Other Tier 35 Pokes-- April 2025

Runo said:
Im curious as to why mega stones are banned from this format, doesn't seem as metagame breaking as the other generational mechanics
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we've had this discussion a million times, but the long and short is that any meta with a mega would just end up centralizing around it. Most pokemon are objectively kind of bad competitively, so 35 Pokes metas trend towards having a lower power level, and I don't think people realize just how powerful megas are.

A good example was back in August 2023 some one asked if we could legalize Mega-Abomasnow. If we made the decision to allow it, it would not only be the Bulkiest Pokemon (105 in both defenses with 157 physical from snow boost) but also be the hardest hitting as it not only has the highest physical attack, but the highest special attack as well. It would also be the highest BST pokemon by 75 points (the next highest is Krookodile). And that's not even mentioning that Abomasnow was ALREADY considered good.
 
NotGerald said:
we've had this discussion a million times, but the long and short is that any meta with a mega would just end up centralizing around it. Most pokemon are objectively kind of bad, so 35 Pokes metas trend towards having a lower power level, and I don't think people realize just how powerful megas are.

A good example was back in August 2023 some one asked if we could legalize Mega-Abomasnow. If we made the decision to allow it, it would not only be the Bulkiest Pokemon (105 in both defenses with 157 physical from snow boost) but also be the hardest hitting as it not only has the highest physical attack, but the highest special attack as well. It would also be the highest BST pokemon by 75 points (the next highest is Krookodile). And that's not even mentioning that Abomasnow was ALREADY considered good.
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Id like to add that basically most if not all mega-legal mons have been good in their metas, witha few excpections with camerupt, lopunny, mawile, sableye and i think thats all. Mawile, lopunny and sableye get insanely strong megas when compared to their normal counterpart, and camerupt mega has such an insane damage output that it would most likely than not have no switchins, with the pure bulk to back it up (and its probably the most realistic mega to add to 35, and im not forgetting audino)
 
New roster goes crazy
 

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35 Pokes is suspect testing Krookodile!





In a 7-1 vote, the 35 Pokes council has voted to suspect test Krookodile in the Septemeber 2024 metagame.

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In a meta with an auto rain setter, two swift swim users. and multiples strong water types which out speed Krookodile, this suspect test may appear odd at first glance. A close look at the limited pool of allowed pokemon, however, belies the true reason for this action. Out of all 35 Pokemon, only Rotom-Fan posseses the coveted ground immunity which renders Earthquake more spammable than rain-boosted water type attacks (to which there are 3 potential immunities). In conjunction with choice scarf, the ability Moxie, and an intimidating base 117 attack, Krookodile's Earthquake lets it run rampant and sweep entire teams once Rotom-Fan is eliminated. A jolly nature allows Krookodile to outspeed both Beartic and Armaldo in the rain, as well as Starmie and Basculin which otherwsie threaten it offensively. Compounding matters is Krookodile's startling physical bulk in comparison to Basculin's wanting attack stat. Basculin-white striped, the only water type aqua jet user in the meta, needs an obnoxious 450% power boost to ohko Krookodile, and is the only priority user capable of doing so.

In equal measure to Earthquake, Krookodile's STAB knock off is a clear and present danger to virtually everything in the meta. Without its heavy-duty boots, Rotom-Fan is too vulnerable to stealth and too low on recovery moves to switch into Krookodile more than once. Spidops and Accelgor share in Rotom's stealth rocks vulnerability, and Musdale suffers from similar recovery issues without its leftovers. Even dark resists such as opposing Krookodiles and Toxicroaks cannot afford switching into knock off lest they lose their choice bands, life orbs, or choice scarfs. The aforementioned potential checks have limited utility into the rest of the metagame, which means that Krookodile can freely switch out on all but the frailest team structures.

In short, Krookodile runs through teams and forces players to utilize one of the meager, unreliable, quasi-defensive checks in conjuction with rotom-fan to have any hope of surviving past turn 6, let alone winning the battle.
 
Ember Celica said:
35 Pokes is suspect testing Krookodile!





In a 7-1 vote, the 35 Pokes council has voted to suspect test Krookodile in the Septemeber 2024 metagame.

View attachment 666793

In a meta with an auto rain setter, two swift swim users. and multiples strong water types which out speed Krookodile, this suspect test may appear odd at first glance. A close look at the limited pool of allowed pokemon, however, belies the true reason for this action. Out of all 35 Pokemon, only Rotom-Fan posseses the coveted ground immunity which renders Earthquake more spammable than rain-boosted water type attacks (to which there are 3 potential immunities). In conjunction with choice scarf, the ability Moxie, and an intimidating base 117 attack, Krookodile's Earthquake lets it run rampant and sweep entire teams once Rotom-Fan is eliminated. A jolly nature allows Krookodile to outspeed both Beartic and Armaldo in the rain, as well as Starmie and Basculin which otherwsie threaten it offensively. Compounding matters is Krookodile's startling physical bulk in comparison to Basculin's wanting attack stat. Basculin-white striped, the only water type aqua jet user in the meta, needs an obnoxious 450% power boost to ohko Krookodile, and is the only priority user capable of doing so.

In equal measure to Earthquake, Krookodile's STAB knock off is a clear and present danger to virtually everything in the meta. Without its heavy-duty boots, Rotom-Fan is too vulnerable to stealth and too low on recovery moves to switch into Krookodile more than once. Spidops and Accelgor share in Rotom's stealth rocks vulnerability, and Musdale suffers from similar recovery issues without its leftovers. Even dark resists such as opposing Krookodiles and Toxicroaks cannot afford switching into knock off lest they lose their choice bands, life orbs, or choice scarfs. The aforementioned potential checks have limited utility into the rest of the metagame, which means that Krookodile can freely switch out on all but the frailest team structures.

In short, Krookodile runs through teams and forces players to utilize one of the meager, unreliable, quasi-defensive checks in conjuction with rotom-fan to have any hope of surviving past turn 6, let alone winning the battle.
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crazy
 
Krookodile remains unbanned from 35 Pokes!

After the most contentious suspect vote in 35 Pokes history, Krookodile remains unbanned from the September 2024 format, falling 10% short of the 60% majority required for a ban. How did Krookodile, which garnered an 87.5% suspect support from the council, manage to make it through the suspect test unscathed?

The first and best answer is also the simplest: time. Despite the usable pokemon changing every month, some trends are universally true in 35 Pokes, and that includes the time progression of a metagame. As a metagame has time to breathe and develop, people begin to discover new and interesting ways to use previously overlooked pokemon. In September 2024, this happened to the Krookodile answers that were previously dismissed as non-viable.

Chief among these developments is offensive utility Spidops. The combination of STAB First Impression, Stakeout, and access to Sticky Web has granted Spidops a coveted palce among the top 10 pokemon of the metagame, beating out 3 of the 4 pokemon this month that are ranked OU in standard national dex play. If Krookodile is ever in against Spidops, it must make the impossible decision between staying in and fainting or switching out and potentially allowing webs to go up for free. Furthermore, the power boost from Stakeout makes it so many of Krookodile's teammates do not enjoy switching in to tank a First Impression on its behalf. The advantage gained in any of the three aforementioned scenarios has proved more than sufficient to even the playing field with regards to Krookodile.

Accelgor has similarly proven itself, though its niche is more specific than Spidops' and so it hasn't enjoyed quite as much popularity. Assuming hazards aren't up, a focus sash Unburden Accelgor can swtich into any move from any Krookodile and threaten an ohko in return. Because it is able to outspeed even the fastest choice scarf users in the metagame, Accelgor's blazing speed means it can set at least one layer of spikes in front of whatever comes in to replace Krookodile, providing overall solid utility beyond merely checking Krookodile.

As time afforded Spidops and Accelgor their moments in the spotlight, it has also cast a partial shadow over Krookodile by exposing its inherent flaws. Despite good stats and typing, Krookodile isn't quite powerful enough on its own before a Moxie boost to threaten neutral switchins with its stabs. This issue is typically overcome by utilizing coverage moves, but Krookodile needs a choice scarf to contend against some of these pokemon in the first place. Staying choice-locked into a coverage move though, is a sure-fire way to either lose Krookodile or grant your opponent a position from which they can secure the win. Krookodile can always elect to play the role of a wallbreaker instead of a Moxie sweeper but, despite thriving in that role, it is still far more manageable to contend with than the alternative.

In equal measure to time and related meta developments, the advent of snow archetypes has taken up significant space previously occupied by Krookodile. Ice types, particularly Slush Rush users, have taken advantage of the Galarian Slowking's chilly reception and the relative lack of viable special attacking threats to prove their worth at the highest levels of ladder play.

With all of that being said, Krookodile is still the most used pokemon in the format, found on nearly 60% of teams. Choice scarf moxie sweeps, while not as common anymore, are also not an unusual occurrence. Taking this and all of the aforementioned factors into account, half of the community voted to ban Krookodile, while the other half were in favor of letting it remain. Because suspect did not attain the required 60% or greater majority, Krookodile remained legal for September 2024.
 
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