earthquake
Chlling Water
Protect
Curse
And since Swampert is a physical attacker,those Intimidaters will come in clutch. This will only work if Swampert doesn't go for Earthquake before the 2nd Chilling Water though.
0+ Atk Tera Poison Swampert Earthquake vs. 6 HP / 252 Def Clodsire: 276-326 (68.6 - 81%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
And if you want to go even further
0 Atk Tera Poison Swampert Earthquake vs. 6 HP / 252+ Def Clodsire: 230-272 (57.2 - 67.6%) -- guaranteed 2HKO
Now there is a chance he may have Ice Punch for ground types, but not only is it weaker than Earthquake, it's not STAB as well
0+ Atk Tera Poison Swampert Ice Punch vs. 6 HP / 252 Def Clodsire: 138-164 (34.3 - 40.7%) -- guaranteed 3HKO
I mean, while the boss may treat the berry as a resistance, I'm not so sure the same can be said for abilities. Primarina had countless moments where she could've went for Psychic pre Tera, but she only ever did it once and it was after an Amnesia boost. Instead she did almost nothing but spam Sing, with the occasional Sparkling Aria, which did nothing but heal my Clodsire.
The raid AI infamously chokes against "absorbed status moves".
Dachsbun abusing raid AI spamming will-o-wisp was a similar case.
Very likely "water sing" being absorbed was messing with the raid AI as well
Also the AI in general has a problem with recognizing type immunities on moves that change type, not just the raids.
I can confirm that Raid Bosses don't get the boost (and don't remove raiders' items) with Knock Off. I drew 12 damage from a 4-star Crawdaunt in the following situation, where the minimum possible damage with the boost would be 14:
-1 Lvl 45 0- Atk Tera Dragon Crawdaunt Knock Off (97.5 BP) vs. +2 252 HP / 6 Def Metagross: 14-18 (3.8 - 4.9%)
From what I remember from the Mighty Pikachu raid that actually goes both ways.
I haven't done it myself, but IIRC people used Knock Off on the Mighty Pikachu, and it worked normally. Either way, it's not likely to matter much until we get another event raid boss holding an item.
I think the issue was moves rounding down to 0 damage not counting towards tera charge, which mainly only came up with Pikachu due to moves only dealing 1% damage before tera. That might be also why weaker Knock Offs might have not worked for some people reportedly.
I was thinking of this rendition:
Bronzong @ Ability Shield
Ability: Levitate
Tera Type: Stellar
EVs: 252 HP / 36 Def / 220 Spe
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Sunny Day
- Reflect
- Psychic
- Metal Sound / Helping Hand
Speed is for neutral Swampert. If it uses Curse and for some reason never resets its stat drops, may as well just run max Defense, too. However, I chose to speed creep because getting the Sun up before Swampert uses Liquidation on you means you’ll take less damage than tanking it at max defense without Sun. Ability Shield means you’ll need to set Reflect and Sun again sooner, but you won’t need to use a moveslot on Protect and can then run another support move. You probably wouldn’t want to Tera anyway, but Stellar lets you keep your defensive typing alongside Levitate.
Shell Bell / Soul Dew
Tera Psychic
252 SpA / 252 Def / 6 HP
Modest Nature
Luster Purge
Psychic
Chilling Water
Calm Mind
Nvm, I forgot it's Swampert's Mega with Swift Swim, not the base form, so no Speed investment and Sunny Day.
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Orthworm @ Ability Shield / Sitrus Berry
Ability: Earth Eater
Tera Type: Stellar
EVs: 252 HP / 252 Def / 4 SpA
Bold Nature
IVs: 0 Atk
- Mud-Slap
- Helping Hand / Earth Power / Protect
- Metal Sound
- Coil
This should almost work similarly to Water Absorb Clodsire vs Primarina, although I do know the AI like to prioritize certain status moves, and I don’t think Swampert will run anything similar to Sing. That being said, Swampert’s Liquidation will barely hurt Orthworm at all, especially after you Coil and other players are setting Reflect, Sunny Day, and/or Feather Dance / Charm. Coil’s not just for the Defense boost, however. The accuracy raise is also nice for enabling Metal Sound to be more consistent.