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np: NU Stage 5 - Won't Get Fooled Again

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jake

jake

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song SINCE APPARENTLY I'M TERRIBLE AT PICKING SONGS ;-; i'll just let #nu pick it from this point on (and no, Keiran, no "jizz in my pants")


A lot of exciting things are happening! B2W2 was just released, giving us a ton of new DW abilities (the most notable of which are Skill Link Cinccino, Regenerator Amoonguss, and Imposter Ditto) as well as plenty of new tutor moves. Tier shifts just happened, too -- following our trend of giving more Pokemon to RU than we receive in return, we lost Cryogonal, Magmortar, Quagsire, and (lol molk and friends) Metang in exchange for only a single Pokemon: Golurk. Crustle just baaaaarely missed the cut, and Klinklang and Scolipede were on the verge of returning to NU as well. At least it's not that bad of a trade-off. Maybe.

Anyway, with everyone spamming Amoonguss, Ditto, and Cinccino (and secretly hoping to hell that Contrary Serperior is never ever released), we'll have to start figuring out what the new best Pokemon in the metagame. What do you think? What's going to happen, based on the absence of those four Pokemon? What effect will GOLURK have on the meta? Post about new trends; what's hot, what's not. Post about your favorites to use, and if there are any interesting tutor moves that we've looked over in other threads. Suspect discussions aren't going to happen for a few weeks now so don't just jump on a bandwagon and spam "BAN CINCY" quiiiite yet.

POST DISCUSS ETC
 
hazards, hazards everywhere !

Ok, seriously, weezing might get a certain boost for he counters golurk and is one of the greatest walls when it comes to switching on hazrds. Every physical monster is going to let go of the grass moves, but can't find a way to abuse that. You also forgot zangoose which is to me, even more painful than cinccino. This will certanly be an extremly offenisve metagame and everyone will have to pack plenty of revenge killers since every offensive threat only has 1 or 2 specific walls. Also, forget about spinning, deal with hazards the best you can.

It will be a terrible/boring month to anyone who likes playing originaly.
 
Why RU?! We just lost our best spinner, one of our sturiest walls, and one of our best attackers (also METANG) in exchange for Golurk. Sure, it will be fun smacking things around with that huge attack stat and STAB Earthquake, but it will not have nearly as big of an impact as Cryogonal, Quagsire, or Magmortar due to the amount of sturdy physical walls we have in the tier.

Edit: LOL posted in np thread instead of usage stats threat, which I intended to. I guess this is fine
 
Editing this after more matches using the mighty Golurk. Has been pretty cool so far, I doubt my opinion about him will change.

PS: SR Golurk is bad and not worth it when the only physical wall it can't 2hko in the tier is Alomomola when using a band set.
 
But we don't kill the old way :( now we all use cinccinos and stuff.

In my last 3 matches theyve all com down to Cinccino speed ties, thats really what the meta has been to me so far. I am really looking forward to CB Golurk though, it hits ridiculously hard and doesnt afraid of anything.
 
Anyone else feel Braviary now with Roost is legitimate suspect? It's versatility is a death sentence that makes it a game changer until you learn the set you are facing.
 
He's really good, but still fairly easy to work around with Scarf users, rock types, electrics, etc...definitely not ban material.
 
TropiOUs said:
PS: SR Golurk is bad and not worth it when the only physical wall it can't 2hko in the tier is Alomomola when using a band set.
Click to expand...

ThunderPunch: 260-306 (48.68 - 57.3%) -- 44.53% chance to 2HKO

lolnope, guaranteed 2HKO with SR.

(CB is, optimally, what? EQ/Shadow Punch/Thunderpunch/Hammer Arm?)
 
breh said:
(CB is, optimally, what? EQ/Shadow Punch/Thunderpunch/Hammer Arm?)
Click to expand...
I'm using Shadow Punch, Earthquake, Ice Punch, and Superpower. Hammer arm is as strong as Superpower, but superpower doesn't have that nasty 90 acuracy. Drain Punch is neat too, but I prefer power over keeping Golurk alive for long.
 
Golurk can run either Thunderpunch or Ice Punch and, either way, Tangela or Alomomola walls it sadly. I'd probably use Ice Punch because it also hits stuff like Rotom-S which you would otherwise miss out on.
 
Try to built a quick balanced hazards based team. For now it works wonderfully, maybe i should try Golurk over Drifblim. Now i think that we should run a least one poison-type to get rid at least of T-Spikes, since now the best spinner is Armaldo and he's too easy to beat and very predictable.

Also, did anyone have news on the new abilities like Contrary Serperior & co. ? We don't have a list of the abilities actually released in BW2 ?

And also, did anyone have try out Sub/BU -Roost Braviary ? I'm pretty sure now that Cincinno is so common, Brav will have a bad time in usage (not the scarf/Band).

Another question: Now that we have update to all the new releases of BW2, the next tier shift will be in a month or in three already? (It's 3 days that i play NU with the Regen Murshroom and i'm pretty annoying of that :P)
 
Ewil said:
Try to built a quick balanced hazards based team. For now it works wonderfully, maybe i should try Golurk over Drifblim. Now i think that we should run a least one poison-type to get rid at least of T-Spikes, since now the best spinner is Armaldo and he's too easy to beat and very predictable.

Also, did anyone have news on the new abilities like Contrary Serperior & co. ? We don't have a list of the abilities actually released in BW2 ?

And also, did anyone have try out Sub/BU -Roost Braviary ? I'm pretty sure now that Cincinno is so common, Brav will have a bad time in usage (not the scarf/Band).

Another question: Now that we have update to all the new releases of BW2, the next tier shift will be in a month or in three already? (It's 3 days that i play NU with the Regen Murshroom and i'm pretty annoying of that :P)
Click to expand...

I don't know if there's a list posted here but a few relevant DW abilities I can think of are

Skill Link Cinccino
Regenerator Amoonguss
Regenerator Alomomola
Simple Swoobat
Imposter Ditto
Toxic Boost Zangoose
Prankster Liepard
Defiant Braviary
Hydration Swanna

Someone can point out if there are any other big ones I missed but I don't think there are. Contrary Serperior still doesn't exist unfortunately (or fortunately if you want Serp to stay in NU)

Also the tiers will update in three months (October 1)
 
steviestar said:
I don't know if there's a list posted here but a few relevant DW abilities I can think of are
Skill Link Cinccino
Regenerator Amoonguss
Regenerator Alomomola
Simple Swoobat
Imposter Ditto
Toxic Boost Zangoose
Prankster Liepard
Click to expand...
Fixed your list. Defiant is pointless on Braviary and most of time it will be like having sheer force/ keen eye because it won't be useful at all. And while Swanna should be mostly used on rain teams, the way she avoids status is with a sub and using her fantastic stabs to damage everything she wants to thatis not called Cincinno/Random multi hit scarfer.
 
Hydration Swanna is actually pretty relevant; I've seen Tribute use a RD Swanna and it is really annoying when it comes in on my Alomomola, something which it simply walls with RD, even if you predict.

Moxie Pinsir is such a weird mon. I tried it out a bit but was always reaaaaally underwhelmed. It's better than Mold Breaker to be sure, but I can't say it's really that good. It kills something then gets threatened with revenge, and then switches out, becoming regular old +0 Pinsir. Alomomola's existence doesn't help.

I don't know if justified Absol really counts for this, but it's now able to get Superpower, which is nice.

Garbodor gets Aftermath which is neat but kind of irrelevant for the time being.
 
breh said:
I don't know if justified Absol really counts for this, but it's now able to get Superpower, which is nice.
Click to expand...
Justified Absol was able to use Superpower since it was released in Novemeber(iirc) last year.
 
steviestar said:
Also the tiers will update in three months (October 1)
Click to expand...

What ? were stuck with cinccino and zanz for 3 months ? This is going to make the tier slightly boring imo, especialy when we'll all be tired of seeing them ( I already am). Just look at them wrecking any attempt to be original. What makes NU so much different than the other tiers is the great variety of teams that can actually be sucessful. Till those guys go up were stuck with an extremly offensive tier with no good spinner and offensive monsters with only very few unique counters.
Only gimmicky thing I see viable now is trick room.
 
Sweet Jesus said:
What ? were stuck with cinccino and zanz for 3 months ? This is going to make the tier slightly boring imo, especialy when we'll all be tired of seeing them ( I already am). Just look at them wrecking any attempt to be original. What makes NU so much different than the other tiers is the great variety of teams that can actually be sucessful. Till those guys go up were stuck with an extremly offensive tier with no good spinner and offensive monsters with only very few unique counters.
Only gimmicky thing I see viable now is trick room.
Click to expand...

Well, Cincy is going to get banned as soon as suspect voting is open.

Zangoose isn't too bad, if anything I see it going up to RU before it gets banned
 
Jobriq said:
No more cryogonal? How does delibird (lol) fair against golurk?
Click to expand...

Detailed Result:
252 Atk Life Orb Hustle Delibird (+Atk) Ice Punch vs 0 HP/0 Def Golurk: 115.67% - 136.36%
Guaranteed OHKO

Detailed Result:
252 Atk Iron Fist Golurk (+Atk) Shadow Punch vs 0 HP/4 Def Delibird: 100.43% - 118.61%
Guaranteed OHKO
 
Tribute said:
Well, Cincy is going to get banned as soon as suspect voting is open.

Zangoose isn't too bad, if anything I see it going up to RU before it gets banned
Click to expand...

tbh, it's not going to get quickbanned; it's just going to go RU. Cincinno is manageable, strangely enough. If you can fit room on your team for Probopass, you're fine. After it hurts something, it's (at least a lot of the time) too frail to come back in after the inevitable <mon with priority> comes in. It is indeed strong, but not infallible.

I wonder if anybody is playing RU at all, though. Nobody seems to be playing on PS; hell, more people are playing LC than it lol.
 
Yes, i agree with breh. Cinccinos low defense allow it to easily be taken out with a revenge killer or by something that can take two hits from.

I think best counter to cinccino in nu right now is physically defensive Misdreavus. Missy is 3hko by cb rock blast, which allows her to switch in and fire off a will o wisp to cripplie its offense.
Sure, cinccino is op for nu but i dont its good enough for an instant ban because there are ways to deal with it.
 
Thank god Scolipede and Crustle didn't drop. The hazards would have been absolutely ridiculous. And then Golurk would have even greater of an impact there, since Spikestacking would have more Pokemon that weren't bad.

The thing about Zangoose is while it is really strong, it plays really similarly to Swellow and Ursaring, but kind of like a Middleman to the two. Swellow is faster and gets Brave Bird, Ursaring hits even harder and can inrease its speed, and both can use Flame Orb (they get worn down slower in that case). However, Zangoose still is a scary cleaner AND it gets Close Combat, but really it has to be treated like Quick Feet Ursaring in my opinion.

It also has a bit of 4MSS, sine it cannot use Return, Close Combat, Quick Attack, Protect, Swords Dance, and whatever Dark move it has at the same time, so its usually going to be walled by something out there.

Also, I think Ditto is worse in NU than in OU. Ditto takes advantage of set up sweepers, and there really aren't that many down here (especially Dragon Dance users). Amoonguss is annoying, but managable. Cinccino is difficult to deal with, but Scarf Sawk/Emboar can deal with him really well. There really isn't much else though (IDK if it will still be NU with Skill Link anyway, since I feel its usage would rise in other tiers, too)
 
Ursaring is actually only about 1.09 times stronger than Zangoose with Guts; without it, it's far weaker and also very inferior. Quick Attack is also something that fully distinguishes Zangoose from Ursaring.

In any case, it's not going to be walled by anything anytime soon. With a set of QA/Facade/CC/Night Slash, it does everything it wants to do well enough. It 2HKOes Alomomola, for god's sake.
 
breh said:
Ursaring is actually only about 1.09 times stronger than Zangoose with Guts; without it, it's far weaker and also very inferior. Quick Attack is also something that fully distinguishes Zangoose from Ursaring.

In any case, it's not going to be walled by anything anytime soon. With a set of QA/Facade/CC/Night Slash, it does everything it wants to do well enough. It 2HKOes Alomomola, for god's sake.
Click to expand...

Very true about ursaring, also while swellow is faster and not as strong, zangoose can also hit rocks that all wall swellow very easily and doesn't have the nasty SR weakness that shortens his toxic turns even more. This comes only at the cost of U-turn and brave bird (brave bird is shit next to CC for this kind of thing).

Seriously, once zanz is in on something slower (there's usualy at least 3 slower pokes per team), something is going down. Even in RU there isn't much to come in on his terribly powerful facade, flawless coverage and priority move. (only counter I can think of is cofagrigus with mummy)
 
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