Metagame 1v1 Metagame Discussion

[Mentality]

BigChu makes a good point about 'clown meta'. Smogon Metagames exist between a scale of "Serious" to "Unserious" that people subconsciously sort various tiers into - which is essentially a scale between OU and AG. Removal of species clause in 1v1 makes it lean more towards the unserious sides, as seeing 3 Regidrago will look more unserious no matter what.

But such a thing can have a positive impact, as the OM crowd that play things like AG, ZU and FFA can feel more inclined to check out 1v1 with loosened restrictions. There is a certain "percieved chaos" factor that can definetly make a metagame more enticing to play. Removal of species clause increases this percieved chaos factor.

 

[Marshme1to]

“clown meta” u got people like 5luke running random shit all the time or just general shitmons usage across people it isnt detrimental to the tier in anyway. Anyways in a tour setting bringing 3 of the same mon is not going to be prevalent, bar random cteam/fish. You’re creating problems that don’t really exist

 

[RTM]

Hey, just wondering about peoples thoughts on a few mons, please feel free to respond no matter your level of skill or experience.


Oger-H stands out as a problem child in the recent meta. This is due to its insane versatility and tech potential, unrivalled by any other mon. She's hard to account for in the builder and at preview, let alone in game due to different sets having different counter play. Oger-H faces little opportunity cost due to keeping core mus via ivy cudgel and power whip. Oger-H is a lot easier and more realistic to tech and beat than archaludon which balances the mon. I believe ogerpon hearthflame, while teetering on the edge of healthiness is currently allowing for a fresh and creative meta so I personally would like to see it stay around a little longer.


Pecharunt is the epitome of an annoying 1v1 mon. An 100bp stab move and toxic in one moveslot opens pecharunt up to a wide range of options, mainly being different variants of stall with differing levels of reliance on poison puppeteer, however this is where the problems with this mon begin. Poison puppeteer confusion can make this mon very frustrating to play against, oftentimes making matchups unreliable on both sides. The countermeasure to this is really just running better counters as pecharunt isn't overly hard to beat or tech, but will expose any counters not well implemented. To me, pecharunt is more an annoyance than an actual threat, and while it has uncompetitive elements, they can be avoided easily which stops it being unhealthy.


Regidrago fell into a slump during the arch meta, which it seems to have come out of after it's ban. Regidrago feels very strong now, especially with it matching up well against both prominent oger forms and beating common mid-tiers and glue mons. I've tried a few sets and saw most success with haban and bulky choice specs. Drago feels fine for now but I could definitely see this becoming an issue in the near future.

 

[Mentality]

Hey, just wondering about peoples thoughts on a few mons, please feel free to respond no matter your level of skill or experience.


Oger-H stands out as a problem child in the recent meta. This is due to its insane versatility and tech potential, unrivalled by any other mon. She's hard to account for in the builder and at preview, let alone in game due to different sets having different counter play. Oger-H faces little opportunity cost due to keeping core mus via ivy cudgel and power whip. Oger-H is a lot easier and more realistic to tech and beat than archaludon which balances the mon. I believe ogerpon hearthflame, while teetering on the edge of healthiness is currently allowing for a fresh and creative meta so I personally would like to see it stay around a little longer.


Pecharunt is the epitome of an annoying 1v1 mon. An 100bp stab move and toxic in one moveslot opens pecharunt up to a wide range of options, mainly being different variants of stall with differing levels of reliance on poison puppeteer, however this is where the problems with this mon begin. Poison puppeteer confusion can make this mon very frustrating to play against, oftentimes making matchups unreliable on both sides. The countermeasure to this is really just running better counters as pecharunt isn't overly hard to beat or tech, but will expose any counters not well implemented. To me, pecharunt is more an annoyance than an actual threat, and while it has uncompetitive elements, they can be avoided easily which stops it being unhealthy.


Regidrago fell into a slump during the arch meta, which it seems to have come out of after it's ban. Regidrago feels very strong now, especially with it matching up well against both prominent oger forms and beating common mid-tiers and glue mons. I've tried a few sets and saw most success with haban and bulky choice specs. Drago feels fine for now but I could definitely see this becoming an issue in the near future.

Pecharunt is an interesting mon. While the counters are obvious (steel, taunt, etc.) the mon can be extremely annoying to play against since it can cripple your team if you don't prepare for it. Malignant Chain is a very good move, and Toxic Puppeteer makes it very unfun to play against due to the confusion factor. It was held back in Archaludon meta but I definitely see it making a big resurgence

The frustration with pecharunt comes down to old lady luck. Will malignant chain poison? Will your mon hit itself? It can probably flip some matchups just off confusion chance. The use of parting short makes your attacks do nothing, and it has plenty bulk to go around in both ways. Even breaking it's air balloon gives it a crucial moment to toxic or PS.


At it's best, it's a mon you click Hyperspace Fury on, and at it's worst, it feels like an uncompetitive, unkillable beast.

Steels will inevitably rise as Drago takes back it's old throne, but we also have the strong threats of Hearthflame or Gouging to beat many of them. This gives pecharunt a happy little slot where it can toxic everything else with glee.

 

[Felucia]

3am sleepy felucia ramble post

With Archaludon gone the meta honestly feels like it's freed up a whole lot. I have the benefit of looking at this meta while still learning, and not being bound by preconceived knowledge what is/isn't "good" and from what I'm seeing the lack of ogerpon counterplay might be being overstated somewhat. I would recommend not taking action on it until at the very least the latest stages of LT to give people plenty of time to adapt to their Arch teams not auto-beating oger and properly thinking about counterplay.

Pecharunt and Iron Valiant if you ask me are 2 pokemon that fit in the same category of "toxic, annoying, but not broken" both have viable counters, but just feel really bad to play against for the non-counters. I think if we're going to worry about either being uncompetitive, we need to remember that as RTM said you shouldn't rely on unreliable counters when reliable ones exist, and only have yourself to blame if you don't. As for their fate in the metagame, I honestly couldn't care less whether they're banned or not. If they're banned, that's one annoyance off my annoyance list, otherwise I can just build around it, but I don't think these are justifiable if we're going by the book.

That brings me to Regidrago and Gouging Fire (yes I'm gonna group them together). When we were trying to ban Arch I argued that the abundance of powerful dragon types limits teambuilding to practically require a Fairy or Steel on most teams. There are 2 mons running around right now that are a cut above the rest when it comes to displaying those symptoms. First there's Regidrago, the mon with so much raw power that practically its only counters are Fairy and Steel types. The arguments for not banning it seem to come down to "There are plenty steel and fairy types to make it balanced" but I want to really start talking about the fact that the existence of Drago counters does not mean it's not overcentralising. Drago more than any mon in SV right now warps the metagame into a certain format and forces the presence of both drago counters and drago counters counters, and severely hinders building expression and metagame diversity.

I lied I'm not grouping them together: Gouging Fire is on the other side of the coin, its fire typing enables it to super-effectively hit steel types and not receive super effective damage from fairy types. In a metagame dominated by dragon types, this puts gouging at an advantage in how it fits into the centralised Regidrago meta. I can't guarantee it'll be banworthy if Drago is removed, but as of now it's contributing to the propagation of a centralised metagame and team archetype that is difficult for me to get on board with.